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" A wise man once said, forgiveness is divine but never pay full price for a late pizza. "
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Post by Nightman on Dec 6, 2016 0:40:21 GMT
I just finished watching last night's episode and what's weird is while I was watching it, I was doing some ironing for tomorrow.
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Post by Giant Ambush Beetle on Dec 7, 2016 0:27:56 GMT
I don't get this show anymore, Negan leisurely sitting on my porch holding my little baby sister? After grabbing and beating him to death with his beloved bat he just put next to my chair I would have carved little toys out of his skull fragments for Judith to play with.
Yes, there were a couple of other armed men but heck, that was one hell of a chance. The group was in MUCH more dire situations before and they took much bigger risks. Heck, I think they all suffer from ball rot. And I mean such severe rot that their balls fell off and rolled away never to be seen again.
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cribbian
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
Posts: 887 Likes: 2,364
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Post by cribbian on Dec 7, 2016 15:02:20 GMT
Not to mention that Carl went to kill Negan, gets a clear shot from a very short distance but doesn't pull the trigger.
You dun goofed Coral
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Post by Sifr on Dec 8, 2016 8:33:28 GMT
Carl did get a few clear shots, but Negan was mostly using his goons as a meatshield in that scene.
Besides, we know that Carl's depth perception isn't brilliant due to the loss of his eye. He repeatedly failed to hit a dart board a few episodes back, even at short range. Even when he's doing a pray and spray with the assault rifle, he only takes out one person in the truck and in the following stand-off before he's disarmed.
He might very well have missed Negan, even if he did pull the trigger. If we think back to the Governor, he did tend to rely on a scoped sniper rifle after losing his eye, because it allowed him to compensate.
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Post by Giant Ambush Beetle on Dec 8, 2016 12:28:12 GMT
Carl did get a few clear shots, but Negan was mostly using his goons as a meatshield in that scene. Besides, we know that Carl's depth perception isn't brilliant due to the loss of his eye. He repeatedly failed to hit a dart board a few episodes back, even at short range. Even when he's doing a pray and spray with the assault rifle, he only takes out one person in the truck and in the following stand-off before he's disarmed. He might very well have missed Negan, even if he did pull the trigger. If we think back to the Governor, he did tend to rely on a scoped sniper rifle after losing his eye, because it allowed him to compensate. I think we can dismiss the depth perception theory, back at Hershels farm untrained people shot zombies from quite a distance in the head with perfect accuracy - at night. With pistols. Also as I said, yeah, Negan brought some goons with him - but Rick's group took MUCH bigger risks in the past than fighting off a handful of armed people. Heck, at Terminus they disarmed people and shot them with their own AK's. They could have started a coordinated attack where the citizens of Alexandria hit the goons and Negan all at the same time. With all the stuff they pulled off in the show this would have been pretty low on the list of ''unbelievable feats''.
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Post by Sifr on Dec 8, 2016 20:46:16 GMT
Yeah, but no-one at Hershel's farm was missing an eye either.
The characters routinely pulling off improbable headshots at any distance is a staple of the show... the Governor once managed to hit a golf ball off Woodbury's walls and "headshot" a Walker down the other end of the street. It's down to rule of cool, like Hershel's "God Shotgun" that never needed reloading in the S2 finale.
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Post by goishen on Dec 14, 2016 2:17:25 GMT
Yah, but (and I admit I could be wrong about this) no one else in the group except for Rick was pulling off those shots without a scope and distance for the first two seasons either.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: JayKay91939
Posts: 666 Likes: 1,405
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by JayKay on Dec 14, 2016 7:57:41 GMT
Yah, but (and I admit I could be wrong about this) no one else in the group except for Rick was pulling off those shots without a scope and distance for the first two seasons either. Yeah, but after living, what, a few years in the zombie apocalypse, you either become a good shot or find some other way to compensate, or you die. It's the epitome of "git gud, n00b."
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Post by smilesja on Dec 14, 2016 8:02:31 GMT
Carl had Negan at gunpoint, the fact he didn't pull the trigger is baffling.
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...lives for biotic explosions. And cheesecake!
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Post by Kappa Neko on Dec 14, 2016 13:07:26 GMT
Like usual, nothing much happened the first half of a Walking Dead season... the whole Negan storyline is painfully contrived. Nobody would let that skinny stick of a guy terrorize them for so long. Every episode there are dozens of moments somebody could have taken him out... these people let him rape/enslave their women, burn their faces. Ridiculous.
I need to stop watching. The writers aren't even trying anymore to fill the episodes with something interesting.
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N7
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 20,860 Likes: 49,289
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Post by Iakus on Dec 14, 2016 15:45:16 GMT
Like usual, nothing much happened the first half of a Walking Dead season... the whole Negan storyline is painfully contrived. Nobody would let that skinny stick of a guy terrorize them for so long. Every episode there are dozens of moments somebody could have taken him out... these people let him rape/enslave their women, burn their faces. Ridiculous. I need to stop watching. The writers aren't even trying anymore to fill the episodes with something interesting. I'm kinda surprised he wasn't killed by his own people long ago.
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Post by flyingsquirrel on Dec 14, 2016 17:45:57 GMT
I'm really wishing I hadn't started watching this show. The cynicism has never sat well with me, but it's also just getting kind of dull and not very coherent lately. The idea of the Alexandria group trying to figure out how to live under the Saviors' dictatorship *could* have been interesting, but they've focused on the most obvious and repetitive aspects (namely scene after scene of Negan being a complete asshole), and now it feels like this chapter is over before it even started. If some time had passed, that would be one thing, but with all the cutaway episodes focused on characters away from Alexandria, it seems like it's taken Rick all of about two weeks to go from "we'd better cooperate" to "I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it any more."
And while I suppose most TV shows have some plot contrivances, the fact that vehicles and gas seem plentiful just makes this whole scenario not very believable. I get that the Alexandrians were in a tough spot because Daryl was a hostage, Tara, Heath, Morgan, and Carol were MIA, and Maggie and Sasha had left for the Hilltop. But what is keeping the Kingdom group, for example, from just piling into their cars, flooring it, and putting a good 200 miles between themselves and the Saviors? The U.S. is a huge country with a lot of roads, and the chances that the Saviors would ever find them - or would even find it worthwhile to try - have to be between slim and none.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by Sifr on Dec 15, 2016 6:18:00 GMT
Like usual, nothing much happened the first half of a Walking Dead season... the whole Negan storyline is painfully contrived. Nobody would let that skinny stick of a guy terrorize them for so long. Every episode there are dozens of moments somebody could have taken him out... these people let him rape/enslave their women, burn their faces. Ridiculous. I need to stop watching. The writers aren't even trying anymore to fill the episodes with something interesting. I'm kinda surprised he wasn't killed by his own people long ago. So, no-one can name any real world Dictators who've done the same (and far worse) than Negan, yet remained in power for decades? The show (and the comics) has made it obvious that a lot of Negan's people hate him just as much as the Hilltop and Alexandria do, but they don't do anything about it because life with Negan in charge is slightly better than the alternative. As long as they don't break Negan's rules, they remain safe, well-fed and well-armed, as well as hold top dog status over the rest of the communities post-Apocalypse, who are all subservient to them. There are those in the Saviours we've seen who are probably far worse than Negan and would like to usurp him, but they can't risk it because they can't guarantee who'd back them up if they made a move. Failure means death or branding, while even success would mean having to fend off others who might wish to claim the prize. In that regard, they have better survival odds working for Negan, than putting themselves in the firing line trying to become Negan. We've seen a few sadistic members of the Saviours and these tend to be people sent out to oversee communities in his stead, ("I'm your Negan" as one of them puts it). This is effective at keeping the communities in line because he knows the lieutenant won't be soft on them, as well as keeps the lieutenant in line by giving them a longer leash, people to torment and shows how rewarding loyalty to Negan can be, which should lessen any thoughts they might have of turning on him. Other people in the Saviours are in the position of Dwight and Fat Joey, people who are "Just trying to get by". They remain with the Saviours either because they afraid of what will happen if they tried to leave, or because they don't think they can make it in the outside world. The latter is not really all that different from Eugene, who lied in order to secure protection because he was incapable of surviving on his own. If a group like Negan's found Eugene before Abraham did, would it really surprise you he might end up joining their ranks as well, out of sheer cowardice? So it does slightly make sense why people follow Negan and why no-one has taken him out?
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N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: JayKay91939
Posts: 666 Likes: 1,405
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
JayKay91939
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Post by JayKay on Dec 15, 2016 7:01:38 GMT
Right, that's the thing--Negan himself wouldn't take too much to take out, but what about all the other Saviours he has around? Like if Rosita actually killed Negan with her one bullet, everyone else that was outside is dead within a minute.
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Post by Giant Ambush Beetle on Dec 15, 2016 15:46:48 GMT
I'm kinda surprised he wasn't killed by his own people long ago. So, no-one can name any real world Dictators who've done the same (and far worse) than Negan, yet remained in power for decades? If Hitler went into the bunker instead of the lightly built barracks he (and a lot of his best men) would have been blown to pieces by a group of highest ranking officers. Also Kennedy, the freaking President of the USA, got his brain liquefied pretty good by a man armed with a precision rifle. Its actually not that hard to kill the man in power since he is just, well, an ordinary man. A single sharpshooter could take out Negan no problem, place false evidence to make it appear like one of his own men shot him. Grab a cold one and watch Negans group tear each other apart in the power vacuum and chaos. Then strike when they're the weakest.
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N7
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 20,860 Likes: 49,289
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Post by Iakus on Dec 15, 2016 15:58:55 GMT
And while I suppose most TV shows have some plot contrivances, the fact that vehicles and gas seem plentiful just makes this whole scenario not very believable. I get that the Alexandrians were in a tough spot because Daryl was a hostage, Tara, Heath, Morgan, and Carol were MIA, and Maggie and Sasha had left for the Hilltop. But what is keeping the Kingdom group, for example, from just piling into their cars, flooring it, and putting a good 200 miles between themselves and the Saviors? The U.S. is a huge country with a lot of roads, and the chances that the Saviors would ever find them - or would even find it worthwhile to try - have to be between slim and none. Don't forget they also seem to have current model cars despite the zombie apocalypse having started years ago And while the U.S. is a large country, it's also a large country full of walkers. Millions of 'em. It'll probably take a few more years for them all to rot to the point where they're no longer a major threat.
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N7
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 20,860 Likes: 49,289
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Post by Iakus on Dec 15, 2016 16:01:48 GMT
Right, that's the thing--Negan himself wouldn't take too much to take out, but what about all the other Saviours he has around? Like if Rosita actually killed Negan with her one bullet, everyone else that was outside is dead within a minute. Right. But what about Dwight? Or other Saviors who wive or girlfriends were forced to join Negan's harem? Or other people he's branded or used for his sick amusement (Is Carl really the first person he's forced to sing for his entertainment?" He has his own people kneel before him like he's some kind of god. Dictators stay in power because they treat their underlings well. Negan seems to treat everyone like sh*t. He just feeds some better than others.
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twitch.tv/goishen
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Post by goishen on Dec 15, 2016 22:39:17 GMT
I'm really wishing I hadn't started watching this show. The cynicism has never sat well with me, but it's also just getting kind of dull and not very coherent lately. The idea of the Alexandria group trying to figure out how to live under the Saviors' dictatorship *could* have been interesting, but they've focused on the most obvious and repetitive aspects (namely scene after scene of Negan being a complete asshole), and now it feels like this chapter is over before it even started. If some time had passed, that would be one thing, but with all the cutaway episodes focused on characters away from Alexandria, it seems like it's taken Rick all of about two weeks to go from "we'd better cooperate" to "I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it any more." And while I suppose most TV shows have some plot contrivances, the fact that vehicles and gas seem plentiful just makes this whole scenario not very believable. I get that the Alexandrians were in a tough spot because Daryl was a hostage, Tara, Heath, Morgan, and Carol were MIA, and Maggie and Sasha had left for the Hilltop. But what is keeping the Kingdom group, for example, from just piling into their cars, flooring it, and putting a good 200 miles between themselves and the Saviors? The U.S. is a huge country with a lot of roads, and the chances that the Saviors would ever find them - or would even find it worthwhile to try - have to be between slim and none. I think that's what they were trying to show with the bunch'a women that were at Lakeside (I think?). The only problem is that you've gotta find a new place, clear it out, then you've gotta build it back up, etc. You've gotta drag all that medical equipment around, as well as your doctor, protect your doctor, etc. It's not just as easy as "move on down the road". EDIT : Also, who's surprised that the bullet that Rosita fired didn't fuck up his bat more, if not render it completely useless? I mean, she was standing no more than 10 yards from him, fresh gunpowder... I'm damn surprised that bullet didn't go through that bat into his skull.
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Post by Giant Ambush Beetle on Dec 16, 2016 2:25:44 GMT
Also, who's surprised that the bullet that Rosita fired didn't fuck up his bat more, if not render it completely useless? I mean, she was standing no more than 10 yards from him, fresh gunpowder... I'm damn surprised that bullet didn't go through that bat into his skull. Well, its not impossible. I'm an avid target shooter and manufacture my own ammunition so I know a thing or two about bullets. We do not know the exact specifications of the reload, but I doubt Eugene had access to proper smokeless powder and good projectiles. Since we saw Eugene with bags of chemicals my guess is he was making very crude black powder which is -compared to modern nitro powder- underpowered. Making modern nitrocellulose powder is much more complex and requires pretty much a whole factory, a laboratory and experts - so thats totally out of question. Since he was reloading -if I remember correctly- a 9x19 bullet, which has a very small case volume, he could not get a lot of said crude weak powder into it to make it as powerful as if he used nitro powder. So firstly, the bullet was not going very fast, not nearly as fast as commercial ammunition. Secondly. the projectile. It looked like it was a lead cast bullet, not a FMJ or jacketed bullet. Eugene probably didn't have access to 9mm jacketed projectiles so he cast his own from lead. Lead is soft, you can harden it with antimony but that stuff is hard to come by in a post apocalyptic world. A pure lead cast bullet is much softer than a jacketed bullet which results in rapid expansion and decreased penetration. Also a 9x19 bullet is not very heavy, decreasing penetration even more. So to summarize: Rosita fired a very soft lightweight lead projectile that was not going very fast into a hard wood bat. I say its highly possible that such bullet does not make it all the way through a proper baseball bat. And even if it did it would have been severely slowed down probably not being able to cause lethal wounds. Negan was very lucky, with a magnum Revolver like a .44 Eugene probably would have been able to cram enough homemade powder into the case and make a bullet heavy enough to plow through the bat severely injuring Negan. As I always say -- go big or go home. KEK.
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Post by Sifr on Dec 17, 2016 15:54:42 GMT
Right, that's the thing--Negan himself wouldn't take too much to take out, but what about all the other Saviours he has around? Like if Rosita actually killed Negan with her one bullet, everyone else that was outside is dead within a minute. Right. But what about Dwight? Or other Saviors who wive or girlfriends were forced to join Negan's harem? Or other people he's branded or used for his sick amusement (Is Carl really the first person he's forced to sing for his entertainment?" He has his own people kneel before him like he's some kind of god. Dictators stay in power because they treat their underlings well. Negan seems to treat everyone like sh*t. He just feeds some better than others. The Saviours operate under a point system, where good behaviour and following the rules are rewarded. Negan is shown in one episode treating the Saviours by declaring the food that night won't require any points whatsoever, while his attempts to break Daryl are followed by offering him his clothes back and his own room, all in exchange for his submission. "You have three choices; One: You end up on the spike and you work for me as a dead man. Two: You get out of your cell, you work for points, but you're going to wish you were dead. Or Three: You work for me, you get a brand new pair of shoes and you live like a King." He's still obviously holding all the cards, but the reward system does provide the illusion of fairness and possible advancement. Kind of reminds me of the Tevinter and the Qunari in some ways. Some slaves in Tevinter are said to hope to earn their freedom through work or having a child who's a mage, even though this "advancement" still leaves them at the bottom end of the social ladder... effectively trading a cell for a gilded cage. While the Qun's strict utilitarian philosophy give the Qunari the illusion of choice when it comes to their assigned roles... but they are ultimately "free to chose to obey".
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N7
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 20,860 Likes: 49,289
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Post by Iakus on Dec 17, 2016 19:21:30 GMT
Right. But what about Dwight? Or other Saviors who wive or girlfriends were forced to join Negan's harem? Or other people he's branded or used for his sick amusement (Is Carl really the first person he's forced to sing for his entertainment?" He has his own people kneel before him like he's some kind of god. Dictators stay in power because they treat their underlings well. Negan seems to treat everyone like sh*t. He just feeds some better than others. The Saviours operate under a point system, where good behaviour and following the rules are rewarded. Negan is shown in one episode treating the Saviours by declaring the food that night won't require any points whatsoever, while his attempts to break Daryl are followed by offering him his clothes back and his own room, all in exchange for his submission. "You have three choices; One: You end up on the spike and you work for me as a dead man. Two: You get out of your cell, you work for points, but you're going to wish you were dead. Or Three: You work for me, you get a brand new pair of shoes and you live like a King." He's still obviously holding all the cards, but the reward system does provide the illusion of fairness and possible advancement. Kind of reminds me of the Tevinter and the Qunari in some ways. Some slaves in Tevinter are said to hope to earn their freedom through work or having a child who's a mage, even though this "advancement" still leaves them at the bottom end of the social ladder... effectively trading a cell for a gilded cage. While the Qun's strict utilitarian philosophy give the Qunari the illusion of choice when it comes to their assigned roles... but they are ultimately "free to chose to obey". But we see that Negan's "justice" is totally arbitrary. He lets things slide for people he likes (or who amuse him) and is absolutely vicious if you p*ss him off at the wrong time. There's little reason to think this reward system is any less arbitrary. He's clearly off his rocker.
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Post by Sifr on Dec 18, 2016 11:26:15 GMT
But we see that Negan's "justice" is totally arbitrary. He lets things slide for people he likes (or who amuse him) and is absolutely vicious if you p*ss him off at the wrong time. There's little reason to think this reward system is any less arbitrary. He's clearly off his rocker. Which again, is no different than many real-world leaders/dictators. There are countless examples throughout human history and even to the modern day, of leaders who have been known to do the same utterly insane things, abuse their power, as well as execute people once they've fallen out of their favour. Often it involves establishing a cult of personality, which is how the Kim dynasty have controlled North Korea since the 40s and how people like Charles Manson and Jim Jones amassed a following who'd commit murder or suicide upon their orders. It's really not surprising that with the breakdown of society following the Apocalypse, people like that (such as Negan) would end up seizing power.
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Post by goishen on Dec 25, 2016 2:40:20 GMT
Squeeeeeee!!! TWD : ANF came out a few days ago, but I'm just learning of it tonight! Thank you, Facebook for reminding me!! Wooooooooooo! Papa gotta Christmas present early!
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" A wise man once said, forgiveness is divine but never pay full price for a late pizza. "
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
Kaiju Sozay
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Post by Nightman on Dec 31, 2016 19:47:20 GMT
There is a Walking Dead marathon on right now on AMC...and my most heart breaking episode is coming up next.......
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Post by goishen on Jan 24, 2017 18:59:08 GMT
Boy did it. Can't believe that she got killed.
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