melbella
N7
Trouble-shooting Space Diva
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: melbella
Prime Posts: 2186
Prime Likes: 5778
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Trouble-shooting Space Diva
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Post by melbella on Sept 3, 2017 21:04:47 GMT
The thing which shits me up the wall with BG2 is forcing the player to play through most of the main quest under-levelled if they want Imoen back and the chance to get her to a decent level. Otherwise it's a great game, and the enhanced edition did a good job with it. This is the thing that always kept me from adding anyone to the party later in the game. Since they don't level with the player unless in the party, anyone you find mid to late game is so under-leveled as to be useless. It also discourages swapping people in and out, so whoever I started out with is pretty much who I used for the whole game.
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Post by alanc9 on Sept 4, 2017 0:19:52 GMT
But the XP tables are so steep that it shouldn't matter all that much when someone joins. Yeah, you'll get killed if you swap people in and out a lot, which is probably why Bio abandoned handling XP that way..
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theflyingzamboni
N3
Sorry, my face is tired from dealing with... everything.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Sorry, my face is tired from dealing with... everything.
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Post by theflyingzamboni on Sept 4, 2017 0:30:07 GMT
The thing which shits me up the wall with BG2 is forcing the player to play through most of the main quest under-levelled if they want Imoen back and the chance to get her to a decent level. Otherwise it's a great game, and the enhanced edition did a good job with it. This is the thing that always kept me from adding anyone to the party later in the game. Since they don't level with the player unless in the party, anyone you find mid to late game is so under-leveled as to be useless. It also discourages swapping people in and out, so whoever I started out with is pretty much who I used for the whole game. CLUAConsole:SetCurrentXP() I wouldn't even consider that cheating, just compensating for a small bit of poor gameplay design.
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Hoge
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion
XBL Gamertag: ehoge
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Post by Hoge on Sept 4, 2017 0:56:24 GMT
I can continuosly play Mass Effect 1 and Dragon Age Origins. It has been about a year and a half since I played through DA:I (which I actually really enjoy). Probably a matter of opinion and subjectivity, but I find their older games more enjoyable and entertaining.
I liked Andromeda, I really did, but I just can't bring myself to play through it again...and that was before I or anyone knew there was going to be no more story content (or any content) added to the game.
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Post by isaidlunch on Sept 4, 2017 8:31:48 GMT
The older games have made me realize how much I miss seeing people's faces in conversations.
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Post by SofaJockey on Sept 4, 2017 8:42:14 GMT
I think I'm played out for a while now. I may revisit Dragon Age games in the run-up to DA4. And Mass Effect again ahead of its eventual sequel. I put around 500 hours into MEA (and enjoyed it), but I'm taking a year off...
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2017 9:07:35 GMT
I can play through Mass effect 1 + 2, and then right up to Cronos Station in Mass Effect 3. I have no problem playing Dragon Age Origins, Dragon Age 2 or Dragon Age Inquisition.
Mass Effect Andromeda is where I draw the line. The game is Bad on so many levels.
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Post by abaris on Sept 4, 2017 10:13:30 GMT
I can continuosly play Mass Effect 1 and Dragon Age Origins. It has been about a year and a half since I played through DA:I (which I actually really enjoy). Probably a matter of opinion and subjectivity, but I find their older games more enjoyable and entertaining. There's that terrible word called streamlining. It first came up with DA2 when they had little time at their hands and started catering to a new audience. DAI, much as I enjoy it, has the least strategic combat of the whole series. Even on the PC it's best played with a controller and combat is just a matter of focussing on one enemy and firing away. With DAI also the strategic presets for the companions have been dumbed down beyond recognition. Maybe it was just a logical step to not being able to control the companions at all in MEA. But it's certainly not something I support.
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yeah rip
N3
Lost in bosom, consumed by abs.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2
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Post by yeah rip on Sept 4, 2017 14:09:08 GMT
I can continuosly play Mass Effect 1 and Dragon Age Origins. It has been about a year and a half since I played through DA:I (which I actually really enjoy). Probably a matter of opinion and subjectivity, but I find their older games more enjoyable and entertaining. There's that terrible word called streamlining. It first came up with DA2 when they had little time at their hands and started catering to a new audience. DAI, much as I enjoy it, has the least strategic combat of the whole series. Even on the PC it's best played with a controller and combat is just a matter of focussing on one enemy and firing away. With DAI also the strategic presets for the companions have been dumbed down beyond recognition. Maybe it was just a logical step to not being able to control the companions at all in MEA. But it's certainly not something I support. I still find it mind-boggling how they thought they were making combat "more tactical"... by removing tactics. And healing.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2017 14:18:44 GMT
I can continuosly play Mass Effect 1 and Dragon Age Origins. It has been about a year and a half since I played through DA:I (which I actually really enjoy). Probably a matter of opinion and subjectivity, but I find their older games more enjoyable and entertaining. There's that terrible word called streamlining. It first came up with DA2 when they had little time at their hands and started catering to a new audience. DAI, much as I enjoy it, has the least strategic combat of the whole series. Even on the PC it's best played with a controller and combat is just a matter of focussing on one enemy and firing away. With DAI also the strategic presets for the companions have been dumbed down beyond recognition. Maybe it was just a logical step to not being able to control the companions at all in MEA. But it's certainly not something I support. DAI did away with the ability to program combat behaviors, but still allowed you to control any party member, and even had the tactical option where you could pause, issue commands to each party member, and advance time at will. You can also customize follower gear, and include some nifty bonuses available via crafting. I'd certainly like to see a return of the programmable combat behaviors, but at least they still allow you to play tactically. (Now if only they'd support NG+, so you wouldn't have to re-acquire everything every playthrough...) MEA completely wiped any semblance of tactical play - 10 giant leaps backwards imho.
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Post by majesticjazz on Sept 4, 2017 18:28:31 GMT
In a build up to DA4, I am going back to read all the DA novels/comics while while doing a trilogy playthrough. I will create a world state where the HoF is a female elf mage who is ruthless and died in the final battle. A female warrior Hawk who is again ruthless and kind of neutral in thr mage/templar war. And a female dalish elf mage IQ who is.....ruthless and pro mage.
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linksocarina
N5
Always teacher, sometimes writer
Teaching Mode Activated
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
Posts: 3,186 Likes: 4,072
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Post by linksocarina on Sept 4, 2017 18:53:50 GMT
Opposite for me - Baldur's Gate shits on all Bioware games that came after. Still blows me away the amount of freedom in those games. You can go into virtually every building - steal anything from everyone, actually kill whoever you want, have party members permanently die, and it had romances. BG2 still would be my favourite RPG of all time. Modern Bioware games are just an exercise in frustration - trilogy and Origins were good though. Basically everything Bioware had in the pipeline pre-EA still has that old Bioware magic that's now long gone. Baldur's Gate 2 is awesome even today (with a few mods or the enhanced edition to make it actually work on my pc) but the first one, I like it but a lot of it was really tedious and the exploration was awful. Endless wondering through wilderness areas that looked pretty much exactly the same as the last area you were in and had very little in them. Like one area might have a couple of quests that were something like "find a cat and give it to a girl" or "protect a tree" and some hidden items but that was usually it. How is that better than Exploration in Inquisition or Andromeda? I liked the main plot and other aspects of the game and not all the side quests were terrible but Baldur's Gate Two massivly improved upon the first in almost every way. Baldur's Gate 2 is pretty good still, although it is looking weathered by now. The biggest problem is the tabletop rule-set itself is outdated (Advanced 2nd Edition and basing everything around alignment and such...) and were dealing with a level 9-20 campaign...its one of the many flaws I have with the Baldur's Gate series (including Dragonspear) is the fact that you need to really play both games and the Dragonspear expansion to "get it" if you will. To have a narrative cohesiveness. Sadly, one game is not really worth playing while the other is damn it's impossible not to avoid, outdatedness and all. The original game is virtually unplayable without some mods to clean it up and an understanding of it's mechanics. I prefer the EE though because it does a lot more for your money, even if the transplanted new NPCs are weak. As an aside, mods should not be needed to make a game better, that is a weakness on the company for that one. Same problem I have with Bethesda titles. AS cool as mods can be, if they are "fixing" the game it's a problem.
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Hope for the best, plan for the worst
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Post by griffith82 on Sept 4, 2017 19:28:05 GMT
To me it doesn't matter if it aged well. I like going back for nostalgia sake. A prime example is a lovely old gen called Rebel Assault. I loved both as a "youngling" but age well it did not. Even back then trying to use without a flight stick? Kaboom! So I had to use health cheats then and now but it's still fun.
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linksocarina
N5
Always teacher, sometimes writer
Teaching Mode Activated
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
Posts: 3,186 Likes: 4,072
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Post by linksocarina on Sept 4, 2017 20:02:07 GMT
To me it doesn't matter if it aged well. I like going back for nostalgia sake. A prime example is a lovely old gen called Rebel Assault. I loved both as a "youngling" but age well it did not. Even back then trying to use without a flight stick? Kaboom! So I had to use health cheats then and now but it's still fun. Of course. A lot of games are like that. But it also doesn't change the fact of its age is my point. I enjoy playing old games a lot too, but we need to be able to point out it's flaws.
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anarchy65
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by anarchy65 on Sept 4, 2017 21:16:50 GMT
I'm replaying Dragon Age: Origins
The size of this game is absurd, even if it is not open world. Every new gameplay I find out I could do something I didn't know I could do. Recently I found out that if you kill Bhelen after you crown Harrowmont, you can go to the Proving, and his champions will attack you if you talk to them (those twins that I forgot their names)
It's a game that really gives an enormous variety of choices with meaning. Something I really miss in Bioware games nowadays. I never felt the weight of my choices on DA:I, and much less in ME:A
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Post by alanc9 on Sept 4, 2017 21:33:44 GMT
There's that terrible word called streamlining. It first came up with DA2 when they had little time at their hands and started catering to a new audience. DAI, much as I enjoy it, has the least strategic combat of the whole series. Even on the PC it's best played with a controller and combat is just a matter of focussing on one enemy and firing away. With DAI also the strategic presets for the companions have been dumbed down beyond recognition. Maybe it was just a logical step to not being able to control the companions at all in MEA. But it's certainly not something I support. DAI did away with the ability to program combat behaviors, but still allowed you to control any party member, and even had the tactical option where you could pause, issue commands to each party member, and advance time at will. You can also customize follower gear, and include some nifty bonuses available via crafting. I'd certainly like to see a return of the programmable combat behaviors, but at least they still allow you to play tactically. (Now if only they'd support NG+, so you wouldn't have to re-acquire everything every playthrough...) MEA completely wiped any semblance of tactical play - 10 giant leaps backwards imho. I wonder if tracking data showed that most people play the games like me. I never control NPCs unless I have to, in any game. In DAI that means just about never; your build and loadout are so determinative of your tactics in that game that adding programmable slots wouldn't give that great a return.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2017 21:47:56 GMT
DAI did away with the ability to program combat behaviors, but still allowed you to control any party member, and even had the tactical option where you could pause, issue commands to each party member, and advance time at will. You can also customize follower gear, and include some nifty bonuses available via crafting. I'd certainly like to see a return of the programmable combat behaviors, but at least they still allow you to play tactically. (Now if only they'd support NG+, so you wouldn't have to re-acquire everything every playthrough...) MEA completely wiped any semblance of tactical play - 10 giant leaps backwards imho. I wonder if tracking data showed that most people play the games like me. I never control NPCs unless I have to, in any game. In DAI that means just about never; your build and loadout are so determinative of your tactics in that game that adding programmable slots wouldn't give that great a return. Build/loadout don't really impact followers' AI though, do they? (It's been awhile since I've played...) I think people who play on higher difficulties - especially with friendly fire - make heavy use of the follower control capabilities. Any AoE skills are a whole different deal when friendly fire is activated.
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Post by abaris on Sept 4, 2017 22:15:42 GMT
I wonder if tracking data showed that most people play the games like me. I never control NPCs unless I have to, in any game. In DAI that means just about never; your build and loadout are so determinative of your tactics in that game that adding programmable slots wouldn't give that great a return. What tracking data? The best Origin can do is record how long, how often and when you play certain games. If you do MP sessions or if you already uninstalled a certain game.
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Post by alanc9 on Sept 4, 2017 22:43:58 GMT
I wonder if tracking data showed that most people play the games like me. I never control NPCs unless I have to, in any game. In DAI that means just about never; your build and loadout are so determinative of your tactics in that game that adding programmable slots wouldn't give that great a return. Build/loadout don't really impact followers' AI though, do they? (It's been awhile since I've played...) I think people who play on higher difficulties - especially with friendly fire - make heavy use of the follower control capabilities. Any AoE skills are a whole different deal when friendly fire is activated. Yeah, nobody's ever written an AI that handles AoE's sensibly, so in DA:O I have to control those abilities manually.
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Post by alanc9 on Sept 4, 2017 22:59:40 GMT
I wonder if tracking data showed that most people play the games like me. I never control NPCs unless I have to, in any game. In DAI that means just about never; your build and loadout are so determinative of your tactics in that game that adding programmable slots wouldn't give that great a return. What tracking data? The best Origin can do is record how long, how often and when you play certain games. If you do MP sessions or if you already uninstalled a certain game. DA:O predates Origin and had a separate data collection system. What it collected, exactly, has not been revealed. The ME trilogy games also transmit data on their own. But even Origin can tell more than that. Achievements track how you played the game, right? Bio knew that only 2% of players got a dwarf character as far as Ostagar, for instance.
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Prime Posts: 4392
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Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on Sept 5, 2017 0:54:03 GMT
I wonder if tracking data showed that most people play the games like me. I never control NPCs unless I have to, in any game. In DAI that means just about never; your build and loadout are so determinative of your tactics in that game that adding programmable slots wouldn't give that great a return. What tracking data? The best Origin can do is record how long, how often and when you play certain games. If you do MP sessions or if you already uninstalled a certain game. Its not from Origin, they have been collecting statistics for ages and you manually have to turn it off otherwise every choice you make is sent back. They even know the breakdown for how many people picked Human/Dwarf/Elf in Origins and it was posted off the cuff at one point around the era of Dragon Age 2.
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Prime Posts: 4392
Prime Likes: 882
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Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on Sept 5, 2017 0:55:35 GMT
I'm replaying Dragon Age: Origins The size of this game is absurd, even if it is not open world. Every new gameplay I find out I could do something I didn't know I could do. Recently I found out that if you kill Bhelen after you crown Harrowmont, you can go to the Proving, and his champions will attack you if you talk to them (those twins that I forgot their names) It's a game that really gives an enormous variety of choices with meaning. Something I really miss in Bioware games nowadays. I never felt the weight of my choices on DA:I, and much less in ME:A Its one of the reasons why I keep saying "I wish BioWare would ignore us" it just seems they are now focusing on fixing and updating the flaws the internet is pointing out instead of making the games they want to.
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melbella
N7
Trouble-shooting Space Diva
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: melbella
Prime Posts: 2186
Prime Likes: 5778
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Trouble-shooting Space Diva
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Post by melbella on Sept 5, 2017 0:59:38 GMT
What tracking data? The best Origin can do is record how long, how often and when you play certain games. If you do MP sessions or if you already uninstalled a certain game. Its not from Origin, they have been collecting statistics for ages and you manually have to turn it off otherwise every choice you make is sent back. They even know the breakdown for how many people picked Human/Dwarf/Elf in Origins and it was posted off the cuff at one point around the era of Dragon Age 2. The problem is, this only tracks data for people who play while connected to the internet. Not everyone does, so for them to say, "this is how many people did this" isn't really accurate. It's like all these surveys people keep talking about - unless everyone who played and finished the game got and filled out a survey, the conclusions they draw from the data is guesswork at best.
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Post by river82 on Sept 5, 2017 1:02:43 GMT
I'm replaying Dragon Age: Origins The size of this game is absurd, even if it is not open world. Every new gameplay I find out I could do something I didn't know I could do. Recently I found out that if you kill Bhelen after you crown Harrowmont, you can go to the Proving, and his champions will attack you if you talk to them (those twins that I forgot their names) It's a game that really gives an enormous variety of choices with meaning. Something I really miss in Bioware games nowadays. I never felt the weight of my choices on DA:I, and much less in ME:A Its one of the reasons why I keep saying "I wish BioWare would ignore us" it just seems they are now focusing on fixing and updating the flaws the internet is pointing out instead of making the games they want to. It's part of the side effect of siding with a massive corporation making games that look to rake in massive amounts of money. As a smaller company they had more freedom to do what they want, but if they ever want to top that 10 million sales figure, they'll have to appeal (and possibly pander to) as wide a range of people as possible.
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Post by alanc9 on Sept 5, 2017 1:14:27 GMT
Its not from Origin, they have been collecting statistics for ages and you manually have to turn it off otherwise every choice you make is sent back. They even know the breakdown for how many people picked Human/Dwarf/Elf in Origins and it was posted off the cuff at one point around the era of Dragon Age 2. The problem is, this only tracks data for people who play while connected to the internet. Not everyone does, so for them to say, "this is how many people did this" isn't really accurate. It's like all these surveys people keep talking about - unless everyone who played and finished the game got and filled out a survey, the conclusions they draw from the data is guesswork at best. That's true, but how relevant is it? We don't know how players without Internet connections differ from players with them, or even if they do. Guesswork? Perhaps, but guesswork with a solid foundation of evidence to back it up.
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