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The Good Drow
510
0
May 14, 2024 22:53:29 GMT
6,800
Gilli
Stuck in the Forgotten Realms
2,913
August 2016
gilli
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Gilli-chan
EMH-Bruce
2712
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Post by Gilli on Aug 18, 2018 2:52:32 GMT
I'd say that quote from Cillian is a sentence he says a lot too. (nearly every time you enter the last Zone in a MP game) And Cillian’s the guy that everyone believes is an ancient elf. Suspicious indeed. He's not an ancient elf, as he grew up in the same clan as Neria, the Keeper. BUT, he did study the ancient elven ways. BackgroundCillian was a child of the Ralaferin clan, like his clan mate Neria. When his magical abilities surfaced, he began training as Keeper Elindra's apprentice and was intended to be her First. But the tales of an ancient order of mystical warriors who turned their magic inward fascinated Cillian, and what he learned from Elindra could not satisfy his curiosity.
As a young man, Cillian decided that he would pursue the way of the arcane warrior. He asked Elindra's blessing to leave to seek his own path. She assented knowing his heart was not in becoming Keeper, and Cillian left his clan, traveling far into the wilderness, seeking out knowledge of the arcane warriors. He explored ruin after ruin until he came across an ancient elven shrine, where he says the secrets of the ancient order were kept. Cillian remained in the shrine for years, meditating, dedicating his mind, body, and soul to the practice of the art form.
Originally driven by the need to seek glory for his people, Cillian's years of meditation and solitude gave him wisdom and respect for all life. When The Breach opened, he knew his duty was to stand against it, fighting to save all he knows and loves.
Cillian is described as peaceful and laughs little by the Katari.
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Jun 17, 2017 17:29:55 GMT
3,700
arvaarad
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Mar 18, 2017 16:32:40 GMT
March 2017
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Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Jade Empire
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Post by arvaarad on Aug 18, 2018 4:05:44 GMT
And Cillian’s the guy that everyone believes is an ancient elf. Suspicious indeed. He's not an ancient elf, as he grew up in the same clan as Neria, the Keeper. BUT, he did study the ancient elven ways. BackgroundCillian was a child of the Ralaferin clan, like his clan mate Neria. When his magical abilities surfaced, he began training as Keeper Elindra's apprentice and was intended to be her First. But the tales of an ancient order of mystical warriors who turned their magic inward fascinated Cillian, and what he learned from Elindra could not satisfy his curiosity.
As a young man, Cillian decided that he would pursue the way of the arcane warrior. He asked Elindra's blessing to leave to seek his own path. She assented knowing his heart was not in becoming Keeper, and Cillian left his clan, traveling far into the wilderness, seeking out knowledge of the arcane warriors. He explored ruin after ruin until he came across an ancient elven shrine, where he says the secrets of the ancient order were kept. Cillian remained in the shrine for years, meditating, dedicating his mind, body, and soul to the practice of the art form.
Originally driven by the need to seek glory for his people, Cillian's years of meditation and solitude gave him wisdom and respect for all life. When The Breach opened, he knew his duty was to stand against it, fighting to save all he knows and loves.
Cillian is described as peaceful and laughs little by the Katari. Ah yeah, I don’t play MP, so the little I’d heard of his backstory sounded more ambiguous. He certainly dresses the part.
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May 14, 2024 16:45:56 GMT
26,686
gervaise21
10,808
August 2016
gervaise21
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by gervaise21 on Aug 18, 2018 7:53:44 GMT
Ah yeah, I don’t play MP, so the little I’d heard of his backstory sounded more ambiguous. He certainly dresses the part. That is taken from World of Thedas 2. Presumably he could have found some ancient armour at the shrine to account for his clothing. However, I do wonder sometimes how he managed to translate the ancient texts at the shrine, and later for the Inquisition, without some additional help. Of course, it could have been that he encountered a spirit, like we did in DAO, that did a mind dump on him. Alternatively, I suppose he might have been located by a certain ancient Dreamer when he was asleep or even have had dealings with Felassan. Felassan was around for at least 20 years prior to the events of Masked Empire and may well have crossed paths with a number of Dalish other than Clan Virnehn. Could he have been the source of the tales of the ancient warriors that so fired Cillian's imagination? After all, neither in DAO or DAI do our Dalish PCs seem to have any prior knowledge of the arcane warrior. If part of Felassan's task was to recruit modern elves to assist Solas when he awoke then sending Cillian off to find the ancient shrine could have been preparatory work for making him an agent of Fen'Harel later on. However, if the entry in WoT2 is telling the whole truth about Cillian then this does not suggest someone who would approve of Solas' plan: Originally driven by the need to seek glory for his people, Cillian's years of meditation and solitude gave him wisdom and respect for all life. When The Breach opened, he knew his duty was to stand against it, fighting to save all he knows and loves.
Of course both Felassan and Solas could have misled him about Fen'Harel's ultimate aim but I do not think that Cillian would knowingly side with Solas if he knew it was going to result in the destruction of all modern life even if it did restore the glory of the elves.
What I would agree with though is the similarity between his mantra "I am the sea, who can stand against the tide" and the philosophy of Koslun. If there is a connection between the two then it likely comes from that ancient shrine where he found his wisdom.
Incidentally another of my pet theories is that in his younger days Solas was an arcane warrior. Their original purpose was to guard the nobility/priesthood/favoured of the gods and he originally seems to have been some sort of bodyguard to Mythal. He also tells the Inquisitor that no one doubted the integrity and commitment of the Arcane Warriors. If Mythal was killed on his watch owing to some lapse on his part it would hardly be surprising he felt duty bound to avenge her.
More trivia that may or may not be significant. The Emerald Knights had wolf guardians but what if that was in fact some residual memory of when arcane warriors guarded the nobility but were known as wolves? What if Solas had originally been the commander in chief of the arcane warriors? Then it would make sense that if Solas was an arcane warrior gone rogue, he was known as the "Dread Wolf". Those giant wolf statues everywhere had to have some significance besides him simply being Mythal's side-kick and they certainly weren't carved in the 250 years the Dales were in existence. However, the Dalish did retain a residual memory of them symbolising Fen'Harel as they continued to place small figurines of Fen'Harel facing outwards at the edge of their camp in order to ward off evil spirits. Their memories of Fen'Harel certainly were muddled.
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510
0
May 14, 2024 22:53:29 GMT
6,800
Gilli
Stuck in the Forgotten Realms
2,913
August 2016
gilli
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Gilli-chan
EMH-Bruce
2712
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Post by Gilli on Aug 18, 2018 13:19:15 GMT
He's not an ancient elf, as he grew up in the same clan as Neria, the Keeper. BUT, he did study the ancient elven ways. BackgroundCillian was a child of the Ralaferin clan, like his clan mate Neria. When his magical abilities surfaced, he began training as Keeper Elindra's apprentice and was intended to be her First. But the tales of an ancient order of mystical warriors who turned their magic inward fascinated Cillian, and what he learned from Elindra could not satisfy his curiosity.
As a young man, Cillian decided that he would pursue the way of the arcane warrior. He asked Elindra's blessing to leave to seek his own path. She assented knowing his heart was not in becoming Keeper, and Cillian left his clan, traveling far into the wilderness, seeking out knowledge of the arcane warriors. He explored ruin after ruin until he came across an ancient elven shrine, where he says the secrets of the ancient order were kept. Cillian remained in the shrine for years, meditating, dedicating his mind, body, and soul to the practice of the art form.
Originally driven by the need to seek glory for his people, Cillian's years of meditation and solitude gave him wisdom and respect for all life. When The Breach opened, he knew his duty was to stand against it, fighting to save all he knows and loves.
Cillian is described as peaceful and laughs little by the Katari. Ah yeah, I don’t play MP, so the little I’d heard of his backstory sounded more ambiguous. He certainly dresses the part. His MP Bio As for his armor, you can unlock different armors by crafting them. I don't understand why the pictures are so small, they're much bigger on the DA wiki.
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May 14, 2024 21:30:37 GMT
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Walter Black
1,257
Sept 15, 2016 15:02:16 GMT
September 2016
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Post by Walter Black on Aug 18, 2018 14:30:42 GMT
I think Tallis might stay Qunari but work to improve it from within. This is always the bit I have a problem with. Gatt expressed a similar idea. How does a person, whose role is not in anyway concerned with education or administration persuade an organisation that considers itself it is the answer to society's problems to change?
This is not about the changing their approach to conquering other nations, which is where they do appear open to new ideas, judging from Sten's story. He was successful in putting forward his ideas as a junior officer because they had just suffered a humiliating defeat.
This is about the things that Tallis and Gatt realise are not ideal, from their POV, and feel uncomfortable with but are an integral part of the Qunari philosophy. Both these characters have been tolerated within the system, despite their rebellious tendencies, because of the particular uses to which they could be put as part of the spy network. However, for anyone to take notice of their suggested "improvements" they would have to demonstrate to their superiors that current practice was detrimental to the Qun. Not easy considering the moment you voice such criticism they are likely to book you in for a session of re-education. I don't think Tallis or Gatt necessarily have to be all that successful, just that their small efforts have a chance of improving the Qun down the line. Honestly, this wishlist scenario is more about making their thematic archetypes different from previous Qunari Companions, even if only slightly. Sten would always stay completely to the Qun as is, whereas Iron Bull could remain obedient or become tal-vashoth. Making Gatt or Tallis Internal Reformists, remaining patriotic in "saving" the Qun, gives their characters alternate narratives from IB and Sten as Qunari. Aside from being elven viddathari, which just icing on the cake.
Ugghh, no... just no . Aside from making Solas even more needlessly memetic than he already is, the alien philosophy and culture of the Qun is what separated the Qunari from generic fantasy orcs. I agree that it was probably distorted over time, but it was still theirs. Taking that from them strips a lot of their agency and dimensions, and makes them look too stupid to have come up with it on their own.
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∯ Oh Loredy...
455
0
May 14, 2024 16:45:56 GMT
26,686
gervaise21
10,808
August 2016
gervaise21
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by gervaise21 on Aug 18, 2018 14:40:20 GMT
I know it is veering slightly off the topic of Tallis and Gatt but I do also wonder where Denarius got the idea to infuse Fenris' skin with lyrium. The markings look elven in design so I wonder if he discovered some ancient elven tract outlining the ideas for the procedure, either in the Tevinter archives or on Seheron. Then he uses Fenris as his bodyguard and calls him Fenris, his "Little Wolf". Come on, that seems too much of a coincidence that there isn't some link back to the ancient elves.
With the comments by Gatsi about those mosaic pieces we discover that seem to have Kossith shown on them, I think they pre-date Tevinter as well. Some Magister had them altered to make him look the hero but I'm guessing that the Kossith do have their origins in the activities of the Evanuris as well.
Ironic when you think about it, if the ancient elves were responsible for the creation of the kossith, probably as a slave army to serve them in their war, that their respective descendants have now effectively reversed those roles, with the Qunari using modern day elves, if not as slaves certainly as tools of the Qun.
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0
Jun 17, 2017 17:29:55 GMT
3,700
arvaarad
1,465
Mar 18, 2017 16:32:40 GMT
March 2017
arvaarad
Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Jade Empire
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Post by arvaarad on Aug 18, 2018 15:11:45 GMT
Ugghh, no... just no . Aside from making Solas even more needlessly memetic than he already is, the alien philosophy and culture of the Qun is what separated the Qunari from generic fantasy orcs. I agree that it was probably distorted over time, but it was still theirs. Taking that from them strips a lot of their agency and dimensions, and makes them look too stupid to have come up with it on their own. Plus it’s not really similar to Solas’ philosophy, if anything it might have drawn influence from Andruil’s. Not necessarily being created by Andruil herself, but building on it and changing it (like Andrastianism built on previous Maker myths). For comparison, here’s Andruil’s Way of the Three Trees: Way of the Arrow Fly straight and never waver. Way of the Bow Bend but never break. Way of the Forest Together we are stronger than the one.
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154
0
May 14, 2024 21:53:54 GMT
1,997
Reznore
942
August 2016
reznore
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Post by Reznore on Aug 18, 2018 15:18:25 GMT
I know it is veering slightly off the topic of Tallis and Gatt but I do also wonder where Denarius got the idea to infuse Fenris' skin with lyrium. The markings look elven in design so I wonder if he discovered some ancient elven tract outlining the ideas for the procedure, either in the Tevinter archives or on Seheron. Then he uses Fenris as his bodyguard and calls him Fenris, his "Little Wolf". Come on, that seems too much of a coincidence that there isn't some link back to the ancient elves. With the comments by Gatsi about those mosaic pieces we discover that seem to have Kossith shown on them, I think they pre-date Tevinter as well. Some Magister had them altered to make him look the hero but I'm guessing that the Kossith do have their origins in the activities of the Evanuris as well. Ironic when you think about it, if the ancient elves were responsible for the creation of the kossith, probably as a slave army to serve them in their war, that their respective descendants have now effectively reversed those roles, with the Qunari using modern day elves, if not as slaves certainly as tools of the Qun. I've read about Danarius getting inspired by elven stuff...although can't remember if fan theory or official. Lyrium marking, instead of blood writing, would be interesting. Because it seems lyrium can sometimes be used as a counter effect to "fade" magic.(templars) If elves were spirity in origin, it might have been used to bound their body to Thedas. or even somewhat restrict their possible use of the fade.
But lyrium, the blights, and even blood are strange when it comes to magic. they all can be used as power battery for a lot of spells, but also have some special properties. Blood magic attracts demons, and seems to have an effect on the veil. Lyrium can be used by templars to counter mages, I also think tranquil were branded with lyrium. And the blight, well you can catch it and it rots things.
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2703
0
2,011
Lazarillo
1,025
January 2017
lazarillo
Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, SWTOR
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Post by Lazarillo on Aug 18, 2018 15:32:16 GMT
I think it's probably better for me if Tallis doesn't show up again. She was really obnoxious in her Sue-ness, and it made zero sense for Hawke to just let her walk away at the end of MotA. I try really hard as a player not to project too much onto my characters, but I think the way she's been handled, it'd be too hard not to immediately start looking for the "kill" button if she appeared.
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duckley
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 527 Likes: 831
inherit
625
0
831
duckley
527
August 2016
duckley
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by duckley on Aug 18, 2018 15:48:35 GMT
I have no strong feelings pro or con. I liked Tallis as a character. Some reference in DAS4 to either of these two would be fine.
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Jun 17, 2017 17:29:55 GMT
3,700
arvaarad
1,465
Mar 18, 2017 16:32:40 GMT
March 2017
arvaarad
Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Jade Empire
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Post by arvaarad on Aug 18, 2018 17:53:31 GMT
I think it's probably better for me if Tallis doesn't show up again. She was really obnoxious in her Sue-ness, and it made zero sense for Hawke to just let her walk away at the end of MotA. I try really hard as a player not to project too much onto my characters, but I think the way she's been handled, it'd be too hard not to immediately start looking for the "kill" button if she appeared. I agree that letting her go ascribes some motivations that might not work for certain Hawkes. If she needed to survive, well, she’s a rogue specialized in infiltration. She spends like half the DLC pointing out ways to avoid fights. If Hawke had been given the option of attacking, she’d throw a smokebomb and disappear. AFAIK, Hawke doesn’t have access to stealth-busting abilities no matter how they’re specced, so it wouldn’t have been out of character if they lost her at that point.
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2703
0
2,011
Lazarillo
1,025
January 2017
lazarillo
Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, SWTOR
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Post by Lazarillo on Aug 18, 2018 19:00:04 GMT
If she needed to survive, well, she’s a rogue specialized in infiltration. She spends like half the DLC pointing out ways to avoid fights. If Hawke had been given the option of attacking, she’d throw a smokebomb and disappear. AFAIK, Hawke doesn’t have access to stealth-busting abilities no matter how they’re specced, so it wouldn’t have been out of character if they lost her at that point. Yeah, this is all I would've asked. Giving her a free escape would've still been Sue-ish, but no moreso than she already was. Not even giving the opportunity just made it feel like they'd taken their pandering to the stunt cast-actress and turned it up to a whole new level on top of that.
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4964
0
Jun 17, 2017 17:29:55 GMT
3,700
arvaarad
1,465
Mar 18, 2017 16:32:40 GMT
March 2017
arvaarad
Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Jade Empire
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Post by arvaarad on Aug 18, 2018 22:06:52 GMT
If she needed to survive, well, she’s a rogue specialized in infiltration. She spends like half the DLC pointing out ways to avoid fights. If Hawke had been given the option of attacking, she’d throw a smokebomb and disappear. AFAIK, Hawke doesn’t have access to stealth-busting abilities no matter how they’re specced, so it wouldn’t have been out of character if they lost her at that point. Yeah, this is all I would've asked. Giving her a free escape would've still been Sue-ish, but no moreso than she already was. Not even giving the opportunity just made it feel like they'd taken their pandering to the stunt cast-actress and turned it up to a whole new level on top of that. I don’t think it would be an issue, power-wise. Mechanically, none of our protagonists have abilities that can handle enemy stealth. If a rogue enemy actually wants to leave a fight with us, it really is as simple as throwing a smokebomb. They just choose not to flee. Which is strange in itself - real enemies are rarely interested in fighting to their death. Somewhat of a tangent, but this is making me wish for more fleeing enemies. That would add some really interesting character moments even in ambient fights - if they’re not stealthed, do I hunt them down, or do I let them leave... at the cost of missing out on loot?
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inherit
1398
0
3,660
Absafraginlootly
"Abso-fraggin-lutely!" ~ Captain John Sheridan and Satai Delenn
1,383
September 2016
absafraginlootly
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by Absafraginlootly on Aug 19, 2018 11:54:05 GMT
Yeah, this is all I would've asked. Giving her a free escape would've still been Sue-ish, but no moreso than she already was. Not even giving the opportunity just made it feel like they'd taken their pandering to the stunt cast-actress and turned it up to a whole new level on top of that. I don’t think it would be an issue, power-wise. Mechanically, none of our protagonists have abilities that can handle enemy stealth. If a rogue enemy actually wants to leave a fight with us, it really is as simple as throwing a smokebomb. They just choose not to flee. Which is strange in itself - real enemies are rarely interested in fighting to their death. Somewhat of a tangent, but this is making me wish for more fleeing enemies. That would add some really interesting character moments even in ambient fights - if they’re not stealthed, do I hunt them down, or do I let them leave... at the cost of missing out on loot?I think the dragon age tabletop has a mechanic like that. Like say after the party killed more than half of the bandit ambush the dm would have to roll to see if the others fled. But it's been a long ass time so I may be misremembering. It would be nice if they added something like that to the main games, maybe not for all enemies, but if you run into bandits or wolves on a open map at some point it makes sense that the remains would nope out.
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3271
0
1,496
rras1994
856
February 2017
rras1994
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Post by rras1994 on Aug 19, 2018 12:34:48 GMT
Ugghh, no... just no . Aside from making Solas even more needlessly memetic than he already is, the alien philosophy and culture of the Qun is what separated the Qunari from generic fantasy orcs. I agree that it was probably distorted over time, but it was still theirs. Taking that from them strips a lot of their agency and dimensions, and makes them look too stupid to have come up with it on their own. Plus it’s not really similar to Solas’ philosophy, if anything it might have drawn influence from Andruil’s. Not necessarily being created by Andruil herself, but building on it and changing it (like Andrastianism built on previous Maker myths). For comparison, here’s Andruil’s Way of the Three Trees: Way of the Arrow Fly straight and never waver. Way of the Bow Bend but never break. Way of the Forest Together we are stronger than the one. Consider that I strongly suspect that the Qunari race were made as a weopen, and Andruil is known to make weopens, and even seemed to try to use the Blight as a weopen (though it seemed to be Mythal who originally made it/discovered it), it wouldn't be that surprising if she was responsible for the Qun/Qunari. It's hard to set down the timeline, specially with regards to Mythal's death and when Solas' started his rebellion, but there did seem to be a war set up amongst the Gods as well as a rebellion brewing (which I think Mythal was brewing as a way to keep power, I don't think she has good intentions as much as Solas thinks), it wouldn't be surprising if other Elhven Gods were coming up with potentiol weopens in secret - and Vashoth are like the ultimate soldier, specially the Sareebas which are even more powerful and dangerous then normal mages. Perfect if you were going to sic them on someone.
Edit: I'll also note that Ghilan'nain is associated with Andruil and became a God herself due to her, and is known for being the creater of living creatures.
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0
3,019
OhDaniGirl
Incoming...
1,085
August 2016
ohdanigirl
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem
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Post by OhDaniGirl on Aug 19, 2018 13:08:57 GMT
Plus it’s not really similar to Solas’ philosophy, if anything it might have drawn influence from Andruil’s. Not necessarily being created by Andruil herself, but building on it and changing it (like Andrastianism built on previous Maker myths). For comparison, here’s Andruil’s Way of the Three Trees: Way of the Arrow Fly straight and never waver. Way of the Bow Bend but never break. Way of the Forest Together we are stronger than the one. Consider that I strongly suspect that the Qunari race were made as a weopen, and Andruil is known to make weopens, and even seemed to try to use the Blight as a weopen (though it seemed to be Mythal who originally made it/discovered it), it wouldn't be that surprising if she was responsible for the Qun/Qunari. It's hard to set down the timeline, specially with regards to Mythal's death and when Solas' started his rebellion, but there did seem to be a war set up amongst the Gods as well as a rebellion brewing (which I think Mythal was brewing as a way to keep power, I don't think she has good intentions as much as Solas thinks), it wouldn't be surprising if other Elhven Gods were coming up with potentiol weopens in secret - and Vashoth are like the ultimate soldier, specially the Sareebas which are even more powerful and dangerous then normal mages. Perfect if you were going to sic them on someone.
Edit: I'll also note that Ghilan'nain is associated with Andruil and became a God herself due to her, and is known for being the creater of living creatures.
Not only did Ghilan'nain create living creatures, she also experimented on them/used them to experiment with. She was kind of a monster.
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0
1,496
rras1994
856
February 2017
rras1994
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Post by rras1994 on Aug 19, 2018 13:24:17 GMT
Consider that I strongly suspect that the Qunari race were made as a weopen, and Andruil is known to make weopens, and even seemed to try to use the Blight as a weopen (though it seemed to be Mythal who originally made it/discovered it), it wouldn't be that surprising if she was responsible for the Qun/Qunari. It's hard to set down the timeline, specially with regards to Mythal's death and when Solas' started his rebellion, but there did seem to be a war set up amongst the Gods as well as a rebellion brewing (which I think Mythal was brewing as a way to keep power, I don't think she has good intentions as much as Solas thinks), it wouldn't be surprising if other Elhven Gods were coming up with potentiol weopens in secret - and Vashoth are like the ultimate soldier, specially the Sareebas which are even more powerful and dangerous then normal mages. Perfect if you were going to sic them on someone.
Edit: I'll also note that Ghilan'nain is associated with Andruil and became a God herself due to her, and is known for being the creater of living creatures.
Not only did Ghilan'nain create living creatures, she also experimented on them/used them to experiment with. She was kind of a monster. A mad scientist monster who was in Andruil's pocket - considering that the Vashoth/kossith have been told "their blood is not their own" and the kossith themselves seemed to have changed over the years, and the Qun has sections that seem very Andruil, I think it would very much fit if these two Gods were involved.
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0
Jun 17, 2017 17:29:55 GMT
3,700
arvaarad
1,465
Mar 18, 2017 16:32:40 GMT
March 2017
arvaarad
Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Jade Empire
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Post by arvaarad on Aug 19, 2018 14:04:57 GMT
I don’t think it would be an issue, power-wise. Mechanically, none of our protagonists have abilities that can handle enemy stealth. If a rogue enemy actually wants to leave a fight with us, it really is as simple as throwing a smokebomb. They just choose not to flee. Which is strange in itself - real enemies are rarely interested in fighting to their death. Somewhat of a tangent, but this is making me wish for more fleeing enemies. That would add some really interesting character moments even in ambient fights - if they’re not stealthed, do I hunt them down, or do I let them leave... at the cost of missing out on loot?I think the dragon age tabletop has a mechanic like that. Like say after the party killed more than half of the bandit ambush the dm would have to roll to see if the others fled. But it's been a long ass time so I may be misremembering. It would be nice if they added something like that to the main games, maybe not for all enemies, but if you run into bandits or wolves on a open map at some point it makes sense that the remains would nope out. I think you’re right about the tabletop game. I don’t play it often, but I do try to squeeze it in at cons. It’s an excuse to meet other Dragon Age fans IRL (except for one time when the GM liked the mechanics of the game but didn’t care about the setting, and the scenario came complete with a dwarf “cleric” and a village where only the men were fit to fight... but I digress). Most recently played it a couple weeks ago, and I do remember some enemies fleeing. Though I don’t quite remember if it was after a fight, or if it was because we told them that the slaves they intended to smuggle were undercover Ben-Hassrath.
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∯ Oh Loredy...
455
0
May 14, 2024 16:45:56 GMT
26,686
gervaise21
10,808
August 2016
gervaise21
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by gervaise21 on Aug 19, 2018 14:51:34 GMT
A mad scientist monster who was in Andruil's pocket - considering that the Vashoth/kossith have been told "their blood is not their own" and the kossith themselves seemed to have changed over the years, and the Qun has sections that seem very Andruil, I think it would very much fit if these two Gods were involved These are the two mosaics I refer to that I think may have been pre-Tevinter and may point to the Evanuris being responsible for the Kossith with the pertinent passages bolded: I think this one is called "Freed Are Slaves," which is exactly the kind of "saying words but meaning different things" I expect from a Tevinter. There's lies in the carving, too, but I'll come back to that.
Subject aside, I like this. It's workmanlike, but in a good dwarven way. It repeats because the carver knows what she's good at, so she does it again and again. Makes me think she has more than a passing knowledge of the Stone.
That said, there's two sets of hands involved, one old, one new. Take this magister. He's glowing because he's fresh. Newer. Same with his trophies flanking him. Carved down from more complex figures. And the flat next to them - seems plain, doesn't it? The bottom is filled with detail, but this is left an open field? No, that's just what it is now, but there's shadows for a clever eye. So, what was here if not this handsome magister wanting his cod stuffed? Someone else instead of him and his friends, and two more figures on each side. Seven total.
Only the top was changed. The Qunari haven't been touched; that's old wear down there. When it was first done and hundreds of years later, yoked Qunari prisoners still fit. I don't suppose it's for the same reasons.
I can only say the what, not the why. I can guess that someone wanted to be a Tevinter hero and paid to have their face carved on an antiquity. I mean, that's a crime against ancestors where I'm from, but I don't expect Tevinters to obey dwarven honor. Or their own, really. They've been at war a long time, so I understand wanting to seem big. Orzammar's the same with the darkspawn, unfortunately. Still, shame to lose the original. Not for the seven, for the carver. Good work, this From what I can figure, this one is called "Sacrifice." I'll get back to that later. By two sculptors, and I'll get back to that sooner.
The sculptor's gone to the trouble of faces. I'd guess she worked from portraits, which means they were people who considered themselves important enough to need them. The scene is a classic example of "don't do this" because the sculptor hates them. It's in the way it's carved: all fast, hard edges. Uglier than they need to be, even for your average Tevinter who - and this isn't just me, mind - stands like a lanky vein of lyrium. But don't mistake that for sloppy carving. It's natural, practiced. The carver knows Tevinter. Bet she is one, and it's self-hate, probably.
And obvious enough. There's skulls all over, and two big and horned. That brings to mind your Qunari, and fair enough, right? Tevinters hate Qunari and have ever since they showed up. No magister wants his mouth contradicted, let alone stitched. So it makes sense they're there, even that early, I suppose.
Because this is probably that business of readying to invade the Fade, and giants with horns are a good motivator to sodding hurry up. Odd thing, though, is that those two are not the only Qunari in the carving. The one in the middle was sculpted with horns, and someone has gone in later and chipped them off. You can tell by the surface of it. Well, maybe you can't. But I can.
Seen it happen time and again. Tastes change, and the ancestor's nudes are suddenly embarrassing. So in comes a new hand to paint on some clothes. And here, judging by the marks, to cut away the horns and make the victim look human. Some proud new owner didn't want to throw out the antiquity, but also didn't want people to think grandm'ma sliced up Qunari. Looks like they didn't care if she kept their heads around, though.
So! The carvers both wanted to show Tevinter being shits, but the later one didn't want to show what about. And that's usually to avoid blame or deny credit. Or to be an arse, I suppose
Now I disagree with some of Gatsi's conclusions on this second one. He thinks it is depicting the preparations for the assault on the Golden city and that the motivation was the arrival of the Qunari, which is bonkers since they didn't arrive until hundreds of years later. He thinks it is depicting the Tevinter being shits but of course we know there was an earlier group of rulers who could have been described in the same way. And the figures with horns who had them chipped off may not have been Kossith at all but depictions of Evanuris with their dragon horn style hair and head-dresses. Also when you enter the Fade through the eluvian to confront Flemeth you pass all sorts of skull and horn iconography. The main thing is that Gatsi points out the mosaics have been altered at a later era to the one in which the originals were carved in and the Kossith were around at that time. Then with the first picture he says there were originally 7 principle figures shown but the later carver removed 4 of them plus carved down and simplified the figures that were left. So I'm pretty sure the mosaic was originally carved in the period of the elven empire, then recovered from the ruins by later human occupiers who built over them and then re-purposed by their leaders to fit their own agenda.
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Post by melbella on Aug 19, 2018 16:38:18 GMT
Does anyone have any GOOD pictures of the mosaics? So much is going on them yet they are almost impossible to see due to the darkness in Skyhold.
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Post by TabithaTH on Aug 19, 2018 18:02:18 GMT
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Post by ellehaym on Aug 19, 2018 18:36:15 GMT
Here's what I could find Assuming the mosaics were ancient Elvhen-made, but later repurposed to suit Tevinter, then the presence of Qunari is interesting. Might explain why Corypheus say that they're not a race, because they were intentionally used as slave labor and probably blood magic sacrifice. I do find it very interesting how their skin can take different properties depending on what type of "paint" is used on their skin. Maybe their skin was also used to make clothes or other materials? It does make me think they left Thedas during the Elvhen civil wars. With so much of what we know not being the whole truth, perhaps some Qunari might have stayed behind until Tevinter enslaved and wiped them out and all records of these horned-men were eventually erased/hidden some time during the Qunari invasion though I would think something like this is worth bragging about?
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Post by arvaarad on Aug 20, 2018 4:00:29 GMT
Here's what I could find Assuming the mosaics were ancient Elvhen-made, but later repurposed to suit Tevinter, then the presence of Qunari is interesting. Might explain why Corypheus say that they're not a race, because they were intentionally used as slave labor and probably blood magic sacrifice. I do find it very interesting how their skin can take different properties depending on what type of "paint" is used on their skin. Maybe their skin was also used to make clothes or other materials? Adding on to these possibilities, since they’re very likely crossed with dragons, they’d have had a higher than normal resistance to the Blight, especially in the earlier generations. Dragons are not totally immune to the Blight, but they can handle a lot more of it by forming cysts that isolate the blighted tissue. Even after several generations of non-dragons, dragon blood still has this effect, as we can see from Fiona’s... mysterious recovery. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) This resistance would make qunari ideal for handling blighted items (if the Blight is an elven bioweapon) or as meat shields against the spread of the Blight (if the Blight was a defense mechanism for the Void/titans, or if it was an elven bioweapon that eventually got out of hand).
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Post by gervaise21 on Aug 20, 2018 14:55:37 GMT
Those pictures are the clearest I have seen. The central figure in the top one could definitely be an Evanuris with horned headdress or even hair like Flemeth's. However, the fact this picture dates to antiquity suggests at the very least that either ancient humans or ancient elves had large numbers of kossith slaves.
What do you make of the item that each of the kossith is holding? Is it a weapon or could it be the top of an oar so they are in fact rowing a gigantic galley? We have no record of elves being great seafarers but we do know the Neromenians were. Otherwise it would seem to be a picture of a march past of a kossith slave regiment in front of what Gatsi tells us was originally 7 generals. That fact alone makes me think it dates to the period of the Evanuris as we know they were the generals in the elven army.
Anyway, clearly the later Magister wanted to take credit for defeating some Qunari and so had someone alter an older picture. So kossith were around in Thedas long before they arrived as qunari. They are known to have been in southern Ferelden before the first blight, so even if that settlement was captured by Tevinter and the citizens taken as slaves, it still dates this picture to long before the time of Corypheus and the Magisters Sidereal.
The second picture is more confusing. According to Gatsi the sharper, more human figures, were the later additions. He also claims the central figure hanging upside down, obviously being sacrificed (or tortured?) originally had horns or does he mean the figure immediately in front of him with the hook. To my mind the figure just to the left of him, in the hood, could be elven (reminds me of Abelas) as could the hooded figure a little further away on the right and the figure standing just in front about to gouge him with a hook. As their faces are not clear it would suggest they are from the earlier period.
The proliferation of skulls definitely reminds me of the lair of Flemeth in the Fade. The ones with horns have to be kossith. I'm guessing at a blood magic ritual or death cult but much earlier probably than even the Imperium. Could it be the time of the Evanuris? Is it in fact depicting transgressors being tortured/punished? So this is what happens when slaves rebel against their masters. May be the kossith slaves were too dangerous to control (apparently a lot of Ghilan'nain's creations were) so they were dumped far away across the sea somewhere. One thing I feel is certain, it has nothing to do with Corypheus' enterprise since we know that specifically used elves.
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Post by ellehaym on Aug 20, 2018 17:56:43 GMT
I was initially reminded of Iron Bull's Tarot Card, but I doubt they're carrying flags(?) The things they're in the mosaic look like large/heavy spikes to me. Not sure what they could be used for, maybe it's a tool and what we're seeing is the process of how Elgar'nan's Eidolons are being made? If they were used as blood magic sacrifices, I can almost see why DA2 Qunari had a criss-cross and bloody look to them. Maybe a cultural memory that they made their own much like the Dalish and the Vallaslin?
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