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Post by alanc9 on Apr 12, 2019 17:37:36 GMT
I'm betting DA4 will be MP first with suitable combat mechanics. Anthem and MEAMP and possibly ME3MP provides an initial boiler plate for us to think about. Which means how many vanity items will the game have at launch and beyond. How different are those "suitable combat mechanics"? I didn't play any of those MP modes; all I remember about them is that they sometimes had fewer powers available than the SP games.
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Post by lennybusker on Apr 12, 2019 17:43:45 GMT
DA4 will be an MP-focused (with solo play possible but not desirable), always online game and anyone who disagrees can go ahead and skip to the part where they admit I was right now You're on. But only in part. It will be a live service for sure, so "always online" is no bet. You're right about that. But I doubt it will be MP-focused. I'll go further and say the primary focus will still be the SP campaign and it will be desirable, or at least, not have a significant penalty like in Anthem. Will it have an MP mode? Yes. In terms of engagement hours, will more of those hours on average be in MP than SP? If they do things "right", absolutely. Does that mean it's MP-focused? You'll probably insist that it is, which makes this whole bet kind of pointless, since I'll insist that it doesn't. If DA4 ends up being close to the ACO model, who wins the bet? Because I think ACO is still SP-focused, in which case, I'd say you lose the bet. Missed the last question. There's no doubting that ACO is a "single player game". That won't be DA4's model. Mark it. My point is there won't be a menu like in ME3, MEA, or DAI where you select "Multiplayer" to go MP.
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Post by samhain444 on Apr 12, 2019 17:44:02 GMT
OK I'll throw my hat in the ring and go with o ne world for SP and MP like Lenny speculates. No separate MP mode. Longer story campaign than Anthem. Not sure about always online. I think the backlash would be too strong. So I say no. It won't be co-op story because I doubt Bioware has the right people to pull that off in a satisfactory manner. Nor seem fans to like the idea. My guess would be that MP is specific missions like the war table where you can team up for mindless killing and this will net you some sort of bonus in SP. Maybe if we get a full on war scenario they could go the ME3MP route and have armies or mercenary groups. I expect the MP implementation to eat up a lot of time and money and SP will suffer for it. Game will be open world again and feel as sterile as before. MTX will probably be skins for your crafted armor, your mount, maybe your home base. If it's one world (SP and MP), pretty sure it absolutely means "always online" because you can't be in MP without being online and connected. I think SP and MP will feed into each other in some way but I don't think SP will "always online" so I believe the two modes would have to be separate. I think, personally, the MP mode will resemble "Anthem's" freeplay with dynamic changing environments, instanced encounters and exploration.
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Post by alanc9 on Apr 12, 2019 17:57:11 GMT
Missed the last question. There's no doubting that ACO is a "single player game". That won't be DA4's model. Mark it. My point is there won't be a menu like in ME3, MEA, or DAI where you select "Multiplayer" to go MP. Marked. Do you figure it'll be like Anthem where you select this at mission start?
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Post by biggydx on Apr 12, 2019 17:58:39 GMT
It will be a live service for sure, so "always online" is no bet. You're right about that. Isn't Assassins Creed: Odyssey an example of a live service game that can be played offline? Yeah, you need to have an internet connection at the start to validate that you own the game, but afterwards, it can be played offline.
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Post by goishen on Apr 12, 2019 18:55:22 GMT
I dunno. I'm waaaaaay past caring at this point.
If it isn't microtransanction free and single player only and linux based, no buy.
I don't give af.
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Post by alanc9 on Apr 12, 2019 19:27:52 GMT
Linux-based?
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Post by goishen on Apr 12, 2019 19:36:52 GMT
Yah, instead of Windows based? Yah, I want it to run from kernel ring 0.
*rolls eyes*
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Post by PapaCharlie9 on Apr 12, 2019 20:14:44 GMT
You're on. But only in part. It will be a live service for sure, so "always online" is no bet. You're right about that. But I doubt it will be MP-focused. I'll go further and say the primary focus will still be the SP campaign and it will be desirable, or at least, not have a significant penalty like in Anthem. Will it have an MP mode? Yes. In terms of engagement hours, will more of those hours on average be in MP than SP? If they do things "right", absolutely. Does that mean it's MP-focused? You'll probably insist that it is, which makes this whole bet kind of pointless, since I'll insist that it doesn't. If DA4 ends up being close to the ACO model, who wins the bet? Because I think ACO is still SP-focused, in which case, I'd say you lose the bet. If we want to clarify, what I'm saying is there won't be different "modes" of multiplayer or singleplayer. It'll just be the game, that you can play solo or you can play multi. An instanced mission structure is likely but I'm not hanging my hat on it. Okay, I’ll take that bet. If there is any kind of pure SP mode, even if bolted on the side and far less content than the main mode, I win. On the other hand, a Fort Tarsis kind of thing in the “just be the game” would not count as an SP mode though.
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Post by alanc9 on Apr 12, 2019 20:20:54 GMT
Yah, instead of Windows based? Yah, I want it to run from kernel ring 0. *rolls eyes* OK. How do you figure your chances are for that? About as good as they are for the other two criteria?
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Post by PapaCharlie9 on Apr 12, 2019 20:22:01 GMT
It will be a live service for sure, so "always online" is no bet. You're right about that. Isn't Assassins Creed: Odyssey an example of a live service game that can be played offline? Yeah, you need to have an internet connection at the start to validate that you own the game, but afterwards, it can be played offline. The driver for live service is recurring revenue. I agreed the game will always be online because I think EA wants to get those impulse buys through the store. When they do the pro vs con trade-off analysis, I believe they will take the hit the always online outrage will generate, because the mtx will be worth it. Even if DA4 SP is like ACO in every other way.
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Post by alanc9 on Apr 12, 2019 20:22:38 GMT
If we want to clarify, what I'm saying is there won't be different "modes" of multiplayer or singleplayer. It'll just be the game, that you can play solo or you can play multi. An instanced mission structure is likely but I'm not hanging my hat on it. Okay, I’ll take that bet. If there is any kind of pure SP mode, even if bolted on the side and far less content than the main mode, I win. On the other hand, a Fort Tarsis kind of thing in the “just be the game” would not count as an SP mode though. How would an Anthem-like implementation -- i.e., you pick whether to be private or not on mission start -- be scored?
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Post by PapaCharlie9 on Apr 12, 2019 20:24:04 GMT
Okay, I’ll take that bet. If there is any kind of pure SP mode, even if bolted on the side and far less content than the main mode, I win. On the other hand, a Fort Tarsis kind of thing in the “just be the game” would not count as an SP mode though. How would an Anthem-like implementation -- i.e., you pick whether to be private or not on mission start -- be scored? Lenny wins.
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Post by biggydx on Apr 12, 2019 20:25:07 GMT
Isn't Assassins Creed: Odyssey an example of a live service game that can be played offline? Yeah, you need to have an internet connection at the start to validate that you own the game, but afterwards, it can be played offline. The driver for live service is recurring revenue. I agreed the game will always be online because I think EA wants to get those impulse buys through the store. When they do the pro vs con trade-off analysis, I believe they will take the hit the always online outrage will generate, because the mtx will be worth it. Online only is a probable outcome. I'm more curious if it needs to be pushed in the single player side of the game, or if those mtx elements will primarily stick to the multiplayer. Safest bet would be to say its both, but you never know.
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Post by reiichiroh on Apr 12, 2019 21:00:08 GMT
It will be a live service for sure, so "always online" is no bet. You're right about that. Isn't Assassins Creed: Odyssey an example of a live service game that can be played offline? Yeah, you need to have an internet connection at the start to validate that you own the game, but afterwards, it can be played offline.
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Post by reiichiroh on Apr 12, 2019 21:00:27 GMT
I can't play AC Odyssey when UPlay is in offline mode.
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Post by Kappa Neko on Apr 12, 2019 21:47:54 GMT
If it's one world (SP and MP), pretty sure it absolutely means "always online" because you can't be in MP without being online and connected. I think SP and MP will feed into each other in some way but I don't think SP will "always online" so I believe the two modes would have to be separate. I think, personally, the MP mode will resemble "Anthem's" freeplay with dynamic changing environments, instanced encounters and exploration. Why would always online be required to play by yourself? Doesn't even make sense for Anthem imo. But clearly that was the cheap solution and they didn't have time for an offline option. Plenty of games that can be played solo or with friends only need to be online when somebody wants to join your session. Always online is an anti-piracy feature more than a requirement.
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Post by tatann on Apr 12, 2019 21:57:19 GMT
How would an Anthem-like implementation -- i.e., you pick whether to be private or not on mission start -- be scored? Lenny wins. EDIT: great, now I have this stupid song in head
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Finished Dissertation long ago lol. Now happily employed :D
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Post by biggydx on Apr 12, 2019 22:01:04 GMT
If we want to clarify, what I'm saying is there won't be different "modes" of multiplayer or singleplayer. It'll just be the game, that you can play solo or you can play multi. An instanced mission structure is likely but I'm not hanging my hat on it. Okay, I’ll take that bet. If there is any kind of pure SP mode, even if bolted on the side and far less content than the main mode, I win. On the other hand, a Fort Tarsis kind of thing in the “just be the game” would not count as an SP mode though. Ooo, I want to throw my hat in the ring. Here's my win state: Default (between all of us): Game will likely be online-only. If its not, the bet is still on between all of us My terms: The game won't have drop-in, drop-out co-op for the overarching singleplayer story. However, there will be specific regions in the game where (if you go into them) you'll be instanced with other people. This could be specific locations on the map, or certain zones that you would travel to (like the various zones in Inquisition).
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Post by samhain444 on Apr 12, 2019 22:06:29 GMT
If it's one world (SP and MP), pretty sure it absolutely means "always online" because you can't be in MP without being online and connected. I think SP and MP will feed into each other in some way but I don't think SP will "always online" so I believe the two modes would have to be separate. I think, personally, the MP mode will resemble "Anthem's" freeplay with dynamic changing environments, instanced encounters and exploration. Why would always online be required to play by yourself? Doesn't even make sense for Anthem imo. But clearly that was the cheap solution and they didn't have time for an offline option. Plenty of games that can be played solo or with friends only need to be online when somebody wants to join your session. Always online is an anti-piracy feature more than a requirement.
It makes sense for "Anthem" because they use dedicated servers which I understand requires a constant connection. "Anthem" can be played solo if you want but it's made for CO-OP play. I'm sure there are other advantages for BioWare besides anti-piracy such as hot fixes instead of waiting for DLC patches to fix an issue or being able to initiate live events on the fly.
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Post by Kappa Neko on Apr 12, 2019 22:30:27 GMT
It makes sense for "Anthem" because they use dedicated servers which I understand requires a constant connection. "Anthem" can be played solo if you want but it's made for CO-OP play. I'm sure there are other advantages for BioWare besides anti-piracy such as hot fixes instead of waiting for DLC patches to fix an issue or being able to initiate live events on the fly. True about live events! Patches don't require always online.
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Post by lennybusker on Apr 12, 2019 22:58:42 GMT
If we want to clarify, what I'm saying is there won't be different "modes" of multiplayer or singleplayer. It'll just be the game, that you can play solo or you can play multi. An instanced mission structure is likely but I'm not hanging my hat on it. Okay, I’ll take that bet. If there is any kind of pure SP mode, even if bolted on the side and far less content than the main mode, I win. On the other hand, a Fort Tarsis kind of thing in the “just be the game” would not count as an SP mode though. Yup.
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Post by Gya on Apr 13, 2019 2:06:15 GMT
This bet is interesting, I'm honestly not sure which way EA/biower will go with this. It's certainly going to be a predominantly multiplayer experience. And always online but with shitty DRM forced in to tank performance, well, that's a given. The primary aim will be to get players invested in multiplayer and interacting with others, and suddenly your cosmetic mtx are much more desirable. (But it's not all bad news for players! The always online MP experience allows for more story content to be added on. This is absolutely a good thing, it means more content! Because they definitely haven't cancelled promised content before! And new content was also impossible in singleplayer games, DLC/expansions have only ever existed for multiplayer games. But I digress).
The bulk of the story is therefore probably going to be told through multiplayer. They may well base this on Gaider's previous ideas, or have a decent story of their own, or even something between the two. The endgame will be repeatable busy work quests to keep players grinding until the next content release.
But will there be a singleplayer campaign at all? If there is, I suspect it will be a short prologue/tutorial, perhaps 10 hours with long cutscenes included. This allows EA to market the title more easily to existing series fans.
Or will it be like Anthem, purely designed for multiplayer, with solo play heavily punished by shitty scaling and giant healthbar enemies? Will enough series fans pick up DA4 if it's basically Anthem 2 with swords and dwarves? To what degree can their marketing obfuscate the true nature of the game?
I am personally leaning towards the first option. I think they will overhype the singleplayer component, and the majority of the storytelling will be a disjointed multiplayer affair full of mashing esc to skip dialogue.
TL;DR You're on, Lenny. It's going to be shit, just which variety of shit? I suspect a short, tacked on singleplayer tutorial/prologue "campaign", just so they can bleat about how it's "still a true Dragon Age experience". I look forward to you paying me 50 bsnbux in 2022.
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Post by Arijon van Goyen on Apr 13, 2019 7:14:16 GMT
I can't play AC Odyssey when UPlay is in offline mode. You can thank or send your damns to all pirates of the world (probably over 2 billion) who get illegal games back in 1995-2009. Ubi, EA and many others went very strict with their login programs since.
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Post by river82 on Apr 13, 2019 7:35:22 GMT
I can't play AC Odyssey when UPlay is in offline mode. You can thank or send your damns to all pirates of the world (probably over 2 billion) who get illegal games back in 1995-2009. Ubi, EA and many others went very strict with their login programs since. Which did not a damn thing on the piracy front, and only serves to punish honest gamers who buy their games through legal channels. Punish honest gamers enough and it may in fact turn them toward piracy. Ubi and EA can say whatever they want, THEY are to blame for what's in their products and nobody else.
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