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Post by alanc9 on Aug 6, 2018 21:44:07 GMT
Arming the Initiative fleet doesn't make a heck of a lot of sense. The space where that would actually make a difference is vanishingly small. An alien race would have had to just discovered interstellar travel for the AI to have any chance against it. After more than a few decades of development they'd outclass any conceivable AI fleet. And on the flip side, if they don't have the mass effect drive yet, then they can't harm the AI at all.
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Post by themikefest on Aug 6, 2018 22:01:06 GMT
The Initiative was hardly defenseless. Sure the Arks didn't have any guns built into them, but they had several squadrons of fighters each. There was also ground weaponry like turrets and even the ability to make combat mech suits. Where was the Nexus defenses and those squadrons of fighters when the Kett took the Hyperion? Was everyone on lunch break?
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Post by Vortex13 on Aug 6, 2018 22:03:03 GMT
So people are seriously complaining about the “social justice” in ME:A? The complaints aren't even accurate, like them making the angara all bisexual sexfriends when one of the two Angaran romance options is neither bisexual or even have sex in her romance. The Angara aren't all bisexual sex buddies, obviously, but the amount of focus that BioWare showcased with the #makeJaalBi twitter campaign (their only addition to the single player, outside of patches BTW) which, when coupled with the fact that they were created with a primary intention of being a romance option, certainly makes it feel that way. Especially, when one also takes into account the overall bland, non-alien depiction of them we are offered in-game. <iframe width="23.960000000000036" height="4.97999999999999" style="position: absolute; width: 23.960000000000036px; height: 4.97999999999999px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none;left: 15px; top: -5px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_14296311" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="23.960000000000036" height="4.97999999999999" style="position: absolute; width: 23.96px; height: 4.98px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 1138px; top: -5px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_88429562" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="23.960000000000036" height="4.97999999999999" style="position: absolute; width: 23.96px; height: 4.98px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 15px; top: 188px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_85367129" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="23.960000000000036" height="4.97999999999999" style="position: absolute; width: 23.96px; height: 4.98px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 1138px; top: 188px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_66585329" scrolling="no"></iframe> They're designed to be the new Asari, but are even more human-like than the monogendered space babes were in ME 1.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Aug 6, 2018 22:12:47 GMT
The Initiative was hardly defenseless. Sure the Arks didn't have any guns built into them, but they had several squadrons of fighters each. There was also ground weaponry like turrets and even the ability to make combat mech suits. Where was the Nexus defenses and those squadrons of fighters when the Kett took the Hyperion? Was everyone on lunch break? Fighting off the rest of the Kett forces involved in the attack. It’s not the first time some of the enemy has been able to slip through the defenses. Even the Citadel had that happen to it on multiple occasions and they were guarded by everything.
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Post by sil on Aug 6, 2018 22:34:23 GMT
Where was the Nexus defenses and those squadrons of fighters when the Kett took the Hyperion? Was everyone on lunch break? Fighting off the rest of the Kett forces involved in the attack. It’s not the first time some of the enemy has been able to slip through the defenses. Even the Citadel had that happen to it on multiple occasions and they were guarded by everything. They couldn't even tell that Legion was a geth.
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Post by themikefest on Aug 6, 2018 22:35:53 GMT
Fighting off the rest of the Kett forces involved in the attack. Were they? Is there any dialogue mentioning that or a scene showing that's what happened? Yep, but it showed the damage the Citadel received whereas there is no damage seen on the Nexus.
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Post by Pearl on Aug 7, 2018 0:09:47 GMT
Could there be? No. EA was pretty brutal with how they axed everything related to Andromeda. I'd say it's more likely that we'll see a KOTOR3 than Andromeda get any more development.
Should there be? Since it's all hypothetical anyway, I don't see why not. They'd have their work cut out for them, though, as the issues with the game are deeper than some ugly faces or abominable UI.
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Post by marshalmoriarty on Aug 7, 2018 4:57:22 GMT
Given how quickly and thoroughly EA pulled up the drawbridge then took off and nuked the site from orbit, I can't see any way back for Andromeda. You only get one chance to make a positive first impression which BW and EA bungled in truly spectacular style. The semi revival of NMS is surprising, but its still considered a joke by a great many. To pull off anything like a similar situation in MEA would require money, time and good will from both EA and gamers.
Which is rather unlikely to manifest, I would suggest (and this is from someone who looked more kindly on MEA than most). The awful main story, lack of interesting new races and 'okay but kind of dull' characters are such a high set hurdles to overcome. I do think the Scourge space phenomeon was very promising though. I think an expansion of that to cause a crisis that forces the races into conflict for territory and ownership of the terraforming technology in the hopes it could fix things would be interesting, especially if it provoked new races and space empires to show themselves.
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Post by alanc9 on Aug 7, 2018 15:31:51 GMT
The Initiative was hardly defenseless. Sure the Arks didn't have any guns built into them, but they had several squadrons of fighters each. There was also ground weaponry like turrets and even the ability to make combat mech suits. Where was the Nexus defenses and those squadrons of fighters when the Kett took the Hyperion? Was everyone on lunch break? Not very well explained. But that's nothing new for the series. (ME1 at least had the decency to shuffle most of its plot holes offstage.)
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Post by alanc9 on Aug 7, 2018 15:33:40 GMT
Fighting off the rest of the Kett forces involved in the attack. It’s not the first time some of the enemy has been able to slip through the defenses. Even the Citadel had that happen to it on multiple occasions and they were guarded by everything. They couldn't even tell that Legion was a geth. "Geth do not intentionally infiltrate."
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ahglock
N5
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
Origin: ShinobiKillfist
Posts: 2,887 Likes: 3,546
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Post by ahglock on Aug 8, 2018 3:17:20 GMT
Arming the Initiative fleet doesn't make a heck of a lot of sense. The space where that would actually make a difference is vanishingly small. An alien race would have had to just discovered interstellar travel for the AI to have any chance against it. After more than a few decades of development they'd outclass any conceivable AI fleet. And on the flip side, if they don't have the mass effect drive yet, then they can't harm the AI at all. I'm not sure I understand the logic here, can you elaborate? My thought process is the MW Galaxy has had space travel for thousands of years and weapon technology has advanced so I'm not so sure why a few decades is all they would take to be outclassed after an alien discovered FTL. Sure the MW stuck in its mass effect tech but I don't think there is any indication that other races would in a short time branch off. It may have been a crutch but it also was a giant leap forward, it would probably take centuries just to catch up to where the MW was.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by TheodoricFriede on Aug 8, 2018 5:47:36 GMT
Ah these are the Bioware forums I remember...
Someone starts a topic on the concept of a major patch to reinvent an older game that wasn't well received, and people are talking about whether or not the Andromeda Initiative was or was not correct in its military assessments.
You guys want to round it out and discuss if the geth or quarians had the moral high ground? Or whether or not Anders was right?
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Post by Vortex13 on Aug 8, 2018 12:42:02 GMT
Ah these are the Bioware forums I remember... Someone starts a topic on the concept of a major patch to reinvent an older game that wasn't well received, and people are talking about whether or not the Andromeda Initiative was or was not correct in its military assessments. You guys want to round it out and discuss if the geth or quarians had the moral high ground? Or whether or not Anders was right? No, but I would be willing to debate how the Geophage was justified if you want
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Post by alanc9 on Aug 8, 2018 15:39:32 GMT
Arming the Initiative fleet doesn't make a heck of a lot of sense. The space where that would actually make a difference is vanishingly small. An alien race would have had to just discovered interstellar travel for the AI to have any chance against it. After more than a few decades of development they'd outclass any conceivable AI fleet. And on the flip side, if they don't have the mass effect drive yet, then they can't harm the AI at all. I'm not sure I understand the logic here, can you elaborate? My thought process is the MW Galaxy has had space travel for thousands of years and weapon technology has advanced so I'm not so sure why a few decades is all they would take to be outclassed after an alien discovered FTL. Sure the MW stuck in its mass effect tech but I don't think there is any indication that other races would in a short time branch off. It may have been a crutch but it also was a giant leap forward, it would probably take centuries just to catch up to where the MW was. I had an implicit assumption that the way space combat techs work is the way we've seen them work in the MET. Either you have the mass effect or you don't. If you have it, then your ships are comparable to everyone else's ships, and it's just a question of numbers with some tech development at the margins. Higher stages are possible, but take thousands of years to reach. You're postulating the existence of some sort of lesser FTL/space weaponry tech than what the MW races all ended up with, then? It's conceivable, but there's no sign of it in either the trilogy or ME:A (kett tech is different, but comparable in effectiveness). The ME:A writers could have invented such a stage if they wanted to, and had the AI planners be aware of such lesser stages as a theoretical possibility, but they did not. I don't see any reason for us to posit that such a technological stage actually exists in the MEU; the world works better if we don't.
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Post by Vortex13 on Aug 8, 2018 16:01:40 GMT
BioWare could have done a lot when it came to Andromeda but, seeing as how it was out sourced to the unproven 'C team' and then was stuck in upper (mis)management hell for the better part of it's development cycle, I guess we should't be too surprised that it turned out the way it did.
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ahglock
N5
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
Origin: ShinobiKillfist
Posts: 2,887 Likes: 3,546
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ahglock
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
ShinobiKillfist
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Post by ahglock on Aug 8, 2018 16:59:50 GMT
I'm not sure I understand the logic here, can you elaborate? My thought process is the MW Galaxy has had space travel for thousands of years and weapon technology has advanced so I'm not so sure why a few decades is all they would take to be outclassed after an alien discovered FTL. Sure the MW stuck in its mass effect tech but I don't think there is any indication that other races would in a short time branch off. It may have been a crutch but it also was a giant leap forward, it would probably take centuries just to catch up to where the MW was. I had an implicit assumption that the way space combat techs work is the way we've seen them work in the MET. Either you have the mass effect or you don't. If you have it, then your ships are comparable to everyone else's ships, and it's just a question of numbers with some tech development at the margins. Higher stages are possible, but take thousands of years to reach. You're postulating the existence of some sort of lesser FTL/space weaponry tech than what the MW races all ended up with, then? It's conceivable, but there's no sign of it in either the trilogy or ME:A (kett tech is different, but comparable in effectiveness). The ME:A writers could have invented such a stage if they wanted to, and had the AI planners be aware of such lesser stages as a theoretical possibility, but they did not. I don't see any reason for us to posit that such a technological stage actually exists in the MEU; the world works better if we don't.
Ah I misunderstood you, you were referring to numbers not a tech advantage. I kind of assume the mass effect tech worked kind of like gun tech with jumps here and there in tech advancement and then periods where it stagnates. The MW was given a cheat sheet that allowed them to move past the metaphorical black powder time frame quicker. And I may have misunderstood the MW but there did seem to be a clear tech divide among the races at least when it came to military tech. It might not be massive but it seemed to be there. And as I thought you were referring to tech levels and not numbers that got me confused. When it comes to numbers I kind of assume ships of that size would be insanely rare and the guns and shields it could sport even when not outfitted like a military vessel would be impressive enough to deal with anything you randomly bumped into, giving you time to flee from any larger force. Escape to another area would be the point of the guns, not to fight off large numbers or wage an effective war against the inhabitants.
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Post by 10k on Aug 12, 2018 13:19:45 GMT
If there was going to be a "ME NEXT" of any kind, I'd rather BW focus on releasing a ME3 special edition. Tweaking the storying in that game. There's a reason Andromeda was dropped; and it'll be a good idea for EAware to stay away from that game wholeheartedly. But with all this ME talk going around, that BW is already brainstorming for the next ME. I'm really interested in where they're going to go next. I personally hope they just bring back Shepard.
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Post by traks on Aug 20, 2018 23:08:49 GMT
I would love an expansion pack that solves some open ends, but can't come up yet with the right 'ingredients'. Jaardan and Kett storylines seem too big and the Benefactor one was probably meant as an ongoing side plot to have a connection to the Milky Way in future main games.
Maybe they could advance all three without solutions, but obviously that only makes sense if they want to develop a sequel further down the road. Finding out why the Kett are building that big army through annihilation (maybe because of the Jaardan?), finding out why the Jaardan created the Angara (maybe they are cloned Jaardan?), securing Khi Tisira (Jaal mentions this as post game goal), poking a little around on Meridian (maybe finding out a little more about the scourge?) and some new planets to exlore are my best 'ingredient list' ATM.
Focusing on new stuff would be atop of my list instead of many people seemingly wanting more old races. I hope they stick in that regard to the initial plan: the third book explains how these races got to Andromeda making it possible for them to be there in sequels. No need to save another Ark.
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Post by Vortex13 on Aug 21, 2018 12:06:50 GMT
If there is going to be dedicated sequels in Andromeda I would prefer to see any rumored story developments getting addressed in-game and not having to have required reading of various novels to understand what is going on.
As far as the Quarian Ark goes, I would prefer that ark arrive in Andromeda at the start of any supposed second game without any complications. I would also prefer that said ark is stuffed to the gills with all the other Milky Way species that we didn't get to see in the first title. The Quarians, Volus, Elcor, Hanar, Drell, and Rachni (at the very least) need to make the trip, since Andromeda is in bad need of 'alien' aliens to populate it.
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Post by sil on Aug 21, 2018 15:24:13 GMT
If there is going to be dedicated sequels in Andromeda I would prefer to see any rumored story developments getting addressed in-game and not having to have required reading of various novels to understand what is going on. As far as the Quarian Ark goes, I would prefer that ark arrive in Andromeda at the start of any supposed second game without any complications. I would also prefer that said ark is stuffed to the gills with all the other Milky Way species that we didn't get to see in the first title. The Quarians, Volus, Elcor, Hanar, Drell, and Rachni (at the very least) need to make the trip, since Andromeda is in bad need of 'alien' aliens to populate it. If they were to delay it to a sequel then I would hope that they'd take the risk and make those aliens have a stronger story presence than the turians, salarians, asari and krogan. Purely because those 4 always have such a big presence in the ME games and the others are always pushed to the side and deserve their turn in the spotlight. Obviously alongside a bunch of other new races, ofc.
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Post by Vortex13 on Aug 21, 2018 15:49:31 GMT
If there is going to be dedicated sequels in Andromeda I would prefer to see any rumored story developments getting addressed in-game and not having to have required reading of various novels to understand what is going on. As far as the Quarian Ark goes, I would prefer that ark arrive in Andromeda at the start of any supposed second game without any complications. I would also prefer that said ark is stuffed to the gills with all the other Milky Way species that we didn't get to see in the first title. The Quarians, Volus, Elcor, Hanar, Drell, and Rachni (at the very least) need to make the trip, since Andromeda is in bad need of 'alien' aliens to populate it. If they were to delay it to a sequel then I would hope that they'd take the risk and make those aliens have a stronger story presence than the turians, salarians, asari and krogan. Purely because those 4 always have such a big presence in the ME games and the others are always pushed to the side and deserve their turn in the spotlight. Obviously alongside a bunch of other new races, ofc. I couldn't agree more. It's time for aliens like the Elcor, Hanar, and Rachni to get their turn in the spotlight and out of the perpetual 'joke/cameo race' typecasting they've been lumped into. All the significant plot lines regarding the mainstay races are done, and there is little reason to keep retreading old ground. I swear if we have another Genophage/Krogan oppression plot line in the next Mass Effect... Even exploring the simple nature of how these aliens with wildly diverse physiologies would approach things, like combat and colonization, would be far more interesting than what we've seen so far with humanity and the 'big 4' human-like races. It would be really amazing if we could actually get some of those 'alien' aliens as companions. More companions like Shale from DA:O or Legion (ME 2), characters written to explore compelling ideas and interesting concepts, and less companions merely put in place to satisfy a romance option please.
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Post by sil on Aug 21, 2018 19:17:59 GMT
If they were to delay it to a sequel then I would hope that they'd take the risk and make those aliens have a stronger story presence than the turians, salarians, asari and krogan. Purely because those 4 always have such a big presence in the ME games and the others are always pushed to the side and deserve their turn in the spotlight. Obviously alongside a bunch of other new races, ofc. I couldn't agree more. It's time for aliens like the Elcor, Hanar, and Rachni to get their turn in the spotlight and out of the perpetual 'joke/cameo race' typecasting they've been lumped into. All the significant plot lines regarding the mainstay races are done, and there is little reason to keep retreading old ground. I swear if we have another Genophage/Krogan oppression plot line in the next Mass Effect... Even exploring the simple nature of how these aliens with wildly diverse physiologies would approach things, like combat and colonization, would be far more interesting than what we've seen so far with humanity and the 'big 4' human-like races. It would be really amazing if we could actually get some of those 'alien' aliens as companions. More companions like Shale from DA:O or Legion (ME 2), characters written to explore compelling ideas and interesting concepts, and less companions merely put in place to satisfy a romance option please. Look at this. Two people on a forum completely agreeing with each other. It's a rarity! We know how the elcor fight, and we've got a vague idea of the volus too, but I'd love to see Bioware explain how a race like the hanar go to war. I always imagined that their 'ground troops' would end up using a mixture of powerful biotics, tech and drone flocks for war, with drell specialists and infantry supporting them. So a hanar squadmate would function like the Sentinel class. But who knows how Bioware would handle them.
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Post by Vortex13 on Aug 21, 2018 19:47:58 GMT
I couldn't agree more. It's time for aliens like the Elcor, Hanar, and Rachni to get their turn in the spotlight and out of the perpetual 'joke/cameo race' typecasting they've been lumped into. All the significant plot lines regarding the mainstay races are done, and there is little reason to keep retreading old ground. I swear if we have another Genophage/Krogan oppression plot line in the next Mass Effect... Even exploring the simple nature of how these aliens with wildly diverse physiologies would approach things, like combat and colonization, would be far more interesting than what we've seen so far with humanity and the 'big 4' human-like races. It would be really amazing if we could actually get some of those 'alien' aliens as companions. More companions like Shale from DA:O or Legion (ME 2), characters written to explore compelling ideas and interesting concepts, and less companions merely put in place to satisfy a romance option please. Look at this. Two people on a forum completely agreeing with each other. It's a rarity! We know how the elcor fight, and we've got a vague idea of the volus too, but I'd love to see Bioware explain how a race like the hanar go to war. I always imagined that their 'ground troops' would end up using a mixture of powerful biotics, tech and drone flocks for war, with drell specialists and infantry supporting them. So a hanar squadmate would function like the Sentinel class. But who knows how Bioware would handle them. Personally, considering the Hanar's duality already shown with their Face and Soul Names, I always figured that they would approach combat with a focus on deception and misdirection. Extensive drone support & Drell auxiliaries would make up the bulk of their forces of course, but with a very small, and very dedicated Hanar "commando squads" providing them with quick surgical strikes. I don't think biotics is a skill commonly employed by their species, and it seems more like any such individuals would be kept far behind the front lines as valuable leaders, or at least supportive assets, to assist the rest of the armed forces. As a species the Hanar seem naturally secretive, it wouldn't make sense (IMO) that they wouldn't 'flaunt' their biotic experts in simple ground combat like the Asari and Humans do. As for companion 'classes' go, I pictured a Hanar being more an infiltrator myself. Being able to float through the air, squeeze into impossible spaces (thanks to no solid skeleton), and possessing natural neural toxins as well as multiple, dextrous limbs would make them formidable close combat opponents; especially if they got the drop on a target. I mean, someone's training the Drell to be assassins, and anyone with that knowledge and skill set must possess said capabilities themselves.
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link2twenty
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: Link2Twenty
XBL Gamertag: carefreetuna
PSN: carefreetuna
Posts: 461 Likes: 898
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Post by link2twenty on Aug 31, 2018 13:29:23 GMT
This would be ideal, though it's a two-sided sword, if they get it right they could really help Mass Effect if they get it wrong they could doom it.
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