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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2017 1:08:59 GMT
It was suggested that I post this here. For those that already replied to the topic, thank you for your advice and you may ignore that topic. Sorry, no. I'm not contemplating murder. Well, a real murder. I am an amateur writer. I have this plot point for a story I'm writing, and I'm not sure what route to take. I want to hear some opinions. I'm going to summarize as simply as I can. There are two 16-year-old twin sisters. A and E. E runs away to the city and gets mixed up in a bad crowed. E starts dating a punk in the city who introduces her to drugs. E becomes obsessed with the boy, possibly brainwashed (I have reasons). A thinks E is not herself anymore. A becomes jealous of all the attention E is giving to the boy. A hates the boy, and blames him for turning E into a drug addict. E dies in a car accident, and A blames the boy for her sister's death. A confronts the boy. A finds that the boy is a mess, mourning E's death. So here's my conundrum. The boy is to die. He's a character destined to die. And when he dies, A is haunted by him. It starts as maleficent haunt, HOWEVER, over time he becomes a sort of a protector of A. Kind of like a knight. The idea is that he is redeemed in death. Now. I'm not sure exactly how I want him to die. 1. A kills him in self-defense. 2. It's an accidental death--coked up, he tries to attack A, she pushes him, and his head goes splat on a corner of something. 3. He is murdered by some other plot point that I haven't thought of. I'm thinking either 1 or 2. I like 1 because it's not a passive decision. It's character defining for A to kill someone..right? What I like about 2 is that it mirrors E's accidental death; HOWEVER, it is more passive. With 2 a would still feel guilty and blame herself for his death, but she could always fall back on it as being an unfortunate event. Huh...I could also see 2 as being especially grey, as A could struggle with the idea of maybe it wasn't an accident, and she always wanted him dead. I guess that would make 1 the more passive choice...right? Because the boy basically made the decision for A, attacking her, and making A kill him. UGGGH Option 3 only exists because a scene/image came to me of the boy stumbling towards A. A thinks he's on something, but discovers that he was stabbed. I realize there could be an option 4 where she kills him in cold blood, but it's not A's character to do such a thing. Even though I feel as I'm even further from making a decision, I think this helped. Maybe I should write all three scenes and see, which fits better. If A is an agent of his death (accidental or not) it is going to call in question her being deserving of spiritual protection. I think you can just turn the "destined to die" in what actually happened. He is ill/irrevocably damaged by the drugs and dies because of that. Suicide is another option, since you said he is a mess over the death of girl #1.
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Post by DomeWing333 on Oct 15, 2017 2:39:39 GMT
If A is an agent of his death (accidental or not) it is going to call in question her being deserving of spiritual protection. Well from what I gathered, it would be something that starts out as a malevolent haunting and then develops into a more protective relationship. Like maybe the boy haunts A but then when it's discovered that there's more going on behind E's death, they agree to put aside their differences to find out more or track down the one who *really* responsible.
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Post by BamBam the Destroyer on Oct 15, 2017 2:39:58 GMT
Forgot a step with a Token Spirited Female Character That Embodies Virtue, Has Breasts and Everything Imagine pictures of Arwen, Hermoine and Leia Wait, you see Hermione as a "token" female character? Hermione Granger, the one who comes up with half of the solutions to the problems in the series and who has dozens of complex discussions and relationships with other female characters? Exactly how do define a token female character? There are several types of token female characters. #1 The I.H.C.Interchangable Hot Chick This female has no identifying characteristics, other than the fact she is female and is hot. The title "IHC" meants you could remove her and replace her with a different woman, with no real impact on the overall story. This applies more to film than to writing, but you still see it here and there. Primary Attributes: -Female -Very Attractive to God-tier attractive -Little to any personality shown -Makes few if any relevant choices Example: Megan Fox in Transformers I can't comment on Hermione, I never read Harry Potter. #2 The B****This female is an extreme social egoist. She is always trying to promote self-image, and image within the immediate group. Common Attributes: -Hot Blooded -Little to any long term goals or vision -Not always intelligent -Lots of antagonistic relationships -Self Righteous and Insecure #3 The Sarkesian (The Damsel in Distress)Token Hostage. Pretty, Helpless, yadda yadda. #4 The Plain JaneThe "everyman" female. The Plain Jane is written to be extremely relate-able, for a reader self-insert. Common Attributes: -Few opinions or preferences given -Lots of observations given And so on..........
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Post by phoray on Oct 15, 2017 3:04:29 GMT
Good folks, if anyone has a moment? I have been fighting with this one for a couple of days. It's under 1000 words, but I transition the character twice & cannot get around it, there is a lot of place changes in this chapter. Does it still feel forced or okay? Prefect Pu Liang parted the curtains to check the progress of his sedan chair. They were barely past the half way point of the windy road up the Hill of the Five Seasons. He sighed in frustration, leaned back, closed his eyes and pictured Serene Sister Weynala again. He was confident that she’d summoned him today because of a certain scroll he’d slipped from his sleeve into hers during their last audience. The matter she cited in her letter was far too trifling to be anything but a pretext to see him. Pu Liang willed himself to see her whispering the verses he’d written back at him as the flower petals fell and fell from her eyelashes past her dark lips. Instead, his imagination uncooperatively painted Serene Sister distant and angry. She ripped his scroll to shreds and threw the scraps at him. His heart lurched, his mind protested the very image it created… why, why? Other men found the fairies spooky, but not Pu Liang.
For most of his life Liang studied for the Examination, and when he was finally admitted to sit it, it was rapture, a culmination of fruitful, exciting years. Alas, the success, the high rank awarded to him and the position in Port Sutao, were not enough for Pu Liang. His days were aimless and dull, since he no longer had the Examination to strive for. Yet Pu Liang served diligently, hoping that a new goal worthy of his mettle would manifest itself. It did, but surprisingly, it was not a political intrigue, or a philosophical dilemma, but a man’s desire. The day Pu Liang first visited the fairies in his official capacity as Prefect, his mind awakened from slumber, spurred on by the excitement of the new challenge. He aspired to win Sister Weynala’s love at least as fervently as he’d wished to pass the Examination when he was a student.
Pu Liang’s anxieties evaporated faster than water in the Sea of Sand and Bones when he finally stepped out of his litter into the courtyard of the Temple of Serene Joy. A fairy acolyte glided over from the dormitories, and beckoned for him to follow. The audience was an informal one, so Pu Liang was not surprised to be led away from the glorious buildings that crowned the Hill of Five Seasons and could be seen from afar. As one of the very few humans who had been admitted on the fairy lands, Pu knew that those buildings were the least cherished of the fairy’s holdings. The Temple grounds extended far beyond what should have fit on the Hill, a patchwork of small gardens and pavilions, each one existing in the season that set off its beauty the best and reflected the mood of its fairy owner. This was the most precious part of the Temple of Serene Joy, set perhaps in Heavens, and linked by some imperceptible boundary to the Hill and its buildings of Earthly materials. Today Pu Liang walked mostly through the displays of Spring, fairies’ favorite season. His eyes grew accustomed to pink and white blossoms coating the boughs, blue stars of snowdrops studding the carpet of emerging grass. Among that splendor, he knew Serene Sister Weynala’s stronghold at once, by the crimson of the autumnal leaves.
Pu Liang followed the stone path to the pavilion, and his heart leapt into his throat when the silent guide stopped at the gates and did not follow him. He walked inside the pavilion, to find a room full of intricately carved tables, benches and shelves, all covered in scrolls. Elated to be in Sister Weynala’s presence, Pu Liang watched her to peruse a scroll. It was not his, but Liang could see it, unrolled, in front of her.
I don't get why flower petals would be falling over her face. Also "watched her to peruse a scroll" towards the end there. Maybe I suck, but what do you mean by Transition the character twice?
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Post by colfoley on Oct 15, 2017 4:59:27 GMT
Wait, you see Hermione as a "token" female character? Hermione Granger, the one who comes up with half of the solutions to the problems in the series and who has dozens of complex discussions and relationships with other female characters? Exactly how do define a token female character? There are several types of token female characters. #1 The I.H.C.Interchangable Hot Chick This female has no identifying characteristics, other than the fact she is female and is hot. The title "IHC" meants you could remove her and replace her with a different woman, with no real impact on the overall story. This applies more to film than to writing, but you still see it here and there. Primary Attributes: -Female -Very Attractive to God-tier attractive -Little to any personality shown -Makes few if any relevant choices Example: Megan Fox in Transformers I can't comment on Hermione, I never read Harry Potter. #2 The B****This female is an extreme social egoist. She is always trying to promote self-image, and image within the immediate group. Common Attributes: -Hot Blooded -Little to any long term goals or vision -Not always intelligent -Lots of antagonistic relationships -Self Righteous and Insecure #3 The Sarkesian (The Damsel in Distress)Token Hostage. Pretty, Helpless, yadda yadda. #4 The Plain JaneThe "everyman" female. The Plain Jane is written to be extremely relate-able, for a reader self-insert. Common Attributes: -Few opinions or preferences given -Lots of observations given And so on..........the closest Hermione would be is the Plain Jane.
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Post by phoray on Oct 15, 2017 6:33:09 GMT
There are several types of token female characters. #4 The Plain JaneThe "everyman" female. The Plain Jane is written to be extremely relate-able, for a reader self-insert. Common Attributes: -Few opinions or preferences given -Lots of observations given And so on..........the closest Hermione would be is the Plain Jane. Not for long. I remember her nagging the boys from day one. Her absolute hate over her cat that she refused to be rid of. And her unilaterally petitioning for Elves rights. Among other grand moments. Even in the first novel, she was the only one clever enough to figure out the riddle.
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Post by smilesja on Oct 15, 2017 6:41:03 GMT
the closest Hermione would be is the Plain Jane. Not for long. I remember her nagging the boys from day one. Her absolute hate over her cat that she refused to be rid of. And her unilaterally petitioning for Elves rights. Among other grand moments. Even in the first novel, she was the only one clever enough to figure out the riddle.
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Post by phoray on Oct 15, 2017 6:46:42 GMT
smilesjaHarry never had a crush on Hermoine. And I don't think Ron realized he liked her that way until book 5 when her getting attention from another man made her stop seeing her as an annoying sister. And didn't her love triangle moment literally die in the same or next book? Hermoine isn't a mary sue
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Post by smilesja on Oct 15, 2017 7:01:29 GMT
smilesja Harry never had a crush on Hermoine. And I don't think Ron realized he liked her that way until book 5 when her getting attention from another man made her stop seeing her as an annoying sister. And didn't her love triangle moment literally die in the same or next book? Hermoine isn't a mary sue Ehh I think she has some traits.
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Post by DomeWing333 on Oct 15, 2017 7:29:14 GMT
smilesja Harry never had a crush on Hermoine. And I don't think Ron realized he liked her that way until book 5 when her getting attention from another man made her stop seeing her as an annoying sister. And didn't her love triangle moment literally die in the same or next book? Hermoine isn't a mary sue Ehh I think she has some traits. The Harry Potter books' titular character is a young boy whose mere existence earns him the attention and regard of an entire world of magical beings, with fantastical characters he's never met greeting him like the second coming of Jesus, but Hermione is a Mary Sue because...what, she's smart?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2017 13:43:47 GMT
Good folks, if anyone has a moment? I have been fighting with this one for a couple of days. It's under 1000 words, but I transition the character twice & cannot get around it, there is a lot of place changes in this chapter. Does it still feel forced or okay? Prefect Pu Liang parted the curtains to check the progress of his sedan chair. They were barely past the half way point of the windy road up the Hill of the Five Seasons. He sighed in frustration, leaned back, closed his eyes and pictured Serene Sister Weynala again. He was confident that she’d summoned him today because of a certain scroll he’d slipped from his sleeve into hers during their last audience. The matter she cited in her letter was far too trifling to be anything but a pretext to see him. Pu Liang willed himself to see her whispering the verses he’d written back at him as the flower petals fell and fell from her eyelashes past her dark lips. Instead, his imagination uncooperatively painted Serene Sister distant and angry. She ripped his scroll to shreds and threw the scraps at him. His heart lurched, his mind protested the very image it created… why, why? Other men found the fairies spooky, but not Pu Liang.
For most of his life Liang studied for the Examination, and when he was finally admitted to sit it, it was rapture, a culmination of fruitful, exciting years. Alas, the success, the high rank awarded to him and the position in Port Sutao, were not enough for Pu Liang. His days were aimless and dull, since he no longer had the Examination to strive for. Yet Pu Liang served diligently, hoping that a new goal worthy of his mettle would manifest itself. It did, but surprisingly, it was not a political intrigue, or a philosophical dilemma, but a man’s desire. The day Pu Liang first visited the fairies in his official capacity as Prefect, his mind awakened from slumber, spurred on by the excitement of the new challenge. He aspired to win Sister Weynala’s love at least as fervently as he’d wished to pass the Examination when he was a student.
Pu Liang’s anxieties evaporated faster than water in the Sea of Sand and Bones when he finally stepped out of his litter into the courtyard of the Temple of Serene Joy. A fairy acolyte glided over from the dormitories, and beckoned for him to follow. The audience was an informal one, so Pu Liang was not surprised to be led away from the glorious buildings that crowned the Hill of Five Seasons and could be seen from afar. As one of the very few humans who had been admitted on the fairy lands, Pu knew that those buildings were the least cherished of the fairy’s holdings. The Temple grounds extended far beyond what should have fit on the Hill, a patchwork of small gardens and pavilions, each one existing in the season that set off its beauty the best and reflected the mood of its fairy owner. This was the most precious part of the Temple of Serene Joy, set perhaps in Heavens, and linked by some imperceptible boundary to the Hill and its buildings of Earthly materials. Today Pu Liang walked mostly through the displays of Spring, fairies’ favorite season. His eyes grew accustomed to pink and white blossoms coating the boughs, blue stars of snowdrops studding the carpet of emerging grass. Among that splendor, he knew Serene Sister Weynala’s stronghold at once, by the crimson of the autumnal leaves.
Pu Liang followed the stone path to the pavilion, and his heart leapt into his throat when the silent guide stopped at the gates and did not follow him. He walked inside the pavilion, to find a room full of intricately carved tables, benches and shelves, all covered in scrolls. Elated to be in Sister Weynala’s presence, Pu Liang watched her to peruse a scroll. It was not his, but Liang could see it, unrolled, in front of her.
I don't get why flower petals would be falling over her face. Also "watched her to peruse a scroll" towards the end there. Maybe I suck, but what do you mean by Transition the character twice? The way he moves from the litter to the temple grounds, then from the temple grounds to her place. Basically, I am wondering if it happens naturally, or fills like I am just doing this: He was doing this and that HERE place ta-da-la-la...FULL STOP (or "it calls for a story break") Oh, look, now he is doing this and that THEREOr you can just follow him, without noticing, and transition from one environment to another, from one action to the next, without being distracted by it. Don't worry about the petals, it's part of her being a fairy in that setting, and I cover it in a long winded description later on.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2017 16:45:50 GMT
Some more of Brandon Sandersons lectures, this time about characters:
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Post by phoray on Oct 16, 2017 19:10:57 GMT
I don't get why flower petals would be falling over her face. Also "watched her to peruse a scroll" towards the end there. Maybe I suck, but what do you mean by Transition the character twice? The way he moves from the litter to the temple grounds, then from the temple grounds to her place. Basically, I am wondering if it happens naturally, or fills like I am just doing this: He was doing this and that HERE place ta-da-la-la...FULL STOP (or "it calls for a story break") Oh, look, now he is doing this and that THEREOr you can just follow him, without noticing, and transition from one environment to another, from one action to the next, without being distracted by it. Don't worry about the petals, it's part of her being a fairy in that setting, and I cover it in a long winded description later on. I noticed the location transitions fine. I don't recall them being jarring.
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Post by smilesja on Oct 16, 2017 19:12:09 GMT
Integrating character flaws is something I struggle a bit with, mainly because of the reader's reactions.
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Post by phoray on Oct 16, 2017 19:24:03 GMT
Integrating character flaws is something I struggle a bit with, mainly because of the reader's reactions. I know, right? I struggle a bit with Vanasha. She has flaws (totally okay with the slavery in Tevinter, vanity, arrogance, trends Neutral Evil-ish) but then I want her to make friends with Kirsa and Magdalene at the same time. And also some believable growth so she's not a static character. And I sometimes feel like I'm depicting her a bit bi personality >_<
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Post by Serza on Oct 16, 2017 19:26:13 GMT
Anyone planning a fresh DA RP soon-ish?
I was reading Twisted Oaths and it inspired me to create a character. Or start creating. But all the RPs are either full, or not that interesting to me.
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Post by smilesja on Oct 16, 2017 19:26:47 GMT
With Cyrus, he's a guy who abandoned a woman he got pregnant because he didn't want to be a father. He also hates the Qunari and did outright brutal things to them (innocent or guilty).
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Post by smilesja on Oct 16, 2017 19:28:22 GMT
Anyone planning a fresh DA RP soon-ish? I was reading Twisted Oaths and it inspired me to create a character. Or start creating. But all the RPs are either full, or not that interesting to me. Mine isn't full, but I won't open it just yet. PM me and Nimlowyn if you're interested.
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Post by cmoe on Oct 16, 2017 19:53:25 GMT
Integrating character flaws is something I struggle a bit with, mainly because of the reader's reactions. I know, right? I struggle a bit with Vanasha. She has flaws (totally okay with the slavery in Tevinter, vanity, arrogance, trends Neutral Evil-ish) but then I want her to make friends with Kirsa and Magdalene at the same time. And also some believable growth so she's not a static character. And I sometimes feel like I'm depicting her a bit bi personality >_< Really? I think she is coming across as realistic. Someone with flaws who likes to keep her emotions hidden and feelings buried. Was that not the intention with her?
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Post by DragonRacer on Oct 17, 2017 18:07:06 GMT
On the subject of music, I prefer all instrumental. Either something classical, Celtic, or, more often the case, soundtracks from movies, shows, games, etc. I skip anything with lyrics as I find it far too distracting. And if I really get on a roll with a song, I'll loop it on repeat until my session is over or the scene moves on and calls for a different feeling to the background music.
On the subject of character deaths, I prefer them to be very few and, when done, done for the sake of the story or character growth rather than a "gotcha!" moment for the audience. A bit ironic when I enjoy The Walking Dead, but there you go. And I am already reading Game of Thrones with fear in my heart knowing that half the damn cast apparently dies, so... yeah. It makes me afraid to get attached to any of the characters, which I think will ultimately detract from the story for me, even though I do admit to enjoying it so far (I am nearly done with the first book).
I would rather see characters struggle and, through that struggle, either grow or fall to ruin. As opposed to just random death for the sake of "nobody is safe". I feel like once you start seeing enough deaths, you become numb to it... for instance, most deaths on The Walking Dead (both show and comic) hardly phase me anymore because it's like, "Oh, well, another one dead." Ho hum. Compare that to, say, the death of Mufasa in The Lion King, which served to advance the plot and give Simba conflict and guilt to eventually overcome in his redemptive return to Pride Rock. That is a death done so well, one that still chokes me up when I watch the scene years later as a grown adult.
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Post by phoray on Oct 20, 2017 0:52:18 GMT
I go to imagination land when I'm driving. Great writing happens. Too bad I can't write it down >_<
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Post by smilesja on Oct 20, 2017 2:20:20 GMT
I go to imagination land when I'm driving. Great writing happens. Too bad I can't write it down >_< I know how you feel!
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Post by legbamel on Oct 20, 2017 11:34:36 GMT
I tend to go there when I'm lying in bed. Then I fall asleep and that perfect scene, that excellent rewording, that brilliant character insight is gone.
If you're alone in the car you could record yourself.
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Post by phoray on Oct 20, 2017 12:34:47 GMT
I tend to go there when I'm lying in bed. Then I fall asleep and that perfect scene, that excellent rewording, that brilliant character insight is gone. If you're alone in the car you could record yourself. Maybe if I got more memory for my phone. I can see how 30 minutes of mostly car noises would use up a lot of space. Thanks
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Post by DragonRacer on Oct 20, 2017 14:13:53 GMT
I go to imagination land when I'm driving. Great writing happens. Too bad I can't write it down >_< Driving, shower, or laying in bed trying to sleep... almost always when not in a good position to record thoughts and by the time the activity is done, it's like everything fled from your brain.
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