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Post by alanc9 on Apr 13, 2017 15:28:19 GMT
Meh. It's Latin but it's commonly used in English. Other Latin words we use in English are alias, P.S.(post script), and etc.(etctera). Would you have complained too if someone said alias? Moniker or Assumed name would be a less confusing and more accurate translation actually. Is English, perhaps, not your native language? Alias is far more common than the alternatives. Look up the ngrams yourself.
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Post by KaiserShep on Apr 13, 2017 15:30:08 GMT
Yes. But which language are we hearing on the translators? English or whichever language you play the game in. An Earth language. So of course, we would hear it through a language we understand. So while alias is more commonly used on earth, we would hear that word more often even if Pee Bee or Garrus or whovever used than moniker Of course, some languages may just wither off the vine.
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Post by Sah291 on Apr 13, 2017 15:42:15 GMT
Garrus was fond of human sayings... I always assumed he understood the idioms he used, but of course he spent a lot of time around humans, what with working on the Citadel, then living on Omega, and being part of Shepard's crew.
On the Ship's little message board thing, Jaal is teaching the crew Angaran words.
I guess it's weird she's using it with Peebee, but Ryder is also listening, so eh. Probably best not to think too deeply about it, the problem of alien languages is glossed over as it is.
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Post by jnericsonx on Apr 13, 2017 17:29:51 GMT
The poster protests too much, methinks.
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Post by kino on Apr 13, 2017 17:39:51 GMT
I'd be more shocked if a translator couldn't interpret Latin than not. Or that a species like the Asari didn't make it a point to learn Latin since most of our biology and medical sciences are labeled in the Latin language.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 13, 2017 17:42:25 GMT
It's a good point, no need for defensive fanboy mode.
Anyone remember this scene from beginning of ME I when Nihlus makes that alien "tick"
On the other hand, this was really poor in comparison:
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Post by jf8350143 on Apr 13, 2017 17:55:41 GMT
You know, Chinese and English is two very different languages, but they have different phrases for the same meaning. And when you translate one into another, you translate one phrase into another, even their literally meaning is different.
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Post by n7ltrobbiesann7 on Apr 13, 2017 18:28:09 GMT
I'm keeping mind they all originate from the milky way galaxy. Is there any reason they would not have learned some human history/phrases before AI?
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Post by kumazan on Apr 13, 2017 18:31:18 GMT
This is the 6437363rd example of BioWare being inconsistent on linguistics and how the translator works. This particular issue being dealt with seriousness and consistency is a ship that has long sailed, it's become a feature by now.
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Post by raikas on Apr 13, 2017 18:38:38 GMT
In Henry VI Shakespeare uses Quid Pro Quo. So, the elcor that did Hamlet obviously also did Henry VI, which is where Vetra and PeeBee picked it up. Obviously. This is really a perfect answer.
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Post by projectpatdc on Apr 13, 2017 18:47:43 GMT
*knocks over Ryncol*
The translator. It just works, damnit! Hehe
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Post by wellsoul2 on Apr 13, 2017 18:58:37 GMT
Considering most of these people were born 170 years in the future we probably would not understand half of the language or idiom of the time.
As in any game it also incorporates speech and issues of the time and technology like flatscreen video screens in Ryder's cabin.
Chances are many items in the future would be unrecognizable, but we primitives are playing the game and so they make things look futuristic without being incomprehensible to our eyes.
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Post by alanc9 on Apr 13, 2017 19:02:15 GMT
It's a good point, no need for defensive fanboy mode. Anyone remember this scene from beginning of ME I when Nihlus makes that alien "tick" What's good about a point founded on a basic miscomprehension of how communication works in the MEU?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 13, 2017 19:05:49 GMT
Sheesh, I expected so much more from the alleged classically educated Turians. I mean, if Vetra finished a banter with "Vale, Pelessaria B'Sayle!" I'd start getting concerned. or if Drack went on reciting Greek poetry...
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Post by alanc9 on Apr 13, 2017 20:31:31 GMT
This is the 6437363rd example of BioWare being inconsistent on linguistics and how the translator works. This particular issue being dealt with seriousness and consistency is a ship that has long sailed, it's become a feature by now. Total consistency wouldn't really be necessary. At any level of proficiency below total fluency, some idioms would be understood correctly and others not. It's very easy to imagine a ltranslator (or a speaker, doesn't matter) understanding "quid pro quo" while not understanding the far less common "fly in the ointment." Quid pro quo would be pretty much mandatory for a translator, since it's used so often in political and legal contexts.
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Post by FrodosCat on Apr 13, 2017 21:17:14 GMT
It's been awhile since I've had so much fun reading a thread. Thanks!
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Post by Fen'Harel Faceman on Apr 13, 2017 21:19:29 GMT
Friends, Romans, countrymen. I was off exploring a shattered planet in the Andromeda galaxy today, in a six wheel drive, all terrain space vehicle, doing jumps when I encountered something that breaks immersion. A robust, planet spanning exchange between PeeBee and Vetra had evolved into a tender moment in the back of the Nomad. Purely platonic. After arguing for three planets we had arrived at the point the girls would make up and admit they liked each other. And then it happened.... Vetra: Quid pro quo, PeeBee? PeeBee: Oh, I know, your sorry for jumping down my throat when I was saying sorry for jumping down your throat. They went on to have a heart warming tender moment that brought a smile to my face, as it was almost loving. But then I heard it again in my mind..... Quid pro quo.....PeeBee? And THAT was where I drew the line. I placed the controller on the floor and turned the game off, wandered over and placed the remote on the top of the television and turned it off manually. How can an Asari understand latin? I asked myself. And how does vetra even know latin when she has no real turian education to speak of (let alone a doctorate in obscure near dead human languages)? Why are they speaking to each other in ancient roman in space anyway Zip? Is this confirmation that Turians are space Romans? Why is Bioware breaking my immersion with tender loving moments in the back of the Nomad? *Sips Ryncol*
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Post by maximusarael020 on Apr 13, 2017 21:41:48 GMT
Oh look, you made yet another complaint topic. Universal. F*cking. Translators. SINCE ME1!!! But why would Turians language be translated into latin? In a tender loving moment that I really enjoyed. Why? *Clutches Ryncol* So "Quid pro quo" doesn't really have an English translation. It does, technically, but it's like "something for something". But more than that, it's an idea. When you say "quid pro quo" you are saying an idea rather than using it for a direct translation. It would make sense that there could be other species that have similar types of things than cannot be translated directly but instead represent an idea. Shadenfreude is another example that we might use in English that is more of an idea that is a direct translation. Keelah se'lai is a Quarian word without translation, just a kind of meaning. So in this case there's a chance that the Turian's have a word that means something very much like our understanding of "Quid pro quo" and that that gives the best "translation". It's an idea that is translated, not actual words. We know what "quid pro quo" means because it's used conversationally, even though we don't speak Latin. So the Turian word or phrase for a concept that is very much like (and best translated as) quid pro quo was used in their exchange and thus we, as humans, hear "Quid pro quo?"
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Post by Sifr on Apr 14, 2017 0:09:23 GMT
Just to throw it out there, but Brits still use the term "quid" as slang for various amount of our currency (i.e. 20 quid is 20 pounds).
(And it just occurred to me that i.e. itself qualifies as another gratuitous bit of latin that we still use, since it's an abbreviation for id est "it is". The same is true of e.g. being exempli gratia "for the sake of an example".)
As others have said, the translator probably replaces various idioms and phrases with similar expressions spoken by other species, so they understand the concept the speaker is trying to convey.
The phrases "Quid pro quo", "tit for tat" or "you rub my back" would sound like complete gibberish to an alien race, as even if they tried to translate it directly, they wouldn't understand that it means someone asking for something in exchange or a favour.
It would be far easier for the translators to find and replace expressions that share similar meanings, rather than confusing the listener with cultural idioms of another species, that they don't fully understand or don't really translate well.
That said, we have seen various aliens comment on or muddle up certain human expressions.
Shepard had to correct a Turian in ME1 who said "A fly in the lotion" rather than "ointment", as well as the Asari socialites in ME3 who said "a stiff one in the lips", rather than "stiff-upper-lip".
The Anagara definitely have trouble following Ryder at times, due to their unfamiliarity with certain human expressions. Such as their non-plussed reaction to Ryder's awful dad jokes on Voeld about the "warm welcome" they received and trying to use humour to "break the ice".
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Apr 14, 2017 0:10:14 GMT
"Oops! Looks like our handwave in the codex of ME1 wasn't enough of an excuse!"
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Post by zipzap2000 on Apr 14, 2017 0:58:22 GMT
It's been awhile since I've had so much fun reading a thread. Thanks! *Lifts Ryncol*
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Post by zipzap2000 on Apr 14, 2017 1:37:40 GMT
But why would Turians language be translated into latin? In a tender loving moment that I really enjoyed. Why? *Clutches Ryncol* So "Quid pro quo" doesn't really have an English translation. It does, technically, but it's like "something for something". But more than that, it's an idea. When you say "quid pro quo" you are saying an idea rather than using it for a direct translation. It would make sense that there could be other species that have similar types of things than cannot be translated directly but instead represent an idea. Shadenfreude is another example that we might use in English that is more of an idea that is a direct translation. Keelah se'lai is a Quarian word without translation, just a kind of meaning. So in this case there's a chance that the Turian's have a word that means something very much like our understanding of "Quid pro quo" and that that gives the best "translation". It's an idea that is translated, not actual words. We know what "quid pro quo" means because it's used conversationally, even though we don't speak Latin. So the Turian word or phrase for a concept that is very much like (and best translated as) quid pro quo was used in their exchange and thus we, as humans, hear "Quid pro quo?" That would depend entirely on the context of the conversation. Quid pro quo is an interchangable phrase with many uses. Which are you referring to? *Sips Ryncol*
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Post by maximusarael020 on Apr 14, 2017 1:51:42 GMT
So "Quid pro quo" doesn't really have an English translation. It does, technically, but it's like "something for something". But more than that, it's an idea. When you say "quid pro quo" you are saying an idea rather than using it for a direct translation. It would make sense that there could be other species that have similar types of things than cannot be translated directly but instead represent an idea. Shadenfreude is another example that we might use in English that is more of an idea that is a direct translation. Keelah se'lai is a Quarian word without translation, just a kind of meaning. So in this case there's a chance that the Turian's have a word that means something very much like our understanding of "Quid pro quo" and that that gives the best "translation". It's an idea that is translated, not actual words. We know what "quid pro quo" means because it's used conversationally, even though we don't speak Latin. So the Turian word or phrase for a concept that is very much like (and best translated as) quid pro quo was used in their exchange and thus we, as humans, hear "Quid pro quo?" That would depend entirely on the context of the conversation. Quid pro quo is an interchangable phrase with many uses. Which are you referring to? *Sips Ryncol* It doesn't matter which one I might be referring to. What matters is the possibility that an advanced VI would be able to take words that represent ideas from one species and translate them into words representing those same ideas for another species. It's kind of like "The Milky Way" and "Andromeda". I'm mostly sure that Turian's, Quarian's, and Angara did not all decide independently to call these galaxies the same thing. However, where in English we call our home galaxy "The Milky Way", Quarian's might call it "Spirally McSpiralface". But the literal translation of what they are saying is then not important, according to the programming in the VI. It's the meaning. And so when they refer to the galaxy using the Quarian name, English-speaking humans will hear, through the translator, "The Milky Way." And so it is with "Quid Pro Quo." Vetra says something in the Turian language that is most equivalent to the English-adopted Latin phrase "Quid pro quo" and so that is what he hear.
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Post by alanc9 on Apr 14, 2017 2:04:14 GMT
Time to bail; this thread's going full troll.
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Post by Cypher on Apr 14, 2017 2:50:22 GMT
Maybe, just maybe, she actually said Quid Pro Quo untranslated just like you would say it untranslated, just like everyone uses various words in their native languages untranslated.
Or maybe it's a game with dialog written within the frame of reference of the average, current day person to make dialog more digestible and easier to understand, like damn near everything on the market.
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