kino
N4
The path up and down are one and the same.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition, Dragon Age The Veilguard
Origin: kinom001
Posts: 2,067 Likes: 4,060
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The path up and down are one and the same.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition, Dragon Age The Veilguard
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Post by kino on Aug 28, 2017 0:33:01 GMT
There's 6 minutes I'm not getting back... So glad I couldn't bring myself to watch it, going with reading the comments instead. Yeah. I feel the same way. Comments might actually be more entertaining...kinda.
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Cyan_Griffonclaw
N5
Uncle Cyan
Dang it.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: griffonclaw39
Posts: 2,516 Likes: 2,607
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Dang it.
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griffonclaw39
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Cyan_Griffonclaw on Aug 28, 2017 0:37:43 GMT
Explain to us how it is not a fact? Origin is the first. Go on, explain that, then Maxis. Then the.... You are sycophants. Or, society has broken you so well that you accept the situation as acceptable and beyond your ability to change. In other words, grow a pair. they as a company have benefited my gaming life so they've been a net positive. So. Opinion. I have to agree. EA is like any other corporation really. My issue is their support of BioWare. They're a great company from a distance (so to speak) but they will make decisions that benefit only EA and it's investors and that's the truth. Everyone else be damned. To be honest, that's life. You take care of your own, but I just can't be that greedy. I believe in the Maker's will and success isn't a sin. It's greed and the failure to do what's right that is the sin. I haven't always done the right thing and my guilty conscious reminds me later in quiet moments. Anyway, I don't trust EA as a publisher one bit. They broke that trust for me, but for others... I totally get it. It works for them. That's it.
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linksocarina
N5
Always teacher, sometimes writer
Teaching Mode Activated
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
Posts: 3,186 Likes: 4,072
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linksocarina
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by linksocarina on Aug 28, 2017 0:48:53 GMT
not really a strawman. Not really a fact. Explain to us how it is not a fact? Origin is the first. Go on, explain that, then Maxis. Then the.... You are sycophants. Or, society has broken you so well that you accept the situation as acceptable and beyond your ability to change. In other words, grow a pair. Maxis is still around, you know. Just not the Emeryville studio. If I recall, Westwood shot itself in the foot when half of the staff quit when EA took up development of Tiberium Wars. There is a lot of conflicting reports on that one, some saying EA was imposing a lot of mandates Westwood didn't like, others saying they were quitting so they can remain independent, it was a mess. OSI had an issue of growing too quickly, and EA shutting them down was a bad idea due to Ultima IX I agree on that one. That said, Origin was divided into several different teams (sound familiar) and each were relatively autonomous. If I recall correctly, this strategy has been the sort of M.O for EA for a while under Riccitelio and Wilson...effectively giving companies free reign to make a game but when it doesn't work, they act accordingly. That is another thing...the old style of managing would close down studios as the returns diminished. To an extent that exists still of course, but EA has clearly been giving companies a lot more time and chances to get work done. Case en point, the transfer of the Montreal staff still employed to Motive. There is a lot to criticize under the Probst days though but as far as i'm concerned, but the current behavior is not too outlandish of what I expect from a commercial business. Thus is the nature of the artform in the end, as cold as it is. Less about growing a pair of anything or criticizing really...if anything the constant bitching about EA being a "sell out coporation" is old hat. In the end, you either like the product they create or you don't. It is frankly dismissive to accuse a company for behaving like every other company out there in the hobby. You're not an iconoclast for doing that, you know. After all, you think Nintendo got to be the juggernaut they are today by playing nice? Or Activision's "pillar" strategy with their three/four big games a year? How about Valve resting on their laurels without developing anything relevant since DOTA 2, or Rockstar and their price grinding with GTA V? They all evil corporations ruining the hobby too right? Or is it now a question of degrees?
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Post by mordingrimes on Aug 28, 2017 1:11:33 GMT
One of the best YouTubers out there, although he didn't say anything new, people just can't hear any analysis that doesn't fit their view. Spot on.
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Qui-Gon GlenN7
In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is.
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Bottom
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Post by Qui-Gon GlenN7 on Aug 28, 2017 1:57:28 GMT
Explain to us how it is not a fact? Origin is the first. Go on, explain that, then Maxis. Then the.... You are sycophants. Or, society has broken you so well that you accept the situation as acceptable and beyond your ability to change. In other words, grow a pair. Maxis is still around, you know. Just not the Emeryville studio. If I recall, Westwood shot itself in the foot when half of the staff quit when EA took up development of Tiberium Wars. There is a lot of conflicting reports on that one, some saying EA was imposing a lot of mandates Westwood didn't like, others saying they were quitting so they can remain independent, it was a mess. OSI had an issue of growing too quickly, and EA shutting them down was a bad idea due to Ultima IX I agree on that one. That said, Origin was divided into several different teams (sound familiar) and each were relatively autonomous. If I recall correctly, this strategy has been the sort of M.O for EA for a while under Riccitelio and Wilson...effectively giving companies free reign to make a game but when it doesn't work, they act accordingly. That is another thing...the old style of managing would close down studios as the returns diminished. To an extent that exists still of course, but EA has clearly been giving companies a lot more time and chances to get work done. Case en point, the transfer of the Montreal staff still employed to Motive. There is a lot to criticize under the Probst days though but as far as i'm concerned, but the current behavior is not too outlandish of what I expect from a commercial business. Thus is the nature of the artform in the end, as cold as it is. Less about growing a pair of anything or criticizing really...if anything the constant bitching about EA being a "sell out coporation" is old hat. In the end, you either like the product they create or you don't. It is frankly dismissive to accuse a company for behaving like every other company out there in the hobby. You're not an iconoclast for doing that, you know. After all, you think Nintendo got to be the juggernaut they are today by playing nice? Or Activision's "pillar" strategy with their three/four big games a year? How about Valve resting on their laurels without developing anything relevant since DOTA 2, or Rockstar and their price grinding with GTA V? They all evil corporations ruining the hobby too right? Or is it now a question of degrees? It is a question of degrees, but to answer your question: yes, they are all trying to ruin the hobby. Indies.
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linksocarina
N5
Always teacher, sometimes writer
Teaching Mode Activated
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
Posts: 3,186 Likes: 4,072
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0
4,072
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Teaching Mode Activated
3,186
August 2016
linksocarina
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by linksocarina on Aug 28, 2017 2:21:10 GMT
Maxis is still around, you know. Just not the Emeryville studio. If I recall, Westwood shot itself in the foot when half of the staff quit when EA took up development of Tiberium Wars. There is a lot of conflicting reports on that one, some saying EA was imposing a lot of mandates Westwood didn't like, others saying they were quitting so they can remain independent, it was a mess. OSI had an issue of growing too quickly, and EA shutting them down was a bad idea due to Ultima IX I agree on that one. That said, Origin was divided into several different teams (sound familiar) and each were relatively autonomous. If I recall correctly, this strategy has been the sort of M.O for EA for a while under Riccitelio and Wilson...effectively giving companies free reign to make a game but when it doesn't work, they act accordingly. That is another thing...the old style of managing would close down studios as the returns diminished. To an extent that exists still of course, but EA has clearly been giving companies a lot more time and chances to get work done. Case en point, the transfer of the Montreal staff still employed to Motive. There is a lot to criticize under the Probst days though but as far as i'm concerned, but the current behavior is not too outlandish of what I expect from a commercial business. Thus is the nature of the artform in the end, as cold as it is. Less about growing a pair of anything or criticizing really...if anything the constant bitching about EA being a "sell out coporation" is old hat. In the end, you either like the product they create or you don't. It is frankly dismissive to accuse a company for behaving like every other company out there in the hobby. You're not an iconoclast for doing that, you know. After all, you think Nintendo got to be the juggernaut they are today by playing nice? Or Activision's "pillar" strategy with their three/four big games a year? How about Valve resting on their laurels without developing anything relevant since DOTA 2, or Rockstar and their price grinding with GTA V? They all evil corporations ruining the hobby too right? Or is it now a question of degrees? It is a question of degrees, but to answer your question: yes, they are all trying to ruin the hobby. Indies. Some indies are good, sure. Others are not though, just a glut of boring game design choices with little innovation attached.I'm kind of tired of pixel graphics and quirky platformers, or impossibly hard games designed to be hard in purpose. I find that to be more hobby destroying at times, frankly, as it has fragmented the market even further to a form of pure commercialism vs commercial art.it's more important to have a presence in social media to get your game noticed with indie buzzwords, versus trying something new. To each their own, there is a lot of bloat in the industry now anyway, enough room for everyone.
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danishgambit
N3
A master of his game
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 364 Likes: 367
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A master of his game
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February 2017
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by danishgambit on Aug 28, 2017 2:46:56 GMT
I assumed they were just cutting their losses. Rockstar isn't going to do singleplayer DLC either.
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Post by shinobiwan on Aug 28, 2017 3:39:51 GMT
This video is awful.
1) the whole theory is premised on the idea that EA would know about the game's reception with enough lead time before launch to alter their sales strategy. But we know insiders thought it was going to review better than it did, and part of the issue was the unexpected success of competitors HZD and Nier Automata.
2) you also claim that EA "made out like bandits" on initial sales. Where are you getting that from? I've seen no reported initial sales figures. You misstate the earnings reports for that proposition, but all they say is that revenue was up YoY (there were no comparable launches in the same quarter of the previous year, and thus the modest growth is actually alarming).
3) here's the real howler - none of this takes into account the known facts that EA is extremely invested in the BW brand. They clearly had plans for Montreal to run MEA as a series, as is evident from the game's plot and inside sources. They're trying to build up BW's brand for a massive key market release next year. Why would they intentionally jeopardize all of that and dismantle a whole studio for a one-game cash-in that generated tons of bad publicity?
This conspiracy theory is ludicrous. In reality, MEA was an unexpectedly poor performer. They might have known it wasn't going to blow anyone away but there's no way they predicted this reaction or thought it would cause this much damage.
As for why they cut off support, no shit they thought it wouldn't be profitable. But there's a lot more to it than that - including the factors mentioned above, which make the decision more perplexing than you present it to be.
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Post by Andrew Lucas on Aug 28, 2017 12:26:32 GMT
There's no bias here, though. He never said Andromeda was a bad game. He will only be biased if he doesn't praise the game's to heaven, I suppose? Problem is there's not much praise to be found. He did a good overview of the while thing. If you're interested in an even deeper analysis, check "Ryder's Block" on YouTube. Speaking of the quest itself in the game, still can't understand how that got approved, locking a much more interesting storyline behind some fetch quest of collecting non-sensical lights throughout the planets. BioWare, why. I think I have seen "Ryder's Block". I've watched so many that it's hard to remember; but it's in my YouTube history. I think the guy was biased. He started out trying to contain it, but it pretty quickly bubbled to the surface. It's fine that he doesn't like the game. I understand that. He doesn't do a good job of keeping that out of his presentation, though. I also think his assessment t is ridiculous, in some respects. Sure EA tries to lock up as many dollars as possible, as quickly as possible. The idea that they knew MEA would bomb, though, and planned for it? Silly. I agree with you that the game shouldn't have been given a pass. It wasn't ready in so many ways. It definitely shouldn't have been released in the state in which it was. I follow his channel, so yeah - he really isn't. Just watch MEA related stuff. And I'm also sure he presents his points better than 90% of the posters here, considering most can't handle the notion of someone criticizing MEA for what it is. The guy's practical and realistic, and that's he's one of the best.
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Post by Andrew Lucas on Aug 28, 2017 12:28:13 GMT
There's no bias here, though. He never said Andromeda was a bad game. He will only be biased if he doesn't praise the game's to heaven, I suppose? Problem is there's not much praise to be found. He did a good overview of the while thing. If you're interested in an even deeper analysis, check "Ryder's Block" on YouTube. Speaking of the quest itself in the game, still can't understand how that got approved, locking a much more interesting storyline behind some fetch quest of collecting non-sensical lights throughout the planets. BioWare, why. Nope. Anyone who says Andromeda made him feel for a Kathy Bates character in Misery is cuckoo. Stop being a whiny brat, seriously. You really - really like MEA, you're no different from a cuckoo by that logic. Children, ffs.
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Post by abaris on Aug 28, 2017 12:58:53 GMT
This video is awful. 1) the whole theory is premised on the idea that EA would know about the game's reception with enough lead time before launch to alter their sales strategy. But we know insiders thought it was going to review better than it did, and part of the issue was the unexpected success of competitors HZD and Nier Automata. That's the whole breaking point of the video. I have a hard time imagining someone running a short con, going public about it. Meaning the Origin Access promotion doesn't fit anywhere in this model. If you know you are about to cash in on an unpolished turd, you keep your mouth shut about it. You let the hype carry the whole mess. Opening up the first ten hours of that unpolished turd to the general public, at a time when preorders still could be cancelled, doesn't make any sense in the theory this guy is running. At the release day the web already was flooded with memes, which hurt sales big times. Otherwise the pricedrop wouldn't have happened within two weeks. A first, far as I am aware, with any Bioware game.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Element Zero on Aug 28, 2017 13:00:45 GMT
I think I have seen "Ryder's Block". I've watched so many that it's hard to remember; but it's in my YouTube history. I think the guy was biased. He started out trying to contain it, but it pretty quickly bubbled to the surface. It's fine that he doesn't like the game. I understand that. He doesn't do a good job of keeping that out of his presentation, though. I also think his assessment t is ridiculous, in some respects. Sure EA tries to lock up as many dollars as possible, as quickly as possible. The idea that they knew MEA would bomb, though, and planned for it? Silly. I agree with you that the game shouldn't have been given a pass. It wasn't ready in so many ways. It definitely shouldn't have been released in the state in which it was. I follow his channel, so yeah - he really isn't. Just watch MEA related stuff. And I'm also sure he presents his points better than 90% of the posters here, considering most can't handle the notion of someone criticizing MEA for what it is. The guy's practical and realistic, and that's he's one of the best. I might check out some of his other vids, since you follow him and say he's good. I've come to enjoy YouTube more in recent years, mostly because of gaming vids.
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linksocarina
N5
Always teacher, sometimes writer
Teaching Mode Activated
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
Posts: 3,186 Likes: 4,072
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by linksocarina on Aug 28, 2017 14:19:50 GMT
This video is awful. 1) the whole theory is premised on the idea that EA would know about the game's reception with enough lead time before launch to alter their sales strategy. But we know insiders thought it was going to review better than it did, and part of the issue was the unexpected success of competitors HZD and Nier Automata. That's the whole breaking point of the video. I have a hard time imagining someone running a short con, going public about it. Meaning the Origin Access promotion doesn't fit anywhere in this model. If you know you are about to cash in on an unpolished turd, you keep your mouth shut about it. You let the hype carry the whole mess. Opening up the first ten hours of that unpolished turd to the general public, at a time when preorders still could be cancelled, doesn't make any sense in the theory this guy is running. At the release day the web already was flooded with memes, which hurt sales big times. Otherwise the pricedrop wouldn't have happened within two weeks. A first, far as I am aware, with any Bioware game. It is like anything, there is possibly a kernal of truth to it but we can't really read the minds of the people involved. I think EA did know the game was having issues, but I also think that it still would have been successful considering their "fake reviews" they did before-hand were in an 85 score range, if I recall. I honestly don't know, but it kind of doesn't matter.
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Post by alanc9 on Aug 28, 2017 14:55:03 GMT
This video is awful. 1) the whole theory is premised on the idea that EA would know about the game's reception with enough lead time before launch to alter their sales strategy. But we know insiders thought it was going to review better than it did, and part of the issue was the unexpected success of competitors HZD and Nier Automata. That's the whole breaking point of the video. I have a hard time imagining someone running a short con, going public about it. Meaning the Origin Access promotion doesn't fit anywhere in this model. If you know you are about to cash in on an unpolished turd, you keep your mouth shut about it. You let the hype carry the whole mess. Opening up the first ten hours of that unpolished turd to the general public, at a time when preorders still could be cancelled, doesn't make any sense in the theory this guy is running. At the release day the web already was flooded with memes, which hurt sales big times. Otherwise the pricedrop wouldn't have happened within two weeks. A first, far as I am aware, with any Bioware game. Was he actually going for a real analysis? I thought he was going for truthiness -- trying to tell a story which makes emotional sense.
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Post by zanephiri on Aug 28, 2017 23:36:48 GMT
I can't focus on the video because I'm too distracted by OP's username tbh.
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Cyan_Griffonclaw
N5
Uncle Cyan
Dang it.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: griffonclaw39
Posts: 2,516 Likes: 2,607
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Dang it.
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griffonclaw39
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Cyan_Griffonclaw on Aug 29, 2017 3:20:48 GMT
Kind of a silly analysis tbh. Some of that doesn't make any sense. Sure there were some bugs, animations could have been better, maybe they should have waited longer and polished more. I don't know I waited to buy the game pre-ordered just before it came out. I played DAI - and expected lots of exploration which BioWare said was going to be in the game. It's a good story, different from ME1-3 but what I expected and some nice surprises. Companies want the pre-orders and will market to get the the maximum amount of people to buy, nothing wrong with that strategy. I think it is, at least when the money spent marketing can match (or even exceed) the amount spent on the game's production. That's an insane amount of money, I'd love to see the breakdown of one to see where it all goes to and to whom. A lot of that money would be better served going into the actual game instead. You have to feed the top and work your way down. Start at $12 million for EA's CEO and then work through each one and you're still several steps from Flynn/Hudson. That's where it goes. It doesn't matter what's left... it's what is lost without having anything to do with the art.
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Cyan_Griffonclaw
N5
Uncle Cyan
Dang it.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: griffonclaw39
Posts: 2,516 Likes: 2,607
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Nov 17, 2024 18:04:04 GMT
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Dang it.
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griffonclaw39
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Cyan_Griffonclaw on Aug 29, 2017 3:27:13 GMT
This video is awful. 1) the whole theory is premised on the idea that EA would know about the game's reception with enough lead time before launch to alter their sales strategy. But we know insiders thought it was going to review better than it did, and part of the issue was the unexpected success of competitors HZD and Nier Automata. That's the whole breaking point of the video. I have a hard time imagining someone running a short con, going public about it. Meaning the Origin Access promotion doesn't fit anywhere in this model. If you know you are about to cash in on an unpolished turd, you keep your mouth shut about it. You let the hype carry the whole mess. Opening up the first ten hours of that unpolished turd to the general public, at a time when preorders still could be cancelled, doesn't make any sense in the theory this guy is running. At the release day the web already was flooded with memes, which hurt sales big times. Otherwise the pricedrop wouldn't have happened within two weeks. A first, far as I am aware, with any Bioware game. It felt like EA knew it was going to look bad at release or had doubts and said, "Let's allow the reputation of the brand carry it through. We'll give everyone 10 hours of access to decide and we'll hold an embargo until the release date." We all so how that plan turned out. YouTubers smelled blood in the water and let me tell you... March was a bad month for my patreon recipients. Google was losing content creators and shooting itself in the foot with its new ad rules. Then... ANDROMEDA! A gift for click-bait. EA saved the day... if you're a bandwagon loser with a camera that thinks SJWs ruined his life.
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Qolx
N3
Sleuth
Posts: 250 Likes: 381
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Post by Qolx on Aug 29, 2017 4:36:07 GMT
Kind of a silly analysis tbh. Some of that doesn't make any sense. Sure there were some bugs, animations could have been better, maybe they should have waited longer and polished more. I don't know I waited to buy the game pre-ordered just before it came out. I played DAI - and expected lots of exploration which BioWare said was going to be in the game. It's a good story, different from ME1-3 but what I expected and some nice surprises. Companies want the pre-orders and will market to get the the maximum amount of people to buy, nothing wrong with that strategy. I think it is, at least when the money spent marketing can match (or even exceed) the amount spent on the game's production. That's an insane amount of money, I'd love to see the breakdown of one to see where it all goes to and to whom. A lot of that money would be better served going into the actual game instead. This blog post from a professional video game dev (Ask a Game Dev) explains how video game budgets are allocated.
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Guts
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 788 Likes: 780
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Post by Guts on Sept 13, 2017 3:48:27 GMT
One of the best YouTubers out there, although he didn't say anything new, people just can't hear any analysis that doesn't fit their view. I personally feel like Totalbiscuit should make a video titled, "I will now talk about Mass Effect Andromeda and Bioware for 60 minutes." Or something to that effect. The reason I say this is because he did a great job talking about the hype surrounding No Man's Sky.
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