Cyan_Griffonclaw
N5
Uncle Cyan
Dang it.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: griffonclaw39
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Post by Cyan_Griffonclaw on Feb 15, 2018 17:22:30 GMT
Y'all have to look at the latest Glassdoor review for BioWare. I think it's pretty genuine.
(added for context, SofaJockey ) "BioWare Reviews 83 reviews 4.0 Stars / 5.0 84% Recommend to a friend 98% Approve of CEO "great place to work." Recommends - Positive Outlook
- Approves of CEO
- I have been working at BioWare full-time (More than 5 years)
Pros - People are in general kind, friendly, and helpful. Many of these people are the best in the world in their individual roles and they care enormously about the games and their team.
- Upcoming projects are exciting and look great.
- Company is family-oriented and leads constantly stress that you should keep healthy work-life boundaries (a nice change from past years).
- Studio is moving soon to a new, very nice office space.
- Perks are great and pay is pretty good.
- Looks great on paper.
- Edmonton isn't as bad as people assume.
- Lots of people REALLY love the games.
Cons - Siloing has always been a huge issue at BioWare.
- Some leads are really insecure which can manifest itself as either avoidance behaviour or abusive behaviour.
- A small but passionate section of BioWare fans have historically and will probably always be mean to our company and our games.
- EA is a double-edged sword.
Advice to Management - Please give people an opportunity to grow beyond "just" senior without forcing them to be people managers. Top talent should be rewarded but there's nothing worse than a manger who is there for the wrong reasons.
- We could be doing more to attract great people. I don't blame the city. I blame our processes. We should modernize our recruitment processes and then become pickier on who we hire.
- Encourage employees to build bridges between teams so reduce siloing.
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Post by samhain444 on Feb 15, 2018 18:46:16 GMT
Y'all have to look at the latest Glassdoor review for BioWare. I think it's pretty genuine. The last review I saw was from 09/2017 and I can't access it since my attempts to log-in are a no-go. Copy and Paste? Maybe provide the gist of it? |
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Sanunes on Feb 15, 2018 21:17:19 GMT
Need more then a Glassdoor "review" before I believe what is said about a studio, too many people even if they worked there have axes to grind. I felt the same about the ones from CDPR until they pretty much said "that is how we are, if you don't like it don't work here".
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Post by SofaJockey on Feb 15, 2018 21:30:47 GMT
Not really an 'Anthem' topic, but still interesting so am moving to the 'articles' sub-forum...
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Post by samhain444 on Feb 15, 2018 21:31:33 GMT
Need more then a Glassdoor "review" before I believe what is said about a studio, too many people even if they worked there have axes to grind. I felt the same about the ones from CDPR until they pretty much said "that is how we are, if you don't like it don't work here". I'm not 100% familiar with Glassdoor. Do they have to confirm they are employee of BioWare/EA somehow or can anyone post anything they want whether they are an employee or not? |
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Post by smilesja on Feb 15, 2018 22:58:26 GMT
Need more then a Glassdoor "review" before I believe what is said about a studio, too many people even if they worked there have axes to grind. I felt the same about the ones from CDPR until they pretty much said "that is how we are, if you don't like it don't work here". They actually said that?  |
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Sanunes on Feb 15, 2018 23:09:30 GMT
Need more then a Glassdoor "review" before I believe what is said about a studio, too many people even if they worked there have axes to grind. I felt the same about the ones from CDPR until they pretty much said "that is how we are, if you don't like it don't work here". They actually said that?  Here is the article about it and it includes what CDPR posted. LinkThey don't go out of their way to say they are a crunch studio, but they use the comment "this approach is not for everyone" after making the comment "requires a lot of faith, commitment, and spirit" after the complaints on Glassdoor about their crunch behavior while not directly saying anything directly about crunch either that they push it or that they don't. |
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Sanunes on Feb 15, 2018 23:10:41 GMT
Need more then a Glassdoor "review" before I believe what is said about a studio, too many people even if they worked there have axes to grind. I felt the same about the ones from CDPR until they pretty much said "that is how we are, if you don't like it don't work here". I'm not 100% familiar with Glassdoor. Do they have to confirm they are employee of BioWare/EA somehow or can anyone post anything they want whether they are an employee or not? Its completely anonymous so you have to take everyone at their word, or at least that in the impression I get. Its why I want to have confirmation on what is being said and not just because it looks like it could be true. Edit: I caught the edit of the OP and regardless of it being positive or negative it just seems to be a place where I have a hard time believing what is said due to the anonymity. |
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Post by SofaJockey on Feb 15, 2018 23:34:24 GMT
The value of such a site is in aggregate.
Due to its anonymity, it's hard to take any individual review as authoritative, but if 100 reviews follow a theme, that's easier to take as a valid assessment.
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Sanunes on Feb 16, 2018 0:10:00 GMT
The value of such a site is in aggregate. Due to its anonymity, it's hard to take any individual review as authoritative, but if 100 reviews follow a theme, that's easier to take as a valid assessment. The problem is there isn't a large enough population to ever get to that point in my opinion. Especially when emotions could be running high if it is a non-mutually agreed upon action. I have experienced people enjoying their job, but if they have been terminated it changes in a heartbeat to complete hatred and then combine in the possibility of troll accounts which has happened at places like Metacritic, but there were enough reviews there to at least give the impression it is a small percentage of the people posting. |
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Post by SofaJockey on Feb 16, 2018 1:09:07 GMT
The problem is there isn't a large enough population to ever get to that point in my opinion. That's fair. HR is my 'day job' so I understand the context. Companies set store by 'exit interviews' when folk leave. Though 'why are you leaving' is rarely a useful question, 'why did you start looking' might be... |
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DragonRacer
Administrator 
BSN Jesus
My Mattock brings all the boys to the yard...
Staff Mini-Profile Theme: DragonRacer
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition, Dragon Age The Veilguard
PSN: DragonRacer13
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Post by DragonRacer on Feb 16, 2018 4:45:28 GMT
The problem is there isn't a large enough population to ever get to that point in my opinion. Though 'why are you leaving' is rarely a useful question, 'why did you start looking' might be... This is so, so on point and I wish more managers and companies were aware of that/paid attention enough to their employees to do "wellness checks". When I reached a point in my former position that I hated my job so much that I was starting to avidly look for employment elsewhere in areas that interested me more (specifically, logistics/operations/production rather than sales), I had a small meltdown with my two bosses in private, told them where I was mentally in my career, and was very frank that I was looking for a new job somewhere else for the first time ever. Because I didn't want to leave the company I'd poured 10 years (and all of my working life so far) into, but I couldn't remain there in a sales position. It was an experiment in position that failed and it was not a good fit for me. I essentially ended up creating my current job position as Operations Lead when they asked me what I could see myself doing here, and the timing was phenomenal since I have no idea how our paper would have survived this chaotic systems transfer without someone to try and organize the mess it has been and still currently is. I essentially put up a white flag and told them my "why I started looking", and they did what they needed to keep what they considered an asset. Otherwise, I could have done like most would and silently left and nobody would have really understood why. |
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Feb 16, 2018 23:37:27 GMT
BioWare is no stranger to badmouthing their own audience but i suppose it's fair at this point to say there is a genuine hatebase. Particularly if you look at the "BioWare were never talented" consensus on GAF and still some part of ERA.
that said, it's dangerous to assume some demographic is just in it to "hate" on you, because that is arguably what they did with ME3's ending and in how they decided to respond. There was a bandwagon and so was there for Andromeda but they have to understand part of it is in retaliation of disappointment and feeling left out of thr conversation, a relatively justified middle finger to get if you play your cards wrongly as a manager of community with an audience, and some are just bitter and need to be muted for sure.
So long as it doesn't only become the people who bend over backwards to force positivity and useless criticism that fails to hammer down what simply didn't work that they solely listen to, and otherwise they should just stop pandering imo. Listen and get ideas from the community whenever EA doesn't ban it, but don't just give your audience exactly what they expect. Like Aonuma and even Casey Hudson said, it's important to always surprise the audience even when they think they know what you're giving them.
But back to the hate thing. I was called a hater numerous times for expressing discontent and disappointment with specific content of the ending or in questioning it. On Youtube, om Reddit, on BSN, and it fucking sucks when people are unwilling to at least listen or give a proper response if you do put in time to give some idea of what you didn't like beyond "fuuuck Bioware, haha, they stink! Lmao!". Nothing worse than being locked out of a community because of what is essentially paranoid censorship.
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Cyan_Griffonclaw
N5
Uncle Cyan
Dang it.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: griffonclaw39
Posts: 2,516 Likes: 2,607
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Post by Cyan_Griffonclaw on Feb 17, 2018 0:12:14 GMT
The value of such a site is in aggregate. Due to its anonymity, it's hard to take any individual review as authoritative, but if 100 reviews follow a theme, that's easier to take as a valid assessment. Basically, it said that one of the cons is that there is "a small group of very vocal fans" that hate BioWare. It could be a false post, but it has a lot of pros in it. I'm looking for it now. I had it alert me on Glassdoor. Here it is copied straight from the site: Feb. 11, 2018 I have been working at BioWare full-time (More than 5 years) Pros - People are in general kind, friendly, and helpful. Many of these people are the best in the world in their individual roles and they care enormously about the games and their team. - Upcoming projects are exciting and look great. - Company is family-oriented and leads constantly stress that you should keep healthy work-life boundaries (a nice change from past years). - Studio is moving soon to a new, very nice office space. - Perks are great and pay is pretty good. - Looks great on paper. - Edmonton isn't as bad as people assume. - Lots of people REALLY love the games. Show Less Cons - Siloing has always been a huge issue at BioWare. - Some leads are really insecure which can manifest itself as either avoidance behaviour or abusive behaviour. - A small but passionate section of BioWare fans have historically and will probably always be mean to our company and our games. - EA is a double-edged sword. Advice to Management -Please give people an opportunity to grow beyond "just" senior without forcing them to be people managers. Top talent should be rewarded but there's nothing worse than a manger who is there for the wrong reasons. - We could be doing more to attract great people. I don't blame the city. I blame our processes. We should modernize our recruitment processes and then become pickier on who we hire. - Encourage employees to build bridges between teams so reduce siloing. |
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Cyan_Griffonclaw
N5
Uncle Cyan
Dang it.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: griffonclaw39
Posts: 2,516 Likes: 2,607
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Post by Cyan_Griffonclaw on Feb 17, 2018 0:16:20 GMT
BioWare is no stranger to badmouthing their own audience but i suppose it's fair at this point to say there is a genuine hatebase. Particularly if you look at the "BioWare were never talented" consensus on GAF and still some part of ERA. that said, it's dangerous to assume some demographic is just in it to "hate" on you, because that is arguably what they did with ME3's ending and in how they decided to respond. There was a bandwagon and so was there for Andromeda but they have to understand part of it is in retaliation of disappointment and feeling left out of thr conversation, a relatively justified middle finger to get if you play your cards wrongly as a manager of community with an audience, and some are just bitter and need to be muted for sure. So long as it doesn't only become the people who bend over backwards to force positivity and useless criticism that fails to hammer down what simply didn't work that they solely listen to, and otherwise they should just stop pandering imo. Listen and get ideas from the community whenever EA doesn't ban it, but don't just give your audience exactly what they expect. Like Aonuma and even Casey Hudson said, it's important to always surprise the audience even when they think they know what you're giving them. But back to the hate thing. I was called a hater numerous times for expressing discontent and disappointment with specific content of the ending or in questioning it. On Youtube, om Reddit, on BSN, and it fucking sucks when people are unwilling to at least listen or give a proper response if you do put in time to give some idea of what you didn't like beyond "fuuuck Bioware, haha, they stink! Lmao!". Nothing worse than being locked out of a community because of what is essentially paranoid censorship. You said it. You can complain all you want about fans, but if you're focused on a small group of haters, then your confidence in your project is sketchy. Who cares what the minority says... they don't know squat compared to EA's CEO. I love BioWare despite what they're currently offering. I'm not alone and I'm pretty sure I'm in the majority now. |
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Feb 17, 2018 4:18:03 GMT
A dedicated minority of critical fans is good on the other hand. Filter out the unnuanced hatewagon but keep note of the fans addressing all their expectations vs shortcomings with the product they have been given, as with all those ending topics on the old bsn or even hardcore RPGers complaining ME2 had no plot.
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Post by SofaJockey on Feb 17, 2018 6:00:03 GMT
I think the con:
"A small but passionate section of BioWare fans have historically and will probably always be mean to our company and our games."
would apply to most game studios...
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mousestalker
Inactive Moderator 
ღ The Untitled
Just here for the cosplay
Staff Mini-Profile Theme: Mousestalker
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by mousestalker on Feb 17, 2018 18:29:08 GMT
Look at any movie over at Rotten Tomatoes. Even the classics, such as 'The Empire Strikes Back', 'Casablanca', and 'The Godfather, part 2" have negatives votes. You could post a video of kittens chasing puppies with landspeeders on Youtube and someone will still hate it. There are even people who dislike 'Pride and Prejudice'.
Tastes vary and no entertainment can possibly please everyone. Not even otters.
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Post by SofaJockey on Feb 17, 2018 18:55:24 GMT
You could post a video of kittens chasing puppies with landspeeders on Youtube and someone will still hate it. Kittens meet puppies video. 4,000 dislikes... |
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Post by BamBam the Destroyer on Feb 19, 2018 17:41:58 GMT
I think the con: "A small but passionate section of BioWare fans have historically and will probably always be mean to our company and our games."would apply to most game studios... I think that is a pretty petty con tbh. "A BUNCH OF STRANGERS I NEVER HAVE TO MAKE FACE CONTACT WITH ARE MEAN TO ME!" It'd be one thing if we sat outside Edmonton and cursed them out every day. But we don't. And everything can be mitigated with an OFF button. Or a spine. |
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Post by BadgerladDK on Feb 19, 2018 18:51:12 GMT
Look at any movie over at Rotten Tomatoes. Even the classics, such as 'The Empire Strikes Back', 'Casablanca', and 'The Godfather, part 2" have negatives votes. You could post a video of kittens chasing puppies with landspeeders on Youtube and someone will still hate it. There are even people who dislike 'Pride and Prejudice'.Tastes vary and no entertainment can possibly please everyone. Not even otters. To be fair, it took adding zombies to make that story truly shine. |
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Post by pessimistpanda on Feb 23, 2018 2:38:16 GMT
They actually said that? Here is the article about it and it includes what CDPR posted. LinkThey don't go out of their way to say they are a crunch studio, but they use the comment "this approach is not for everyone" after making the comment "requires a lot of faith, commitment, and spirit" after the complaints on Glassdoor about their crunch behavior while not directly saying anything directly about crunch either that they push it or that they don't. After my own extremely negative experience with a company that used language like this, I consider words like "commitment" and "spirit" to be massive red flags. Ditto for "loyalty". Such employers never display those same qualities towards their workers, and they will leverage their status as "independent" companies as an excuse to overwork you, while lowballing you in terms of salary and benefits. Any prospective employee ahould ignore that bullshit PR speak, and focus solely on the cold hard facts about what rights and benefits the employer is offering. |
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giubba
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Post by giubba on Feb 24, 2018 14:12:17 GMT
A dedicated minority of critical fans is good on the other hand. Filter out the unnuanced hatewagon but keep note of the fans addressing all their expectations vs shortcomings with the product they have been given, as with all those ending topics on the old bsn or even hardcore RPGers complaining ME2 had no plot. This is wishful thinking at his best. In this day and age there is nothing good,positive or salvageable from critics made through internet. Everything even point of critics well argumented are drowned,distorted and perverted in the hate train. Point in case Inquisition. The major and most glaring failing of DAI was that tried to include every single request made on the BSN between DAO and DA2 even when they were pathetically out of place in a Dragon Age game, someone care to explain to me why we got mounts ? or if it was so fucking fundamental for the game success that bows had to have a bowstring? And why's that? because there was no fucking way to filter what was fundamental and what wasn't in those request! Every single request was a life or death situation everything had so much fucking drama and hate balled around it that leaving it out of the game could have lead to another fucking meltdown like on ME3 ending. |
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giubba
N3
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Origin: Giubba
PSN: Giubba1985
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Post by giubba on Feb 25, 2018 11:39:06 GMT
because there was no fucking way to filter what was fundamental and what wasn't in those request! Every single request was a life or death situation everything had so much fucking drama and hate balled around it that leaving it out of the game could have lead to another fucking meltdown like on ME3 ending. Of course there are ways to do that. Design by committee especially based on offhand comments on the internet isn't the way to make a decent product. However, you can still listen and if someone has a good idea you can consider it. Of course, deciding what's a good idea and what isn't requires that people in charge have sufficient skill, and a clear vision of how the game should be. Bowstrings are certainly one of those little things that add to immersion, and managing to put them inside a game is hardly a revolutionary concept (I'd say that at this point it's rather strange if you can't do them), but claiming that NOT putting them in the game would have triggered a response on the same level of ME3's ending is ludicrous. ME3's ending triggered a meltdown for a very good reason: It was the supposed to be the payoff, the epic finale, the crescendo, a sendoff worthy of the beloved franchise. Unfortunately it simply wasn't. (at least, it wasn't for all those people who reacted badly to it) No there wasn't, not in those days (which you cleary didn't pass through or simply don't remember the sheer amount of insane hate that passed on the BSN board) and answer like yours still show that there isn't any chance for devs to make the "right" choice. Please tell me how the people in charge could show "that people in charge have sufficient skill, and a clear vision of how the game should be." when you have to apparently deal with a mass of screeching imbeciles ? Which is the piece of "feedback" that should count in a mass of howling rage that show that a dev have a "sufficent skill, and a clear vision"? The one that conform to your particular vision of the game and GOD forbid if they didn't put it in the game because rally an angry mob ready to blood is so very hard in internet and have so little effect, am i right? Damned if they don't and damned if they do is the only answer that internet give to devs in these days(except for people like CD project which live in that perfect bubble of fanboyis that sooner or later will pop up and how i will laugh).
Unfortunately it simply wasn't. (at least, it wasn't for all those people who reacted badly to it)
And what? That's the excuse? the great validation of that fucking insanity? Some people didn't like the ending so the death threats, the insults everything was and is allowed? |
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Feb 25, 2018 12:10:55 GMT
I mean, there is one way to stop the hate. Make a game that is actually good which does not also have some sort of BS in it. Last time was ME2. That was the start of the shit because the plot disappointment their previous fanbase but it was a super good game without some sort of major controversy to it. DA2 had Kirkwall and heavy reuse of assets and changed the artstyle, inserted dialogue wheels, ME3 had the ending and autodialogue, DAI had the Power mechanics and chore-questing, MEA had the facial animation fuckery.
Hey, they're working with EA now, and the structure and culture within BioWare has also changed a LOT partially in tandem with how time goes as america is very left-hippie right now, but even moreso with EA and its corporate correctness and politician-PR style BS seeping into the way even BioWare oldies act and behave. Like MrBTongue says, the mentality comes from the top and this is how it is for all EA studios in the end. So right now they have to deal with some shit. There are ways to filter that out better than closing their official forums and then whining on Twitter whilist blocking fans. Just sayin.
Glassdoor reviews also have interesting ideas and it has been a common theme: Don't reward good work by promoting talent into positions that make them inept. I've come and gone to the site since pre-Andromeda because i wanted to know wtf was going on and i keep hearing how specifically people in managerial roles are unsuitable for it. I can think of one in particular right now but I'm too tired to do my meme thing today and i don't want to bully so I'll just heavily insinuate my you-know-who. Latest con in an otherwise positive evaluation also blamed their hiring practices; something i actually speculated on back in 2017 as a major flaw in the "downfall" of BioWare. It's not about discrimination, it's not even about "diversity-hires" I think it's about nepotism and i have a suspicion BioWare hires based on friendly conversations held at conventions at their worst. Aaryn Flynn is gone and he struck me as weak-minded as a leader. Dunno if he took applicants or not or if it goes through EA. But see this: Casey comes in, just one month later and they're going to a brand new studio in a better location in Edmonton. He's making stuff happen and he sure as hell seems smarter than Aaryn. I believe in him.
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