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Post by Son of Dorn on Feb 28, 2018 20:44:44 GMT
Stupid question, but what the F does SJW even mean? Because I have no F'ing idea what it means. "Social Justice Warrior"... Oh, those ass clowns. Thanks for answering that question. It's been bugging me for a while.
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dmc1001
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: ferroboy
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Post by dmc1001 on Feb 28, 2018 21:37:47 GMT
I wonder if whoever came up with the rule that whomever brings up Hitler in an argument first loses, if he/she hadn't come up with that rule, would we still be in this mess today? I'm guessing not. Because forcing me to say words like Zhe and Zher is no more appropriate than Jews wearing tattoos on their arm and big Stars of David. Who's forcing you to say those words? No one.
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Post by riou on Mar 1, 2018 6:07:27 GMT
Was? You mean still is. Andromeda is a great game. I'm going to do a little modding for it to help spruce it up but it's still a fantastic game.
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helios969
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Kamisama
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Post by helios969 on Mar 1, 2018 11:18:51 GMT
If we want to say MEA was a failure it had little to do with SJW's and almost entirely was the result of poor management and superficial writing. And for the record SJW's/anti-SJW's are just opposites on the spectrum of idiocy. I think anyone identifying with either side lacks the capacity to think for themselves.
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Post by warden on Mar 1, 2018 12:51:37 GMT
I don't know what do you expect in an apologist fanboy forum to be honest.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 1, 2018 15:03:05 GMT
If we want to say MEA was a failure it had little to do with SJW's and almost entirely was the result of poor management and superficial writing. And for the record SJW's/anti-SJW's are just opposites on the spectrum of idiocy. I think anyone identifying with either side lacks the capacity to think for themselves. funny that. I thought there was SJW's on one side and the vast majority of sane people on the other. NO such thing as anti-SJWs.
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Origin: helios969
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Post by helios969 on Mar 1, 2018 15:26:17 GMT
If we want to say MEA was a failure it had little to do with SJW's and almost entirely was the result of poor management and superficial writing. And for the record SJW's/anti-SJW's are just opposites on the spectrum of idiocy. I think anyone identifying with either side lacks the capacity to think for themselves. funny that. I thought there was SJW's on one side and the vast majority of sane people on the other. NO such thing as anti-SJWs. Keep believing that. The sane people reside in the middle.
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Post by smilesja on Mar 1, 2018 17:19:40 GMT
If we want to say MEA was a failure it had little to do with SJW's and almost entirely was the result of poor management and superficial writing. And for the record SJW's/anti-SJW's are just opposites on the spectrum of idiocy. I think anyone identifying with either side lacks the capacity to think for themselves. funny that. I thought there was SJW's on one side and the vast majority of sane people on the other. NO such thing as anti-SJWs. You'd be very surprised.
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Post by alanc9 on Mar 1, 2018 17:49:55 GMT
Yep. Though I believe "SJW" now means "anything I don't like". Stupid question, but what the F does SJW even mean? Because I have no F'ing idea what it means. You were so lucky to not know that.
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cypherj
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Post by cypherj on Mar 1, 2018 21:40:14 GMT
I didn't know what SJW meant until I saw it here either. But I don't know what all the crying was about. ME:A didn't touch on nearly as many things as the trilogy did.
The OT has Eugenics (Genophage), Nationalism (Alliance), Xenophobia (Ashley), Genocide (Rachni), Prejudice and Discrimination if you look at how Quarians were treated for example. Far bigger issues as a far more integral part of the game.
You put a gay character in the game nowadays and everyone starts screaming SJW. I still don't see what the SJW themes in this game were that caused such an uproar. I think it was one those things where people didn't like the game so they decided to nitpick everything, even if it were something that wouldn't have otherwise bothered them as much.
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Post by dmc1001 on Mar 1, 2018 22:23:40 GMT
That's the thing. No one was forced into a gay romance. No one was forced to play a non-white character. No one was forced to play a female (well, except those few minutes as Sara). Or, to flip it, no one was forced into a straight romance. No one was forced to play a white character. No one was forced to play a male (except those few minutes as Scott). However, people will act like it was shoved down their throats because *gasp* they interacted with "those people" (maybe). I just don't have any sympathy for them.
Fact is, we live in a day and age where anything that makes people feel uncomfortable is now "bad". So, unless BioWare intentionally set out to offend people, I say all the "SJW" claims are horseshit. Grows some fucking balls.
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Post by isaidlunch on Mar 2, 2018 2:24:31 GMT
It does seem like Bioware are forcing in LGBT content for brownie points though and they're not doing it particularly well. Between Traynor being fetishist lesbian porn, their abuse of gay/bi male tropes (Cortez, Gil, Dorian, Iron Bull etc), transgender NPCs sharing their status and deadname within 5 seconds of meeting you, Jaal's sexuality being changed in a patch, Asari talking about which human pronouns they like to be referred to as, Iron Bull lecturing the player on transgenderism in a medieval setting - it's getting a bit much.
To me the "SJW" complaints are more about the quality of the content. No one really complains about Avitus being gay or Sera being a lesbian or the two gay companions in Fallout New Vegas because they were all written in a believable way. We need more LGBT content like that instead of cheap tokenism.
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dmc1001
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: ferroboy
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Post by dmc1001 on Mar 2, 2018 2:41:54 GMT
No argument there. It didn't make sense when the asari in Andromeda were claiming they sometimes used the male pronoun. The closest it has to back up that claim is in relation to "fathers" but that's a little weak. (Tbh, the use of the "father" term was also weak because you have to assume they never used that term until encountering other races.) Jaal, though, I'm in the camp that believes his sexuality was cut content. You could ask all of your squadmates about romance except for him. It was no problem to bring it up to Liam and get rejected. The lack stood out. Plus, people found all the files prior to the game being fully released. You could argue that their screwing around with procedurally-generated planets for three years was the reason why it was cut but it still seems to be true.
Yes, Hainly Abrams was weird in her bringing up the subject but, then, you did ask what brought her. As for Krem, that took following some dialogue paths to uncover so I don't really see it as the same thing. Really don't see Traynor as any kind of fetish. The asari as a race, yes, but not Traynor.
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Post by alanc9 on Mar 2, 2018 5:57:47 GMT
The pronoun thing struck me as being a particular case of a general ME:A phenomenon of members of one race trying on cultural artifacts from other races. An asari using a male pronoun is no weirder than a human using a "vas Hyperion" surname.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2018 10:02:36 GMT
I didn't know what SJW meant until I saw it here either. But I don't know what all the crying was about. ME:A didn't touch on nearly as many things as the trilogy did. The OT has Eugenics (Genophage), Nationalism (Alliance), Xenophobia (Ashley), Genocide (Rachni), Prejudice and Discrimination if you look at how Quarians were treated for example. Far bigger issues as a far more integral part of the game. You put a gay character in the game nowadays and everyone starts screaming SJW. I still don't see what the SJW themes in this game were that caused such an uproar. I think it was one those things where people didn't like the game so they decided to nitpick everything, even if it were something that wouldn't have otherwise bothered them as much. not true. Gay people are perfectly acceptable in games. Being an SJW is so much more than that.
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Post by KaiserShep on Mar 2, 2018 14:02:51 GMT
The pronoun thing struck me as being a particular case of a general ME:A phenomenon of members of one race trying on cultural artifacts from other races. An asari using a male pronoun is no weirder than a human using a "vas Hyperion" surname. I wonder what Liara's father would have preferred.
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Post by shechinah on Mar 2, 2018 14:18:29 GMT
The pronoun thing struck me as being a particular case of a general ME:A phenomenon of members of one race trying on cultural artifacts from other races. An asari using a male pronoun is no weirder than a human using a "vas Hyperion" surname. It struck me as continuing the inconsistency trend that's been a thing since the first game in the Mass Effect trilogy. They're supposed to be a monogender race and exclusively use feminine language when referring to themselves and their culture to the extent that there is no word for Patriarch in their language. And yet, Liara says that gender has no real meaning to them and that she is not really a woman. When Shepard says that both of Liara's parents would be considered the mother regardless of who gave birth if they were human, Aethyta takes clear offense to that, replying that she's not human. I would also mention the developer that said Liara was biologically asexual but he got other things wrong so I won't chalk that up because he might have meant something else. The vas Hyperion makes sense: if she wasn't exposed to human culture then it make senses that she'd adopt the cultural practices and traits of the quarian people because that's who she grew up with and was surrounded by.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Mar 2, 2018 16:27:09 GMT
The pronoun thing struck me as being a particular case of a general ME:A phenomenon of members of one race trying on cultural artifacts from other races. An asari using a male pronoun is no weirder than a human using a "vas Hyperion" surname. It struck me as continuing the inconsistency trend that's been a thing since the first game in the Mass Effect trilogy. They're supposed to be a monogender race and exclusively use feminine language when referring to themselves and their culture to the extent that there is no word for Patriarch in their language. And yet, Liara says that gender has no real meaning to them and that she is not really a woman. When Shepard says that both of Liara's parents would be considered the mother regardless of who gave birth if they were human, Aethyta takes clear offense to that, replying that she's not human. I would also mention the developer that said Liara was biologically asexual but he got other things wrong so I won't chalk that up because he might have meant something else. I think the issue is that sex and gender are terms that are often switched. So by monogendered, the devs are actually referring to an asari’s sex since they are all biologically female. Liara’s dialogue meanwhile is referring to gender not sex, since due to them having only one sex the separation of genders didn’t matter to them. It would be like if we met an alien race that had three sexes. Since we only have two the third wouldn’t really have any meaning to us. Now that said, yes Asari suddenly having meaning to genders in Andromeda is a bit of a retcon since as you say between Liara and Aria it is established that the Asari saw themselves as only women. But then maybe like how many people in real life that don’t recognize or understand people with non-binary genders, Asari are the same with Asari who identify as men or neutral.
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Post by goishen on Mar 5, 2018 4:30:14 GMT
I honestly believe that anytime anyone bitches about an SJW, what they're really referring to is an SJW propagandist.
I'm not against social justice. But I don't think that by pandering to the least of our community that It's automatically gonna solve everything.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2018 10:55:03 GMT
anyhoo back to topic. I'm currently replaying the Mass Effect trilogy on my PS3. I've just got through ME1 and am onto ME2. I've just recruited Tali , beaten the Shadow Broker, and am currently scanning for raw materials. Miranda is Loyal and I'm about to do Jacks Loyalty Mission. God what a good game. What a really good game.
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Biotic Booty
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: ferroboy
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Post by dmc1001 on Mar 5, 2018 15:32:56 GMT
I'm also currently replaying the MET (on ME1, atm) but am discussing it in the appropriate sub-forum. Y'know, the one about the MET.
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Post by KaiserShep on Mar 5, 2018 16:23:59 GMT
I'm also currently replaying the MET (on ME1, atm) but am discussing it in the appropriate sub-forum. Y'know, the one about the MET. Well, comparisons to the MET are pretty much inevitable. Given the game's reception and short support life, these sorts of subjects are pretty much guaranteed.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by xassantex on Mar 5, 2018 16:30:51 GMT
the trilogy doesn't have THAT much consistency since ME2 has often been viewed as a massive DLC , adding to the lore but sidetracking from the main quest ( i still loved it most ).
Andromeda basically lacks a strong Ryder from the start . Even if the pathfinder is to shape himself/herself as the story develops , Ryder should have had way more character , goodness, his dad is an N7 alpha control freak and his mom is a scientist . So he ( i don't play female Ryder) should be way more than " an adrenaline junky ... and didn't get killed "... ffs. But i enjoyed the game after the patches. It's uneven, but it has some clever moments that i appreciate whenever i play.
I do hope BW will pop out an ME5 .
Meanwhile, i cross my fingers over DA4.
( Anthem is hardly on my radar but who knows).
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Post by smilesja on Mar 5, 2018 18:55:58 GMT
It does seem like Bioware are forcing in LGBT content for brownie points though and they're not doing it particularly well. Between Traynor being fetishist lesbian porn, their abuse of gay/bi male tropes (Cortez, Gil, Dorian, Iron Bull etc), transgender NPCs sharing their status and deadname within 5 seconds of meeting you, Jaal's sexuality being changed in a patch, Asari talking about which human pronouns they like to be referred to as, Iron Bull lecturing the player on transgenderism in a medieval setting - it's getting a bit much. To me the "SJW" complaints are more about the quality of the content. No one really complains about Avitus being gay or Sera being a lesbian or the two gay companions in Fallout New Vegas because they were all written in a believable way. We need more LGBT content like that instead of cheap tokenism. It seems that anytime a gay character gets introduced, It's derided as "propaganda". Maybe I would take the complaints seriously if people won't stop yelling it out every time there's a gay character.
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Post by KaiserShep on Mar 5, 2018 21:19:56 GMT
It does seem like Bioware are forcing in LGBT content for brownie points though and they're not doing it particularly well. Between Traynor being fetishist lesbian porn, their abuse of gay/bi male tropes (Cortez, Gil, Dorian, Iron Bull etc), transgender NPCs sharing their status and deadname within 5 seconds of meeting you, Jaal's sexuality being changed in a patch, Asari talking about which human pronouns they like to be referred to as, Iron Bull lecturing the player on transgenderism in a medieval setting - it's getting a bit much. To me the "SJW" complaints are more about the quality of the content. No one really complains about Avitus being gay or Sera being a lesbian or the two gay companions in Fallout New Vegas because they were all written in a believable way. We need more LGBT content like that instead of cheap tokenism. It seems that anytime a gay character gets introduced, It's derided as "propaganda". Maybe I would take the complaints seriously if people won't stop yelling it out every time there's a gay character. I'm still hung up on the constant use of "shoving down our throats". Like, c'mon people. You make this too easy.
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