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Post by griffith82 on May 22, 2017 3:41:25 GMT
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Biotic Booty
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: ferroboy
Prime Posts: 77
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Post by dmc1001 on May 22, 2017 3:59:53 GMT
As a person who enjoys MEA, I can say that I don't find it the best game of the series. Thanks for posting, though. More positive reviews are needed.
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Post by KaiserShep on May 22, 2017 4:05:22 GMT
Even as one that actually really loves the game, even more than the Supreme Holiness that is Mass Effect 2, the idea that it's the best of the franchise is a particularly hard sell from just about any angle, especially when you account for the more matter-of-fact technical issues that many players had (or still have to) contend with.
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Post by colfoley on May 22, 2017 4:15:07 GMT
Best? Probably not. But it's a great launching point for the next me saga.
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Prime Posts: 4392
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Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on May 22, 2017 4:23:16 GMT
I don't consider it the best, mostly due to the amount they have to reestablish instead of expanding upon existing content, but I don't think the game got a fair shake either. There were enough people that wanted to see the game burn and did everything they could to exploit any misstep.
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Post by KaiserShep on May 22, 2017 4:52:02 GMT
I don't consider it the best, mostly due to the amount they have to reestablish instead of expanding upon existing content, but I don't think the game got a fair shake either. There were enough people that wanted to see the game burn and did everything they could to exploit any misstep. In fairness, BioWare also made this a little too easy. Had the game been released without the serious animation jankiness and stability issues, at least then the main focus would just be on the actual content rather than the inevitable meme-ification that would come out of its technical problems (ex: the autism idiots). People are always gonna spit venom, especially on anon-shitshow haunts like YouTube comments. |
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kino
N4
The path up and down are one and the same.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition, Dragon Age The Veilguard
Origin: kinom001
Posts: 2,067 Likes: 4,060
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The path up and down are one and the same.
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Post by kino on May 22, 2017 5:05:40 GMT
Good article. I agree with most of those points, though I think a couple were made more of than they are.
I can't say it's the best, I wish I could but nothing is going to match the hype leading up to ME3, but it's definitely the most innovative of the franchise and lays the groundwork for a great story line.
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N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Prime Posts: 4392
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Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on May 22, 2017 5:58:38 GMT
I don't consider it the best, mostly due to the amount they have to reestablish instead of expanding upon existing content, but I don't think the game got a fair shake either. There were enough people that wanted to see the game burn and did everything they could to exploit any misstep. In fairness, BioWare also made this a little too easy. Had the game been released without the serious animation jankiness and stability issues, at least then the main focus would just be on the actual content rather than the inevitable meme-ification that would come out of its technical problems (ex: the autism idiots). People are always gonna spit venom, especially on anon-shitshow haunts like YouTube comments. I agree, I will never say BioWare is without blame. I just think people took it too far. |
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dm04
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 342 Likes: 432
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Post by dm04 on May 22, 2017 8:14:06 GMT
I don't consider it the best, mostly due to the amount they have to reestablish instead of expanding upon existing content, but I don't think the game got a fair shake either. There were enough people that wanted to see the game burn and did everything they could to exploit any misstep. Eh what, people wanted to see MEA burn? What people? People who do not know ME do not care enough to want it to burn, people who know ME and like the ME3 "controversy" certainly did not want MEA to burn and the people who like ME but hated ME3 "controversy" wanted MEA to succeed for it to be redemption for the series. Your comment is very strange. Now, after release of MEA, yes some people want to kick BW so hard in the ass they finaly wake up because of all the release problems. This is not about something subjective like the story or writing, but objective problems. The facial expressions and animations are a joke for todays standards, BW screwed BIG. The unpolished/unfinished features are actualy unthinkable for ME and BW and the number of game breaking bugs.... ouch. I will never understand why there are so many forgiving people who defend MEA and BW, this unconditional love is not good, heck, it is even contraproductive. These are hard facts and huge problems, whether one sees them or not, and oh boy, if someone do not see them, have to open eyes and put down that rosa shades. This people you say want MEA burn wish they could just talk the problems away, so they can enjoy the next ME game. |
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Post by SofaJockey on May 22, 2017 8:16:41 GMT
15 best things eh? - The Tempest - hmmm, Tempest or Normandy, I love the Tempest bridge so I'll give it: 1
- Multiplayer - ME3 is still the more mature experience, maybe when MEAMP is done but I won't give it now: 0
- Visuals - hell yes: 1
- Simplifying the small stuff - not really seeing that: 0
- Volume of Content - it's there and it's optional - yes: 1
- Choices have consequences - in a future game maybe, but in MEA, no: 0
- Loyalty Missions - ME2 was better even though I liked them: 0
- Moral Realism - mmm: no because there were no real consequences: 0
- Customization - Good (for ME) so, ok: 1
- Profiles - I thought this was an improvement and it's optional: 1
- Characters - Not yet an iconic cast but some may become that - 0.5
- Ryder - has really grown on me (particularly Sara): 1
- Story - It is a solid story, just takes a while: 1
- Open World Exploration - yep: 1
- Combat - hell yes: 1
I'm kind of with 9.5/15 of those things.
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Post by Psychevore on May 22, 2017 9:02:03 GMT
I don't consider it the best, mostly due to the amount they have to reestablish instead of expanding upon existing content, but I don't think the game got a fair shake either. There were enough people that wanted to see the game burn and did everything they could to exploit any misstep. Eh what, people wanted to see MEA burn? What people? People who do not know ME do not care enough to want it to burn, people who know ME and like the ME3 "controversy" certainly did not want MEA to burn and the people who like ME but hated ME3 "controversy" wanted MEA to succeed for it to be redemption for the series. Your comment is very strange. Now, after release of MEA, yes some people want to kick BW so hard in the ass they finaly wake up because of all the release problems. This is not about something subjective like the story or writing, but objective problems. The facial expressions and animations are a joke for todays standards, BW screwed BIG. The unpolished/unfinished features are actualy unthinkable for ME and BW and the number of game breaking bugs.... ouch. I will never understand why there are so many forgiving people who defend MEA and BW, this unconditional love is not good, heck, it is even contraproductive. These are hard facts and huge problems, whether one sees them or not, and oh boy, if someone do not see them, have to open eyes and put down that rosa shades. This people you say want MEA burn wish they could just talk the problems away, so they can enjoy the next ME game. Are you new to the internet? |
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correctamundo
N5
Dr Obfuscate
Don't knock the little winds. They're important - for morale.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
Origin: correctamundo1
Prime Posts: A thousand and then some.
Prime Likes: They never liked me! No one likes me!
Posts: 2,831 Likes: 5,274
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Don't knock the little winds. They're important - for morale.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
correctamundo1
A thousand and then some.
They never liked me! No one likes me!
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Post by correctamundo on May 22, 2017 10:24:36 GMT
This article sort of sums up my view. Kind of hilarious to see the butthurt in the comments section.  Whatever happened to this post? The quoting just Went haywiere or something and a whole paragraph just disappeared. Bah.  |
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Post by SofaJockey on May 22, 2017 10:32:04 GMT
This article sort of sums up my view. Kind of hilarious to see the butthurt in the comments section. Whatever happened to this post? The quoting just Went haywiere or something and a whole paragraph just disappeared. Bah. " " ! |
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correctamundo
N5
Dr Obfuscate
Don't knock the little winds. They're important - for morale.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
Origin: correctamundo1
Prime Posts: A thousand and then some.
Prime Likes: They never liked me! No one likes me!
Posts: 2,831 Likes: 5,274
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correctamundo
Don't knock the little winds. They're important - for morale.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
correctamundo1
A thousand and then some.
They never liked me! No one likes me!
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Post by correctamundo on May 22, 2017 10:39:49 GMT
This article sort of sums up my view. Kind of hilarious to see the butthurt in the comments section. Whatever happened to this post? The quoting just Went haywiere or something and a whole paragraph just disappeared. Bah. " " ! I wanted to ask you about "no real consequences". Because there are a lot of choices I make in the game that will have consequences in the game. If I made the same choices IRL I could definitely see me suffering the same consequences all of which would feel very real. I then gave some five or six examples. 
So then why is it not a real consequence in game?
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dm04
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 342 Likes: 432
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Post by dm04 on May 22, 2017 10:45:18 GMT
Eh what, people wanted to see MEA burn? What people? People who do not know ME do not care enough to want it to burn, people who know ME and like the ME3 "controversy" certainly did not want MEA to burn and the people who like ME but hated ME3 "controversy" wanted MEA to succeed for it to be redemption for the series. Your comment is very strange. Now, after release of MEA, yes some people want to kick BW so hard in the ass they finaly wake up because of all the release problems. This is not about something subjective like the story or writing, but objective problems. The facial expressions and animations are a joke for todays standards, BW screwed BIG. The unpolished/unfinished features are actualy unthinkable for ME and BW and the number of game breaking bugs.... ouch. I will never understand why there are so many forgiving people who defend MEA and BW, this unconditional love is not good, heck, it is even contraproductive. These are hard facts and huge problems, whether one sees them or not, and oh boy, if someone do not see them, have to open eyes and put down that rosa shades. This people you say want MEA burn wish they could just talk the problems away, so they can enjoy the next ME game. Are you new to the internet? Obviously I am On the other hand, hate is an emotion and if someone hates, s/he cares. And I know not one person who hates for the sake of hating, because s/he "loves" to hate. All people I know would rather love then hate. And btw all this hate/hating/hate speech talk... all inventions of the 2010s by special snowflakes without proper education, political correct and usualy SJWs. F... this and F... that and Sh... this and Sh... that, that is not hate, not hating and certainly not hate speech. There are certainly people who have problems articulating themselves and drop the F and S bomb all the time, and sometimes this bombs are a way of expressing something without writing novels. I would be more worried when people stop talking about MEA, no matter in what way, then this so called "hate". Whatever, I am certainly new to the internet, have no idea about anything, and hate MEA because I do not put it on a pedestal. SOmething that is realy interesting, when someone of "us" MEA "haters" exaggerates, all the MEA lovers are very quick at pointing it out. On the other hand, to the MEA lovers, everyone who dislikes MEA is a hater... what was it about exaggeration? This is far beyond pure fanboyism. |
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Post by SofaJockey on May 22, 2017 11:08:39 GMT
I wanted to ask you about "no real consequences". Because there are a lot of choices I make in the game that will have consequences in the game. If I made the same choices IRL I could definitely see me suffering the same consequences all of which would feel very real. I then gave some five or six examples.
So then why is it not a real consequence in game?
Let's pick on a few... Salarians or Krogan, aside of some huffing and puffing from Drack, none. Military or Scientific, no real outcome there. The contagious person, consequences to the virus being lost? no, to the person's fate? no. Even going against the initiative to seek Meridian, no consequence: 'you were right pathfinder...' Now some of these things may bite us later, but the consequences strike me as minutiae not consequential. Perhaps ME1 / 2 dressed the same things up better, I don't know, but consequences would not be top of my list for MEA, and I really liked the game. |
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Post by christsuperstar on May 22, 2017 11:19:33 GMT
It's a good game, overall, definetly worth the money - but for me it lies in the shadow of what it could/should have been.
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correctamundo
N5
Dr Obfuscate
Don't knock the little winds. They're important - for morale.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
Origin: correctamundo1
Prime Posts: A thousand and then some.
Prime Likes: They never liked me! No one likes me!
Posts: 2,831 Likes: 5,274
inherit
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correctamundo
Don't knock the little winds. They're important - for morale.
2,831
August 2016
correctamundo
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
correctamundo1
A thousand and then some.
They never liked me! No one likes me!
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Post by correctamundo on May 22, 2017 11:31:40 GMT
I wanted to ask you about "no real consequences". Because there are a lot of choices I make in the game that will have consequences in the game. If I made the same choices IRL I could definitely see me suffering the same consequences all of which would feel very real. I then gave some five or six examples.
So then why is it not a real consequence in game?
Let's pick on a few... Salarians or Krogan, aside of some huffing and puffing from Drack, none. Military or Scientific, no real outcome there. The contagious person, consequences to the virus being lost? no, to the person's fate? no. Even going against the initiative to seek Meridian, no consequence: 'you were right pathfinder...' Now some of these things may bite us later, but the consequences strike me as minutiae not consequential. Perhaps ME1 / 2 dressed the same things up better, I don't know, but consequences would not be top of my list for MEA, and I really liked the game. You have to fight Behemoths all the way. I call that a consequence. Military/scientific, yae. Contagious, maybe? And of course Kallo would say "you were right Parthfinder". Forever playing on the winning horse. 
But maybe I misunderstood you as I figured you meant no real consequences at all. But suppose you have a character who you play as interested in Jaal, move the flirting a long and then you don't dare to trust his judgement on Akksul. Forever shut down. IRL that would be heartbreak and a real consequence. Why not in the game? Khesh and Drack? Well specifically Khesh who is very open to you and supportive. You can build that relationship over the game and then if you chose "wrong" according to the Krogan she will not speak to you again. IRL I would think that something like that would feel real. Then there is the Avitus Rix conundrum.
So for me it feels like I don't understand what real consequences mean?
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Post by abaris on May 22, 2017 12:19:43 GMT
It boils down to tastes. Apart from the obvious bugs and glitches that can be taken care off by patches. I wouldn't call MEA the best. Not by a long chalk. I wouldn't call it bad either. For me it lies somewhere in the middle. I had and still have my fun, so I got my return on investment, but the game failed to deliver on what I would call the USP of Bioware. And that's a strong lead and companions you want to get to know. There are instances where this game comes close, but it never really delivers. I never had this wish to avoid talking to certain companions and the skip button has become my dearest friend in certain conversations. Again, neither best nor worst in my opinion. Enjoyable, but looking at the obvious potential, it falls short on the delivery. |
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Post by SofaJockey on May 22, 2017 12:28:10 GMT
Let's pick on a few... Salarians or Krogan, aside of some huffing and puffing from Drack, none. Military or Scientific, no real outcome there. The contagious person, consequences to the virus being lost? no, to the person's fate? no. Even going against the initiative to seek Meridian, no consequence: 'you were right pathfinder...' Now some of these things may bite us later, but the consequences strike me as minutiae not consequential. Perhaps ME1 / 2 dressed the same things up better, I don't know, but consequences would not be top of my list for MEA, and I really liked the game. You have to fight Behemoths all the way. I call that a consequence. Military/scientific, yae. Contagious, maybe? And of course Kallo would say "you were right Parthfinder". Forever playing on the winning horse.
But maybe I misunderstood you as I figured you meant no real consequences at all. But suppose you have a character who you play as interested in Jaal, move the flirting a long and then you don't dare to trust his judgement on Akksul. Forever shut down. IRL that would be heartbreak and a real consequence. Why not in the game? Khesh and Drack? Well specifically Khesh who is very open to you and supportive. You can build that relationship over the game and then if you chose "wrong" according to the Krogan she will not speak to you again. IRL I would think that something like that would feel real. Then there is the Avitus Rix conundrum.
So for me it feels like I don't understand what real consequences mean?
Hmmm, what's interesting here is that many people (I read this somewhere) tend to re-run the same choices in subsequent playthroughs. I never saw what happened with Akksul because I never took the shot... You can upset Kesh? ok, I always build the base at New Tuchanka. Avitus Rix always became the Pathfinder. Maybe I don't see the breadth of consequence because I didn't make those choices... |
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Prime Posts: 4392
Prime Likes: 882
Posts: 6,004 Likes: 9,088
inherit
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9,088
Sanunes
Just a flip of the coin.
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Sept 13, 2016 11:51:12 GMT
September 2016
sanunes
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Sanunes on May 22, 2017 12:34:31 GMT
You have to fight Behemoths all the way. I call that a consequence. Military/scientific, yae. Contagious, maybe? And of course Kallo would say "you were right Parthfinder". Forever playing on the winning horse.
But maybe I misunderstood you as I figured you meant no real consequences at all. But suppose you have a character who you play as interested in Jaal, move the flirting a long and then you don't dare to trust his judgement on Akksul. Forever shut down. IRL that would be heartbreak and a real consequence. Why not in the game? Khesh and Drack? Well specifically Khesh who is very open to you and supportive. You can build that relationship over the game and then if you chose "wrong" according to the Krogan she will not speak to you again. IRL I would think that something like that would feel real. Then there is the Avitus Rix conundrum.
So for me it feels like I don't understand what real consequences mean?
Hmmm, what's interesting here is that many people (I read this somewhere) tend to re-run the same choices in subsequent playthroughs. I never saw what happened with Akksul because I never took the shot... You can upset Kesh? ok, I always build the base at New Tuchanka. Avitus Rix always became the Pathfinder. Maybe I don't see the breadth of consequence because I didn't make those choices... Unfortunately I think they are playing it safe with the choices now that people how the chants of "our choices don't matter" were made for what I found was that a lot of choices the only impact was troops at Meridan. If you pick a Military base it slightly changes some dialogue with some people liking and others not liking whatever choice you made and if you pick military you have some extra troops. As mentioned if you pick the Krogans over the Salarian you don't have to fight more then the one Behemoth in the game. I think a lot of the choices in the game were done extremely subtly too, so we might not be noticing them. |
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Post by SofaJockey on May 22, 2017 12:39:59 GMT
The most meaningful choice I made was not visiting Sara in the cryobay when I should (I just forgot).
That hurt, I remember that one...
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Post by abaris on May 22, 2017 12:41:21 GMT
I think a lot of the choices in the game were done extremely subtly too, so we might not be noticing them. Choices that we don't take note of the consequences, don't matter. I'm not under the dillusion that anything I did in the trilogy really mattered, apart from the Virmire surivivor, but they handled the illusion of player agency in a better way. And that's what ultimately matters. You being at the helm and shaping a character. I also have to say, I'm not a fan of abandoning paragon/renegade. Sure, it was a simplistic system, but at least it was a system where you could be a bitch/dick or handle things smoothly. |
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Prime Posts: 4392
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Just a flip of the coin.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Sanunes on May 22, 2017 12:53:20 GMT
I think a lot of the choices in the game were done extremely subtly too, so we might not be noticing them. Choices that we don't take note of the consequences, don't matter. I'm not under the dillusion that anything I did in the trilogy really mattered, apart from the Virmire surivivor, but they handled the illusion of player agency in a better way. And that's what ultimately matters. You being at the helm and shaping a character. I also have to say, I'm not a fan of abandoning paragon/renegade. Sure, it was a simplistic system, but at least it was a system where you could be a bitch/dick or handle things smoothly. After seeing what people were saying about choices in Mass Effect 3, I just can't see it happening. I don't mind the nullification of choice by allowing it to be set to a neutral state for future games, but having an impact on the current one. The problem is I don't think I am in the majority. Edit: An example would be Uldina/Anderson as the Ambassador to the Citadel. Now I could be remembering it wrong, but Mass Effect 3 takes it as you have always made Uldina the Ambassador, but just a couple of lines of dialogue to acknowledge it would have been nice to see. |
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Post by aglomeracja on May 22, 2017 13:21:09 GMT
The choices don't matter for couple of reasons, one of the being that most of the time the game tells you things instead of showing them. It's also quite easy to miss all those subtle changes that are in the game because of MEA's open world setting. You have to do quests in certain order, otherwise the narrative breaks quite often.
I've discussed this on BSN a couple of times and honestly it was surprising how every time I claimed that there are no meaningful\morally grey\etc choices someone would provide multiple examples of those fitting this description that are in the game. I've encountered most of them, but didn't recognize them as 'meaningful'. Why is that? Here's one example:
"The lost song" quest. Poachers are killing Angaran sacred animals, Jaal wants you to take him with along with you for this one, so it must be important.
-You find poachers, they start shooting at you, you kill a dozen or so and get inside the cave.
-There you meet some scientist who couldn't care less that you just killed plenty of people to get inside. The 'emotiona' Angara doesn't seem to be capable of feeling emotions at the time.
-She tells you that "the enzyme in the yevara's skin could treat the effect of Kett weaponry" and that's the reason why she kills those animals. How very convenient.
-Jaal says he can't make the decision, so Ryder has to. How super convenient.
-If you let her continue Jaal won't talk to you. If you don't, nothing happens. Both consequences come down to 'nothing', because Jaal's silent treatment is a convenient excuse for not showing us an actual confilct.
Now, we didn't even see those fucking animals. In theory you have a premise-> twist-> meaningful choice, but what do you actually see in the game is the cheapest and laziest possible version of that. While playing it I could literally see the game mechanic, a big, flashy "choice moment". It's impossible to get immersed in a story like that.
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