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Post by aoibhealfae on Jan 26, 2017 7:38:18 GMT
Sigh.. Just got out from another hating Kaidan topic because he accuse Shepard for cheating on him. Dear gods.. Shepard sleeping around out of spite and expect Kaidan to smile and pamper them like an idiot.
The nerve of Shepard having to apologize to him. Tch tch. Kaidan wasn't sympathetic about Thane. Bohoo..
Seriously?
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Post by catalina on Jan 26, 2017 10:04:19 GMT
It was Kaidan's choice to stay an L2 though, partly because he was afraid of the surgery ("one wrong cut and you forget your name") but also was content with his abilities even if it was an outdated implant with little drawback, considering. True that even with a lower level implant he was still stronger than a lot of L3s (except Shepard, as he notes). I just hope that Destroy wouldn't cause him any pain or damage. I mean, it's in his head... It that case, they can be two invalids nursing each other back to health. I can imagine Kaidan taking Shep back to Canada & Kaidan's mum fussing over both of them Just going through some of my old pics and found this I had way too much time on my hands, and I've never read the book, honest.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2017 4:07:31 GMT
Well after seeing Liam-I gotta say it looks like Kaidan will reign as the hottest space husbando a bit longer yet.
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Post by melbella on Jan 27, 2017 5:31:48 GMT
Sigh.. Just got out from another hating Kaidan topic because he accuse Shepard for cheating on him. Dear gods.. Shepard sleeping around out of spite and expect Kaidan to smile and pamper them like an idiot. The nerve of Shepard having to apologize to him. Tch tch. Kaidan wasn't sympathetic about Thane. Bohoo.. Seriously? Well, being called a traitor is kind of a big FU and a break up in my book. There was no cheating since at that point the relationship was over. It is annoying, especially since male Shep can call out Ashley for the same attitude. Yet femShep is supposed to apologize to Kaidan? Um, no.
I like the Kaidan romance as much as anyone, but that line really bothers me.
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Post by SpiritVanguard on Jan 27, 2017 7:03:32 GMT
I see it as Kaidan overreacted and was being emotional (he thought Shepard was dead, Cerberus is shady, I think it's understandable he might not handle this well), so I could see Shep as also being overreactive by "starting" with somebody else just because they got into a fight (which feels so forced to begin with to me). BUT it is up to the player to define these relationships... to an extent. It's possible to end it there with him, in your head: Part of my problem with that moment in 3 is that it's like they deliberately made it confusing: Single ME2 Shep = Kaidan acts like you broke up. Not-Single ME2 Shep = Kaidan says you cheated. I romanced Ashley in 1 with an mShep but hooked up with someone else and her overall attitude was like she assumed it was over, or that SHE decided it was over back on Horizon. Kaidan seems to have been left waiting, in the way he was written. (I haven't done a "loyal" playthough with Ashley yet so I don't know the difference there.)At any rate, waiting for Kaidan in 3 leads to a better romance imo than doing somebody else in 2. There are little differences between the two romance paths including a line change near the end of the game.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2017 8:06:29 GMT
I see it as Kaidan overreacted and was being emotional (he thought Shepard was dead, Cerberus is shady, I think it's understandable he might not handle this well), so I could see Shep as also being overreactive by "starting" with somebody else just because they got into a fight with Kaidan (which feels so forced to begin with to me). BUT it is up to the player to define these relationships... to an extent. It's possible to end it there with him, in your head: Part of my problem with that moment in 3 is that it's like they deliberately made it confusing: Single ME2 Shep = Kaidan acts like you broke up. Not-Single ME2 Shep = Kaidan says you cheated. I romanced Ashley in 1 with an mShep but hooked up with someone else and her overall attitude was like she assumed it was over, or that SHE decided it was over back on Horizon. Kaidan seems to have been left waiting, in the way he was written. (I haven't done a "loyal" playthough with Ashley yet so I don't know the difference there.)At any rate, waiting for Kaidan in 3 leads to a better romance imo than doing somebody else in 2. There are little differences between the two romance paths including a line change near the end of the game. what's the difference, and is that only for fem shep I take it?
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Post by SpiritVanguard on Jan 27, 2017 8:59:22 GMT
what's the difference, and is that only for fem shep I take it? Yeah. The difference at the end stems from the dialogue that get's cutoff for mShep. (And I can't use mods so I don't know if that matters.) Kaidan has two different responses after Shepard tells him she loves him: Shep: You mean a lot to me Kaidan. I love you.
Kaidan to "loyal" Shep: I've always loved you. Through all these years, through... through everything... I'm the luckiest man alive. -- Kaidan to "disloyal" Shep: I love you too. Until the end of time. I have never started a new romance with him as femShep in 3 though so I don't know what or which is said in that case. As for the other differences with loyal Shep it's little changes in the dialogues, like during the hospital visits, as well as Shep admiring his bum after he rejoins the Normandy.
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Post by catalina on Jan 27, 2017 10:00:10 GMT
Although I felt really frustrated for my Shep on Horizon I did feel that Kaidan was torn up emotionally, and possibly feeling that he had now lost her twice. Once thinking she was dead and now she was alive, but working with Cerberus. The woman he loved and knew would never have worked for them. After reading the note from Kaidan , did anybody else’s Shep want to find out who this doctor was that he went out with? I was thinking in ME3 it might have been interesting to come across the doctor, maybe treating Kaidan on the Citadel? I always thought they might have had Rahna show up at some point to. My Shep has always been loyal. She just stares at his pic in her room.
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Post by aoibhealfae on Jan 27, 2017 12:47:54 GMT
I thought it's kinda obvious Kaidan never take their relationship for granted, he's the kind of guy who does everything in end-game term. With their reputation and career at stake, they're risking a court-martial; the logical resolution to this was marriage. If Kaidan and Shepard were about to be secretly engaged prior to her death, why wouldn't he feel pissed that Shepard choose to sleep with another guy and throw their relationship away?
On Horizon, he's already feeling like a total failure and then you just have to show up like its a walk in the park with "Hey, I got a great sponsor, they're terrorists but nice kind. Why are you so mad?" like a quarter million of people wasn't just being taken and turned to proto-reaper mulch. He had less than five minutes in a game which culminate to a letter where he apologised, talk about how he was ready to move on but he chose to chase your ghost instead. Then he hinted that they'll sort everything out when everything settles down.... that is not a breakup.
Also, what is the right reaction for Kaidan and Unfaithful Shepard? "Shepard, you're allowed to sleep with anyone you want and I'm not going to get angry at all or accuse you of cheating because not like I haven't spent these few years being faithful to you."
Now... I don't have any history with it but I do understand how horrible it was to be accused of cheating... but it's a situation that can be avoided very easily and he's just a fictional character... who still received death threats to this day..... smh.
And I didn't realise this thread have 14.5k views.... awesome
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Post by Davrin's boobs on Jan 27, 2017 14:43:39 GMT
I've never met Kaidan angry side, I feel that his reaction in Horizon was very human and I can totally get the guy, damn I was like that the entire game as player thinking about the true intentions of Cerberus, and Kaidan/Ashely was right afterall. I can't conceive a unfaithful MShepard playthrough (mainly because Garrus and Thane don't want my flesh xD :insert sad face:), but I don't recall Kaidan calling Shepard a traitor, when does that happen?
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Post by Catilina on Jan 27, 2017 15:48:39 GMT
I've never met Kaidan angry side, I feel that his reaction in Horizon was very human and I can totally get the guy, damn I was like that the entire game as player thinking about the true intentions of Cerberus, and Kaidan/Ashely was right afterall. I can't conceive a unfaithful MShepard playthrough (mainly because Garrus and Thane don't want my flesh xD :insert sad face:), but I don't recall Kaidan calling Shepard a traitor, when does that happen? Anger is very human, and understandable sometimes...
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Post by dmc1001 on Jan 27, 2017 17:02:38 GMT
At any rate, waiting for Kaidan in 3 leads to a better romance imo than doing somebody else in 2. There are little differences between the two romance paths including a line change near the end of the game. I've found it quite acceptable to not romance anyone in ME2 and wait for Kaidan in ME3 (regardless of whether or not I modded in an existing romance for ME1). Because dialogue on the Normandy seems less necessary to me for some reason I just get on with the missions and import into ME3 where I can meet my "True Love".
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Post by melbella on Jan 28, 2017 1:35:02 GMT
I thought it's kinda obvious Kaidan never take their relationship for granted, he's the kind of guy who does everything in end-game term. With their reputation and career at stake, they're risking a court-martial; the logical resolution to this was marriage. If Kaidan and Shepard were about to be secretly engaged prior to her death, why wouldn't he feel pissed that Shepard choose to sleep with another guy and throw their relationship away?
This is all head-canon. Marriage never comes up, is never even implied anywhere in the game. You can't judge another player's interpretation of what is said IN THE GAME based on how you head-canon their relationship outside of it. It may not be a break up to him. But we're talking about Shepard here. Why can't Shepard view Horizon as a break up and act accordingly? She may not have gotten the email. She may not have READ the email. Even so, it's an EMAIL apology. Why does he never apologize in person, even if they reconcile later on?
He can have whatever reaction he wants. That doesn't make it right or fair. So can Shepard. That doesn't make her right or her actions fair either. Btw, Kaidan went on a date, at least, per the email. He was trying to move on. So why can't Shepard ALSO try to move on, if she feels their relationship is over?
Yes, it can be avoided. But not every Shepard is the same.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2017 5:29:32 GMT
Hmmm..I hate missing out on dialogue just cause I couldn't romance Kaidan in Mass Effect 1, but oh well...he's still got great content at least!
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Post by aoibhealfae on Jan 28, 2017 5:32:51 GMT
The part where they talk about fraternization and risking a court-martial isn't a headcanon. Joker disapproves of their relationship throughout the trilogy and the threat is there. Which is why Kaidan became a Spectre in the first place before he could join the team again. Kaidan never once called Shepard his girlfriend. He loves her from the beginning to the end. Even if marriage never come up, he acted like he's a life partner to her. Taking her to dinner, making her dinner, he has a beachside property, he planned on having a long career in military, naturally he doesn't see his relationship with her as a momentary fling. His last words were for you to come back to him alive. He wanted to live and grow old and die being in love with Shepard.
It is up to you as Shepard to assume your relationship with him as a momentary lapse of judgement but just because you take his love for granted doesn't mean he does it for you. You choose to side with terrorist which is a betrayal for his loyalty to the Alliance and then it hurt player's ego more that Kaidan doesn't take being cuckolded like a pussy and instead he's a jerk for making you apologize for sleeping with another man after having a couple minutes disagreement. A quarter million people just die because TIM planted rumors that you're on that planet to bait the reapers to see him as a person of interest. He just wanted you to leave Cerberus and prove to him that you're the person he still loves who loves him back.
You're standing in a half barren city where people; parents, lovers, grandparents and children, forcibly taken and horribly killed... but you only hear that he's angry and assume your relationship is over because he won't join you and now you're free to pick anyone who could scratch your itch.
Priorities.
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Post by SpiritVanguard on Jan 28, 2017 7:29:12 GMT
I've never met Kaidan angry side, I feel that his reaction in Horizon was very human and I can totally get the guy, damn I was like that the entire game as player thinking about the true intentions of Cerberus, and Kaidan/Ashely was right afterall. I can't conceive a unfaithful MShepard playthrough (mainly because Garrus and Thane don't want my flesh xD :insert sad face:), but I don't recall Kaidan calling Shepard a traitor, when does that happen? I think Kaidan seems less confrontational on friend path. In romance carry over from 1 it's a little more heated (or at least feels that way) but it's not like he's yelling and screaming slander. He's upset, confused and quite honestly I feel like it get's blown out of proportion -- like he's not allowed to be upset, or not allowed to question Shepard. He doesn't outright call you a traitor, but feels betrayed and says so. I was frustrated the first time because the dialogue options are so terrible. It's basically just 3 different ways to insensitively argue with Kaidan, when I actually agreed with what he was saying. At any rate, waiting for Kaidan in 3 leads to a better romance imo than doing somebody else in 2. There are little differences between the two romance paths including a line change near the end of the game. I've found it quite acceptable to not romance anyone in ME2 and wait for Kaidan in ME3 (regardless of whether or not I modded in an existing romance for ME1). Because dialogue on the Normandy seems less necessary to me for some reason I just get on with the missions and import into ME3 where I can meet my "True Love". Romancing somebody in 2 is fun but there's something to be said for staying single; in the way it can make your Shep's story feel whether they were with someone in 1 or not and how that can carry into 3. And it's certainly special to wait for Kaidan in 3 as mShep. Plus, when you stay single in 2 (and/or if you haven't locked in a romance yet), you get the dialogue with Mordin if you talk to him enough where he thinks you're interested in him. I love it -- and also kinda wish...
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Post by melbella on Jan 28, 2017 17:24:47 GMT
You choose to side with terrorist
No, the game forced it. There was no choice, unless you (the player) choose to not play the game. Still, working with Cerberus as a contract hire, for lack of a better term, doesn't equate to joining Cerberus. The forced dialogue on Horizon makes it impossible to make this distinction, however.
And say Shepard does go with him - then what? The Council and Alliance already made it clear she wasn't welcome back and that they weren't going to do anything about the missing colonies. So what would be the point?
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Post by aoibhealfae on Jan 28, 2017 20:08:20 GMT
Shepard was offered a choice to stay or go. It was before the Freedom Progress mission where you're being debriefed by TIM. Right after that Shepard choose to stay and work with them to stop the Collectors. I don't like it either but considering they already have Joker and Dr Chakwas on the same space station even before Shepard agreed to it, kinda clue the fact that TIM could just point a gun to their heads to make Shepard submit. And considering TIM knew that Freedom's Progress was just freshly attacked by Collectors, planted a bait for Kaidan on Horizon, created the false turian signal for the Collector Ship, aware of Reaper IFF and knowingly let his scientists get indoctrinated on the Derelict Reaper... Shepard was actively being manipulated by TIM but out of everything you just have to take his advice to sleep with one of your crew?
Twelve human colonies were attacked by the Collectors; each of them probably has around hundred thousand to millions of people occupying them. A lot are funded by the Systems Alliance like Fehl Prime (Vega) and Ferris Field (where Cortez lived with his husband). But Systems Alliance doesn't have the military capacity of the Turian Empire (especially after Battle of Citadel if you rescue the council) or politically suave as the Asari Republic (Ilium being a sandwich between the republic and Terminus system and Aria controlling Omega ) to actually start militarizing the Traverse and Terminus system. As humanity is now a council race, doing so is an act of war. Which is why Anderson send Kaidan alone on Horizon to investigate whether the disappearance is a terrorist act or something more.
Project Lazarus isn't exactly a common knowledge (Thank you Liara T'Soni), Kaidan himself doesn't know Shepard was brain dead until the end of the trilogy. On Horizon, he's starting to believe Cerberus propaganda that Shepard really did became a Cerberus Operative for two years and that the attack on the first Normandy was a ruse. He's emotionally compromised and was throwing his calm rational amicable demeanour through the roof. But he chooses to walk away and give Shepard an ultimatum; If you're still the woman I remember I know you'll find a way to stop these Collector attacks. But Cerberus is too dangerous to be trusted.
And he started his letter with an apology and half of ME3 was him grovelling. Was it expected that Kaidan would simply make himself feel sorry again and mope around feeling worthless because Her Horniness Shepard chose another guy to be in bed with? Or react like Ashley who simply get drunk or Liara who drown herself in work while standing to look extra busy with their own "I'm happy for you" lines?
But no... F&^*^@*# KAIDEN!!
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Post by dmc1001 on Jan 28, 2017 23:32:51 GMT
Hmmm..I hate missing out on dialogue just cause I couldn't romance Kaidan in Mass Effect 1, but oh well...he's still got great content at least! You can but it's slightly complicated and has some flaws. You have to start the game as FemShep (make sure you give a male name). Then you use a console command for a gender swap. It's something like "set gender = 0" for male and 1 for female. I think. Then either reload or wait for a cutscene for the change to take effect. Also, you have to use the default FemShep which switches over to default BroShep ("Sheploo"). Custom Sheps don't translate well. The flaw is that the game will continue to believe you are female. You'll be called "ma'am" and even "princess" at one point. The sex scene with Kaidan will also briefly switch you to FemShep. The import into ME2 will work well enough. At this point the game will acknowledge you as male. An email from Kaidan will reference you as a woman but I don't think anything in the dialogue between you is altered. ME3 has a minor issue in that Kaidan's VA didn't record certain dialogue but the captions will still display things properly. And there are references to the romance as well as one small cutscene that you only get with an imported romance.
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Post by SpiritVanguard on Jan 29, 2017 0:06:30 GMT
You'll be called "ma'am" and even " princess" at one point. Because Harkin is a massive pig. That scene is horribly unpleasant with femshep. Does he hit on you with this mod-change? Because mShep is lucky that way. --There actually are moments in the series where the game bugs and calls femShep "sir" (even Jacob). There aren't any gendered phrases used in the Horozon scene with a romance import as far as I remember, so I think that it should be the same. Even Shepard's response are... the same with and without imported romance.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2017 7:31:50 GMT
Hmmm..I hate missing out on dialogue just cause I couldn't romance Kaidan in Mass Effect 1, but oh well...he's still got great content at least! You can but it's slightly complicated and has some flaws. You have to start the game as FemShep (make sure you give a male name). Then you use a console command for a gender swap. It's something like "set gender = 0" for male and 1 for female. I think. Then either reload or wait for a cutscene for the change to take effect. Also, you have to use the default FemShep which switches over to default BroShep ("Sheploo"). Custom Sheps don't translate well. The flaw is that the game will continue to believe you are female. You'll be called "ma'am" and even "princess" at one point. The sex scene with Kaidan will also briefly switch you to FemShep. The import into ME2 will work well enough. At this point the game will acknowledge you as male. An email from Kaidan will reference you as a woman but I don't think anything in the dialogue between you is altered. ME3 has a minor issue in that Kaidan's VA didn't record certain dialogue but the captions will still display things properly. And there are references to the romance as well as one small cutscene that you only get with an imported romance. No console commands on ps3, and you can't even edit save files from mass effect 1 either (which I read makes it possible on Xbox I think). The save files for mass effect 1 on ps3 are copy protected for some reason. Though given how locked down ps3 save files are, I doubt it would have worked anyway.
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Post by Kaidan Fan on Feb 1, 2017 21:35:23 GMT
Playing through Mass Effect 3 atm just finished doing Eden Prime. Took Kaidan with me, of course Do you guys usually wait to have Kaidan with you before doing Eden Prime or do you go before doing the Citadel attack?
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Post by aoibhealfae on Feb 2, 2017 1:28:13 GMT
After citadel coup. Javik is a relatively optional character who can wait. I like to make all cerberus related quests after the coup.
Also I like to save the turian platoon until after rannoch.kinda weird how it wasnt as heartfelt with ashley than with kaidan
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Post by dmc1001 on Feb 2, 2017 1:55:42 GMT
Playing through Mass Effect 3 atm just finished doing Eden Prime. Took Kaidan with me, of course Do you guys usually wait to have Kaidan with you before doing Eden Prime or do you go before doing the Citadel attack? I get Kaidan as soon as possible. That means as soon as I've cured the genophage and and (I think) one of the missions for Wrex/Wreav and Victus - usually I do the krogan mission prior so that I can get an extra mission with Kaidan (since the Victus mission turns into two missions). I also do whatever side quests will disappear post-coup to avoid losing the war assets. Eden Prime is done with Kaidan (or Ash if somehow I had her) because it brings back special memories. Even Shepard said it wouldn't have the same impact if Kaidan weren't there (or maybe that was a fanfic - but I think it was the game).
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Post by dmc1001 on Feb 2, 2017 1:57:36 GMT
After citadel coup. Javik is a relatively optional character who can wait. I like to make all cerberus related quests after the coup. Also I like to save the turian platoon until after rannoch.kinda weird how it wasnt as heartfelt with ashley than with kaidan It makes sense to me. Shepard and Kaidan have the memory of losing Jenkins on Eden Prime. Ash doesn't have that since she didn't join up with them until a little later. Sure, she lost her entire squad but Shepard didn't know them.
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