linksocarina
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
Posts: 3,186 Likes: 4,072
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Post by linksocarina on Apr 5, 2017 4:29:56 GMT
So I guess the vocal contingent of fans bitching about origins being too easy, linear and nothing like baldurs gate never happened then? Or the complaints about graphics and bugs and all that as well? It's not about comparing the two games (where you got that idea is a mystery) but pointing out how predictable the pattern of behavior is with most of the people on this forum. Do not try to whitewash events by denying they didn't exist. Nothing peeves me more when people do that. And I say to you - don't try and whitewash Andromeda's flaws by bitching about Bioware's past - which produced far more polished work than its present. www.metacritic.com/game/pc/dragon-age-origins/user-reviews?sort-by=date&num_items=100&page=6I guess some people are simply ignorant of their own failings of comprehension.
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Post by dis_Op2399 on Apr 5, 2017 4:30:14 GMT
The hate on this game is becoming obnoxious. No "whatever floats your boat" here, just howling and shrieking as if it's literally and objectively the most ungodly stinking turd to ever drop in the entire history of electronic entertainment.
It's a video game. It involves shooting badguys with guns and space magic as well as exploring new planets. Does it succeed at that? Hell yes. Would I prefer that the writing and characterization that surrounds it were a bit more elegant? Sure. Is the writing leaps and bounds worse than previous Bioware? No. Bioware games have always had their fair share of cool moments and cringe and ME:A is no different.
Oh, and if you think DA:O release wasn't a shit storm you're actually deluded. Just Google "Dragon Age Origins graphics" and look for posts from around the release. People were up in arms about how bad it looked.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2017 4:31:02 GMT
You really hit the nail on the head - The great Bioware villains are often the characters you do not consider to be villains, or is trying to achieve something you can sympathize with, even if you disagree. Jon Irenicus, Saren, Illusive Man (ME2), Solas, The Arishok, Loghain. Its not like they haven't created great villains in their previous games, but they need to step away from the "mwhahaha i am evil and you can't/don't understand my reasons" cliche. The only thing that made Corypheus tolerable was that he is tied to previous lore, and could provide answers to questions we have had since the franchise started. The Archon doesn't connect to anything, and he never tries to be compelling. His only good scene is his introduction, because he doesn't speak and it has some nice visual storytelling. So that is his only plus. The main villain for Andromeda however is Addison! Her face is constantly tired, and she can't pronounce Pathfinder. Exactly. Those are all great characters because you can sympathize with them, even if you are their rival. I think the only villains that had an excuse to be "evil and you can't comprehend my reasons" were our dear Cthulhus in the trilogy, but that was justified, it's what they are supposed to be, and actually made them a lot more terrifying at first. Sovereign's speech is still all chills to this day for me, not considering the resolution for that problem, of course ![:lol:](//storage.proboards.com/6576594/images/qUctXNjCPgwPaLsZeKry.png) . But yes, Irenicus, Loghain and the Arishok were good examples, they were all great villains, had compelling motivations and you can respect them a lot for it. And I still think Solas has the potential to be the best villain of Bioware to date, if they play their cards right. It would be better if we could face him as the Inquisitor, because of our already developed relationship with him, it would be a lot more personal (and that's why I don't like the changing of protagonists in Dragon Age). And, I hope those who want to redeem him instead of killing him, get their shot. But maybe give us sadistic bitches/bastards the chance to finish him off as well. ![:devil:](//storage.proboards.com/6576594/images/vm0LdmaZNliQuiOl0pxw.png) Options, options.
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Post by suikoden on Apr 5, 2017 4:35:05 GMT
I guess some people are simply ignorant of their own failings of comprehension. Feel free to click the link and prove yourself wrong.
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linksocarina
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Always teacher, sometimes writer
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
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Post by linksocarina on Apr 5, 2017 4:39:31 GMT
I guess some people are simply ignorant of their own failings of comprehension. Feel free to click the link and prove yourself wrong. You really don't get it, do you? Let me spell it out and be absolutely clear then: not only are your feelings wrong, but you are formulating the wrong argument to make about what happened on the old forums. So shut the fuck up, you fucking moron.
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Post by suikoden on Apr 5, 2017 4:40:30 GMT
The hate on this game is becoming obnoxious. No "whatever floats your boat" here, just howling and shrieking as if it's literally and objectively the most ungodly stinking turd to ever drop in the entire history of electronic entertainment. It's a video game. It involves shooting badguys with guns and space magic as well as exploring new planets. Does it succeed at that? Hell yes. Would I prefer that the writing and characterization that surrounds it were a bit more elegant? Sure. Is the writing leaps and bounds worse than previous Bioware? No. Bioware games have always had their fair share of cool moments and cringe and ME:A is no different. Oh, and if you think DA:O release wasn't a shit storm you're actually deluded. Just Google "Dragon Age Origins graphics" and look for posts from around the release. People were up in arms about how bad it looked. Keep tooting that horn. A whole 25 posters on an IGN forum and 3 pages on a giant bomb forum. PEOPLE ARE UP IN ARMS!!! IT WAS SO BAD!! Get real. Read the metacritic user reviews for Origins. You don't think it would filled with 0's deriding the graphics if they were an issue? Andromeda is an all-time low for outrage and ridicule - don't keep trying to sully the past to make Andromeda better than it is. It's pretty sad.
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Post by alanc9 on Apr 5, 2017 4:41:15 GMT
He's telling the truth. A lot of old-time players were very upset at DAO copying MMO concepts like Threat and infinitely increasing stats. Eventually most of them came around because of the game's strengths in other areas, but it really was bad for a few weeks. Nothing like as bad as NWN's release, of course. You are in denial. Nope. From my perspective that's revisionist history. You're the one in denial - keep trying to make Andromeda appear on par with Bioware's past. Feel free to check out DA:O on metacritic and look up it's early user reviews. If there was any discontent, that'd be filled with 0's just like with Andromeda, but guess what? It's not. "From my perspective?" That's just silly. Either it's a factual question or it isn't. As for Metacritic zeroes, were people doing that back then? linksocarina and I were only talking about forum chatter. And don't lie about my position on ME:A. I have never claimed it's the equal of earlier Bio games. I have not reviewed ME:A yet at all -- my PC won't run it adequately, and I haven't been able to put in enough time on borrowed rigs to form a final opinion, though I'm fairly happy with the little I've played. My best guess is that I'll rank it above the NWN OC and SOU, Jade Empire, and ME1, but that's just a guess. So, below-average Bioware. What I have claimed is that I've seen this sort of reaction before about Bio games, that some specific criticisms are incoherent nonsense, and that other specific criticisms apply equally well to other Bio games. I'll stand by those statements.
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Post by smilesja on Apr 5, 2017 4:42:32 GMT
So I guess the vocal contingent of fans bitching about origins being too easy, linear and nothing like baldurs gate never happened then? Or the complaints about graphics and bugs and all that as well? It's not about comparing the two games (where you got that idea is a mystery) but pointing out how predictable the pattern of behavior is with most of the people on this forum. Do not try to whitewash events by denying they didn't exist. Nothing peeves me more when people do that. And I say to you - don't try and whitewash Andromeda's flaws by bitching about Bioware's past - which produced far more polished work than its present. www.metacritic.com/game/pc/dragon-age-origins/user-reviews?sort-by=date&num_items=100&page=6What makes you think he is whitewashing ME: A's flaws? It's been well established that Origins back then wasn't well received by some long time gamers. Constantly putting a link to metacritic isn't going to erase that fact.
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Post by suikoden on Apr 5, 2017 4:42:37 GMT
Feel free to click the link and prove yourself wrong. You really don't get it, do you? Let me spell it out and be absolutely clear then: not only are your feelings wrong, but you are formulating the wrong argument to make about what happened on the old forums. So shut the fuck up, you fucking moron. That kinda talk is what gets you banned. Why the need to throw around insults? Did you get that angry when you clicked the link? You're absolutely seething. I was on the old forums - the response doesn't compare in the slightest to the derision that Andromeda is rightfully getting for its lack of polish.
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Post by suikoden on Apr 5, 2017 4:44:54 GMT
Nope. From my perspective that's revisionist history. You're the one in denial - keep trying to make Andromeda appear on par with Bioware's past. Feel free to check out DA:O on metacritic and look up it's early user reviews. If there was any discontent, that'd be filled with 0's just like with Andromeda, but guess what? It's not. "From my perspective?" That's just silly. Either it's a factual question or it isn't. As for Metacritic zeroes, were people doing that back then? linksocarina and I were only talking about forum chatter. And don't lie about my position on ME:A. I have never claimed it's the equal of earlier Bio games. I have not reviewed ME:A yet at all -- my PC won't run it adequately, and I haven't been able to put in enough time on borrowed rigs to form a final opinion, though I'm fairly happy with the little I've played. My best guess is that I'll rank it above the NWN OC and SOU, Jade Empire, and ME1, but that's just a guess. So, below-average Bioware. What I have claimed is that I've seen this sort of reaction before about Bio games, that some specific criticisms are incoherent nonsense, and that other specific criticisms apply equally well to other Bio games. I'll stand by those statements. Metacritic has been around since the late 90's. It's full of reviews from back in 2009 when the game released (mine is one of them actually). Apologies for lumping you in with the apologists. I'll agree with you there's always been criticisms, I'd argue they've never been as deserved as they are now, however.
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Post by alanc9 on Apr 5, 2017 4:45:01 GMT
I guess some people are simply ignorant of their own failings of comprehension. It's pretty much what my alcoholic brother does when he's been drinking -- he keeps having the argument he wants to have rather than the argument the other people he's talking to are having.
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Post by suikoden on Apr 5, 2017 4:47:39 GMT
What makes you think he is whitewashing ME: A's flaws. It's been well established that Origins back then wasn't well received by some long time gamers. Constantly putting a link to metacritic isn't going to erase that fact. Aside from being proof you mean? How is it well-established exactly? Because two forum posters said so? Because 25 posters on an old IGN forum said so? Because of a couple of pages on a Giant Bomb forum (that apparently everyone hates because they gave Andromeda a 2/5?). By all means, support your claim.
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linksocarina
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Always teacher, sometimes writer
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
Posts: 3,186 Likes: 4,072
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Post by linksocarina on Apr 5, 2017 4:47:53 GMT
I guess some people are simply ignorant of their own failings of comprehension. It's pretty much what my alcoholic brother does when he's been drinking -- he keeps having the argument he wants to have rather than the argument the other people he's talking to are having. Moving the goal posts and other lovely fallacies of logic. I deal with that behavior in my day to day with my students, I'd expect smarter argumentation here too much sometimes.
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Post by alanc9 on Apr 5, 2017 4:48:07 GMT
"From my perspective?" That's just silly. Either it's a factual question or it isn't. As for Metacritic zeroes, were people doing that back then? linksocarina and I were only talking about forum chatter. And don't lie about my position on ME:A. I have never claimed it's the equal of earlier Bio games. I have not reviewed ME:A yet at all -- my PC won't run it adequately, and I haven't been able to put in enough time on borrowed rigs to form a final opinion, though I'm fairly happy with the little I've played. My best guess is that I'll rank it above the NWN OC and SOU, Jade Empire, and ME1, but that's just a guess. So, below-average Bioware. What I have claimed is that I've seen this sort of reaction before about Bio games, that some specific criticisms are incoherent nonsense, and that other specific criticisms apply equally well to other Bio games. I'll stand by those statements. Metacritic has been around since the late 90's. It's full of reviews from back in 2009 when the game released (mine is one of them actually). Apologies for lumping you in with the apologists. I'll agree with you there's always been criticisms, I'd argue they've never been as deserved as they are now, however. Bad edit on my part. I meant to specifically talk about the review bombing with zeroes which you brought up. My impression is that's a more recent behavior, so DAO not getting so bombed is meaningless.
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Games: Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition
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Post by dis_Op2399 on Apr 5, 2017 4:48:16 GMT
Keep tooting that horn. A whole 25 posters on an IGN forum and 3 pages on a giant bomb forum. PEOPLE ARE UP IN ARMS!!! IT WAS SO BAD!! Get real. Read the metacritic user reviews for Origins. You don't think it would filled with 0's deriding the graphics if they were an issue? Andromeda is an all-time low for outrage and ridicule - don't keep trying to sully the past to make Andromeda better than it is. It's pretty sad. Of course metacritic - that bastion of rational objective thought! Definitely not just full of pitchfork wielding numbskull reactionaries like yourself. Like the ones there are for every major game release. Kid you're so deluded. It's almost sweet. But go ahead keep weeping in butthurt self-pity about how Andromeda touched you in bad places.
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Post by suikoden on Apr 5, 2017 4:50:03 GMT
I guess some people are simply ignorant of their own failings of comprehension. It's pretty much what my alcoholic brother does when he's been drinking -- he keeps having the argument he wants to have rather than the argument the other people he's talking to are having. Pretty petty and callous of you to say something like that. Not surprising, though. It's like all of you can't even fathom how someone might have a different opinion in your secluded little refuge here on the internet from all of the criticism Andromeda is receiving. We should just agree to disagree and leave it at that.
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Post by smilesja on Apr 5, 2017 4:50:58 GMT
You really don't get it, do you? Let me spell it out and be absolutely clear then: not only are your feelings wrong, but you are formulating the wrong argument to make about what happened on the old forums. So shut the fuck up, you fucking moron. That kinda talk is what gets you banned. Why the need to throw around insults? Did you get that angry when you clicked the link? You're absolutely seething. I was on the old forums - the response doesn't compare in the slightest to the derision that Andromeda is rightfully getting for its lack of polish. Please.... You've been throwing insults around, and you're still here. Though I think linksocarina needs to tone it down a bit.
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Post by NUM13ER on Apr 5, 2017 4:51:07 GMT
Is anyoen gonna bring up the fact that this isnt bioware prime? To be fair that doesn't hurt the case being made EA and BioWare are not treating their franchises well. Handing off one of your biggest franchises to a team that cannot handle it, whilst your A-teams are otherwise occupied, isn't encouraging.
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Post by smilesja on Apr 5, 2017 4:52:19 GMT
It's pretty much what my alcoholic brother does when he's been drinking -- he keeps having the argument he wants to have rather than the argument the other people he's talking to are having. Pretty petty and callous of you to say something like that. Not surprising, though. It's like all of you can't even fathom how someone might have a different opinion in your secluded little refuge here on the internet from all of the criticism Andromeda is receiving. We should just agree to disagree and leave it at that. Did you even read his arguments? Anyones for that matter? You keep twisting them to fit your own argument, that's why people are angry at you.
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Post by suikoden on Apr 5, 2017 4:52:26 GMT
Keep tooting that horn. A whole 25 posters on an IGN forum and 3 pages on a giant bomb forum. PEOPLE ARE UP IN ARMS!!! IT WAS SO BAD!! Get real. Read the metacritic user reviews for Origins. You don't think it would filled with 0's deriding the graphics if they were an issue? Andromeda is an all-time low for outrage and ridicule - don't keep trying to sully the past to make Andromeda better than it is. It's pretty sad. Of course metacritic - that bastion of rational objective thought! Definitely not just full of pitchfork wielding numbskull reactionaries like yourself. Like the ones there are for every major game release. Kid you're so deluded. It's almost sweet. But go ahead keep weeping in butthurt self-pity about how Andromeda touched you in bad places. Ahh the insults keep coming. You're making the other apologists who have a rational opinion look bad, you know that right? My point was (if you bothered to click the Metacritic link - which you didn't), was that if there was a shitstorm in the past regarding DA:O's graphics, that would have appeared on its Metacritic - but low and behold, there's a whole lotta 10's! ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/6576594/images/KGsHESiZGZU0pPuHuhQr.png)
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Post by KaiserShep on Apr 5, 2017 4:52:31 GMT
The hate on this game is becoming obnoxious. No "whatever floats your boat" here, just howling and shrieking as if it's literally and objectively the most ungodly stinking turd to ever drop in the entire history of electronic entertainment. It's a video game. It involves shooting badguys with guns and space magic as well as exploring new planets. Does it succeed at that? Hell yes. Would I prefer that the writing and characterization that surrounds it were a bit more elegant? Sure. Is the writing leaps and bounds worse than previous Bioware? No. Bioware games have always had their fair share of cool moments and cringe and ME:A is no different. Oh, and if you think DA:O release wasn't a shit storm you're actually deluded. Just Google "Dragon Age Origins graphics" and look for posts from around the release. People were up in arms about how bad it looked. Keep tooting that horn. A whole 25 posters on an IGN forum and 3 pages on a giant bomb forum. PEOPLE ARE UP IN ARMS!!! IT WAS SO BAD!! Get real. Read the metacritic user reviews for Origins. You don't think it would filled with 0's deriding the graphics if they were an issue? Andromeda is an all-time low for outrage and ridicule - don't keep trying to sully the past to make Andromeda better than it is. It's pretty sad. Honestly, the reception for both Inquisition and Andromeda are fairly tame compared to how it was when, say, Mass Effect 3 was released. What a fucking shitshow that was. The ending pissed people off to no end and some people still complain about it. To many, it's largely considered a massive torching of the franchise. When was the last time outside of that game did BioWare actually write new sequences and add content just to put a bandage over the backlash in a game's narrative like the Extended Cut? No one is going to give a varren queef about face animation 6 years from now.
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Post by commandercole5 on Apr 5, 2017 4:55:38 GMT
Is anyoen gonna bring up the fact that this isnt bioware prime? To be fair that doesn't hurt the case being made EA and BioWare are not treating their franchises well. Handing off one of your biggest franchises to a team that cannot handle it, whilst your A-teams are otherwise occupied, isn't encouraging. Oh no I totally agree, I just feel bad for BMon, they are DLC and MP makers, not a (an?) AAA A team...thats to many A's
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Post by suikoden on Apr 5, 2017 4:56:33 GMT
Pretty petty and callous of you to say something like that. Not surprising, though. It's like all of you can't even fathom how someone might have a different opinion in your secluded little refuge here on the internet from all of the criticism Andromeda is receiving. We should just agree to disagree and leave it at that. Did you even read his arguments? Anyones for that matter? You keep twisting them to fit your own argument, that's why people are angry at you. This is his argument:1. Other Bioware games had issues. 2. Therefore, it's natural for Andromeda to have issues. Heres my argument:1. Other Bioware games had issues. 2. But you can put all of those issues together and they'd amount to less issues than Andromeda currently has. 3. Therefore - its disingenuous and downright insulting to compare Bioware's past to its present in an attempt to make Andromeda seem adequate.
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Always teacher, sometimes writer
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
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August 2016
linksocarina
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
LinksOcarina
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Post by linksocarina on Apr 5, 2017 5:01:09 GMT
It's pretty much what my alcoholic brother does when he's been drinking -- he keeps having the argument he wants to have rather than the argument the other people he's talking to are having. Pretty petty and callous of you to say something like that. Not surprising, though. It's like all of you can't even fathom how someone might have a different opinion in your secluded little refuge here on the internet from all of the criticism Andromeda is receiving. We should just agree to disagree and leave it at that. You come in here trying to prove an argument that no one is having, insult myself and others in passive agressive way and fall back on "in my opinion" now when multiple people told you that it's wrong? Then you use evidence that is irrelevant to the point and chide others for disagreeing with you, accusing them of being apologists, petty and liars when they simply point out something of known record that happened, against the tide of the internet rating games on an unreliable aggregate website vs the long time folks on here who witnessed the complining of the said game here? No. You're not getting the privilege of saying agree to disagree. You're assertions are wrong, your demeanor is pitiful, your arguments are terrible and almost everyone here knows it.
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The Smiling Knight
538
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Jun 23, 2024 20:27:39 GMT
22,315
smilesja
13,898
August 2016
smilesja
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Post by smilesja on Apr 5, 2017 5:02:36 GMT
Did you even read his arguments? Anyones for that matter? You keep twisting them to fit your own argument, that's why people are angry at you. This is his argument:1. Other Bioware games had issues. 2. Therefore, it's natural for Andromeda to have issues. Heres my argument:1. Other Bioware games had issues. 2. But you can put all of those issues together and they'd amount to less issues than Andromeda currently has. 3. Therefore - its disingenuous and downright insulting to compare Bioware's past to its present in an attempt to make Andromeda seem adequate. That is not what he was saying at all.
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