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Post by Beregond5 on Nov 3, 2016 19:56:54 GMT
Right now, I think we all reached to a point of discussion that, no matter what we say, we'll be right for different reasons. There's evidence that leads to a lot of interpretations, which doesn't necessarily mean one is more correct than the other. If we want to stick to facts, the truth of the matter is that the devs hadn't really thought about pairing Kaidan with a male Shepard, but when they realised how popular the idea was among fans - especially since some of the dialogue seemed to actually encourage the notion rather than the other way around - they figured, 'Yeah, why not?' and made it happen in 3. Beyond that, it's a matter of headcanon. Someone believing that Kaidan is Shepardsexual (Look ma! New word!) is no less wrong than people believing that he was always bisexual or that it depends on what gender is your Shepard. After all, it's been said before (and I really should have remembered it before participating) that people can't really have *one* label going for them. (Even if they're Bioware characters. XD) Anyway, here's something cute I came across. Source: linkAnd something else, because why not. XD
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Post by SpiritVanguard on Nov 3, 2016 20:58:27 GMT
This is where it does get dicey. In FemShep's trilogy, even if he is unromanced by her, he does not show any interest in other men at all but he did so with other women. His comment on Jacob's looks only happen if you romance Kaidan in ME1 and sleep with Jacob in ME2, but its out of jealousy and spite, not because he's personally interested in Jacob. Kaidan's bisexuality is exclusively for ME3's MaleShep player. Therefore, it is entirely within MaleShep player's prerogative to think Kaidan is a bisexual man but it doesn't make him as one in FemShep player's narrative. Its just a case where he is or isn't only if you want him to be. As I wrote before, I just hope, we never will get again such a lame solutions, but I was happy with Kaidan in ME3. I honestly don't think this will be a problem. They still make missteps but they are getting better, I think. MEA will probably be similar to the romance setup in DAI. As to whether or not the romances are likable is another case... What I really don't want is a repeat of Anders. Don't hide important information just because of player gender! But, you know well enough how I feel about this...
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Post by NRieh on Nov 3, 2016 22:43:54 GMT
I don't like it this way. NPC is called NPC for reasons. It's a Non-Player Character, that does not (and should not) depend on player's gender, sexuality, alignment, race, whatever else. Kaidan is Kaidan to me, always the same (and same true for Anders). Technically that's metagaming, but I accept them as they are, and I (female & straight, playing as female & straight) have no problems with them having...let's call it 'the different experience'. It could be just me with my habbit of sorting things out via headcanons (comes with being a BW player, I guess, lol), but I don't see their 'coming out' as something character-breaking and\or horrible. For Kaidan Alchera could be that 'breaking point'. Don't get me wrong, I don't want to make it sound like bisexuality\ s\s affection is kind of traumatic symptom or a disease, but Alchera& the order to leave definitely IS a Shenko 'milestone', regardless of the Shep's gender. And...after all no one had ever specified 'The Doctor's' gender, right? And Anders? Maker, name me a single rule he had not broken while staying with Circle. Obviously some things are not that significant for a man who knows what freedom should look like. 'But, oh, he had not told femHawke\femShep'... Yeah, he hadn't, and neither had Kaidan. So what? I've never told my husband about the men I've met before him. And neither had he. Not because it's some kind of forbidden subject, we just never needed that. I love him for what he is, I didn't care about it back then and I certainly don't now. We've been together for 10 years, our kids are 6&9yrs.
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Post by SpiritVanguard on Nov 3, 2016 23:50:05 GMT
** 'But, oh, he had not told femHawke\femShep'... Yeah, he hadn't, and neither had Kaidan. So what? I've never told my husband about the men I've met before him. And neither had he. Not because it's some kind of forbidden subject, we just never needed that. I love him for what he is, I didn't care about it back then and I certainly don't now. We've been together for 10 years, our kids are 6&9yrs. I really don't think I should get into this here, but there's always this idea that "Anders just didn't talk about his former boyfriend" when it's so much more than that. There's pertinent, character buiding information that's tied to Karl, about who Anders is and why he fights, but all of that is stripped away for femHawke because of "reasons." It's not about needing him to state his sexuality and sexual history to everyone that walks by, it's about not removing character development because of player gender. Karl is more than "just an ex-boyfriend." And trust me, I absolutely do love Anders the way he is. Kaidan isn't as comparable in this aspect in my mind. He does have Rahna and although it's been a while since I played I don't think he goes into great detail about her unless in romance, which makes sense, but you still learn about who is through the "Brain camp" story. Rahna doesn't remove that part of his character. Jack is similar, she doesn't talk about a serious boyfriend she had unless in romance -- the difference here is only mShep can romance her.
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Post by Catilina on Nov 4, 2016 0:38:49 GMT
I don't like it this way. NPC is called NPC for reasons. It's a Non-Player Character, that does not (and should not) depend on player's gender, sexuality, alignment, race, whatever else. Kaidan is Kaidan to me, always the same (and same true for Anders). Technically that's metagaming, but I accept them as they are, and I (female & straight, playing as female & straight) have no problems with them having...let's call it 'the different experience'. It could be just me with my habbit of sorting things out via headcanons (comes with being a BW player, I guess, lol), but I don't see their 'coming out' as something character-breaking and\or horrible. For Kaidan Alchera could be that 'breaking point'. Don't get me wrong, I don't want to make it sound like bisexuality\ s\s affection is kind of traumatic symptom or a disease, but Alchera& the order to leave definitely IS a Shenko 'milestone', regardless of the Shep's gender. And...after all no one had ever specified 'The Doctor's' gender, right? And Anders? Maker, name me a single rule he had not broken while staying with Circle. Obviously some things are not that significant for a man who knows what freedom should look like. 'But, oh, he had not told femHawke\femShep'... Yeah, he hadn't, and neither had Kaidan. So what? I've never told my husband about the men I've met before him. And neither had he. Not because it's some kind of forbidden subject, we just never needed that. I love him for what he is, I didn't care about it back then and I certainly don't now. We've been together for 10 years, our kids are 6&9yrs. Alenko and Anders position is not same. Alenko maybe was hiding/was too shy or something whatever. But Anders relationship was very important in viewpoint of the story. Karl was not the simple ex-first-lover, Karl was the reason, why Anders had come in Kirkwall, why he need Hawke's help. And: Hawke was not his lover, their love fulfilled just after three years. And if the player only played as female, this fact totally lost for him/her. Maybe it's not too important to you, but there are people, who would feel cheated.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2016 3:59:34 GMT
Kaidan's sexuality is an area that could be expanded on in an eventual trilogy remake that included a bi kadian in mass effect 1. I don't know if such a thing will ever come to pass, but one can dream.
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Post by Kaidan Fan on Nov 4, 2016 4:03:46 GMT
I'm probably the minority in this opinion, but I'd prefer to not have the games remade or have changes made to them. Making them available on the new gen gaming consoles is probably as remade as I'd like. I prefer them to spend time, money and resources on new games.
Although......Kaidan in frostbite...................*wanders off*
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Post by NRieh on Nov 4, 2016 9:12:44 GMT
But that one is in-game for the femHawke too. The only thing that gets left 'offscreen' for her is that they had been actually more than friends. That line about 'why are you looking at me like this?' is still there, though. Karl's importance to Anders is 200% ovbious, and one has to be totally blind and deaf not to get it. From my experience there are two kind of players which are affected by the 'Anders issue'. It's straight male players who had been 'dishonored' by the very fact of Anders eventually taking the initiative (and by those -5 rep points too...'How dare they to tax me for being straight?!'). And the other kind are straight female players who can't deal with his bisexuality (which they had never ever seen outside the interwebs, to begin with). There are also some 'lore nazzis', but their struggles are very likely to be more about the DAA-DA2 timeline (which IS totally f**ed up), and not about some mage's sexual preferences. But back to Kaidan. Minority or not, but you're not alone in this one. I also think that games should be left as they had been created, with all the characters, combat mechanics, designs etc. Im' not even a big fan of changing textures, last time I've tried Jedi Knight with one of those packs and I rolled back, it all looked awfully wrong to me. I never even mod anything other than hairstyles and outfits, and I never mod NPCs in any way. So, I'd rather have ME&Kaidan 'as is'. The only thing I can accept is adapting old games for newer system (fixing widescreen, adding 1080 support, scaling UI etc). BG\IWD EE had it right, but I hated the retextured Bioshock. They've changed too much of the old art&styls for my tastes, and those 'Disney-Dory-under-the-sea' additions don't fit in (because, yeah, glueing a copy-pasted starfish to every glass surface does not really work well with dark-retro-steampunk setting).
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Post by Beregond5 on Nov 4, 2016 13:07:56 GMT
I'm probably the minority in this opinion, but I'd prefer to not have the games remade or have changes made to them. Making them available on the new gen gaming consoles is probably as remade as I'd like. I prefer them to spend time, money and resources on new games. Although......Kaidan in frostbite...................*wanders off* I wouldn't say no to an improved CC segment... As it is, I can only make one decent male looking Shepard and there's no way I'm using him to romance anybody else than Kaidan, no matter how badly I want to. XD (Sheploo is to be taken by Miranda. At some point. Eventually.)
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Post by SpiritVanguard on Nov 4, 2016 22:22:40 GMT
But that one is in-game for the femHawke too. The only thing that gets left 'offscreen' for her is that they had been actually more than friends. That line about 'why are you looking at me like this?' is still there, though. Karl's importance to Anders is 200% ovbious, and one has to be totally blind and deaf not to get it. ** Not actually true, but whatever.
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Post by SpiritVanguard on Nov 4, 2016 22:59:18 GMT
Anywho~ here's some Kaidan fan art: Link -- bekarts.tumblr.com ^ Click the link to see a shirtless Kaidan too.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2016 23:03:24 GMT
Anyway, here's something cute I came across. Source: linkThat is too cute And also... is that the head of an Angel from Buffy the Vampire Slayer POP! glued atop a recoloured Commander Shepard POP! body??? If so thats inventive and I love it and need one. My Shep, Garrus and Tali POP!'s miss Kaidan and Liara
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Post by dmc1001 on Nov 5, 2016 3:11:17 GMT
This is where it does get dicey. In FemShep's trilogy, even if he is unromanced by her, he does not show any interest in other men at all but he did so with other women. His comment on Jacob's looks only happen if you romance Kaidan in ME1 and sleep with Jacob in ME2, but its out of jealousy and spite, not because he's personally interested in Jacob. Kaidan's bisexuality is exclusively for ME3's MaleShep player. Therefore, it is entirely within MaleShep player's prerogative to think Kaidan is a bisexual man but it doesn't make him as one in FemShep player's narrative. Its just a case where he is or isn't only if you want him to be. I always assume that for Kaidan, he never thought much about a relationship with another guy until Shepard came along. He definitely never shows interest in other guys in ME3, but does show interest in women even in a s/s romance.
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Post by aoibhealfae on Nov 5, 2016 9:46:52 GMT
I always assume that for Kaidan, he never thought much about a relationship with another guy until Shepard came along. He definitely never shows interest in other guys in ME3, but does show interest in women even in a s/s romance. I don't mind it if he's truly written as a bisexual for the entire trilogy but Kaidan in FemShep's trilogy doesn't need to have his sexuality scrutinized merely for someone who never exist in their story. What FemShep has with her Kaidan doesn't invalidate what MaleShep has with his Kaidan. Its just for different story between different people.
On another hand, trying out some other new mods for ME3 but I still just couldn't help it... His thousand yard stares always reminds me of this song. Wake up and look me in the eyes again, I need to feel your hand upon my face. Words can be like knives, they can cut you open. And then the silence surrounds you, and haunts you
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Post by Beregond5 on Nov 5, 2016 11:10:56 GMT
Anyway, here's something cute I came across. Source: linkThat is too cute And also... is that the head of an Angel from Buffy the Vampire Slayer POP! glued atop a recoloured Commander Shepard POP! body??? If so thats inventive and I love it and need one. My Shep, Garrus and Tali POP!'s miss Kaidan and Liara I think it's the head of Castiel from Supernatural, but yeah, pretty much. It's cool what one can come up with. And the artist accepts commissions too, if you're interested.
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Post by SpiritVanguard on Nov 7, 2016 22:16:52 GMT
Saw this in the Mass Effect: Andromeda twitter thread about potential m/m romance and thought I'd share: No real spoilers, but under a tag just in case.
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Post by aoibhealfae on Nov 8, 2016 12:58:02 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2016 21:46:01 GMT
Already I want to play as BroRyder and romance Liam (provided he is the guy in the promotional images with the Ryder siblings). Even so, no one will replace Kaidan for me
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Post by Kaidan Fan on Nov 10, 2016 1:32:09 GMT
It's going to be super hard to beat Kaidan methinks He is my absolute favorite of all ME/DA romances.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2016 10:08:41 GMT
Kaidan's romantic storyline, for FemShep and BroShep, for me, felt entirely lacking in cliche or melodrama.
It was unique, and well written and portrayed. Which is why I feel it will be so hard to beat.
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Post by Kaidan Fan on Nov 10, 2016 16:48:16 GMT
I think it helps that Kaidan is a strong character on his own with or without a romance. He has his own opinions and beliefs that don't require Shepards approval. Though I suppose that could be said about most of the characters in Mass Effect, for Kaidan it just seems more real. He's deep, man!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2016 0:20:29 GMT
I remember reading on a website about Mass Effect cocktails (if you don't believe me, savegameonline.com/c3-features/save-games-mass-effect-squadmate-cocktails-the-best-drinks-this-side-of-the-citadel) and in the Kaidan Alenko description, they said that he is the still waters run deep kinda guy, and it is sooo true! Kaidan is a character whose many layers and qualities are there to be unraveled, they aren't there at face value like some other characters. You have to work at understanding and getting to know Kaidan, which is why I think he is one of BioWare's best, and unsung heroes! He is a multifaceted, fully formed character, who stands out with or without a romance, as a strong and inspirational Mass Effect character. He will forever remain iconic to me, and I am sure countless others
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Post by corkyspetals on Nov 11, 2016 16:34:10 GMT
It's going to be super hard to beat Kaidan methinks He is my absolute favorite of all ME/DA romances. Maybe... somebody made a Kaidan clone with Kaidan Prime's exact personality... and put it aboard the Hyperion!
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Post by aoibhealfae on Nov 13, 2016 17:19:31 GMT
So... I've been testing a mod lately. The mod restore the covered windows in ME3 with the regular ME2 and I didn't realize that it make a very big difference. also romance-related I still need to use my flycam for some of this and there's some gesture stuttering but I like that it smooth out the scene between the Apollo's Cafe and the comment he made after Admiral Koris mission. Finally they get to kiss in the middle of the game. The picture scene is well-done too. Reminds me of ME2, and then she smiles! Although I'm curious that the mod was very detailed on Kaidan personnel's records that doesn't seem to be fanfic-ish. Made him as my proper XO
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Post by fenris on Nov 16, 2016 13:07:35 GMT
Does Femshep also check out Kaiden's ass when he comes on board the Normandy after the Citadel attack? I've never used the ME1 gay romance mod before, so now ME3 treats my game as thought my broShep and Kaiden were lovers in previous games, and he checked out Kaiden's ass. Never saw that before. It was hilarious.
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