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Post by midnight tea on Dec 11, 2017 21:58:36 GMT
which is what I am afraid of....and what people above me are telling me is not possible
there will be no companions, no PC VS NPC interactions in the manner we are used to
No love interests, no best friends/buddies/rivals in the crew
it will basically be NOTHING of what we like from a bioware game and everything like Destiny with a soulless "make your own adventure with the repetitive quests we throw at you made shiny by our gorgeous graphics" sort of an excuse for a campaign
It’s possible, but I wouldn’t worry about it. It could happen, but just because they aren’t drawing attention to the usual Bioware stuff (which they never do) doesn’t mean it won’t be there. I’m not saying it’s impossible, just that there isn’t a reason to get worked up quite yet. Well, I'd like to point out that the very first minute of demo is focused on a.) environment and environmental storytelling (looking around the market) b.) and story element (Praxley mission).
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Dec 11, 2017 22:09:05 GMT
It’s possible, but I wouldn’t worry about it. It could happen, but just because they aren’t drawing attention to the usual Bioware stuff (which they never do) doesn’t mean it won’t be there. I’m not saying it’s impossible, just that there isn’t a reason to get worked up quite yet. Well, I'd like to point out that the very first minute of demo is focused on a.) environment and environmental storytelling (looking around the market) b.) and story element (Praxley mission). which felt very impersonal and disconnected because there is no dialogue, only the commentary from the "player" (aka designer pretending to be a gamer -vomits-)
environmental story telling is nice but it is NOT why we play Bioware games now is it?
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Dec 11, 2017 22:11:52 GMT
I'm expecting companions and/or other NPCs to be part of the mix, though at this point I have no clue how... you don't have a clue how because there is realistically no way of implementing them in a Destiny-like game unless they are nothing like the Bioware-like games. The two are mutually exclusive
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Post by Iakus on Dec 11, 2017 22:13:09 GMT
wanna be afraid of something? Don't be afraid of Anthem mimicking SWBF2....be afraid of it mimicking DESTINY! this is a Bioware game and I am insanely afraid it will have a token borderline story-less 7 hours campaign mode made just to prepare you to the never ending "shared world gameplay" nonsense which consists of "do your daily, your weekly and then keep on grinding them over and over again to watch your progression snail pace towards a meaningless number" UGH! With BioWare's story-telling credentials from it's "A-team' in Edmonton. One thing I'm not worried about is a lack of story. It would seem bizarre to me if those writers that we know are there have been sitting on their hands. MEA had some serious talent on their writing team too. Just saying.
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Post by midnight tea on Dec 11, 2017 22:16:53 GMT
Well, I'd like to point out that the very first minute of demo is focused on a.) environment and environmental storytelling (looking around the market) b.) and story element (Praxley mission). which felt very impersonal and disconnected because there is no dialogue, only the commentary from the "player" (aka designer pretending to be a gamer -vomits-) This is not commentary from the player. Those are two different voices. Just listen to it - the woman talking with Praxley is the one from the teaser. The woman talking with her squad mate later has a lighter, less raspy voice. Also - you can't be serious in expecting for them to reveal some sort of deep story mission in first demo, when we're learning about the game overall. The fact however that they start slow, with emphasis on world, character and story mission, way before we get to fly and shoot stuff is telling. Storytelling is storytelling. You have to have a story to tell it, be with through action, dialogue or environment. It's also an important part of visual medium - I know, I'm a visual artist and I pay attention to this stuff. And Bioware is certainly getting better at it, especially compared to earlier titles.
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Post by Heimdall on Dec 11, 2017 22:18:47 GMT
Well, I'd like to point out that the very first minute of demo is focused on a.) environment and environmental storytelling (looking around the market) b.) and story element (Praxley mission). which felt very impersonal and disconnected because there is no dialogue, only the commentary from the "player" (aka designer pretending to be a gamer -vomits-)
environmental story telling is nice but it is NOT why we play Bioware games now is it?
Actually the initial dialogue was the character, not the player. In any case, I will remind you that one of the devs (I think it was Corey ☹️) told us directly that a traditional “Bioware style” story would be in Anthem. What does that mean? I’m not sure, but I doubt it includes tossing dialogue choice and developing connections to NPCs off the top of Fort Tarsis.
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Post by SofaJockey on Dec 11, 2017 22:21:39 GMT
I'm expecting companions and/or other NPCs to be part of the mix, though at this point I have no clue how... you don't have a clue how because there is realistically no way of implementing them in a Destiny-like game unless they are nothing like the Bioware-like games. The two are mutually exclusive I don't buy that. If it is not possible in a Destiny-like game, then it will be less Destiny-like, it will be more Anthem-like. But as you rightly say, I'm acting on gut here...
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Post by Gandalf the Fabulous on Dec 11, 2017 22:23:28 GMT
Well, I'd like to point out that the very first minute of demo is focused on a.) environment and environmental storytelling (looking around the market) b.) and story element (Praxley mission). which felt very impersonal and disconnected because there is no dialogue, only the commentary from the "player" (aka designer pretending to be a gamer -vomits-) Dont worry mang I got you covered
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Post by Sanunes on Dec 11, 2017 22:25:02 GMT
That is BioWare's MO though. How many times did they mention Skryim or Witcher 3 over the years for other games. witcher 3 and skyrim have EXTENSIVE single player campaigns....I am not getting your point Those games were still vastly different then what BioWare eventually released. I don't see any of The Witcher 3 in Andromeda just like I didn't see a lot of Skyrim in Inquisition, just because they are comparing these games together it doesn't mean that they are going to be at alike. Its marketing and we don't know enough about Anthem to really have a good viewpoint of what the game will really be like and frankly BioWare's game comparisons I think are generated by EA's PR department and not BioWare themselves.
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Post by Iakus on Dec 11, 2017 22:32:03 GMT
witcher 3 and skyrim have EXTENSIVE single player campaigns....I am not getting your point Those games were still vastly different then what BioWare eventually released. I don't see any of The Witcher 3 in Andromeda just like I didn't see a lot of Skyrim in Inquisition, just because they are comparing these games together it doesn't mean that they are going to be at alike. Its marketing and we don't know enough about Anthem to really have a good viewpoint of what the game will really be like and frankly BioWare's game comparisons I think are generated by EA's PR department and not BioWare themselves. Could you imagine Inquisition with a Creation Kit? Or MEA?
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Dec 11, 2017 22:36:12 GMT
you don't have a clue how because there is realistically no way of implementing them in a Destiny-like game unless they are nothing like the Bioware-like games. The two are mutually exclusive I don't buy that. If it is not possible in a Destiny-like game, then it will be less Destiny-like, it will be more Anthem-like. But as you rightly say, I'm acting on gut here... ok so, if we all have different characters who live in the same shared world...and the crew is ALWAYS the same and thus accessible by all of the players how are interpersonal relationships going to be handled? because those NPC will be basically acquaintances for all the shared world players not YOUR crew.
don't get me started on the love interests...
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Dec 11, 2017 22:38:09 GMT
which felt very impersonal and disconnected because there is no dialogue, only the commentary from the "player" (aka designer pretending to be a gamer -vomits-)
environmental story telling is nice but it is NOT why we play Bioware games now is it?
Actually the initial dialogue was the character, not the player. In any case, I will remind you that one of the devs (I think it was Corey ☹️) told us directly that a traditional “Bioware style” story would be in Anthem. What does that mean? I’m not sure, but I doubt it includes tossing dialogue choice and developing connections to NPCs off the top of Fort Tarsis. and I will tell you what I tell everyone when they tell me things like that
without a detailed, complete, coherent and supported by examples answer from the developers these evasive quotes mean nothing.
Until then, sadly, I am going to expect the worst, there is a chance I will be pleasantly surprised
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Dec 11, 2017 22:39:01 GMT
witcher 3 and skyrim have EXTENSIVE single player campaigns....I am not getting your point Those games were still vastly different then what BioWare eventually released. I don't see any of The Witcher 3 in Andromeda just like I didn't see a lot of Skyrim in Inquisition, just because they are comparing these games together it doesn't mean that they are going to be at alike. Its marketing and we don't know enough about Anthem to really have a good viewpoint of what the game will really be like and frankly BioWare's game comparisons I think are generated by EA's PR department and not BioWare themselves. true but they were talking about conceptual things not game mechanics that shape the narrative of game
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Post by Heimdall on Dec 11, 2017 22:47:20 GMT
Actually the initial dialogue was the character, not the player. In any case, I will remind you that one of the devs (I think it was Corey ☹️) told us directly that a traditional “Bioware style” story would be in Anthem. What does that mean? I’m not sure, but I doubt it includes tossing dialogue choice and developing connections to NPCs off the top of Fort Tarsis. and I will tell you what I tell everyone when they tell me things like that
without a detailed, complete, coherent and supported by examples answer from the developers these evasive quotes mean nothing.
Until then, sadly, I am going to expect the worst, there is a chance I will be pleasantly surprised
Well if you want to assume the worst, I expect there’s nothing anyone could say or do to dissuade you 😒
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Post by SofaJockey on Dec 11, 2017 23:26:24 GMT
BioWare think they have done a clever thing here. A 'Bob Dylan' of games no less.
Can it be true? We're struggling here because we don't know what they've done.
Either times will indeed be a-changin’, or they will leave us blowin' in the wind. We'll know soon enough...
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Post by PapaCharlie9 on Dec 11, 2017 23:31:36 GMT
Until then, sadly, I am going to expect the worst, there is a chance I will be pleasantly surprised
If the “worst” is *only* that it doesn’t have a traditional Bioware story experience, we will have dodged a fusillade of bullets. This whole thread is about not inconceivable things that could happen that are far, far worse. So if all that goes wrong is no romances, I for one will breathe a sigh of relief.
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Post by SofaJockey on Dec 11, 2017 23:41:42 GMT
So if all that goes wrong is no romances, I for one will breathe a sigh of relief Maybe Praxley is a hunky love interest...
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Dec 12, 2017 0:13:40 GMT
Until then, sadly, I am going to expect the worst, there is a chance I will be pleasantly surprised
If the “worst” is *only* that it doesn’t have a traditional Bioware story experience, we will have dodged a fusillade of bullets. This whole thread is about not inconceivable things that could happen that are far, far worse. So if all that goes wrong is no romances, I for one will breathe a sigh of relief. Uhhh...no, because if the MT only affect the social aspect of the game and the hypothetical Bioware story experience is unaffected by it and it actually IS a Bioware story I could care less how many loot crate they throw in. No Bioware story experience = this is not a Bioware game which is THE worst possible outcome for someone who wants a goddamn Bioware game.
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Dec 12, 2017 0:15:29 GMT
BioWare think they have done a clever thing here. A 'Bob Dylan' of games no less. Can it be true? We're struggling here because we don't know what they've done. Either times will indeed be a-changin’, or they will leave us blowin' in the wind. We'll know soon enough... Ok, present me with hard evidence.of the contrary then...
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Post by SofaJockey on Dec 12, 2017 0:30:56 GMT
Ok, present me with hard evidence.of the contrary then... Sure, I'll be back in 8-12 months with that...
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Dec 12, 2017 0:42:49 GMT
Ok, present me with hard evidence.of the contrary then... Sure, I'll be back in 8-12 months with that... god damn it I quoted the wrong post
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Dec 12, 2017 0:45:21 GMT
and I will tell you what I tell everyone when they tell me things like that
without a detailed, complete, coherent and supported by examples answer from the developers these evasive quotes mean nothing.
Until then, sadly, I am going to expect the worst, there is a chance I will be pleasantly surprised
Well if you want to assume the worst, I expect there’s nothing anyone could say or do to dissuade you 😒 ok, present me with hard evidence of the contrary then... Because when ME1 was first revealed we already knew what a Bioware game was but they REAAAAALLY stressed out about the story, the character interactions and so on and so forth then from ME2 they focused on the action because the genere of the game was established. Right now all we know is that Anthem is a destiny wanna be.
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Post by Sanunes on Dec 12, 2017 0:46:44 GMT
Not directly related to Anthem, but I suspect that the next big cofvefe is going to be with Red Dead Redemption 2. What with Take2 apparently defending LB/MT and similar practices. With how much money they made on "shark-cards" in GTA, I suspect that they are going to try and largely ignore the backlash against these practices, and push it in anyway. Haven't they been trying to call microtransactions and lootboxes other things so they aren't under the same stigma as well? Its hard to say what is going to push people to the point of outrage, for I thought Shark Cards would have upset people based on what I have been told of how much money the different additions cost in the game for I was told some vehicles cost over $100 and its why when they pulled mods people did finally get upset. Just like over Black Friday about how someone on YouTube was trying to start a boycott with EA with FIFA and its microtransactions, but outside of a couple of reports on that video I haven't seen anything else about it. Even though I disliked what they were doing with Battlefront 2 as well, I think it was also a culmination of events too for in a very small window there was Shadow of War, Activision's patent, and Battlefront 2 so it all combined into a nasty situation. I personally don't think there are going to be any real changes unless players stop buying or a publisher/developer goes over the line again and the company that was the closest so far in my eyes was Valve and how they allowed APIs so players could cash out of the Steam wallet. My expectations is the only publisher that is going to make any real changes is EA and the others are just going to continue what they were doing for they weren't targeted for it the same way as EA was and that is my disappointment with this situation for too many people when asked about the other publishers the responses I saw would include something along the lines of "but EA".
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Post by Heimdall on Dec 12, 2017 2:59:56 GMT
Well if you want to assume the worst, I expect there’s nothing anyone could say or do to dissuade you 😒 ok, present me with hard evidence of the contrary then... Because when ME1 was first revealed we already knew what a Bioware game was but they REAAAAALLY stressed out about the story, the character interactions and so on and so forth then from ME2 they focused on the action because the genere of the game was established. Right now all we know is that Anthem is a destiny wanna be. We don’t have hard evidence either way. All we have is marketing speak, the word of the devs, and a brief demo built to advertise to the looter-shooter crowd. None of that is enough to have a clear picture of what the final product will be. That is the only point I’m making. I don’t really see why you would jump to the worst possibilities when the truth is that we know next to nothing about the final product.
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Post by Sartoz on Dec 12, 2017 5:10:36 GMT
ok, present me with hard evidence of the contrary then... Because when ME1 was first revealed we already knew what a Bioware game was but they REAAAAALLY stressed out about the story, the character interactions and so on and so forth then from ME2 they focused on the action because the genere of the game was established. Right now all we know is that Anthem is a destiny wanna be. We don’t have hard evidence either way. All we have is marketing speak, the word of the devs, and a brief demo built to advertise to the looter-shooter crowd. None of that is enough to have a clear picture of what the final product will be. That is the only point I’m making. I don’t really see why you would jump to the worst possibilities when the truth is that we know next to nothing about the final product.-(_ANTHEM_)-
Eh? We have both explicit and implicit evidence.
Explicit
Anthem has LBs. No question about that. Is both 1st person and 3rd person. Is a four team co-op online game. Supposed to last 10 years and we can play solo. It has exo suits with jump jets with underwater capability.... for starters.
The rest is implicit but strong facts supporting the "theory" it has MTs. (1) ME3MP + DAIMP + MEAMP
(2) Wilson quoted as saying he wants to exploit "Hyperspace". (3) Other EA games (BF2 + FIFA + UAFC ... etc) with predatory MT mechanisms supporting # (2).
(4) The fact that EA wants less but longer games = must have a constant revenue stream = MTs.
Additionally, recent games (ie: SWBF2 + UAFC) were designed as Pay-to-Win with the approval of EA. Recent quotes indicate that both the CEO and CFO of EA are well informed about the mechanics of their online revenue streaming games.
It is true that Anthem PR makes Anthem the new "Bob Dylan". However, the sole question is whether the Anthem architects agreed to a predatory MT mechanics as a core design.
While technically we know little, anecdotal evidence suggests much. The logic easily brings us to a game that is not all sugar and spice regardless whether it has a solid Single Player Campaign or not.
🌸
EDIT: Item (4) is a clear policy directive about game design for constant online revenue streaming and Visceral is a perfect example of what can happen for failing to adhere to that directive.
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