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Post by smilesja on Jun 3, 2022 5:01:30 GMT
Was Knight Enchanter like a balanced Arcane Warrior? I don't remember......
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Post by Grog Muffins on Jun 3, 2022 5:33:08 GMT
Ah, I see. Not a fan of that at all, though it would be better than how a lot of other media's been going lately where atrocities are treated as good things and the person committing them was the true victim (I still expect this in DAD). But I see what you mean now. The sympathetic villain trope has become much more common in recent media, including in games like The Witcher 3 (as it was with the Bloody Baron questline), Assassins Creed Odyssey/Valhalla, as well as the more recent Marvel Movies. Problem is, I think people see this type of character design as more worthwhile for storytelling, when you can have just as well told an enemy faction who fits the role of a wholly malicious force. Take, for example, The Hive in Destiny. Through multiple character interactions and lore books surrounding their race, they became much more fleshed out as an enemy faction. This included details surrounding how they existed on their homework (Fundament), how they ultimately came to be servants of the Worm Gods/Darkness, and the motivations of their leaders who are essentially demigods in their own right. I wish we could go back to this style of storytelling, as it was basically what the Darkspawn embodied. Thing is, an antagonist who is malicious just for the sake of being malicious is not really compelling from a storytelling perspective. A villain that commits heinous acts just because it's Atrocity Tuesday is not a good villain - they may be fun in a campy, scenery chewing way, but it's pure fluff with no substance. People don't work that way, making a motivation for why a character does something is not a way to minimize their bad behavior, it's writing a complex and realistic character. Even agents of chaos still have some motivation behind their actions. That is in relation to individualistic characters, as for the hivemind-like enemies, I don't think we're in danger of having the Darkspawn be different than they were. It's just that they weren't the main antagonists in DA2 and DAI. If in DAD the Darkspawn will be coming to the foreground again, we may get more insight into them outside of the Codex. Awakening showed that giving them individualism didn't work out all that well for all of them, maybe it would be better for them to continue being a hivemind, it would just depend on who ends up in control.
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Post by DragonKingReborn on Jun 3, 2022 6:03:32 GMT
The sympathetic villain trope has become much more common in recent media, including in games like The Witcher 3 (as it was with the Bloody Baron questline), Assassins Creed Odyssey/Valhalla, as well as the more recent Marvel Movies. Problem is, I think people see this type of character design as more worthwhile for storytelling, when you can have just as well told an enemy faction who fits the role of a wholly malicious force. Take, for example, The Hive in Destiny. Through multiple character interactions and lore books surrounding their race, they became much more fleshed out as an enemy faction. This included details surrounding how they existed on their homework (Fundament), how they ultimately came to be servants of the Worm Gods/Darkness, and the motivations of their leaders who are essentially demigods in their own right. I wish we could go back to this style of storytelling, as it was basically what the Darkspawn embodied. Thing is, an antagonist who is malicious just for the sake of being malicious is not really compelling from a storytelling perspective. A villain that commits heinous acts just because it's Atrocity Tuesday is not a good villain - they may be fun in a campy, scenery chewing way, but it's pure fluff with no substance. People don't work that way, making a motivation for why a character does something is not a way to minimize their bad behavior, it's writing a complex and realistic character. Even agents of chaos still have some motivation behind their actions. That is in relation to individualistic characters, as for the hivemind-like enemies, I don't think we're in danger of having the Darkspawn be different than they were. It's just that they weren't the main antagonists in DA2 and DAI. If in DAD the Darkspawn will be coming to the foreground again, we may get more insight into them outside of the Codex. Awakening showed that giving them individualism didn't work out all that well for all of them, maybe it would be better for them to continue being a hivemind, it would just depend on who ends up in control. Is Atrocity Tuesday going to be a thing from now on? Because I kind of like that idea. But you’re right, of course. The bad guys are the heroes of the other side. The difference comes from the point at which the end stops justifying the means.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 3, 2022 6:18:17 GMT
The sympathetic villain trope has become much more common in recent media, including in games like The Witcher 3 (as it was with the Bloody Baron questline), Assassins Creed Odyssey/Valhalla, as well as the more recent Marvel Movies. Problem is, I think people see this type of character design as more worthwhile for storytelling, when you can have just as well told an enemy faction who fits the role of a wholly malicious force. Take, for example, The Hive in Destiny. Through multiple character interactions and lore books surrounding their race, they became much more fleshed out as an enemy faction. This included details surrounding how they existed on their homework (Fundament), how they ultimately came to be servants of the Worm Gods/Darkness, and the motivations of their leaders who are essentially demigods in their own right. I wish we could go back to this style of storytelling, as it was basically what the Darkspawn embodied. Thing is, an antagonist who is malicious just for the sake of being malicious is not really compelling from a storytelling perspective. A villain that commits heinous acts just because it's Atrocity Tuesday is not a good villain - they may be fun in a campy, scenery chewing way, but it's pure fluff with no substance. People don't work that way, making a motivation for why a character does something is not a way to minimize their bad behavior, it's writing a complex and realistic character. Even agents of chaos still have some motivation behind their actions. I agree. I have no qualms with sympathetic villains. My complaint they were responding to is more and more there are stories that are going too far and making them not just sympathetic but trying to portray them as the true hero or victim. They mentioned the MCU, so an example from that is Wanda in WandaVision. Woman enslaved and tortured a town of innocent people, yet at the end it has the gall to make her the real victim with stuff like the whole “they’ll never know what you gave up for them.” There are examples like this in anime too, like Itachi and Obito in Naruto or Eren Yeager in Attack on Titan. These people slaughter thousands of innocents, or billions in the last case, yet all the other protagonists see them not as the monsters they are but as good people thanking them for all the suffering they experienced to help the ones they care for, completely brushing away the actual victims.
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Post by Grog Muffins on Jun 3, 2022 6:23:54 GMT
Is Atrocity Tuesday going to be a thing from now on? Because I kind of like that idea. But you’re right, of course. The bad guys are the heroes of the other side. The difference comes from the point at which the end stops justifying the means. Feel free to use it, I was feeling sassy this morning. Yep, you can understand why a villain does something because you're a human capable of empathy and compassion while at the same time holding them accountable for their actions because you're a human capable of empathy and compassion for their victims. It's why I love Emet-Selch in FFXIV, I get the pain he's in but I also can't overlook the vile things he's done. I want Solas to make me feel like I get him because at this point, all I see of him is an old man who took a nap and, after waking up, started complaining his grandkids moved the furniture around. I guess that's motivation enough, but it ain't exactly compelling to me.
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Post by Grog Muffins on Jun 3, 2022 6:33:46 GMT
Thing is, an antagonist who is malicious just for the sake of being malicious is not really compelling from a storytelling perspective. A villain that commits heinous acts just because it's Atrocity Tuesday is not a good villain - they may be fun in a campy, scenery chewing way, but it's pure fluff with no substance. People don't work that way, making a motivation for why a character does something is not a way to minimize their bad behavior, it's writing a complex and realistic character. Even agents of chaos still have some motivation behind their actions. I agree. I have no qualms with sympathetic villains. My complaint they were responding to is more and more there are stories that are going too far and making them not just sympathetic but trying to portray them as the true hero or victim. They mentioned the MCU, so an example from that is Wanda in WandaVision. Woman enslaved and tortured a town of innocent people, yet at the end it has the gall to make her the real victim with stuff like the whole “they’ll never know what you gave up for them.” There are examples like this in anime too, like Itachi and Obito in Naruto or Eren Yeager in Attack on Titan. These people slaughter thousands of innocents, or billions in the last case, yet all the other protagonists see them not as the monsters they are but as good people thanking them for all the suffering they experienced to help the ones they care for, completely brushing away the actual victims. Bruh, I am so behind on a lot of pop-media nowadays. I've seen only a handful of episodes of Attack on Titan (probably read more of the manga than seen the anime but Eren's basement was still a mystery when I stopped), stopped watching Naruto during The Great Filler Exodus (I only barely remember some Sasuke forgiveness for Itachi because complicated brotherly love influenced by Eastern Asian mentality of familial piety and I have no idea what Obito did)..... The only thing I do know is the Wanda thing and I agree it was cringe and a big old wtf at the time.
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Post by smilesja on Jun 3, 2022 6:41:05 GMT
The sympathetic villain trope has become much more common in recent media, including in games like The Witcher 3 (as it was with the Bloody Baron questline), Assassins Creed Odyssey/Valhalla, as well as the more recent Marvel Movies. Problem is, I think people see this type of character design as more worthwhile for storytelling, when you can have just as well told an enemy faction who fits the role of a wholly malicious force. Take, for example, The Hive in Destiny. Through multiple character interactions and lore books surrounding their race, they became much more fleshed out as an enemy faction. This included details surrounding how they existed on their homework (Fundament), how they ultimately came to be servants of the Worm Gods/Darkness, and the motivations of their leaders who are essentially demigods in their own right. I wish we could go back to this style of storytelling, as it was basically what the Darkspawn embodied. Thing is, an antagonist who is malicious just for the sake of being malicious is not really compelling from a storytelling perspective. A villain that commits heinous acts just because it's Atrocity Tuesday is not a good villain - they may be fun in a campy, scenery chewing way, but it's pure fluff with no substance. People don't work that way, making a motivation for why a character does something is not a way to minimize their bad behavior, it's writing a complex and realistic character. Even agents of chaos still have some motivation behind their actions. That is in relation to individualistic characters, as for the hivemind-like enemies, I don't think we're in danger of having the Darkspawn be different than they were. It's just that they weren't the main antagonists in DA2 and DAI. If in DAD the Darkspawn will be coming to the foreground again, we may get more insight into them outside of the Codex. Awakening showed that giving them individualism didn't work out all that well for all of them, maybe it would be better for them to continue being a hivemind, it would just depend on who ends up in control. For villains, I think there's a difference between having a sympathetic backstory and actually being sympathetic. That's something writers fumble with. Something I did like in Awakening was that just because you can give a Darkspawn sentience doesn't mean they'll begin the path of good. If anything, many of them just become worse because they were broken off the hive mind.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 3, 2022 6:46:12 GMT
I agree. I have no qualms with sympathetic villains. My complaint they were responding to is more and more there are stories that are going too far and making them not just sympathetic but trying to portray them as the true hero or victim. They mentioned the MCU, so an example from that is Wanda in WandaVision. Woman enslaved and tortured a town of innocent people, yet at the end it has the gall to make her the real victim with stuff like the whole “they’ll never know what you gave up for them.” There are examples like this in anime too, like Itachi and Obito in Naruto or Eren Yeager in Attack on Titan. These people slaughter thousands of innocents, or billions in the last case, yet all the other protagonists see them not as the monsters they are but as good people thanking them for all the suffering they experienced to help the ones they care for, completely brushing away the actual victims. Bruh, I am so behind on a lot of pop-media nowadays. I've seen only a handful of episodes of Attack on Titan (probably read more of the manga than seen the anime but Eren's basement was still a mystery when I stopped), stopped watching Naruto during The Great Filler Exodus (I only barely remember some Sasuke forgiveness for Itachi because complicated brotherly love influenced by Eastern Asian mentality of familial piety and I have no idea what Obito did)..... The only thing I do know is the Wanda thing and I agree it was cringe and a big old wtf at the time. For Eren, basically he commits genocide on everyone not on the island. The others try to stop him, but he still kills 80% of the global population. After they stop him, they get a message about why he did what he did (which they already knew before going to stop him) and then go on to thank him for murdering billions of innocent people to protect their people from being wiped out. And the surviving 20% are forced to just accept it and not retaliate. Yep, the series ends with a pro-genocide message. And yeah, Obito is basically the same as Itachi, but with Kakashi and Naruto forgiving him for murdering thousands of innocent people including those they love like Naruto's parents. Yeah, I hated that with WandaVision. Wanda was not the one who lost the most by giving up her imaginary husband and kids. It was the hundreds of people whose minds and bodies were taken from them to the point they begged for death rather than going back. And apparently the Dr. Strange 2 movie even adds to this. I fear the same kind of story is going to happen with Solas. He's going to commit atrocities, even if his planned global genocide never comes to pass, yet it'll act like he was the true victim suffering in this world. And how we should forgive and accept his actions.
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N5
Agent 46
Clearance Level Ultra
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: ALoneGretchin
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Post by Gileadan on Jun 3, 2022 9:26:56 GMT
I just realized that DAI was very green, now this is very purple. They've basically announced the background lighting colour of DAD's character generator.
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Post by gervaise21 on Jun 3, 2022 10:18:17 GMT
Corinne Busche 🏳️⚧️ @corinnebuscheI just finished a Knight Enchater run, a build which I’d never played before and really enjoyed it as well! Such a great power fantasy for a mage to rush in with Spirit Blade I assume this means she has been playing DAI as a Knight Enchanter and, since she hadn't played that build before, does that mean she wanted to educate herself to how it should work ready for play-testing the next game? I do hope so because I found Knight Enchanter a blast to play, even though it was ridiculously overpowered. Honestly, I should not have been able to take down the high dragons in the Emprise du Lion single handed (because my companions had been knocked out and I couldn't be bothered to revive them). Was Knight Enchanter like a balanced Arcane Warrior? I don't remember...... It was a revamped Arcane Warrior. In DAO the build allowed you to use your magic score to equip non-mage armour and weapons and certain other defense benefits. In DAI it allowed you to equip a light sabre and utilise magic in your defense than essentially meant you regenerated barrier every time it was hit, so you were virtually impregnable. It was great.
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Post by gervaise21 on Jun 3, 2022 10:35:06 GMT
I fear the ignorance being forced on us, to pretend we don't know what has already been revealed, and being unable to act on what we (the players) do know. It wouldn't be the first time they have done this. Every time they use a cut scene to show an event that the player cannot possibly know about, they break our immersion as the PC. They first did it in DAO with introducing Zevran, although it only took as far as our encounter with him to bring our PC up to speed about who his employer was. To be honest, I never saw the need for that cut scene and we would have lost nothing in leaving it out. Now the epilogue to DAI is more serious because, even with Trespasser, we still know more than the Inquisitor, let alone the new PC. Unless that confrontation with Flemeth/Mythal is ultimately going to be forgotten by the writers, that is a surprise waiting in store for our new hero. People may have noticed that I am somewhat obsessive in memorising the lore of Thedas and this continually comes back to bite me when they see fit to deviate from what we have previously been told. So I will do my best to erase my memory for the next game and approach it as though I was a new player, so I can immerse myself properly in my new hero, and hope they don't pull any more cut scenes that ruin this approach in game.
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Solas
N5
blep mlem mlem
ratlobster banger
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Solas on Jun 3, 2022 10:42:18 GMT
I'm so excited let's fucken gooooooo
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Post by TabithaTH on Jun 3, 2022 10:56:13 GMT
Looks like Solas got a makeover .
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Post by gervaise21 on Jun 3, 2022 11:00:38 GMT
I fear the same kind of story is going to happen with Solas. He's going to commit atrocities, even if his planned global genocide never comes to pass, yet it'll act like he was the true victim suffering in this world. And how we should forgive and accept his actions. To some extent they already did this in Trespasser but at least they gave the option of rejecting this view. Part of my problem with even offering the redeem option was that the only person who can redeem Solas is Solas himself, by rejecting his plan for global genocide. Then there was the way it was translated into the words they put in your mouth: "I'm going to prove you wrong." What about? He already admits he knows the consequences of his action. That he can save the elves without doing this? Well, he's already admitted to denying me information that could help me. Besides, that still wouldn't redeem him because he was still willing to take his previous action despite the predicted outcome for the majority of Thedas; he'd merely changed his mind about the means of accomplishing his aims. Then in the epilogue they declare they are going to save their friend from himself, so the focus is on saving Solas and saving the world is just a by-product of this. I feel that the emphasis should really have been the other way round. So something along the lines of "we are going to save the world from Solas and if possible save him from himself", as opposed to the other option which was to stop him by any means necessary. Although in truth that is only a difference in nuance. The important part is that saving the world and its people is the priority. To be honest, I find his constant apologies to the Inquisitor are wearing rather thin and prefer his attitude when speaking with an Inquisitor who was not his friend/lover. That to me shows the real Dread Wolf persona. It is one aspect where having a new PC with no prior acquaintance might be preferable as he won't feel the need to apologise to them for his previous betrayal. I often wish we could have said back to him in Trespasser the words he says to Dorian: "If you are really sorry for the past, then free the slaves of all races". Now I'll admit that would probably result in a fair bit of bloodshed as a result but at least not the destruction of the whole world.
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Post by Walter Black on Jun 3, 2022 13:45:30 GMT
Thing is, an antagonist who is malicious just for the sake of being malicious is not really compelling from a storytelling perspective. A villain that commits heinous acts just because it's Atrocity Tuesday is not a good villain - they may be fun in a campy, scenery chewing way, but it's pure fluff with no substance. People don't work that way, making a motivation for why a character does something is not a way to minimize their bad behavior, it's writing a complex and realistic character. Even agents of chaos still have some motivation behind their actions. I agree. I have no qualms with sympathetic villains. My complaint they were responding to is more and more there are stories that are going too far and making them not just sympathetic but trying to portray them as the true hero or victim. They mentioned the MCU, so an example from that is Wanda in WandaVision. Woman enslaved and tortured a town of innocent people, yet at the end it has the gall to make her the real victim with stuff like the whole “they’ll never know what you gave up for them.” There are examples like this in anime too, like Itachi and Obito in Naruto or Eren Yeager in Attack on Titan. These people slaughter thousands of innocents, or billions in the last case, yet all the other protagonists see them not as the monsters they are but as good people thanking them for all the suffering they experienced to help the ones they care for, completely brushing away the actual victims. Still can't get over that one. There was absolutely no good reason that Agatha and/or the Darkhold couldn't have been responsible for all the worst of Westview, especially since Wanda was being used anyway. Not to mention that Mordo and/or Evil Steve could have given Stephen some actual development as MoM's primary antagonist, as opposed to being a passenger in his own movie. But Wanda Maximoff was ruined because...reasons? Marvel couldn't let her compete with Dr.Strange's brand? Or Carol Danvers as the most powerful MCU female? Because the writers couldn't reconcile a powerful woman simultaneously struggling with various traumas, instead of simply shrugging them off or going mental? Because DARK PHEONIX was so "cool and edgy", so let's do that again? Maybe future writers could fix the Scarlet Witch by saying it was the Darkhold or 616 Wanda got possessed by an evil variant. But as the character stands now, it is a betrayal of her history and sad waste of potential.
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N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Prime Posts: 4392
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Post by Sanunes on Jun 3, 2022 13:49:11 GMT
Yeah, I can see why that’s a problem for you. For me, having him as a bait and switch would be an issue, but I was also one that would’ve been perfectly fine with the Inquisitor back as a protagonist. I get your point on Cory-2, although I don’t think it’s necessarily out of the question for him to be nuanced…but we can only wait and see at this point. It’d have definitely be easier to do that with the Inquisitor. My point was more about him being actually a dangerous antagonist, which Corypheus kind of stopped being after Haven.
Dragon Age: Dreadwolf
Is this the new title? 'Cause I don't like it.
(◔‿◔) ______________________
I don't see how. There's no way the new protagonist will have an entire game's worth, or a year and a half in-universe time, of developing a bond with him as either a comrade, friend, or lover. And Solas has seemingly sworn off that persona now that his plan is underway. So the only Solas the new protagonist will experience is the one of a man who plans to genocide millions. Not much room for nuance there.
Not a fan of the name myself, especially with it being a single word. That's just seem silly since Dread Wolf has always been 2 words. What's the point of changing it now?
My biggest concern with the protag likely not being the Inquisitor again is that we, the players, will know way more about what's going on than the PC will. This was bad enough just in Trespasser knowing Solas was really Fen'harel while the Inq and everyone else had no clue until the very end. I'm not looking forward to playing an entire game where I have more info than the PC does. All it does is breed frustration when you know your PC is making a huge mistake but have no way to stop them from making it because they don't know any better. If I don't know any better either, then bad choices are on me, but I fear the ignorance being forced on us, to pretend we don't know what has already been revealed, and being unable to act on what we (the players) do know.
Its so little information I am pretty sure BioWare will insert it at the beginning of the game for the characters to know and to bring new players up to speed. For it really isn't much that we know so if they have Solas doing something at the very start of the game there could be a quick conversation between the new protagonist and the Inquisitor and they will be all caught up.
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N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Prime Posts: 4392
Prime Likes: 882
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Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on Jun 3, 2022 13:51:30 GMT
I agree. I have no qualms with sympathetic villains. My complaint they were responding to is more and more there are stories that are going too far and making them not just sympathetic but trying to portray them as the true hero or victim. They mentioned the MCU, so an example from that is Wanda in WandaVision. Woman enslaved and tortured a town of innocent people, yet at the end it has the gall to make her the real victim with stuff like the whole “they’ll never know what you gave up for them.” There are examples like this in anime too, like Itachi and Obito in Naruto or Eren Yeager in Attack on Titan. These people slaughter thousands of innocents, or billions in the last case, yet all the other protagonists see them not as the monsters they are but as good people thanking them for all the suffering they experienced to help the ones they care for, completely brushing away the actual victims. Still can't get over that one. There was absolutely no good reason that Agatha and/or the Darkhold couldn't have been responsible for all the worst of Westview, especially since Wanda was being used anyway. Not to mention that Mordo and/or Evil Steve could have given Stephen some actual development as MoM's primary antagonist, as opposed to being a passenger in his own movie. But Wanda Maximoff was ruined because...reasons? Marvel couldn't let her compete with Dr.Strange's brand? Or Carol Danvers as the most powerful MCU female? Because the writers couldn't reconcile a powerful woman simultaneously struggling with various traumas, instead of simply shrugging them or going mental? Because DARK PHEONIX was so "cool and edgy", so let's do that again? Maybe future writers could fix the Scarlet Witch by saying it was the Darkhold or 616 Wanda got possessed by an evil variant. But as the character stands now, it is a betrayal of her history and waste of potential. I think Marvel right now is having the same problem DC did back with the Snyder movies. They don't know how to put things together so it has become the rule of cool. I have been having issues with the majority of Marvel movies since they started phase 4. Now I am not sure if its because of issues around the pandemic or they don't know how to incorporate Disney+, but the releases have been pretty lackluster so far.
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Post by QuizzyBunny on Jun 3, 2022 13:57:43 GMT
I feel like I'm veering off topic, but Wanda's MCU story comes from her most famous storyline in which she desired a normal life and "created" her children (with some outside demonic "help" she wasn't aware of) and then was made to forget about them when their true nature was revealed and they were "killed". Once she remembered them the trauma of everything she experienced led her to utter the infamous words "No more mutants", erasing most of them from reality and essentially creating a new world.
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Post by azarhal on Jun 3, 2022 14:00:35 GMT
DAD The first thing that came to my mind is that I'm not going to be able to google search the next Dragon Age game with only 3 letters/numbers. DAO, DA2 and DAI works perfectly. DAD is going to return a bunch totally unrelated things and persons. Was Knight Enchanter like a balanced Arcane Warrior? I don't remember...... Lorewise, Knight Enchanter is a Chantry/Circle version of the Elven Arcane Warrior, but gameplay wise it is quite different. Also, balanced isn't the term I would use, it's the most OP spec in DAI, even after the nerf. A tank with a nuke.
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Post by Cyberstrike on Jun 3, 2022 14:13:02 GMT
I agree. I have no qualms with sympathetic villains. My complaint they were responding to is more and more there are stories that are going too far and making them not just sympathetic but trying to portray them as the true hero or victim. They mentioned the MCU, so an example from that is Wanda in WandaVision. Woman enslaved and tortured a town of innocent people, yet at the end it has the gall to make her the real victim with stuff like the whole “they’ll never know what you gave up for them.” There are examples like this in anime too, like Itachi and Obito in Naruto or Eren Yeager in Attack on Titan. These people slaughter thousands of innocents, or billions in the last case, yet all the other protagonists see them not as the monsters they are but as good people thanking them for all the suffering they experienced to help the ones they care for, completely brushing away the actual victims. Still can't get over that one. There was absolutely no good reason that Agatha and/or the Darkhold couldn't have been responsible for all the worst of Westview, especially since Wanda was being used anyway. Not to mention that Mordo and/or Evil Steve could have given Stephen some actual development as MoM's primary antagonist, as opposed to being a passenger in his own movie. But Wanda Maximoff was ruined because...reasons? Marvel couldn't let her compete with Dr.Strange's brand? Or Carol Danvers as the most powerful MCU female? Because the writers couldn't reconcile a powerful woman simultaneously struggling with various traumas, instead of simply shrugging them off or going mental? Because DARK PHEONIX was so "cool and edgy", so let's do that again? Maybe future writers could fix the Scarlet Witch by saying it was the Darkhold or 616 Wanda got possessed by an evil variant. But as the character stands now, it is a betrayal of her history and sad waste of potential.
Have your read any of the Marvel Comics she is even more fucked up in the comics. Her kids were blinked out of existence because of demons and her powers and the only idea that the Avengers, the X-Men, and every other superhero and villain was not to mention it and when she did finally learn the truth she destroyed the Avengers, and was so unhinged that BOTH Professor X and her father Magneto were thinking about mercy killing her then created the House of M and at the end of that she nearly wiped out all the mutants because of something Quicksilver said to her. So the MCU version is kind on point with her.
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Post by Iakus on Jun 3, 2022 16:43:06 GMT
Still can't get over that one. There was absolutely no good reason that Agatha and/or the Darkhold couldn't have been responsible for all the worst of Westview, especially since Wanda was being used anyway. Not to mention that Mordo and/or Evil Steve could have given Stephen some actual development as MoM's primary antagonist, as opposed to being a passenger in his own movie. But Wanda Maximoff was ruined because...reasons? Marvel couldn't let her compete with Dr.Strange's brand? Or Carol Danvers as the most powerful MCU female? Because the writers couldn't reconcile a powerful woman simultaneously struggling with various traumas, instead of simply shrugging them off or going mental? Because DARK PHEONIX was so "cool and edgy", so let's do that again? Maybe future writers could fix the Scarlet Witch by saying it was the Darkhold or 616 Wanda got possessed by an evil variant. But as the character stands now, it is a betrayal of her history and sad waste of potential.
Have your read any of the Marvel Comics she is even more fucked up in the comics. Her kids were blinked out of existence because of demons and her powers and the only idea that the Avengers, the X-Men, and every other superhero and villain was not to mention it and when she did finally learn the truth she destroyed the Avengers, and was so unhinged that BOTH Professor X and her father Magneto were thinking about mercy killing her then created the House of M and at the end of that she nearly wiped out all the mutants because of something Quicksilver said to her. So the MCU version is kind on point with her.
To be fair, comic-Wanda was also genuinely insane, and further was losing her grip on reality (which is especially bad when the insane person in question has the power to WARP REALITY WITH HER MIND). I read Disassembled and House of M and honestly, it's left open to interpretation just how much of what she did was her own idea, how much was subconscious, and how much was just other people taking advantage of the situation (I don't think they ever explained if that Kree warship was real or not) MCU-Wanda...still seems to know precisely what she's doing, and doesn't care.
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Post by cuthbertbeckett on Jun 3, 2022 17:11:18 GMT
huminds @humindsAll I ever wanted was apotheosis and to restore the Black City to its primordial glory @patrickweekes David Gaider @davidgaider"Dragon Age: Apotheosis" is the most metal title one could ever possibly hope for. I wish this tweet had more response because i am not gonna lie but that´s a much better title. Maybe not mainstream and bit too smart but i kinda like this. I still would prefer a title which wouldn´t be that Solas focused but Apotheosis would be worth the long wait.
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Post by QuizzyBunny on Jun 3, 2022 17:14:20 GMT
I also like that potential title more cuthbertbeckett, not that Dreadwolf is necessarily bad it just... I'm not sure, doesn't fit in as well with the previous ones? Ironically my favorite title is the one that never was - Dragon Age: Exodus. Such a nice title, I hope they can make it happen one day for a remaster/remake.
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Post by midnight tea on Jun 3, 2022 17:34:29 GMT
I also like that potential title more cuthbertbeckett , not that Dreadwolf is necessarily bad it just... I'm not sure, doesn't fit in as well with the previous ones? Ironically my favorite title is the one that never was - Dragon Age: Exodus. Such a nice title, I hope they can make it happen one day for a remaster/remake. How do the other ones fit with one another tho? Unless one knows what's in the game they seem quite random. Also, DAII notwithstanding, all past Dragon Age titles have a one-word structure - Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age: (Exodus), Dragon Age: Inquisition, Dragon Age: Dreadwolf, so I guess it's a fit in that sense. Also, Apotheosis would be a cool title, but I'd also call it a bit... spoilery? Like, if apotheosis of some sort does indeed happen.
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Post by smilesja on Jun 3, 2022 17:36:51 GMT
Can we romance Solas again?
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