Cyan_Griffonclaw
N5
Uncle Cyan
Dang it.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: griffonclaw39
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Post by Cyan_Griffonclaw on Apr 7, 2017 11:39:15 GMT
www.forbes.com/sites/davidthier/2017/04/06/mass-effect-andromeda-and-how-games-take-advantage-of-their-biggest-fans/#3f55fee9162bI get it now. If I don't want to feel burned about an unfinished product or it being buggy, then it's best to wait it out. The whole notion of preordering to get some digital stuff is by no means worth it. Inquisition took five months to get all the 'kinks' worked out. Andromeda, even though they fixed a lot in just a few days, still puts me on the wary side. I'll get the DLC for Inquisition because apparently, the DLC actually continues and concludes the Inquisition. For me, it's way more convenient to buy the deluxe edition down the road. I wish I was into multiplayer, then I would dive in right away.
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Apr 7, 2017 12:00:03 GMT
It's so true, the fact that biggest fans are pretty much burned with every BioWare release. We got the buggiest ME3 and the shittiest ending, we got the most "meh" ending for DA:I and the most game-breaking bugs that were not supposed to be there in a shippable game (cassandra's romance scene and the Warden subplot had mandatory gamebreaking scenes, requiring you to mash the "skip" button to make it through, a la Drack's Loyalty fail) and now we have Andromeda which is inarguably the sloppiest day-1 release BioWare has ever made but in a year's time it'll be a decent/great game overall and only the non-fans or the most patient but unenthusiastic fans will pick it up for the first time then and be totally oblivious to how bad the game was in march 2017.
I get it. Every game in this day and age gets more stable over its fiscal year with patches but BioWare has learned it's okay to ship games in near unacceptable states and get away with it.
I hope the reviews serve as a lesson, however. It's a sign that not even journalists or critics are okay with this now that they have much better and more impressive AAA titles to compare it to which they definitely did not have back in 2014 when the only other really good contenders were Destiny, which shipped with barebones, almost placeholder content and Shadow of Mordor - a good game but not a "masterpiece" or anything of that calibre.
Over at those Glassdoor reviews, multiple negative ones mention that leaders at BioWare take breaks to play computer games for fun which is bad for morale. You get the impression that there's a lot of slack going on over there which would also explain how and why both DA:I and this game ended up shipping with very simple icing-on-the-top additions being cut right before release, whether that's the nonexistent Squad customizations (just apperances) or the lack of costumes in DA:I which wasn't added until much later.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2017 12:04:35 GMT
Harsh, but fair. I agree with what he said. I'm waiting out anyway. Have to fully commit to this game later, and I'd rather have everything improved, including the CC.
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Post by decafhigh on Apr 7, 2017 12:11:06 GMT
This is the first BW game since ME2 that I bought at release. Guess I learned my lesson.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2017 12:12:38 GMT
While a small part of me is mad that Andromeda has taken a bigger hit for this than other AAA titles, such as every broken Ubisoft release. It is also a good thing. A chance for Bioware to get their act together and do better in the future. We've already seen the results from this first patch and what can be fixed in just a few weeks/a month.
I usually wait with purchasing games now because of this, and waiting for a goty edition is a smart move. Still i am part of the problem when it comes to Bioware as they are my weakness. Will do better when it comes to the new IP and Dragon Age 4.
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Post by warbaby2 on Apr 7, 2017 12:13:15 GMT
This is the first BW game since ME2 that I bought at release. Guess I learned my lesson. If we just wouldn't have to relearn that lessen in regular intervals... humans are idiots like that.
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Post by Fogg on Apr 7, 2017 12:14:59 GMT
I'm still a big fan and like the game. But...
1) I'm not going to pre-order anymore.
2) I'm going to wait with ME:A for a couple of more patches before I do a new playthrough. Too much bugs still unresolved.
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Apr 7, 2017 12:17:03 GMT
No matter how much I groan or feel cynical during the promotional content and pre-release days for the recent BioWare games I always end up being too excited on day 1 not to buy the thing. I don't regret anything, I just want BioWare to actually plan their development better and get things done on time rather than saying "we can always ship Q1 and then fix up the stuff that didn't quite make it."
Everything about DA:I and now especially this just reeks of "sloppy".
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Post by decafhigh on Apr 7, 2017 12:18:04 GMT
This is the first BW game since ME2 that I bought at release. Guess I learned my lesson. If we just wouldn't have to relearn that lessen in regular intervals... humans are idiots like that. Well, full disclosure, release issues isn't why I wasn't buying them. ME2 just killed my attachment to the OT. I figured I would give BW another chance since they were basically soft rebooting the series anyway. But still ended up biting me.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2017 12:20:20 GMT
No matter how much I groan or feel cynical during the promotional content and pre-release days for the recent BioWare games I always end up being too excited on day 1 not to buy the thing. I don't regret anything, I just want BioWare to actually plan their development better and get things done on time rather than saying "we can always ship Q1 and then fix up the stuff that didn't quite make it." Everything about DA:I and now especially this just reeks of "sloppy". Yeah, but atleast this time they got called out on it, in a big way. Which means they have to shape up, as the next game will be examined that much more closely for faults. It is a good thing, all in all.
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Post by warbaby2 on Apr 7, 2017 12:21:20 GMT
If we just wouldn't have to relearn that lessen in regular intervals... humans are idiots like that. Well, full disclosure, release issues isn't why I wasn't buying them. ME2 just killed my attachment to the OT. I figured I would give BW another chance since they were basically soft rebooting the series anyway. But still ended up biting me. Personally, I like to believe that with each release like this one, more and more people will be turned off from the whole pre-order culture, until it ultimately dies off and companies will be forced to actually finish their games again, before releasing them... we'll see, I guess.
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DoctorFox
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Post by DoctorFox on Apr 7, 2017 12:21:24 GMT
Harsh, but fair. I agree with what he said. I'm waiting out anyway. Have to fully commit to this game later, and I'd rather have everything improved, including the CC. Same. I'll finish my first playthrough that i've already started with a default Ryder face then i'm just going to wait until the improved CC is out and the stutter bugs are gone.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2017 12:34:26 GMT
That's one of the reasons that I don't preorder games or buy them at release. I'm in no hurry, I've got plenty of games to play.
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Post by Qui-Gon GlenN7 on Apr 7, 2017 12:37:06 GMT
"Something has got to give."
It has already. He was not entirely correct that ME3 fans were across the board willing to be beta testers again.
I didn't buy the game, I almost did. I decided early on to wait, and then nostalgia and 3MP friendships made me want the game and I Amazon'd it. Then I canceled, as sense came back to me.
I am the fan he describes, and they lost me. Something has got to give.
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Cyan_Griffonclaw
N5
Uncle Cyan
Dang it.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Cyan_Griffonclaw on Apr 7, 2017 12:38:43 GMT
If we just wouldn't have to relearn that lessen in regular intervals... humans are idiots like that. Well, full disclosure, release issues isn't why I wasn't buying them. ME2 just killed my attachment to the OT. I figured I would give BW another chance since they were basically soft rebooting the series anyway. But still ended up biting me. I'm guilty too.
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mmoblitz
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USN-Retired
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by mmoblitz on Apr 7, 2017 12:39:17 GMT
AS a rule I don't pre-order games, in fact I often wait until the final patch/DLC is put out and buy in a package deal. I Save money and get the best experience for my money. That is how I buy all games. MMO's of course if a bit different. Will usually wait a month or two then buy it. I already have and played MEA, but that is because my daughter bought it for me as an early Birthday gift since she knew I had the trilogy and liked playing it.
Until gamers speak with their wallets and stop pre-ordering games and accepting games that are clearly released before they are ready, publishers will continue to release crap and push the envelope to see what they can get away with. Don't blame the devs/publishers, blame yourselves for allowing it to continue.
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Post by slimgrin on Apr 7, 2017 13:07:21 GMT
Yep. This is why I waited. The number of devs who release a polished product on release is far smaller than it should be. These are AAA publishers with AAA budgets.
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Post by Kappa Neko on Apr 7, 2017 13:10:35 GMT
The three previous Bioware games (DA2, ME3, DAI) were the only games I ever bought at release, DAI was a preorder. And I had no regrets. DAI was not particularly buggy for me on PC except for cutscene crashes that did get a bit annoying. But nothing actually game-breaking.
All other games I bought cheap used for Xbox. Now on PC I wait for digital sales. I'm never in a hurry to play games. Bioware being an exception because I want to be part of the early discussions and don't want to be all paranoid about spoilers for months.
But it really never pays to buy games on release day these days. Many are super buggy. MEA was a disgrace at release. I haven't bought it yet and will just borrow it from a friend after the game gets patched enough. Waiting/hoping for a major combat overhaul. I hate bullet sponges. And I want the thundering biotic boom back. Would love to play the MP too but sounds like balancing is a real mess. So not touching that until they make it actually fun to play.
If we accept shit and eat it up, companies will keep serving shit. Simple as that.
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Cyan_Griffonclaw
N5
Uncle Cyan
Dang it.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: griffonclaw39
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Post by Cyan_Griffonclaw on Apr 7, 2017 13:12:49 GMT
Yep. This is why I waited. The number of devs who release a polished product on release is far smaller than it should be. These are AAA publishers with AAA budgets. I'm beginning to think EA is doing more to just make a fast buck and playing it cheap (this is far from safe) instead of just letting the developers and artists do their thing and making big bucks. Bioware literally prints money.
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Post by Doctor Fumbles on Apr 7, 2017 13:15:55 GMT
Eh, I will still continue to pre-order games even though I might get burnt from it. It is like trying new food out. Sometimes you enjoy it while other times it tastes like crap. At least, you gave it a shot though.
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Post by simsimillia on Apr 7, 2017 13:36:49 GMT
You know what's weird. The first time I played through the game, I didn't encounter many bugs and glitches, apart from the typical clipping and the infamous animation issues I encountered ONE bug where my game crashed to desktop...that's it!
Now I started a second playthrough (before the new patch) and I suddenly get ALL the bugs. - when the Hyperion arrives and approaches Habitat 7, the outside is just black, no scourge, no planet, nothing. - when I take the tram to get to the Nexus the first time, I get stuck in a view of the tramrail system and have to kill and restart the game - when approaching Eos, Liam suddenly creeps up REALLY close behind my Sara like some freak - when fighting at one of the monoliths on Eos I manage to end up inside a rock
It's like I get it all at once now.
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Post by isaidlunch on Apr 7, 2017 13:51:33 GMT
Bioware games are my exception when it comes to pre-ordering and this will probably be the end of it. I had fun, but I'll gladly take a polished game over a pet pyjak.
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VanSinn
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by VanSinn on Apr 7, 2017 14:21:39 GMT
I was on the fence for a long time about ME:A. Then I saw enough in the pre-release media stuff that gave me very strong ME1 "but better" vibes that I knew I was gonna buy the game eventually anyway. I pre-ordered 2 days before the game released, but I knew what I was getting into. I knew there'd be bugs (no open-ish world game in the last decade hasn't released with bugs, Skyrim, Fallout 3, NV and 4, Witcher series, etc...) and I knew the animations had some issues.
Those aren't huge deals for me, though, 'cause bugs will (usually) be worked out, and animations are icing on the cake, not the cake itself.
I will say that I'm satisfied with my early purchase, and now I know that the game will be getting better over the next few months? Even better news!
I'm totally on board with the whole vote with your wallet and wait, I didn't buy Fallout 4 until almost a year after release, same with Witcher 3, etc. While on some level I think the criticism of Bioware has gone over and beyond the actual issues the game has, it doesn't bother me to see it. Hopefully any sequels will be more polished before initial release. I still believe Bioware wanted to polish more, but EA forced the release to meet fiscal deadlines, so I don't necessarily blame Bioware itself, but if the criticism helps out the next game, I'm all for it.
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stysiaq
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Gigavorcha Breeder
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by stysiaq on Apr 7, 2017 14:54:18 GMT
www.forbes.com/sites/davidthier/2017/04/06/mass-effect-andromeda-and-how-games-take-advantage-of-their-biggest-fans/#3f55fee9162bI get it now. If I don't want to feel burned about an unfinished product or it being buggy, then it's best to wait it out. The whole notion of preordering to get some digital stuff is by no means worth it. Inquisition took five months to get all the 'kinks' worked out. Andromeda, even though they fixed a lot in just a few days, still puts me on the wary side. I'll get the DLC for Inquisition because apparently, the DLC actually continues and concludes the Inquisition. For me, it's way more convenient to buy the deluxe edition down the road. I wish I was into multiplayer, then I would dive in right away. All it takes is a little willpower and not preordering stuff. I'm a die-hard ME fan, yet I managed to not buy the game and will wait till it's ready. Sucks to be in position where you do a full playthrough before the patch. But writing was there on the wall.
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xassantex
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by xassantex on Apr 7, 2017 15:02:07 GMT
the article is good, except that no matter what, bad writing is "hard coded" into the game, no patches and DLC will improve it. They would have to re-hire writers and voice actors and re-do the lip sync... not happening. And the empty writing is what pisses me off the most .
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