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Post by Catilina on Dec 14, 2021 21:50:30 GMT
Then his idiotic plan didn't even work. Although if this is the case then Hawke didn't play a huge part in events like it implied. Correct, it didn’t work. The mages all dismissed Anders’s terrorism and mass murder as those of a madman. The actual cause of the war being something completely different a couple years later. He murdered hundreds of innocent people for nothing. In fact: it worked: he ignited the spark of the rebellion. And one of his significant reason was the Tranquility's existence, and he was right about the Templars too: when the mages rebelled, and Fiona declared the independence, the Seekers and the Templars started a war against everyone, instead of protecting people.
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Post by Catilina on Dec 14, 2021 20:43:50 GMT
I don't think, it would cause a rebellion, if he kills Meredith and attacks Templars (there are many times Hawke can attack Templars: my Hawke killed a lot during the game, not at the end, and not even just in Anders' personal quest.) Decimus in Starkhaven probably ignited the Circle tower, but this didn't cause a rebellion. Then his idiotic plan didn't even work. Although if this is the case then Hawke didn't play a huge part in events like it implied. Seems it worked. And depends on: how Hawke thinks about it. My Hawke like to think, he played a big part of the rebellion. My favourite moment in the Inquisition: "[…] But all the Circles were rising up by then. We helped a lot of them take that final step." (Hawke, when meets with the Inquisitor, Anders' romance) But of course, the game let you think, Hawke just was in the bad place in the bad time. I prefer my version.
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Post by Catilina on Dec 14, 2021 17:44:54 GMT
That still doesn't explain why he doesn't immediately turn on Meredith after she declares the Annulment. Also, if Anders is tired of fighting, why does he then return to the fight if you spare his life? He doesn't do it out of gratitude to Hawke because he will do this whether you side with the mages or the Templars, in the latter case turning up to oppose you. Although I suppose you could argue he knows such a confrontation would be fatal and he wants to die. Nevertheless, if Justice has completely turned to Vengeance that is all the more reason why he would immediately turn on Meredith. Not only has she declared the Annulment but she has been responsible for all the atrocities committed against mages. As overall leader you can delegate tasks but not responsibility for what your subordinates do under your command. She also made conditions worse for ordinary citizens by taking over secular rule of the city as well. So the fact he didn't turn on Meredith would suggest that Anders still is in control of the partnership. I didn't say it made complete sense. I do think he should have gone right after Meredith but if he did then one of them would be dead and we couldn't choose who we wanted to join. Or if Meredith killed him then anders fans would have lost their character in no win situation and some wouldn't like that. The decision to destroy the chantry to me speaks of a loss of reason because if he really wanted to spark a war and help mages he would have slaughtered meredith and many of the templar leadership in front of the public and thus spark a war or at least make the templars everywhere crack down on mages in response justified or not and force the mages to rebel and thus start a war without gaining mages the hatred of the common people. It is my way of justifing the way it went down. Your way does make more sense but it isn't what we got.
The same thing can be argued as to why Cullen decides to turn on meredith if she decides to kill a hawk who decided to fight for the mages. It made no sense since hawke decided to fight against her and thus kill templars.
The same question can be asked of most games at some point why some character didn't do something that made sense and was obvious. I don't think, it would cause a rebellion, if he kills Meredith and attacks Templars (there are many times Hawke can attack Templars: my Hawke killed a lot during the game, not at the end, and not even just in Anders' personal quest.) Decimus in Starkhaven probably ignited the Circle tower, but this didn't cause a rebellion.
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Post by Catilina on Dec 13, 2021 20:06:42 GMT
I think it was probably the lack of time. It may also have been something they intended to bring back in during the Exalted March DLC and when that was cancelled the outcome of this interesting aspect of the politics in Act 3 was lost as well. This was always a major problem I had with the choice, as I outline above. Even if you are entirely pro-Chantry and pro-Circles what Meredith was doing was both illegal and illogical. We are told at the beginning of Act 3 by Orsino that the majority of the mages had their liberty curtailed and although the Templars under Thrask had been overriding that command, by the end of the Act we had dealt with that problem and to all intents and purposes the majority of the Circle mages were locked in their rooms/cells. So Meredith knows that they cannot possibly be responsible for the bombing of the Chantry, even without Anders' confession. However, he does confess to the crime and then after stating his case he even sits down quietly and waits to die. Yet Meredith prefers to condemn all the mages for his actions but doesn't execute him. Which brings me to another major problem I have and that is whilst Justice probably feels that it is justice for Anders to die, the moment Meredith ignores that solution and instead perpetrates a monstrous injustice in condemning all the other mages, why does Justice not rise up and take over again, like he did with Ser Alric? If you are on the rival path it is pretty much implied that Justice is the dominating force in the relationship but to some extent that only becomes apparent because you are causing Anders to doubt himself. On the friendship path he has not such doubts so he and Justice are working in tandem. If you spare Anders and yet side with the Templars (which seems somewhat odd to me), then he will turn up again later to confront you, so he clearly wants to defend the mages from the injustice then, so why not at the beginning? To be honest, Anders/Justice should have turned on Meredith immediately she declared the Annulment and then perhaps she fled in order to regroup with her full force of Templars, whilst Anders either joins you to defend the mages or has some sort of confrontation with Hawke straight away which can lead to his death but he ought to have attacked Meredith first. I think by that point anders and justice are just insane and he is exhausted and wants it to end. Yes what your saying makes absolute sense and would probably have been the best way to do it. but I think Anders was just like "I did what I had to and now I just want the insanity to stop". The insanity being his mind melding with justice and how he has to fight the impulses and so on. To me Anders actions at the end of DA2 were just him finally losing the fight with justice and giving into it and thus warping justice farther. How else can he justify killing all the innocent people in the chantry. Even if he thinks the grand cleric is responsible through inaction what about all the other people inside? Thus justice has completely switched over to vengence and anders is tired of fighting and just goes along with it. "Just insane" – an easy explanation... And neither Anders, nor Justice, nor their whole story deserve this. To be honest, I didn't even see, Anders is "losing the fight against Justice" – because he's just as Anders as Justice at the end as well. Sometimes more Anders – sometimes more Justice. If they wanted to show: he lost in Justice/Vengeance – they should do it better.
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Post by Catilina on Dec 12, 2021 18:34:52 GMT
Well: boomerang vote to Adonniel – for now: we'll see. (And I should re-read my backstory, rofl.)
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Post by Catilina on Dec 12, 2021 16:24:34 GMT
fylimar I'm male, not female and I was more of making fun of my character in my first answer. I do have a question for you and Catilina : Do you have an accent? I'll also wait for Seven to potentially shed light on the situation. No. And you? (sorry if it was, I don't see in my notes)
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Post by Catilina on Dec 3, 2021 0:32:05 GMT
No "evidence" – but a great possibility.
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Post by Catilina on Nov 30, 2021 14:45:03 GMT
Hmm, still without clue – I vote for Space.
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Post by Catilina on Nov 30, 2021 10:59:22 GMT
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Post by Catilina on Nov 27, 2021 20:58:48 GMT
I want DA4.
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Post by Catilina on Nov 27, 2021 11:20:53 GMT
My red Hawke is okay with "Killer" – he's far not that terrible, as infamous, in fact, sometimes (in the eyes, who don't know him well) surprisingly merciful, but he loves and preserves his fame.
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Post by Catilina on Nov 26, 2021 21:13:12 GMT
Oh, the question... So: I ask adonniel and Space Cowboy they're familiar with Skyhold? (I hope they weren't asked about it) I believe so, yes An interesting answer...
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Post by Catilina on Nov 26, 2021 18:27:53 GMT
Well...
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Post by Catilina on Nov 26, 2021 17:30:27 GMT
Oh, the question... So: I ask adonniel and Space Cowboy they're familiar with Skyhold? (I hope they weren't asked about it)
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Post by Catilina on Nov 20, 2021 13:45:48 GMT
Seems almost everyone's best friend is Varric and Aveline.
One of my favourite Hawkes (above) rivaled Varric and Aveline.
With Varric the reason was Varric gossipy nature and that he spoke about people like figures in his story. And Varric's "mages and Templars are just humans in skirt" – but this issue was his life. Also: their humour was different a little. ... And really, dude... "Whateverishisname possessed mage?"
With Aveline the reason was, that he heard, Aveline prevented Carver's joining to the guards. He and Carver had brotherly rivalry and their teasing sound often rude to ears of an outsider – but he knew his brother's ability and heart. He was sure, that Carver would be a good guard. Better than Aveline.
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Post by Catilina on Nov 17, 2021 13:02:19 GMT
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Post by Catilina on Nov 16, 2021 16:28:18 GMT
Oh, it looks interesting.
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Post by Catilina on Nov 16, 2021 12:29:36 GMT
Grand Cleric Elthina was "neutral" – I just say. And Elthina's "neutrality" supported Meredith. Well sure...but Hawke could've just said "I'm on the side of the people" and gotten support from other sources...say, the nobles we get help from against Meredith's "rule" provided we actively sided against her in the Act3 intro. Or the city guard...yes yes, the city guard is somewhat corrupt as well...but at least if we've secured Aveline's friendship/rivalry they'll be somewhat on our side
I see your point about "both sides" forgetting the common people of Kirkwall. But this isn't really true: Orsino said to Meredith, she should stop it before she destroys Kirkwall what she wanted to protect, and Meredith also mentions "people" – like: "people will demand blood". But now imagine that three-front war: everyone against everyone – and later, the Chantry can stigmatize Kirkwall as heretic, because of attacked the Templars, the Chantry's arm (like Threnhold, again?). It wouldn't cause lesser bloodshed –I think, even more!– but also: I see at least seems Hawke would be more active part of that conflict – with involve Kirkwalls civilian too. Interesting, and a missed opportunity. By the way: Hawke already started it with ally the nobles – if Hawke chose the mage side during the game (Act3, Orsino's speech). This part of the story dropped. Intentionally? For the more drama? Or just because they were in lack of time? Anyway, an interesting nuance: but I suppose it was intentional: to show the desperate situation – and that something is bigger than our hero: who can't solve every problem. This is a part of Hawke's Greek drama. (Just a tip.)
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Post by Catilina on Nov 16, 2021 0:28:53 GMT
I mean...I'm still upset they didn't give us a neutral option where we fight both sides the game initially gives you that choice only for them to say "you need to pick a side" Grand Cleric Elthina was "neutral" – I just say. And Elthina's "neutrality" supported Meredith.
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Post by Catilina on Nov 13, 2021 11:09:12 GMT
I wish the best, Pela!
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Post by Catilina on Nov 11, 2021 11:01:42 GMT
Well, I'll back-vote to Adonniel. (Without any suspicion yet.)
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Post by Catilina on Nov 5, 2021 22:52:56 GMT
Every character of me have a piece of me.
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Post by Catilina on Nov 5, 2021 21:45:17 GMT
Playing "evil" character isn't my cup of tea. But playing a morally questionable character is fun.
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Post by Catilina on Nov 2, 2021 14:16:24 GMT
Not. fylimar, seven – the similar question: you're familiar with Skyhold?
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Post by Catilina on Oct 30, 2021 15:10:50 GMT
Well, here we are nearly at Halloween and I'm feeling a bit better. Thank you for all your good wishes. Had a bit of spiritual guidance from my local priest last Sunday (who is also chaplain at our hospital and so has had a lot of experience dealing with the fall out from Covid). Also, finally got all my horses to Wales so able to relax and start to enjoy my new home. Plus, I'm going to be a grandparent. So I think I might be ready to run a game, if anyone is interested. Congratulation!
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