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Post by shinobiwan on Mar 25, 2019 17:01:49 GMT
Good luck on this. I've already tried to explain the numbers, but some people are too easily overwhelmed by headlines and spin. If they want to continue to think that millions short of the mark (the $100 million digital revenue is my favorite, as that implies only ~1.66 million copies sold assuming zero mtx or LoD version sales) is a good result, there's no convincing them. People are easily manipulated. the problem is that contradicts the games current 2nd place spot in overall sales for the year from NPD. Unless that has changed as more sales data comes in, we know Kingdom Hearts III is sitting at around 5 million copies in early February. We also know that Resident Evil 2 was 3rd on that list, and was around 4 million units at the end of February. We also know the NPD numbers are tracking console sales, not PC digital sales, and not Origin Access Primer. Taking that all into consideration, the 1.66 million implied does not match up with overall ranking, unless the numbers are incorrect on NPD, and they are usually the most reliable, and the purchases of Resident Evil 2 or the like made less money, but sold more units somehow. I am also not sure if the 1.66 number is fully accurate. For example when taking into consideration the $100 million in digital revenue, was it based on what EA makes off the game? That is always a bit unclear; it seems to imply that EA netted that amount for themselves. Also into that consideration; does that number include the full price of a $60 title, or just their overall cut of the title which is substantially lower when it comes to physical copies, maybe an average of only $25 (not sure the exact number, making that up). If that is the case, then the $100 million could be focusing only only $25 per game, instead of $60. That is just for physical sales alone too, digital it may be a bigger slice for EA but suffers similar distribution of cost to dev salaries, overhead, marketing, and so on. I don't know what the real sell-through is, but the implications ultimately is that the game sold well upon launch enough to be in a top spot. Will it continue to sell, that I can't answer. The 3.5 million in digital purchases is more troubling to me because that is the long-term lifeblood. Yeah, thanks for proving my point so well. The 1.66 million figure was clearly in reference to the "digital revenue" noted the post above, and was stated to be illustrative ("implies," with assumptions about mtx/LoD versions that are clearly not true and would further reduce the figure if properly accounted for) to demonstrate what the overall $100 million represents. I was not commenting here on the NPD figure which includes physical sales. I have elsewhere if you genuinely want the response - but for most of these conversations that does not appear to be the case. There are people here who seriously believe that actually, Andromeda made a killing, but EA decided not to make further profit, cancelled dlc plans, and gutted Bioware Montreal because of big bad meanies on the internet. With those, you can only get so far.
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Post by cypherj on Mar 25, 2019 17:28:13 GMT
So they're two things I'm confused about here.
1) I specifically remember EA saying DA:I had the best launch of any Bioware game based on units sold. So if this report is saying ME3 had the best launch ever, what metric are they using for this report?
2) If ME3 sold 6 million copies over it's lifetime, and EA wanted Anthem to sell 6 million in 37 days. How can Anthem have a worse launch than ME3 but still total ME3's lifetime sales in only 37 days?
This all just seems weird to me. If Anthem is going to sell 6 million copies in 37 days it would need to have Bioware's best launch ever by any metric you could use to measure it. By far.
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Always teacher, sometimes writer
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PSN: LinksOcarina
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Post by linksocarina on Mar 25, 2019 17:28:39 GMT
the problem is that contradicts the games current 2nd place spot in overall sales for the year from NPD. Unless that has changed as more sales data comes in, we know Kingdom Hearts III is sitting at around 5 million copies in early February. We also know that Resident Evil 2 was 3rd on that list, and was around 4 million units at the end of February. We also know the NPD numbers are tracking console sales, not PC digital sales, and not Origin Access Primer. Taking that all into consideration, the 1.66 million implied does not match up with overall ranking, unless the numbers are incorrect on NPD, and they are usually the most reliable, and the purchases of Resident Evil 2 or the like made less money, but sold more units somehow. I am also not sure if the 1.66 number is fully accurate. For example when taking into consideration the $100 million in digital revenue, was it based on what EA makes off the game? That is always a bit unclear; it seems to imply that EA netted that amount for themselves. Also into that consideration; does that number include the full price of a $60 title, or just their overall cut of the title which is substantially lower when it comes to physical copies, maybe an average of only $25 (not sure the exact number, making that up). If that is the case, then the $100 million could be focusing only only $25 per game, instead of $60. That is just for physical sales alone too, digital it may be a bigger slice for EA but suffers similar distribution of cost to dev salaries, overhead, marketing, and so on. I don't know what the real sell-through is, but the implications ultimately is that the game sold well upon launch enough to be in a top spot. Will it continue to sell, that I can't answer. The 3.5 million in digital purchases is more troubling to me because that is the long-term lifeblood. Yeah, thanks for proving my point so well. The 1.66 million figure was clearly in reference to the "digital revenue" noted the post above, and was stated to be illustrative ("implies," with assumptions about mtx/LoD versions that are clearly not true and would further reduce the figure if properly accounted for) to demonstrate what the overall $100 million represents. I was not commenting here on the NPD figure which includes physical sales. I have elsewhere if you genuinely want the response - but for most of these conversations that does not appear to be the case. There are people here who seriously believe that actually, Andromeda made a killing, but EA decided not to make further profit, cancelled dlc plans, and gutted Bioware Montreal because of big bad meanies on the internet. With those, you can only get so far. I'm fine with a response so long as it's mutual versus one trying to argue in bad faith. The latter I get enough of from my students who legitimately don't know anything. For andromeda, what were the overall sales numbers? What I know about dlc and things like that is they would have had money set aside for it as a seperate budget, so the cancellation aspect is likely true if it sold poorly, but that decision would have to had been made super early in the games release, which is possible. Personally I think the problem was moreso the long dev time hemmoraging due to change in focus, and EA knew it would be skewered when it relwased so they cut funding for dlc before launch. I can't really say in the end I just don't know.
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Post by samhain444 on Mar 25, 2019 17:55:57 GMT
the problem is that contradicts the games current 2nd place spot in overall sales for the year from NPD. Unless that has changed as more sales data comes in, we know Kingdom Hearts III is sitting at around 5 million copies in early February. We also know that Resident Evil 2 was 3rd on that list, and was around 4 million units at the end of February. We also know the NPD numbers are tracking console sales, not PC digital sales, and not Origin Access Primer. Taking that all into consideration, the 1.66 million implied does not match up with overall ranking, unless the numbers are incorrect on NPD, and they are usually the most reliable, and the purchases of Resident Evil 2 or the like made less money, but sold more units somehow. I am also not sure if the 1.66 number is fully accurate. For example when taking into consideration the $100 million in digital revenue, was it based on what EA makes off the game? That is always a bit unclear; it seems to imply that EA netted that amount for themselves. Also into that consideration; does that number include the full price of a $60 title, or just their overall cut of the title which is substantially lower when it comes to physical copies, maybe an average of only $25 (not sure the exact number, making that up). If that is the case, then the $100 million could be focusing only only $25 per game, instead of $60. That is just for physical sales alone too, digital it may be a bigger slice for EA but suffers similar distribution of cost to dev salaries, overhead, marketing, and so on. I don't know what the real sell-through is, but the implications ultimately is that the game sold well upon launch enough to be in a top spot. Will it continue to sell, that I can't answer. The 3.5 million in digital purchases is more troubling to me because that is the long-term lifeblood. There are people here who seriously believe that actually Andromeda made a killing... Who believes ME:A "made a killing"?
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We destroy them or they destroy us.
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Post by bshep on Mar 25, 2019 18:50:48 GMT
There are people here who seriously believe that actually Andromeda made a killing... Who believes ME:A "made a killing"? Don't bother. That is just shinobiwan usual cherry picking.
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Dr Obfuscate
Don't knock the little winds. They're important - for morale.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
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Post by correctamundo on Mar 25, 2019 19:42:51 GMT
So they're two things I'm confused about here. 1) I specifically remember EA saying DA:I had the best launch of any Bioware game based on units sold. So if this report is saying ME3 had the best launch ever, what metric are they using for this report? 2) If ME3 sold 6 million copies over it's lifetime, and EA wanted Anthem to sell 6 million in 37 days. How can Anthem have a worse launch than ME3 but still total ME3's lifetime sales in only 37 days? This all just seems weird to me. If Anthem is going to sell 6 million copies in 37 days it would need to have Bioware's best launch ever by any metric you could use to measure it. By far. You're confusing NPD with EA. They're not the same. DAI is Bioware's most successful launch measured in units sold (EA) and their biggest selling game overall according to Darrah (tweet from 21 april 2018 I believe). Anthem is second biggest after ME3 when NPD looks at their numbers. They don't get the full picture though. 😎
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Dr Obfuscate
Don't knock the little winds. They're important - for morale.
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Post by correctamundo on Mar 25, 2019 19:48:52 GMT
Another game that according to "superdata" made "more than 100 million digital revenue" at launch was Fallout 4. However that was on all platforms not just console. Make of that what you will. 😎
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Post by NotN7 on Mar 25, 2019 19:59:45 GMT
Who believes ME:A "made a killing"? Don't bother. That is just shinobiwan usual cherry picking. I concur samhain444, pls shinobiwan name them or go home
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Post by cypherj on Mar 25, 2019 20:45:36 GMT
So they're two things I'm confused about here. 1) I specifically remember EA saying DA:I had the best launch of any Bioware game based on units sold. So if this report is saying ME3 had the best launch ever, what metric are they using for this report? 2) If ME3 sold 6 million copies over it's lifetime, and EA wanted Anthem to sell 6 million in 37 days. How can Anthem have a worse launch than ME3 but still total ME3's lifetime sales in only 37 days? This all just seems weird to me. If Anthem is going to sell 6 million copies in 37 days it would need to have Bioware's best launch ever by any metric you could use to measure it. By far. You're confusing NPD with EA. They're not the same. DAI is Bioware's most successful launch measured in units sold (EA) and their biggest selling game overall according to Darrah (tweet from 21 april 2018 I believe). Anthem is second biggest after ME3 when NPD looks at their numbers. They don't get the full picture though. 😎
I'm not confusing them. I'm just asking what metrics NPD uses to calculate things since it's obviously different than what EA uses.
My other point was that EA for all intents and purposes expects Anthem to become Bioware's top selling game in only 37 days. I don't know what DA:I ended up selling, but I know ME3 sold 6 million because EA's CFO said as much. So if Anthem is going to equal ME3 lifetime sales in 37 days it would need to blow by ME3/s launch totals by a lot. It shouldn't matter what metrics you are using to compare ME3's and Anthem's launch, Anthem would have to be doing far better than ME3 did by any metric you choose if it's going equal ME3's lifetime sales in just over a month's time.
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Always teacher, sometimes writer
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Post by linksocarina on Mar 25, 2019 22:19:27 GMT
Who believes ME:A "made a killing"? Don't bother. That is just shinobiwan usual cherry picking. That's a bit unfair. Shinobi has made solid points before. I don't see it as cherry picking at all.
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Post by SofaJockey on Mar 25, 2019 23:11:14 GMT
Is part of the issue that we are only seeing indications of commercial data unknown to the public?
That allows more than enough wriggle room to interpret whichever way people please, around a general idea: 'did better than feared, but didn't break all records'.
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Post by smilesja on Mar 26, 2019 2:27:14 GMT
Don't bother. That is just shinobiwan usual cherry picking. That's a bit unfair. Shinobi has made solid points before. I don't see it as cherry picking at all. His post is more like misrepresentation.
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N5
Dr Obfuscate
Don't knock the little winds. They're important - for morale.
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Post by correctamundo on Mar 26, 2019 5:50:05 GMT
You're confusing NPD with EA. They're not the same. DAI is Bioware's most successful launch measured in units sold (EA) and their biggest selling game overall according to Darrah (tweet from 21 april 2018 I believe). Anthem is second biggest after ME3 when NPD looks at their numbers. They don't get the full picture though. 😎
I'm not confusing them. I'm just asking what metrics NPD uses to calculate things since it's obviously different than what EA uses.
My other point was that EA for all intents and purposes expects Anthem to become Bioware's top selling game in only 37 days. I don't know what DA:I ended up selling, but I know ME3 sold 6 million because EA's CFO said as much. So if Anthem is going to equal ME3 lifetime sales in 37 days it would need to blow by ME3/s launch totals by a lot. It shouldn't matter what metrics you are using to compare ME3's and Anthem's launch, Anthem would have to be doing far better than ME3 did by any metric you choose if it's going equal ME3's lifetime sales in just over a month's time.
It's 5-6 millions. Not 6. NPD is comparing numbers from 2012 with an entirely different set from 2019. The possible error seems way to large to me to draw such definite conclusions.
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Post by Sartoz on Mar 26, 2019 7:08:26 GMT
You're confusing NPD with EA. They're not the same. DAI is Bioware's most successful launch measured in units sold (EA) and their biggest selling game overall according to Darrah (tweet from 21 april 2018 I believe). Anthem is second biggest after ME3 when NPD looks at their numbers. They don't get the full picture though. 😎
I'm not confusing them. I'm just asking what metrics NPD uses to calculate things since it's obviously different than what EA uses.
My other point was that EA for all intents and purposes expects Anthem to become Bioware's top selling game in only 37 days. I don't know what DA:I ended up selling, but I know ME3 sold 6 million because EA's CFO said as much. So if Anthem is going to equal ME3 lifetime sales in 37 days it would need to blow by ME3/s launch totals by a lot. It shouldn't matter what metrics you are using to compare ME3's and Anthem's launch, Anthem would have to be doing far better than ME3 did by any metric you choose if it's going equal ME3's lifetime sales in just over a month's time.
Six million units sold at $60 a pop is = $360M. That is the front-end sales for ME3. EA's response, I think, will be in their 4th Q Financial Statements. I expect the unit sales for Anthem will be mentioned (if sales was strong) along with Apex Legends.
Frankly, Apex Legends will be the darling in EA's Financials vs Anthem.
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Post by cypherj on Mar 26, 2019 10:47:29 GMT
I'm not confusing them. I'm just asking what metrics NPD uses to calculate things since it's obviously different than what EA uses.
My other point was that EA for all intents and purposes expects Anthem to become Bioware's top selling game in only 37 days. I don't know what DA:I ended up selling, but I know ME3 sold 6 million because EA's CFO said as much. So if Anthem is going to equal ME3 lifetime sales in 37 days it would need to blow by ME3/s launch totals by a lot. It shouldn't matter what metrics you are using to compare ME3's and Anthem's launch, Anthem would have to be doing far better than ME3 did by any metric you choose if it's going equal ME3's lifetime sales in just over a month's time.
It's 5-6 millions. Not 6. NPD is comparing numbers from 2012 with an entirely different set from 2019. The possible error seems way to large to me to draw such definite conclusions. It's not about NPD. It shouldn't take any specific site, or any site at all to know that Anthem would need to blow the launches of any other Bioware game out of the water to sell that many copies in so much shorter a time frame. If it had the best launch of a Bioware game ever we'll hear about it, and everyone knows it, whether they want to admit it or not. If we don't hear it, there's no way it met the expectations. But, like with Andromeda, I thought the expectations were a little too ambitious. 6-10 million for Andromeda, when ME3 only sold 6 million. Now 5-6 million in 37 days for Anthem, when this isn't even Bioware's normal type of game.
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Post by Pounce de León on Mar 26, 2019 11:03:11 GMT
It shouldn't take 13 pages of discussion about some projected sales numbers to understand that something doesn't add up. You only need to look at this forum, twitch, other forums that discuss the game, amount of gameplay and tips vids and you'll notice that the interest has significantly slowed down. I wouldn't be surprised if I got more search results for Oxygen not Included build advice than Anthem character builds.
Even if it sold like hot cake - it sure doesn't seem to really take off.
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Post by therevanchist25 on Mar 26, 2019 11:04:09 GMT
It's 5-6 millions. Not 6. NPD is comparing numbers from 2012 with an entirely different set from 2019. The possible error seems way to large to me to draw such definite conclusions. It's not about NPD. It shouldn't take any specific site, or any site at all to know that Anthem would need to blow the launches of any other Bioware game out of the water to sell that many copies in so much shorter a time frame. If it had the best launch of a Bioware game ever we'll hear about it, and everyone knows it, whether they want to admit it or not. If we don't hear it, there's no way it met the expectations. But, like with Andromeda, I thought the expectations were a little too ambitious. 6-10 million for Andromeda, when ME3 only sold 6 million. Now 5-6 million in 37 days for Anthem, when this isn't even Bioware's normal type of game. You are forgetting how these corporations think. Public PR, bad press? ultimately pointless. The gaming public at large are sheep, and will continue to buy our products, regardless of how public they are about "boycotts". Because the reality is boycotts and such just don't work like 90% of the time. Add onto that, that these companies constantly expect HIGHER profit margins from each successive product, regardless of reception or PR damage. Remember, simply making profit for the shareholders is not good enough. The profit has to be constantly on an upward trend, forever, or else they are failing. ALL Of The Money in the world must be made, every time, or else they'll go out of business. Because games are just FAAAR too expensive to produce. /s
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Post by shinobiwan on Mar 26, 2019 12:00:25 GMT
Lol, some solid name calling and labeling in response to my previous post. No substantive response, surprise surprise. You are forgetting how these corporations think. Public PR, bad press? ultimately pointless. The gaming public at large are sheep, and will continue to buy our products, regardless of how public they are about "boycotts". Because the reality is boycotts and such just don't work like 90% of the time. Add onto that, that these companies constantly expect HIGHER profit margins from each successive product, regardless of reception or PR damage. Remember, simply making profit for the shareholders is not good enough. The profit has to be constantly on an upward trend, forever, or else they are failing. ALL Of The Money in the world must be made, every time, or else they'll go out of business. Because games are just FAAAR too expensive to produce. /s It's really not (just) that. Gaming is one of the fastest growing sectors of the entertainment industry, and it has grown substantially even since ME3 came out. All else equal, you would expect a succeeding title to outperform the previous title, and the projections need to reflect that.
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Post by cypherj on Mar 26, 2019 12:02:36 GMT
It's not about NPD. It shouldn't take any specific site, or any site at all to know that Anthem would need to blow the launches of any other Bioware game out of the water to sell that many copies in so much shorter a time frame. If it had the best launch of a Bioware game ever we'll hear about it, and everyone knows it, whether they want to admit it or not. If we don't hear it, there's no way it met the expectations. But, like with Andromeda, I thought the expectations were a little too ambitious. 6-10 million for Andromeda, when ME3 only sold 6 million. Now 5-6 million in 37 days for Anthem, when this isn't even Bioware's normal type of game.You are forgetting how these corporations think. Public PR, bad press? ultimately pointless. The gaming public at large are sheep, and will continue to buy our products, regardless of how public they are about "boycotts". Because the reality is boycotts and such just don't work like 90% of the time. Add onto that, that these companies constantly expect HIGHER profit margins from each successive product, regardless of reception or PR damage. Remember, simply making profit for the shareholders is not good enough. The profit has to be constantly on an upward trend, forever, or else they are failing. ALL Of The Money in the world must be made, every time, or else they'll go out of business. Because games are just FAAAR too expensive to produce. /s
The bottom of the Andromeda range I can understand. If ME3 sold 6 million they would want to at least sell as much as the previous game. But the top of the range was a little ambitious.
But Anthem. I thought was wholly wrong. They don't have an existing base for this game. You can't count on your SP RPG player base running over to a looter-shooter. If my best friend wasn't playing this and I didn't already have Access Premier, I would have never bought this game. They need to bring in a lot of new players to meet these expectations.
As far as shareholders, yes, they want greater profits. But, when you become too aggressive, you run the risk of not meeting your earnings projections and having the stock take a huge hit like last quarter. They adjusted their earnings outlook after they moved the release of Battlefield and still missed it. They fell short on projections on Battlefield and Battlefront. Was that bad budgeting and/or forecasting, bad PR, boycotts? They need to figure that out.
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correctamundo
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Post by correctamundo on Mar 26, 2019 12:18:50 GMT
It's 5-6 millions. Not 6. NPD is comparing numbers from 2012 with an entirely different set from 2019. The possible error seems way to large to me to draw such definite conclusions. It's not about NPD. It shouldn't take any specific site, or any site at all to know that Anthem would need to blow the launches of any other Bioware game out of the water to sell that many copies in so much shorter a time frame. If it had the best launch of a Bioware game ever we'll hear about it, and everyone knows it, whether they want to admit it or not. If we don't hear it, there's no way it met the expectations. But, like with Andromeda, I thought the expectations were a little too ambitious. 6-10 million for Andromeda, when ME3 only sold 6 million. Now 5-6 million in 37 days for Anthem, when this isn't even Bioware's normal type of game. "First" it was about NPD metrics and "now" it isn't about NPD at all. Nice, goalposts keep moving around.
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Post by PillarBiter on Mar 26, 2019 12:45:24 GMT
Can't we all agree that without source data and the method of calculation being known, not a single person in this thread is right? And that trying to "win" this argment is pointless?
Let's all be just happy that BioWare will probably not get curbstomped by EA following this news.
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Post by cypherj on Mar 26, 2019 12:54:54 GMT
It's not about NPD. It shouldn't take any specific site, or any site at all to know that Anthem would need to blow the launches of any other Bioware game out of the water to sell that many copies in so much shorter a time frame. If it had the best launch of a Bioware game ever we'll hear about it, and everyone knows it, whether they want to admit it or not. If we don't hear it, there's no way it met the expectations. But, like with Andromeda, I thought the expectations were a little too ambitious. 6-10 million for Andromeda, when ME3 only sold 6 million. Now 5-6 million in 37 days for Anthem, when this isn't even Bioware's normal type of game. "First" it was about NPD metrics and "now" it isn't about NPD at all. Nice, goalposts keep moving around.
1) I specifically remember EA saying DA:I had the best launch of any Bioware game based on units sold. So if this report is saying ME3 had the best launch ever, what metric are they using for this report?
2) If ME3 sold 6 million copies over it's lifetime, and EA wanted Anthem to sell 6 million in 37 days. How can Anthem have a worse launch than ME3 but still total ME3's lifetime sales in only 37 days?
My original post. Two completely different points. I know they're two completely different points because I numbered them.
1) What metric is NPD using, because it's different than EA.
2) Anthem would need to beat ME3 launch to by a lot in order to sell that many games in 37 days.
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Post by therevanchist25 on Mar 26, 2019 13:45:06 GMT
You are forgetting how these corporations think. Public PR, bad press? ultimately pointless. The gaming public at large are sheep, and will continue to buy our products, regardless of how public they are about "boycotts". Because the reality is boycotts and such just don't work like 90% of the time. Add onto that, that these companies constantly expect HIGHER profit margins from each successive product, regardless of reception or PR damage. Remember, simply making profit for the shareholders is not good enough. The profit has to be constantly on an upward trend, forever, or else they are failing. ALL Of The Money in the world must be made, every time, or else they'll go out of business. Because games are just FAAAR too expensive to produce. /s
The bottom of the Andromeda range I can understand. If ME3 sold 6 million they would want to at least sell as much as the previous game. But the top of the range was a little ambitious.
But Anthem. I thought was wholly wrong. They don't have an existing base for this game. You can't count on your SP RPG player base running over to a looter-shooter. If my best friend wasn't playing this and I didn't already have Access Premier, I would have never bought this game. They need to bring in a lot of new players to meet these expectations.
As far as shareholders, yes, they want greater profits. But, when you become too aggressive, you run the risk of not meeting your earnings projections and having the stock take a huge hit like last quarter. They adjusted their earnings outlook after they moved the release of Battlefield and still missed it. They fell short on projections on Battlefield and Battlefront. Was that bad budgeting and/or forecasting, bad PR, boycotts? They need to figure that out.
BFV was the result of rushing the game out the door when only about half of it's features were ready, and also the team at DICE being obnoxious around the time of release. BF2 might just be the first time public backlash caused a major rethink of a game. Or, it could have simply been because Disney, the PC mafia, dropped the boot and said "We are THE Family Friendly company, how dare you try to swindle money from children with one of our properties!" We'll never really know eaither way. But Anthem? I honestly don't know. I suppose it could be chalked up to EA just being their typical selves, and just assuming "Okay this type of game is really popular, therefor it will sell!" The disconnet comes from us, the fanbse. Because we actually think about the realities of each situation. Companies by and large do not do that. Logically, EA should have realized that, since EA started the whole "Everything on Frostbite" thing, Bioware has been struggleing, because they had to start working on their types of games, with absolutely no tools or designs on Frostbite to work with. I really think Bioware has coped fairly well all things considered due to how ill-prepared Frostbite was for anything that wasn't FPS games. Andromeda and Anthem seem to be more the casualties of mismanagment more than anything else. Andromeda had what, 5 years? to make a game. With proper direction, vision, and leadership? Andromeda might very well have been a masterpiece after having 5 years of Dev time, instead of a scrambled 18 months because they spent 4 years trying to make No Man's Effect. The end result of Anthem's loot/gear system I can only describe as team managers simply not really doing proper research on this genre. I mean, EA is able to get updates on these games throughout production. Now, I seriously think Anthem had a drastic shift in direction or something about halfway through development, because I simply cannot believe whats in this game is the result of 6 solid years of dev time. The loot system is simply too ridiculously designed for me to believe that. Hell, maybe that system is the root of the games problem from a dev standpoint. Bioware has said themselves they don't like where the loot/gear system is at. Maybe that was a common sentiment among the team for quite some time, but the managers thought it was fine so it stayed. Maybe thats why the "real" Loot/Gear fix will take months, because they are literally going to make an actually whole new system from scratch. Maybe one they've already been outlining for awhile because they knew this wasn't going to cut it. It's like the Square Enix team prior to FF14 1.0 release. They KNEW before it even came out that it wasn't acceptable, but it had to come out, regardless. Too much money was already spent with no income coming in. Square basically admitted in NoClips, that really the entire company was living in a Bubble, they never bothered to check out their competition to see what they were doing. We'll probably never really know how Anthem happend the way it did. Maybe Bioware truly thought this was a home run waiting to happen. Maybe they truly thought these are all great ideas. Thats all entirely possible. But I just don't see that being the case. I just have a feeling this game split the Dev team on a lot of issues, and that for some of these features, the "bad" ideas won the argument. Which is why ultimately, I think the end result of EA's expectations comes down to a few different things. Either EA does not get complete and accurate information from their developers about a games current state. They don't care at all about a games current state. Or they simply don't know anything about video games...
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Post by midnight tea on Mar 26, 2019 13:51:19 GMT
"First" it was about NPD metrics and "now" it isn't about NPD at all. Nice, goalposts keep moving around.
1) I specifically remember EA saying DA:I had the best launch of any Bioware game based on units sold. So if this report is saying ME3 had the best launch ever, what metric are they using for this report?
2) If ME3 sold 6 million copies over it's lifetime, and EA wanted Anthem to sell 6 million in 37 days. How can Anthem have a worse launch than ME3 but still total ME3's lifetime sales in only 37 days?
My original post. Two completely different points. I know they're two completely different points because I numbered them.
1) What metric is NPD using, because it's different than EA.
2) Anthem would need to beat ME3 launch to by a lot in order to sell that many games in 37 days. Many people play games now compared to 2012. Also - EA Access. There's just no way EA is not factoring EA Access into that, given how big it is compared to 2012 and how much money it's making them (or the fact that Anthem has been tailored to it).
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Post by cypherj on Mar 26, 2019 14:18:07 GMT
1) I specifically remember EA saying DA:I had the best launch of any Bioware game based on units sold. So if this report is saying ME3 had the best launch ever, what metric are they using for this report?
2) If ME3 sold 6 million copies over it's lifetime, and EA wanted Anthem to sell 6 million in 37 days. How can Anthem have a worse launch than ME3 but still total ME3's lifetime sales in only 37 days?
My original post. Two completely different points. I know they're two completely different points because I numbered them.
1) What metric is NPD using, because it's different than EA.
2) Anthem would need to beat ME3 launch to by a lot in order to sell that many games in 37 days. Many people play games now compared to 2012. Also - EA Access. There's just no way EA is not factoring EA Access into that, given how big it is compared to 2012 and how much money it's making them (or the fact that Anthem has been tailored to it).
More people playing the game, EA Access, none of this changes the point I'm trying to make.
5-6 million copies is 5-6 million copies. So if we know that ME3 sold 6 million. Anthem would need to blow past ME3 launch by a lot to make these expectations. Say ME3 sold 2 -2.5 million copies at lanuch. Anthem would need to surpass this significantly, and then continue strong sales in the following weeks to get to 5-6 million. If they have a worse launch there's no way they make 3.5-4 million on the back end in-between the close of the launch window and the end of the 37 days.
This is the only point I've been trying to make. This game has to have a far better launch than ME3 did no matter how you look at it.
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