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Post by themikefest on Jan 10, 2017 16:53:12 GMT
There's also the matter of Shepard technically being a marine. As I recall you do not want to call a marine "soldier". In RL anyway. No you don't. I was stationed on a base where there were fights between soldiers and marines involving soldiers calling marines soldiers. That wasn't the main reason for the fights, but was one of them.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2017 16:53:59 GMT
ME2 wouldn't have to stick with the military jargon since it was an entirely civilian operation. ME3 is another story but I don't recall whether or not they used it. Shepard did try to start out formally with Anderson, and Anderson told him point blank "not to go all formal." There is a crewman walking about the ship who will salute Shepard if clicked on. Shepard does salute Hackett a couple of times. I believe he says "Yes, sir" though rather than "Aye, aye." I'm also not sure if these were cases where Hackett was actually issuing an order... I'd have to go back to the one point where I know where Hackett actually orders Shepard to kill TIM and does specify "that's an order" to see what the response actually was at that point. (It happens if you first activate the attack on the Cerberus Base, then back off, and then go back later to talk to Hackett a second time.)
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Post by CrutchCricket on Jan 10, 2017 16:56:40 GMT
Yeah see I liked it in ME1 because you were "just a marine". That's what you signed up for, you had a job to do, you got things done. With the Spectre route the scope should've increased but you should've remained a problem solver. Then in ME2 you start on the path of Space Jesus and things start to fall apart. But you can still make it work since you're kind of going rogue out on the fringe with a wacky crew for space shenanigans (now that I've seen Firefly I get the comparisons). That's an acceptable progression as well. The problem is ME3 tries to shove you back in the box you started in (go back to being the Alliance's errand boy) while still being Space Jesus.
It's a symptom of the same basic clash that plagues the series as a whole: freedom and authority for the ultimate empowered PC... that still gets his chain yanked to a painfully obvious rail.
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Post by disi on Jan 10, 2017 17:05:16 GMT
Sorted by priority!
- I want to holster my weapon in ME3 - I don't like Ashleys hair in ME3, how do you fight under a helmet with that? - The outfits looked best in ME1 and ME2, ME3 is too sexy (female body/outfit). - Ashley is still the best character (Tali, Garrus and Liara close second). - I liked the minigames in ME2 and didn't like the complete lack of it in ME3. - Jack is a really cool character, especially in ME3 (didn't romance her). - Tali's quest in ME2 is the best, but it wouldn't if you don't know her from ME1. - The Qunari lore is great and you should have influence in ME2 for the Qunari going to war with the Geth. - Tali's suicide in ME3 under the circumstances was brilliant sad. - Miranda is the worst character in the game. - Maybe they should have sticked to full developed characters only, the two extras Zaeed and Kasumi are like a fifth wheel on a wagon.
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Post by Raga on Jan 10, 2017 17:12:21 GMT
Yea, I really liked the hacking minigame in ME2. It made me feel like a computer guru, dammit! I could do without the kindergarten matching the hidden tiles bypass game though.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2017 17:12:51 GMT
Yeah see I liked it in ME1 because you were "just a marine". That's what you signed up for, you had a job to do, you got things done. With the Spectre route the scope should've increased but you should've remained a problem solver. Then in ME2 you start on the path of Space Jesus and things start to fall apart. But you can still make it work since you're kind of going rogue out on the fringe with a wacky crew for space shenanigans (now that I've seen Firefly I get the comparisons). That's an acceptable progression as well. The problem is ME3 tries to shove you back in the box you started in (go back to being the Alliance's errand boy) while still being Space Jesus. It's a symptom of the same basic clash that plagues the series as a whole: freedom and authority for the ultimate empowered PC... that still gets his chain yanked to a painfully obvious rail. I think it's somewhat atypical for a graduate of the highest level of spec ops training in the system to refer to themselves as "just a marine" as well.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2017 17:14:33 GMT
Yea, I really liked the hacking minigame in ME2. It made me feel like a computer guru, dammit! I could do without the kindergarten matching the hidden tiles bypass game though. I found them enjoyable in ME2, but absolutely hated them in ME1. After playing through two games worth of hacking minigames, not having to do it in ME3 just feels like a breath of fresh air and a well-earned break from it. I really like that each game plays differently from the last one in the series and think I get bored with the series much more quickly if all the games, scanning, exploration, dialogue mechanics, etc. were the same throughout all 3. I certainly would NOT want all three games to have ME1 combat or ME1 styled planets or, especially, ME1 style hacking.
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Post by disi on Jan 10, 2017 17:18:16 GMT
Yea, I really liked the hacking minigame in ME2. It made me feel like a computer guru, dammit! I could do without the kindergarten matching the hidden tiles bypass game though. There is also nothing more relaxing than scanning planets. Coffee in the left hand and the scanner(mouse) in the right...
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Post by themikefest on Jan 10, 2017 17:34:23 GMT
There is also nothing more relaxing than scanning planets. Coffee in the left hand and the scanner(mouse) in the right... For me, a lot of my playthroughs I don't scan planets since I have enough to complete the game without any problem
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Post by CrutchCricket on Jan 10, 2017 17:48:55 GMT
I think it's somewhat atypical for a graduate of the highest level of spec ops training in the system to refer to themselves as "just a marine" as well. It works in the context of that conversation with Anderson (barring the terminology fail). Even in Space Jesus Glorious Leader mode I don't see Shepard as much of a politician.
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Post by dmc1001 on Jan 10, 2017 17:58:28 GMT
Shepard says ASAP, ETA and stuff, but it sounded more like they were imitating CoD and or other military shooters in the industry with ME3, because I don't recall the usage of "aye aye" or "Ashore" or "sir" the way they did in ME1. It's probably becuase Shepard is so tight with his buddies as well. I dislike how he introduces Garrus to James by saying "He's a hell of a soldier" though. At that point I think he should've just called him his friend or something. There's a lot of platitudes in ME3. There's also the matter of Shepard technically being a marine. As I recall you do not want to call a marine "soldier". In RL anyway. Hard to say, but it seems like there's just one human military, the Systems Alliance. It's Navy with ground forces being called marines. There doesn't appear to be an army or air force.
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Post by themikefest on Jan 10, 2017 18:03:37 GMT
The Alliance is Bioware's military. They can do whatever they want with it no matter if it makes sense or not.
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Post by shechinah on Jan 10, 2017 18:19:19 GMT
There's also the matter of Shepard technically being a marine. As I recall you do not want to call a marine "soldier". In RL anyway. Hard to say, but it seems like there's just one human military, the Systems Alliance. It's Navy with ground forces being called marines. There doesn't appear to be an army or air force. Since the System Alliance was made to be Earth and its colonies' representative body in space specifically, I think Earth and its countries would still have militaries of their own. I cannot imaging there still wouldn't be conflicts on Earth since I think we would have heard of it if there wasn't. During the Reaper Wars, I imagined that most of the militaries were probably wiped out by the Reapers, though.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2017 14:32:45 GMT
ME3>ME1>ME2
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Jan 18, 2017 15:24:21 GMT
ME3>ME1>ME2 That ending though.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2017 15:27:03 GMT
ME3>ME1>ME2 That ending though. Ok, I'll give you that one. That made me laugh. Follow up unpopular opinion: The endings don't bother me cause Citadel DLC ending is my headcanon ending
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Jan 18, 2017 15:31:03 GMT
The Alliance is Bioware's military. They can do whatever they want with it no matter if it makes sense or not. Not in the 3rd or fourth entry in their series. I mean, yes, all unwritten or yet unexplained aspects of it can be inserted however they like, like Ashley promoting 7 ranks in 6 months from Gunnery Chief to LT which according to some mail you get was awarded to her at some ceremony for the Alliance. In that case you can say "oh, I guess that's how the Alliance operates with ranking!" but as soon as rules have been set they have to maintain internal consistency and that goes all across the board. Any lack of consistency like a contradiction has to be handwaved or similar to make it work but the result then is that the audience can tell and thus it becomes a contrivance which it is. For example, we don't know why or how there are Krogan aboard the Andromeda Initiative. What if the reason was that there are 1000 Krogan aboard and they're all handpicked because they're fertile. Already it creates questions like "those are important to the Krogan in the Milky Way, so why did they leave and why does their clan let them?" and surely there must be somewhere in the trilogy that contradicts that there are supposedly even just 1000 fertile Krogan out there somewhere during the events of ME2. It's not inherently bad, because it can be explained but the first thing it draws attention to is the problems and the questions. So what I mean is if there are written or implied rules about the Alliance such as the Jargon they use, if BioWare doesn't abide to their own rules, even if they handwave or whatever, people will be able to pick up on it and it cheapens the fiction.
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Post by gothpunkboy89 on Jan 18, 2017 15:32:22 GMT
I think part of the criticism towards Refuse ending comes from how people really wanted to see an ending where all their conventional forces came into play. People weren't interested in the magical solution to beat Reapers. They wanted to see the game premise fulfilled of armassing a galactic armada like a Suicide Mission on a larger scale and then seeing that come into play. DA:O did something like that with actual gameplay and it wasn't even super advanced. BioWare could've done something but clearly the final Earth mission we got was rushed. You can tell it was a relatively early draft of a final mission because there's so many strange dialogue thingies in it, like Anderson telling you he was born in London and Shepard going "really?" even though he just said it over comms earlier and then there's randomly picking up a cain to destroy some Reaper the size of a Destroyer. It felt like it could've used more work. And yet the game from the start directly states that the forces of the galaxy can not match the Reaper forces. Sovereign was only in trouble specifically because it would have been a single Reaper vs entire galaxy. Suicide squad implies there is a chance at survival. The game very clearly stated from moment 1 the concept of the Reapers were introduced that it is game over completely and utterly. Randomly picking up a cain to destroy some Reaper the size of a Destroyer? You mean the Hades Cannon? That thing that had a massive obvious weak point? Who wasn't firing standard Reaper ammo but massive amounts of energy that would have to be build up and then released to allow it to hit fast moving shuttles. The fact that the Cain explodes right at the connection point causing a chain reaction when the energy gets disrupted. Yea clearly they didn't do enough work. Save for the fact everything makes sense unless you cover your ears and claim other wise.
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Post by dmc1001 on Jan 19, 2017 7:23:58 GMT
The Alliance is Bioware's military. They can do whatever they want with it no matter if it makes sense or not. Not in the 3rd or fourth entry in their series. I mean, yes, all unwritten or yet unexplained aspects of it can be inserted however they like, like Ashley promoting 7 ranks in 6 months from Gunnery Chief to LT which according to some mail you get was awarded to her at some ceremony for the Alliance. In that case you can say "oh, I guess that's how the Alliance operates with ranking!" but as soon as rules have been set they have to maintain internal consistency and that goes all across the board. Any lack of consistency like a contradiction has to be handwaved or similar to make it work but the result then is that the audience can tell and thus it becomes a contrivance which it is. For example, we don't know why or how there are Krogan aboard the Andromeda Initiative. What if the reason was that there are 1000 Krogan aboard and they're all handpicked because they're fertile. Already it creates questions like "those are important to the Krogan in the Milky Way, so why did they leave and why does their clan let them?" and surely there must be somewhere in the trilogy that contradicts that there are supposedly even just 1000 fertile Krogan out there somewhere during the events of ME2. It's not inherently bad, because it can be explained but the first thing it draws attention to is the problems and the questions. So what I mean is if there are written or implied rules about the Alliance such as the Jargon they use, if BioWare doesn't abide to their own rules, even if they handwave or whatever, people will be able to pick up on it and it cheapens the fiction. Based on what I saw, Ash jumped one grade in 2 years. Then she switched from NCO to commissioned officer, which is a separate track. It's not that unlikely that her NCO rank translated to something existing in the commissioned ranks, such as, perhaps, Staff Lieutenant. Then it's not such a leap. But nothing I've seen indicates her jumping 7 ranks even starting with ME1. Kaidan started as a commissioned officer so his rank increases are easy to see. He moved up 2 ranks from ME1 to ME2 and another rank from ME2 to ME3. What is your specific source for this alleged 7 rank jump in 6 months?
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Post by cooldude on Jan 19, 2017 8:08:21 GMT
I think the trilogy would have been better had Saren been the main villain throughout the entire story. A growing/evolving relationship between hero and villain is always interesting.
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Jan 19, 2017 17:44:13 GMT
Yeah see I liked it in ME1 because you were "just a marine". That's what you signed up for, you had a job to do, you got things done. With the Spectre route the scope should've increased but you should've remained a problem solver. Then in ME2 you start on the path of Space Jesus and things start to fall apart. But you can still make it work since you're kind of going rogue out on the fringe with a wacky crew for space shenanigans (now that I've seen Firefly I get the comparisons). That's an acceptable progression as well. The problem is ME3 tries to shove you back in the box you started in (go back to being the Alliance's errand boy) while still being Space Jesus. It's a symptom of the same basic clash that plagues the series as a whole: freedom and authority for the ultimate empowered PC... that still gets his chain yanked to a painfully obvious rail. Aside from the resurrection because Cerberus has magic resources and TIM thinks Shepard is important, I don't see how Shepard became Jesus in ME2. Yeah, it may be too much how he solves all his team's personal issues but mostly they have the agency to resolve their problem and then just gives Shepard, being the leader, the choice to be made. In the case of Garrus there's a mentor relationship so you have to teach him a lesson (or not) and with Miranda you just help her but she leads her mission and the conversations involving her personal friends or foes, in Thane's and Samara's you're their guinea pig and otherwise you mostly just go along to shoot things up or encourage your staff. It was only in ME3 Shepard became this monolithic hero who resolves everything indefinitely that he touches and conflicts that have lasted hundreds of years if not millennia, involving entire species. He may have been branded as special in ME2 because he saved the Citadel, but they kept the ME2 plot constrained to a personal scale about individuals and Shepard leading a team he had to help. I don't see anything Jesus-esque about the way they handled that. It was only after LOTSB and ME3 that it started to feel like it was too much. Characters fawning over Shepard and Shepard always being at the centre of a conflict to resolve it to the point where he singlehandedlt stands confronting a Reaper in ME3 - "Get outta here BioWare" was my reaction
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Post by pathfinderhatu on Jan 19, 2017 17:54:55 GMT
Joker is a raging alcoholic...just like Male Shepard. I can totally back Joker and EDI, Would SHIP JOKER AND EDI!!
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Post by CrutchCricket on Jan 19, 2017 18:02:41 GMT
Aside from the resurrection because Cerberus has magic resources and TIM thinks Shepard is important, I don't see how Shepard became Jesus in ME2. Yeah, it may be too much how he solves all his team's personal issues but mostly they have the agency to resolve their problem and then just gives Shepard, being the leader, the choice to be made. In the case of Garrus there's a mentor relationship so you have to teach him a lesson (or not) and with Miranda you just help her but she leads her mission and the conversations involving her personal friends or foes, in Thane's and Samara's you're their guinea pig and otherwise you mostly just go along to shoot things up or encourage your staff. It was only in ME3 Shepard became this monolithic hero who resolves everything indefinitely that he touches and conflicts that have lasted hundreds of years if not millennia, involving entire species. He may have been branded as special in ME2 because he saved the Citadel, but they kept the ME2 plot constrained to a personal scale about individuals and Shepard leading a team he had to help. I don't see anything Jesus-esque about the way they handled that. It was only after LOTSB and ME3 that it started to feel like it was too much. Characters fawning over Shepard and Shepard always being at the centre of a conflict to resolve it to the point where he singlehandedlt stands confronting a Reaper in ME3 - "Get outta here BioWare" was my reaction Yeah, the literal dying for our sins is why I said he started on the path. You can also point to Legion's obsession with him and Arrival where Shepard gets blasted on full from a Reaper artifact and suffers zero consequences apart from being knocked out. But yes for the most part the scope of ME2 keeps it from going into full blown Space Jesus, though like I said, the roots are there. In ME1 people kind of know you because you got shit done in the past. In ME2 everyone's in awe of you more or less, but it's hero level worship and for the most part appropriate. By 3 though when they ramped the scope to galactic that's when it gets ridiculous. And for me, it's not necessarily a bad thing that the majority of characters are super reverent towards Shepard or that he can't really do wrong, it's the mashing of that with being Hackett's errand boy all over again that I find really jarring. I mean I'm cool with Hackett and Anderson in their roles and it makes sense for me to work with them, but the way that's kind of forced on us and the way the story's structured as everything being their idea with Shepard just yes sir'ing, no sir'ing up and down the place really doesn't sit well with me because the story's grown him beyond that. I've said this before but I really wanted Shepard to be independent in ME3. ME1 we were Alliance ME2 we were Cerberus, ME3 we're our own faction, Hackett and the rest are on our team, not the other way around. Hell we certainly had all the tools to make our own Resistance at the end of ME2. It still galls me how all that was squandered.
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Jan 19, 2017 18:16:07 GMT
I 100% agree with all of that.
Before I played ME3 I just assumed we'd continue to either work with Cerberus or go that same route though there was he inevitable trial at arcturus which would complicate matters.
Naturally, being excited for ME3 I formed ideas in my head based on the revealed footage of 3 the same way people like to ponder about the possibilities of Andromeda right now and given the marketing of that game I remember qurstioning if we'd even have the Normandy. I was thinking maybe Shepard got to the trial, then visits Earth and gets stuck there for the first couple of missions in the game but then I thought once we got off into space the rest of the game would be about Shepard - not forming alliances to help the military - but on some kind of quest for leads to find something out about the Reapers that could weaken them or something similar. The idea of the prothean device or Javik weren't far off but it wasn't executed well IMO, because the Crucible was just this big construct we never knew what it did until the very finale and Javik turned into DLC. But like you said, I just expected Shepard once again defying the ignorance of the galaxy regarding the Reapers; that he'd defy those who seriously think conventional military would do anything against Reapers and then I expected TIM to be negotiable so he would actually find leads about Reapers for his own gains but would tip them off to Shepard if you cut a deal with him. I dunno. It's fan fiction realm I'm in now but I hope the point gets across.
I was pretty darn disappointed the second I learned Cerberus was just the unanimous bad guys of ME3, and I've been in record many times saying I hated the "war" aspect of ME3 because it never made sense to me for Shepard to be fighting for conventional forces to fight the Reapers back when we know that doesn't work.
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Post by Neria on Jan 19, 2017 18:21:03 GMT
I love the Tower of Hanoi and wish they had implemented it in post-KOTOR/ME1 games.
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