Yep I feel after playing ME OT and MEA "side by side" the MEA cast is much more 'human' / 'alive' / 'real' feeling compared to the most of ME OT. Same happened in DAI too.
that last sentence is fighting words.
Sure I guess, but the better models and animations are to account for some of that too in both cases for me maybe thats why felt more alive.
[ LegendCNCD / AsariLoverFI ] Waiting for DA4 & ME5 - Look's like sometime in 2186, everything went to hell. We got out just ahead of it! MEA & ME1 (>>>> 3 > 2) -- DAI > DAO > DA2 -- 3500h+ & maxed out all 02/2020 in MEAMP, APEX 137001+, DAIMP (565/745/200), ANTHEM, SW BF II - Drinking tears of MP lamers since DooM & Quake in 90's softknees.bandcamp.com/
Mike Jungbluth @lightbombmike Movies I’ve inflicted on the Dragon Age animation team: Killer Klowns from Outer Space Theodore Rex Super Mario Bros Return of the Living Dead Night of the Comet TMNT III Vampire's Kiss Cool As Ice Velocipastor Cats One Cut of the Dead Santa's Slay Troll 2 Miami Connection The FP
For those keep score at home, the latest additions to the DA Animation Team Good Bad Movie List have been: Psycho Goreman Hardcore Henry Teen Witch
The 19th Good Bad Movie the DA Animation team has watched is Hercules in New York. Without a doubt the most awkwardly performed and filmed movie we have watched yet. Though it had not a cynical bone in its buffed up body.
The 20th Good Bad Movie night for the Dragon Age animation team was The Wicker Man. This is how we officially welcomed @ jess_Anim to the team. No turning back now
Ah yes, Velocipastor. With the best VFX
If three humans are in the room, there will be six opinions.
I hear Velocipastor is gearing up for a sequel. It got a resurgence, after getting an Amazon Prime release, where people lost their shit over it, kind of like with Tiger King at the start of the pandemic, so now they're planning a sequel.
When I die, I want Bioware to carry my casket, so they can let me down, one last time.
Patrick Weekes @patrickweekes One of the most difficult but also vital parts of professional writing (at BioWare or in novels) is taking feedback that you don't initially agree with and figuring out what to do with it.
It's easy (so, so, SO easy) to say that you should ignore feedback you disagree with. But it's usually a bad idea.
The people giving the feedback aren't always right, but they always had a point. I'd rather hear about a problem from editors, while there's time to fix it.
But I've also seen what happens when someone takes every note from every source and does exactly what every note suggests. You get a pile of mush with all the interesting bits filed off. It's safe, inoffensive, and forgettable, most of the time.
Being a professional writer means figuring out that balance -- listening well enough to take feedback and make changes, while still believing in yourself and your work enough to stay true to your vision.
I am fortunate that both at work and in novel writing, the vast majority of the feedback I receive is the kind that makes me wince and go, "Argh, I was hoping nobody would notice that, but yeah, fair."
Doesn't make the revisions fun, but does usually make them straightforward.
And on that note, my novel revisions are done, and the novel is back off to my agents!
So I can slack for a week and then get back to the next thing.
Ya'll are going to war over this single opinion that was *checks*... 4 pages back. You guys good?
It's amazing how gamers say: like what you like but the moment you say something that's not popular they treat you utter garbage. The Dragon Age fanbase is among the worst when it comes to this.
LOL,
Personally, the Athem fanbois were obnoxiously loud if someone posted negative comments.
Metacritis users finally woke up and demand quality games at launch. DICE, though, failed to read the "beware the players" notes for their recent 2042 title. I'm hoping Boi's management learned from past mistakes. Also hoping the EA suits demand quality at launch as well.
(◔‿◔)
__________
Morpheus: "know what happened happened and that it could not have happened in any other way".
Patrick Weekes @patrickweekes One of the most difficult but also vital parts of professional writing (at BioWare or in novels) is taking feedback that you don't initially agree with and figuring out what to do with it.
It's easy (so, so, SO easy) to say that you should ignore feedback you disagree with. But it's usually a bad idea.
The people giving the feedback aren't always right, but they always had a point. I'd rather hear about a problem from editors, while there's time to fix it.
But I've also seen what happens when someone takes every note from every source and does exactly what every note suggests. You get a pile of mush with all the interesting bits filed off. It's safe, inoffensive, and forgettable, most of the time.
Being a professional writer means figuring out that balance -- listening well enough to take feedback and make changes, while still believing in yourself and your work enough to stay true to your vision.
I am fortunate that both at work and in novel writing, the vast majority of the feedback I receive is the kind that makes me wince and go, "Argh, I was hoping nobody would notice that, but yeah, fair."
Doesn't make the revisions fun, but does usually make them straightforward.
And on that note, my novel revisions are done, and the novel is back off to my agents!
So I can slack for a week and then get back to the next thing.
Not sure I really agree with Weekes. Changing based on feedback that points out things you actually agree with/hadn’t thought of I get. lacking courage of your convictions and convincing yourself to make changes you don’t agree with seems bad regardless of if it’s 10% mush or 100% mush.
Not sure I really agree with Weekes. Changing based on feedback that points out things you actually agree with/hadn’t thought of I get. lacking courage of your convictions and convincing yourself to make changes you don’t agree with seems bad regardless of if it’s 10% mush or 100% mush.
I'm ambivalent, because, on the one hand, you should write what you want, but on the other hand, we're not infallible. So there is a good chance what we produce is just not that good. It's why we have editors, for the most part. And if you really want something that you've written, but it just doesn't work, then you gotta make it work. And that's the part where you gotta get creative. Otherwise, you end up with flawed works, like the Star Wars prequels, or, heaven forbid, entirely unwatchable messes, like the Last Jedi.
When I die, I want Bioware to carry my casket, so they can let me down, one last time.
It's amazing how gamers say: like what you like but the moment you say something that's not popular they treat you utter garbage. The Dragon Age fanbase is among the worst when it comes to this.
LOL,
Personally, the Athem fanbois were obnoxiously loud if someone posted negative comments.
Metacritis users finally woke up and demand quality games at launch. DICE, though, failed to read the "beware the players" notes for their recent 2042 title. I'm hoping Boi's management learned from past mistakes. Also hoping the EA suits demand quality at launch as well.
(◔‿◔)
__________
Metacritic seriously? The people who just review bomb games they don't like?
Patrick Weekes @patrickweekes One of the most difficult but also vital parts of professional writing (at BioWare or in novels) is taking feedback that you don't initially agree with and figuring out what to do with it.
It's easy (so, so, SO easy) to say that you should ignore feedback you disagree with. But it's usually a bad idea.
The people giving the feedback aren't always right, but they always had a point. I'd rather hear about a problem from editors, while there's time to fix it.
But I've also seen what happens when someone takes every note from every source and does exactly what every note suggests. You get a pile of mush with all the interesting bits filed off. It's safe, inoffensive, and forgettable, most of the time.
Being a professional writer means figuring out that balance -- listening well enough to take feedback and make changes, while still believing in yourself and your work enough to stay true to your vision.
I am fortunate that both at work and in novel writing, the vast majority of the feedback I receive is the kind that makes me wince and go, "Argh, I was hoping nobody would notice that, but yeah, fair."
Doesn't make the revisions fun, but does usually make them straightforward.
And on that note, my novel revisions are done, and the novel is back off to my agents!
So I can slack for a week and then get back to the next thing.
Not sure I really agree with Weekes. Changing based on feedback that points out things you actually agree with/hadn’t thought of I get. lacking courage of your convictions and convincing yourself to make changes you don’t agree with seems bad regardless of if it’s 10% mush or 100% mush.
Huh... no, it's not
I have to admit, as someone who creates stuff, I am weirded out by the whole 10% and 100% thing... How do you determine what is 10% and what is 100%? And how do you determine how a given advice influences given work, among a myriad other factors? How do you know the state of mind of a creator and how you can possibly know if, or when they 'lacked courage of convictions' when they've made changes based on feedback??? ...What if their conviction IS that they want to craft their work based on someone's input, including one that they're not crazy about, even if only initially? It also takes courage to introspect and sometimes kill your darlings, you know?
I'm also mystified with the idea that one can have only two stances on given feedback - either agree with it or not. Like... wut? I can't have mixed feelings on it? See the point, but wonder if there's better implementation than one that is suggested? See what I can discard and what I can keep? Etc, etc, etc?
Anyway, I know from my own experience that advice that I didn't always like sometimes turned out to be good in hindsight, and sometimes solutions I liked or agreed with eventually turned out to be a dead end - and I'm pretty sure most people know this too. Like... how do you grow - in any field - if all you do is you change things based only on feedback you agree with? What about challenging oneself? Getting out of one's comfort zone? Yes, that often can come from grappling with things one doesn't necessarily likes.
So to me, the statement above is no less absolutist than the recent 'console spec limitations are BAD for gaming at all times' only it's 'if the author cedes control over one's creative vision in any form, then it's ALWAYS bad, regardless of context'.
I've seen this sentiment rear its head in different forms - and to me, this has always been a very shallow understanding of creative process. Creating art is a form of communication - a two way street. It's a balancing act that can have great complexity - and we don't always get it right, or 100% right, because we're only humans. But with enough experience and maturity one can get more hits than misses. And yes, that can involve heeding advice we don't always jive with.
To say that it's always bad is... uh... like, you seem to be against creators 'caving' to make changes they may not always agree with in some respects, while this is nothing more than DICTATING what you think creators should do, by saying that some of the methods they choose to do their craft is ALWAYS bad, even if the way to measure the thing or its influence on the final product is pretty much wholly arbitrary
That's the most bizarre thing I've noticed. People who usually are very preoccupied with author's 'courage of convictions' usually are the quickest to tell us what we SHOULD do, or tell us that the way we ultimately chooseto do something is bad, whether because of some misguided understanding of creative process, or because they just don't personally like what the author is doing.
Last Edit: Oct 22, 2021 1:42:45 GMT by midnight tea
“The cosmos is within us. We are made of star-stuff. We are a way for the universe to know itself.”
Patrick Weekes @patrickweekes Reminder that @eplerjc @karinweekes @sherylchee and Sylvia “Suspended from Twitter for Unnecessary Roughness” Feketekuty will be raising money for Food Banks Canada this Saturday at 4PM Mountain Time!
Sylvia’s unflappable, Sheryl’s hilarious, Karin’s delightful, Epler’s swole, and I’m willing to look like a giant doofus, so please donate, and please join us!
Emily C Taylor 💉💉 pentapod Starting to suspect I’m in the running for “most annoying questions asked to the writing team in the course of making a single game”. I wonder if they’ve ever given out awards? Sounds like something that should be part of a launch day celebration 😄
Emily C Taylor 💉💉 pentapod "For example, you can't just ask for a dog if we don't already have a dog planned." "We can just slap the dog model on the elf rig and it'll be fine!" #overheardintheoffice #gamedev
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda Posts: 1,600 Likes: 6,889
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Emily C Taylor 💉💉 pentapod "For example, you can't just ask for a dog if we don't already have a dog planned." "We can just slap the dog model on the elf rig and it'll be fine!" #overheardintheoffice #gamedev
David Mergele @elegrem Hold my coffee...
This is going to be Ser Noodle the horse all over again ...
Patrick Weekes @patrickweekes One of the most difficult but also vital parts of professional writing (at BioWare or in novels) is taking feedback that you don't initially agree with and figuring out what to do with it.
It's easy (so, so, SO easy) to say that you should ignore feedback you disagree with. But it's usually a bad idea.
The people giving the feedback aren't always right, but they always had a point. I'd rather hear about a problem from editors, while there's time to fix it.
But I've also seen what happens when someone takes every note from every source and does exactly what every note suggests. You get a pile of mush with all the interesting bits filed off. It's safe, inoffensive, and forgettable, most of the time.
Being a professional writer means figuring out that balance -- listening well enough to take feedback and make changes, while still believing in yourself and your work enough to stay true to your vision.
I am fortunate that both at work and in novel writing, the vast majority of the feedback I receive is the kind that makes me wince and go, "Argh, I was hoping nobody would notice that, but yeah, fair."
Doesn't make the revisions fun, but does usually make them straightforward.
And on that note, my novel revisions are done, and the novel is back off to my agents!
So I can slack for a week and then get back to the next thing.
Not sure I really agree with Weekes. Changing based on feedback that points out things you actually agree with/hadn’t thought of I get. lacking courage of your convictions and convincing yourself to make changes you don’t agree with seems bad regardless of if it’s 10% mush or 100% mush.
When speaking in generals, it's hard to really comment on what they say, though. Is the criticism about themes? Is it about wording? Is it about adding some extra stuff for clarity or taking some stuff out to reduce padding? Examples and context are everything in a discussion like this. Certain things, sure, you shouldn't compromise on, like themes, but stuff that improves pacing or adds clarity is always something to consider. As a creator of anything, the thing you create is your baby and it might seem like that big bad critic/editor is just massacring your boy but, more often than not, especially if they're professionals, the suggestions and criticisms are coming from a place of trying to help you improve. If you don't agree or you still have questions, you just talk it out, explain, see where they're coming from and go from there.
I mean what if the critics are in are arguing in bad faith? An author should learn when to weed out that kind of criticism.
Well, like they're saying, it's a balancing act. You don't dismiss something you don't like out of principle just because you don't like it/disagree with it, but give it its due consideration. If it's something that turns out to help, why not consider going with it? If it turns out it doesn't help or it's just trolling, then you can disregard it. Bad faith criticism isn't always obvious so it's easy sometimes to lump in anything you don't agree with in the bad faith category and move on but, ultimately, I find that kind of mindset limits you as a creator in the long run.
Ashes to ashes, dust to dust Life's a b***h and beer's a must
Yeah but one should criticize the critic, especially if their critiques either miss the point the author's making or is just criticizing things that aren't there.
Matthew Goldman @sergoldman This is a very cute drawing and proof that animation, posture and gesture, even a single frame, can breathe life into an art work. Thanks for giving me a smile @baiyun_cat
Yeah but one should criticize the critic, especially if their critiques either miss the point the author's making or is just criticizing things that aren't there.
Well, of course. As in all things, conversation is key. Since Patrick specifically mentioned editors, that's what happens. You don't send a manuscript to your editor, get it back filled with revisions and suggestions and you decide whether to change stuff or not and that's the end. That's why it takes a long time to edit a book before publishing, going back and forth with the editor. That's the way feedback and criticism is, or rather, should be discussed in all areas, as well. I know the internet doesn't usually agree with that approach because it's the internet and it discourages genuine conversations, especially if you try having said conversation in an environment that isn't conducive to lengthy discussions that such a topic would need (yes, I'm sub-tweeting Twitter ), but a balanced approach is in all regards the best way to start. Don't think you're infallible and also don't think your critic is infallible, either. Likewise, the critic shouldn't they're infallible and they also shouldn't think the person whose work they're criticizing is infallible, either. Sounds really nice but that's why it's the ideal.
Ashes to ashes, dust to dust Life's a b***h and beer's a must
Yeah but one should criticize the critic, especially if their critiques either miss the point the author's making or is just criticizing things that aren't there.
Wow. Dismissive much?
By all means, don't dispute the alternate opinion, but rather shoot the messenger.
John Epler @eplerjc: Having been in this industry for a while, one thing has proven out, time and time again. Success belongs to the team, and failure belongs to leadership. No game is a one-person show, or even close.
Emily C Taylor pentapod "Okay, so my hair is in a different part of the level from my head, yet still connected to my head. This is not good..." #overheardintheoffice #gamedev
Emily C Taylor pentapod "Okay, so my hair is in a different part of the level from my head, yet still connected to my head. This is not good..." #overheardintheoffice #gamedev