KalleDemos
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kalledemos
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 18, 2017 19:24:24 GMT
If all this is true...while is does suck that we came quite close to minimized LGBT content, kudos to the ME team for revisiting that issue and making progressive choices in the end. Eh, kudos? If we were looking at ME alone, then yes (that is assuming Jaal is bi and not cut). But we have DA to compare, with 2 homosexual squadmates and a significant trans guy. The ME team going "oh crap, our gay content is looking pretty thin" is nowhere near praise worthy as "hey, we have multiple queer men in our ensemble, LGBT content is equal to straight content, and no one needed to remind us." I agree. Mass Effect doesn't exist inside a vacuum :ulikeit: . To do less in the area of LGBT content than the latest DA and ME games is to willingly exclude us. Didn't the leak state that was the original idea? I will try to withhold judgement until I've played the game for myself and there's still much we don't know. Anyway, throwing in gay content at the last minute is not worthy of praise but concern.
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KalleDemos
N2
#Resist
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 164 Likes: 474
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kalledemos
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 18, 2017 18:59:36 GMT
Like here in the forums where Dormer, an attractive actress, was auto assumed to have a romance role. Sexy Doctor trope anyone? For this reason I am pleased that Bioware decided to go in a different direction and hope that those of you who admire Dormer would come to appreciate her talents and Lexi in a non sexual capacity. The majority of people who were hoping that Dr. Lexi would be a romance option were hoping that before her VA was even revealed, and again half those were hoping for or were okay with her being a nonsexual romance option. You need to stop making assumptions about the posters here. Glad that you find joy in our sorrow, jerk. I was not responding to Lexi (still see sexy alien doctor trope) in a personal sense but to the response by the fandom and how marketing handled Dormer's VA reveal. Again, not firing at everyone.
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KalleDemos
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 164 Likes: 474
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kalledemos
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 18, 2017 17:00:06 GMT
Y'all need to stop. I can see wanting to romance Lexi but suggesting that sex appeal is the only thing that Dormer brings to the character and game on top of Lexi being an Asari with the 'space babe' trope hanging in the air makes this conversation sound misogynistic af. An attractive actor has been hired for something other than sexy sounds in a simulated sex scene? What an absolute travesty! This CANNOT be allowed to stand! No one I've seen has suggested sex appeal is the only thing Natalie Dormer brings to the character. She's a very talented actress... who also has mad sex appeal and nerd cred. To ignore this or believe BioWare isn't banking on it with not one, not two, but three videos promoting her and her role is just plain gullible. And to then take all this star power which most certainly didn't come cheap and not utilize it to its full extent by not making the character romanceable, and pissing off fans expecting it in the process is frankly, Wiseau levels of "special". I'm not ignoring it, I'm pointing out that it's a problem. The sexualization of Dormer in marketing is one piece of a larger issue that many of us in the forums have been decrying. It, that being, overt heteronormalization has left many of us feeling isolated I.E. the absence of Gil in marketing. Anthony is also an attractive actor who played a beloved character in a popular series. Why is it that he had absolutely no video interviews promoting his character who is actually a romance option? Perhaps another casualty was the promise to utilize Sara equally in marketing but instead we receive an abundance of Scott 'finding out for himself' with Cora and Peebee while ignoring that most of the main cast is gay or bisexual. Banking in on Dormer's appeal thrice while ignoring Anthony completely enforces the very corrosive idea that hetero male sexuality is 'normal' and everything else must submit to it or be pushed aside. This idea manifests itself in a variety of ways and in different intensities. Like here in the forums where Dormer, an attractive actress, was auto assumed to have a romance role. Sexy Doctor trope anyone? For this reason I am pleased that Bioware decided to go in a different direction and hope that those of you who admire Dormer would come to appreciate her talents and Lexi in a non sexual capacity.
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KalleDemos
N2
#Resist
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 164 Likes: 474
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 17, 2017 21:31:20 GMT
Y'all need to stop. I can see wanting to romance Lexi but suggesting that sex appeal is the only thing that Dormer brings to the character and game on top of Lexi being an Asari with the 'space babe' trope hanging in the air makes this conversation sound misogynistic af. An attractive actor has been hired for something other than sexy sounds in a simulated sex scene? What an absolute travesty! This CANNOT be allowed to stand! I hope this isn't directed at all the Lexi fans. I was hoping she was a nonsexual romance option. Not all of course. Some dialog I've seen around here has just been degrading on Dormer and her character.
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KalleDemos
N2
#Resist
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kalledemos
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 17, 2017 21:20:29 GMT
Y'all need to stop. I can see wanting to romance Lexi but suggesting that sex appeal is the only thing that Dormer brings to the character and game on top of Lexi being an Asari with the 'space babe' trope hanging in the air makes this conversation sound misogynistic af. An attractive actor has been hired for something other than sexy sounds in a simulated sex scene? What an absolute travesty! This CANNOT be allowed to stand!
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KalleDemos
N2
#Resist
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 164 Likes: 474
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 17, 2017 20:42:43 GMT
I try to romance everyone as I usually play Bioware games multiple times to see how the various choices, characters, etc pan out. It is still very meaningful to have romance options that I can personally identify with. It's just really unfair that straight men have been guaranteed for months to have such options for three different playthroughs while many of us have been worried about having even one.
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KalleDemos
N2
#Resist
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
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kalledemos
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 17, 2017 10:40:20 GMT
Maybe these insights are not getting to the attention of the right people by being discussed in the wrong places. Well, even though they shut down their own forums I can't imagine they dive in completely without customer input. Where can we discuss this where it will be seen by Bioware? I mean, they know these forums exist...
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KalleDemos
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 17, 2017 10:36:26 GMT
I honestly wonder what it would take for Bi Liam (and Cora), like maybe a few less flings or one side romance, to flesh this out. Committing more time into writing the romance instead of flings, when in fact there isn't much more to commit bc it's just to tweak the scenes and dialogue and other things a bit so it wouldn't be all the same. And why it couldn't be done/Bioware didn't want to do it. We could go to twitter and other outlets and 'politely' bring our concerns about this imbalance to their attention. Once the game is released they will have no more excuses or #Goodbanging to hide behind. I'm sure that many capable of math (all 3 women for straight Scott) would support us as this is blatantly unfair. Frankly the treatment we received on this issue all around from marketing and devs was horrendous. Bi Liam and Cora would be a great way to make up for it. This probably won't happen but we should ensure our voices are heard so that this situation doesn't occur again in the future.
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KalleDemos
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 17, 2017 10:20:18 GMT
This is totally unacceptable. Is there a way to reach devs without Twitter? E-mail or something? Not that I know of. But I have already seen a fair amount of people complaining about it and the game's sporadic autosave function. I'm sure it will come to their attention fairly quickly. I find it disconcerting that this is a problem in the first place. I mean...Why? media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lyoxdgU4sd1qfi704.gif
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KalleDemos
N2
#Resist
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 17, 2017 1:09:39 GMT
I agree Tali was totes into Femshep, but, uh, poly doesn't seem like the best idea for quarians. Unless they stay in their suits the whole time, I guess, but that would have a pretty small fanbase and also not really line up with the progression of the rest of her romance arc as written? Probably not but she was into it. I felt like the biggest downfall to romancing Garrus was that Tali would be alone. Same with Isabella and Merrill I felt a little guilty because they would be so cute together. Isabella and Merrill? Doesn't Isabella hook up with Fenris?
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KalleDemos
N2
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 16, 2017 21:45:54 GMT
Not what I wanted, but it was the closest I could get with what little options there were. I knew Dorian was connected but DAMN!
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KalleDemos
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#Resist
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 16, 2017 21:26:26 GMT
The devs said that Gil wasn't the only m/m romance in the game, but who knows at this point. Jaal. I'm guessing we don't get a third significant romance outside of the Reyes fling and anyone who cares about trophies will have to romance a woman/play as Sara, unfortunately. I'll end up romancing everyone eventually but still the fact that I will be FORCED to switch orientations or gender to get the achievement that was obviously tailor-made for straight Scott while no one else has to is... 33.media.tumblr.com/ac692cfb82e9997e6e93d1b0f72e1587/tumblr_ngxt36Zsn71smwj1yo1_500.gif
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KalleDemos
N2
#Resist
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 16, 2017 18:26:40 GMT
Hmm...Does Jacob Frye(Assassin's Creed) count? OH! Yeah? I think so? I haven't played Assassin's Creed so this just passed me by. There wasn't anything within the story to indicate that he was bisexual, right? I'm only going by what Google search is telling me. But this is a start. I think he ends up having a daughter? That still doesn't mean he is bi tho. And I don't recall if she was established as his biological daughter. And what about 'The Last of Us'?
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KalleDemos
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 16, 2017 17:46:40 GMT
I don't think most people's problem with Gil is that they find him unattractive but that his CC face and absence from advertisement indicate that not a lot of effort was put into his conception. We can't judge his personality because we know nothing about him while non romance characters Dr. Lexi and that Salarian politician had overviews with their voice actors. Also, the general 'nice' comments about 'that guy in the hold' don't exactly inspire confidence. Our fear is that this will be a repeat of ME3 Steve 2.0. and that Gil is just a non-essential crew bone thrown at us to get us to shut up while in contrast straight Scott has the options of all three women in the Squad, who are fully developed fixtures of the main cast, story, and who've we've actually seen in action and advertisement. It's also disappointing to see gay men and women sidelined to the crew, yet again. Actually my fear is that he is even worse than Cortez, if that is even possible. I didn't dislike Cortez, but he was a filler-character and it showed. I'm afraid that Gil is just as much a filler too. Now, I know devs have said that the crew romances are just as good and important etc etc. The problem here is that I don't trust a shit they say. I was losely following the marketing of DA2, DAI and ME3, and there were lies told. Mike Laidlaw has no integrity left in my eyes. After ME3 it has been the same for that Bioware department too. You can't lie me and then expect me to let it slip, I never will. If you say there is no a, b, c ending and then there is exactly that, it is a lie and you got busted. So maybe that IS the biggest problem I've had with Gil from the beginning. I don't trust what Bioware say about his romance, I dislike his looks and I'm afraid he is a total filler, a token gay-character, a stereotype of a gay man to whom the whole relationship is about sex. That stereotype should die, among with it's friend, a gay man who doesn't commit to one person. And I don't really mind if there IS a token gay NPC if he/she is well-made, not a stereotype (at least Cortez wasn't a commitmentphobic sexfiend) and they made him/her with care. I'm not optimistic when it comes to Gil for what I've seen and heard about him this far. I hope I'm totally wrong and he is awesome. I'm willing to wait for more info and actually get to know Gil before I come to conclusions but I agree. I also DO NOT believe Bioware when they say that crewmances will be equal to Squadmances. If that was true why don't they have their own face models? And we also know that there is a difference between Squad loyalty missions, which seem to be extensive, and crew missions. It's not hard to guess which one had more resources poured into it.
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KalleDemos
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 16, 2017 17:16:59 GMT
Lexi being unavailable to the Ryders is a good thing as the good doctor has been said to have designs on Drack. Her research makes it sound like she knows her interests well. She's being true to her character. I like the idea of these squad romances going on concurrently. Peebee and Jaal, that's gonna happen knowing those two. :heh: These triangles could get messy. :amirite: I like this as well. I like it more that the people who only value Dormer for her sexual appeal are annoyed. As if she couldn't possible have anything else to offer to the character.
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KalleDemos
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 16, 2017 17:05:01 GMT
I think we should just resign to the fact that gay players will never have more options than other groups. Lesbian may get benefit from being grouped with straight men like if there are more bi options (lesbians are hot), lesbian players will benefit. Straight females often will also being looked after since they also a major buyers and Bioware could pull the equality card. Gay players will always have less options, even if the majority of the characters are males like DA2 and DAI, most of the options still go into straight females while in ME series, most of the options go to straight males. It's just better to resign at this point that we will ALWAYS have less options. XD Hmm, the gaming industry isn't there yet, but at least we're getting there. When we see a canonical gay male protagonist as the lead in a roleplaying game developed by a AAA studio ( not a customisable PC), and one that's written well... well... that'll be the day. Hmm...Does Jacob Frye(Assassin's Creed) count?
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KalleDemos
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 16, 2017 16:51:14 GMT
I have never liked any exclusively gay characters they give us in Bioware games. I'm happy for those who enjoy them but I can't change how I feel. ME seems to put in minimal efforts when it comes to gay options compared to DA, but I guess each team has different priorities. At the end of the day, it's all about sales after all. I can't really fault them for that. Yes you can. Part of Bioware's appeal is that they're inclusive, or at least they say that they are. Customers, gay, straight, male/female, non-binary, are attracted by this but then in the end product ONE group shines above the rest with preferential treatment and content i.e. straight male Scott romancing all three female Squad members while everyone else is relegated to crew members. This is a problem and gay and women customers are not the only ones who see it.
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KalleDemos
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 16, 2017 16:29:18 GMT
i hope that is true i know i can't form my opinion based on other peoples experience but i admit i'm kind of grasping at straws atm. i'm still very much wondering who is the third m/m option, i doubt i will be able to leave this thread alone untile then how about you? are you playing early access? if you are, how are you enjoying the game so far? Most people seem to think he is fun, I think. The loudest voicest that seem to speak '' ill '' of Gil are gay/bi men who weren't into him at all and really wanted Jaal. That's what I believe. I haven't anything bad of him said by anyone else. The third m/m option, I assume is going to be a bi human (from the Nexus???). I base this speculation on nothing. Nah, not playing early access. And besides I'm eurotrash, have to wait till the 23rd (if my preorder even comes that day) to get my game, gonna be one hell of a ride... I don't think most people's problem with Gil is that they find him unattractive but that his CC face and absence from advertisement indicate that not a lot of effort was put into his conception. We can't judge his personality because we know nothing about him while non romance characters Dr. Lexi and that Salarian politician had overviews with their voice actors. Also, the general 'nice' comments about 'that guy in the hold' don't exactly inspire confidence. Our fear is that this will be a repeat of ME3 Steve 2.0. and that Gil is just a non-essential crew bone thrown at us to get us to shut up while in contrast straight Scott has the options of all three women in the Squad, who are fully developed fixtures of the main cast, story, and who've we've actually seen in action and advertisement. It's also disappointing to see gay men and women sidelined to the crew, yet again.
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 16, 2017 8:20:02 GMT
I feel for the Liam fans, but I think Jaal + Gil is still enough to make the Salty Gay Team go like 80% sodium free. Nah. More like 30%. This is still ME3.2.0. I'm very glad the situation isn't as bad as leaks suggested, that f/f players have more options and that alien-chasers get their Purple, Squid, Cobra, Cat Man 'lovin. But compounding the non progress on m/m options(content comparisons TBA), the marketing, the dev non response/baiting and the turmoil we have been in for weeks fearing we wouldn't have options at all...I'm just... www.reactiongifs.com/r/hmc.gif
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 16, 2017 7:48:19 GMT
I kind of feel slightly bad about Reyes, to be honest. I was holding a little hope that Sarcastic Hawke 2.0 would be a good boyfrando, after all. I really can't complain if Jaal is bi, though. That's the best case scenario out of all semi-possible seeming options that were on the table. No doubt, I'll romance Jaal first playthrough. Maybe I'll get to Gil later, but I have a habit of not being able to pass up my favorite on future games. Poor Fenris, I loved him, but I could never turn down terrorist boyfrando numero uno. </3 Haha, funny story - I started DA2 with every intention of romancing Fenris first but then Anders shows up bonded with Justice, uber pro Mage and was like: media.giphy.com/media/10TwGbLPwCDBoQ/giphy.gif
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 16, 2017 7:25:53 GMT
If that happened then the discussion to exclude gay men from the squad happened and the decision was implemented before being rescinded. This should concern all of us. The devs need to be confronted about why they don't think gay men are worthy of Squad status, should this be true. Nope! We figured out what happened. Her friend was thinking of a gay squadmate not a bi one and might have never been informed of him. Jaal was always bi, as proof of luke's leak of a shirtless Scott with a male alien. Very well. Still, the gay man and woman are relegated to the crew. Again. Not cute. I'll reserve full judgement for the moment and I'm pleased about the bi rep at least.
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 16, 2017 6:53:47 GMT
I know I shouldn't get my hopes up but... I really, really hope this is true! Bi Jaal and Bi Vetra? It'd be amazing! I kept telling you there's a chance it was cut and re-added. I think this is what happened, unless your friend was never informed of the change! If that happened then the discussion to exclude gay men from the squad happened and the decision was implemented before being rescinded. This should concern all of us. The devs need to be confronted about why they don't think gay men are worthy of Squad status, should this be true.
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Feb 23, 2018 22:08:52 GMT
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KalleDemos
#Resist
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Feb 24, 2017 22:55:37 GMT
February 2017
kalledemos
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 16, 2017 6:26:18 GMT
Yep. Can confirm now. Cyonan can vouch I think. Origin Games\Mass Effect Andromeda\Data\Win32\sbd\rest\conversationperformances.sbAll is there. No gender-lock for Vetra, Peebee and Jaal. Locks for their own gender for Suvi and Gil. Locks for opposite genders for Cora and Liam. (if pathfinder is x then) Bi Jaal is true, guys. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ cjarnoldwriting.files.wordpress.com/2014/02/happy.gif
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KalleDemos
N2
#Resist
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 164 Likes: 474
inherit
3847
0
Feb 23, 2018 22:08:52 GMT
474
KalleDemos
#Resist
164
Feb 24, 2017 22:55:37 GMT
February 2017
kalledemos
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 15, 2017 22:18:54 GMT
Just in case the backlash is too loud and BW decides to fix the issue? It's not like they'd need to record tons of new material. You never know tbh. But it's safe to not get your hopes up. "Time constraints", trimming and a myriad of issues sadly, it happened with Thane in ME2. 'Time constraints' hit Thane, Solas and Cullen who all miraculously had the m/m side of their bi romances cut. This is an unfortunate pattern.
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KalleDemos
N2
#Resist
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 164 Likes: 474
inherit
3847
0
Feb 23, 2018 22:08:52 GMT
474
KalleDemos
#Resist
164
Feb 24, 2017 22:55:37 GMT
February 2017
kalledemos
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by KalleDemos on Mar 15, 2017 21:58:12 GMT
Unless I missed something substantial, Legion and EDI are alright in Synthesis? But I haven't played this in a long time, so maybe I'm about to be real sad. Legion dies when he sacrifice himself for the Geth, no? I thought that was the best ending for him, peace between quarians and geth, with jesuscrist Legion (the tears ) there're other routes besides sacrificing quarians/geth? :gasp: Edit. Ninja'd i hope you enjoy it, when you get around to it!! liara's my absolute fave, but i suppose that's evident enough, hehe. not being able to romance jack was soooooo ??? like why dangle her in front of our faces. sigh. i'm setting my phasers to optimistic though! at some point in the future there'll be an f/f human on the squad. there has to be. at some point they'll look at themselves and say "guys we've done this straight starting humans thing like ten times in a row let's switch it up now". and i'm sending bi jaal thoughts out into the universe. I hope Bioware listen to your wise words, and the game gods give us a future lesbian/bi human squadmate, and bi Jaal Yeah...but Bioware already said they could do better and...we are, at best, back at ME3 levels of gayness. Andromeda, as a benchmark on this issue, tells me that they have not been listening and the game hasn't even been released yet.
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