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Post by theascendent on Feb 12, 2019 17:03:21 GMT
How do you guys think it will play out? Will it be a major component of the next game or something that happens offscreen and only vaguely mentioned. I am hoping for a more direct hands on involvement in the conflict. This could be a major turning point in the history of Thedas, the last time the Qunari invaded it took the combined might of nearly every nation and various irregular allies such as the Felicisma armada to stop them. I know certain members may not like the Tevinter Imperium, but if they fall the rest of Thedas is next.
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Post by Little Bengel on Feb 12, 2019 17:06:46 GMT
I just want it to play a bigger role in DA4 than the Mage-Templar War did in Inquisition.
As long as that happens, I'm a happy man.
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Post by gervaise21 on Feb 12, 2019 18:47:49 GMT
This could be a major turning point in the history of Thedas, the last time the Qunari invaded it took the combined might of nearly every nation and various irregular allies such as the Felicisma armada to stop them. I know certain members may not like the Tevinter Imperium, but if they fall the rest of Thedas is next. Last time they invaded though it was directed at a number of different places in the north. They overran Rivain pretty quickly and a fair bit of Antiva, probably due to the fact that Antiva always relied on the reputation of the Crows to keep them safe rather than keep a standing army. They also pushed on into the Freemarches. This is the bread basket of Thedas so was probably why it was so difficult to contain them at first. However, it is also true that it was the defence provided by the Tevinter Imperium that provided sufficient challenge to split their forces. So whilst I'd agree that if Tevinter falls, it would not bode well for the other nations, the fact is they have never not been at war with the Qunari and it should be remembered that the latest assault on the Tevinter mainland was Plan B so far as the Qunari were concerned, Plan A being to blow up the various leaderships in the south and take over there first. So the current war will undoubtedly complicate the efforts in locating and dealing with Solas but I dare say that it won't be world changing, whereas failing to deal with him would be.
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Post by Beerfish on Feb 12, 2019 20:00:05 GMT
Agreed this conflict is ripe for some good lore and game play. As for me? I'd like to take it to the horned devils. Create an alliance with tevinter and other areas and invade par vollen and deal out a bit of justice. (Then again I am a fan of sister Petrice. )
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Feb 12, 2019 20:07:26 GMT
I think it will be one of the two main quests while Solas will be the main main one. Sort of like how the Blight is the main quest in DAO, the stuff with Loghain was also a major questline.
I just hope we aren't forced to pick a sidfe like we were with the Mages and Templars and instead be like the Quarians and Geth where you could choose either or if you made certain choices could actually get both as allies.
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Post by leadintea on Feb 12, 2019 21:19:55 GMT
I think it will be one of the two main quests while Solas will be the main main one. Sort of like how the Blight is the main quest in DAO, the stuff with Loghain was also a major questline. I just hope we aren't forced to pick a sidfe like we were with the Mages and Templars and instead be like the Quarians and Geth where you could choose either or if you made certain choices could actually get both as allies. I think that it's going to be like this as well. I imagine DA4 to be broken up into 3 acts; the Tevinter reformation, the Tevinter-Qunari war, and the Solas plot, in that order. We'll see a bit of each plot in each act (I doubt the faction or person we back will be decided and be "in office" in Act 1, for example), but the crux of each plot would be in their individual acts.
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Post by yogsothoth on Feb 12, 2019 23:49:02 GMT
I think it will be one of the two main quests while Solas will be the main main one. Sort of like how the Blight is the main quest in DAO, the stuff with Loghain was also a major questline. I just hope we aren't forced to pick a sidfe like we were with the Mages and Templars and instead be like the Quarians and Geth where you could choose either or if you made certain choices could actually get both as allies. I think that it's going to be like this as well. I imagine DA4 to be broken up into 3 acts; the Tevinter reformation, the Tevinter-Qunari war, and the Solas plot, in that order. We'll see a bit of each plot in each act (I doubt the faction or person we back will be decided and be "in office" in Act 1, for example), but the crux of each plot would be in their individual acts. I would imagine it would be Qunari vs Tevinter first, then the reformation. The Qunari are an immediate, external threat that has already started their invasion and have successfully claimed territory. Dealing with it should be paramount, and dealing with them can serve as an explanation for how the DA4 protagonist is allowed a place at the table for any reformation discussions.
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Post by Noxluxe on Feb 13, 2019 0:08:12 GMT
I'm actually pretty excited. They're the two most intriguing and controversial cultures in Thedas left pretty much unexplored, besides the ancient kingdom of a the elven gods. I hope the game does them justice.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Feb 13, 2019 0:38:35 GMT
I'm not that concerned about the Qunari. They talk a big game about invading Thedas again, they make no secret of their plans, but they never put their money where their mouths are. The fact that they resort to subterfuge and secret missions that they can disavow if thwarted tells me that they likely do not possess the capacity to wage open war as they would obviously prefer.
I don't think the combined might of Thedas "pushed them back", I suspect it absolutely annihilated them. I think they are afraid to face the full might of Thedas head-on again. I think, barring some dramatic calamity, the eternal skirmish with Tevinter is pretty much all they can manage, and a second force joining the fight would overwhelm them.
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Post by isaidlunch on Feb 13, 2019 2:11:11 GMT
I hope that it takes up the majority of the game. I can appreciate that Thedas is a big place with many different subplots going on, but I find it hard to get invested when they're all crammed into the same game. The series is starting to value quantity over quality.
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Post by xerrai on Feb 13, 2019 5:45:40 GMT
I'm not that concerned about the Qunari. They talk a big game about invading Thedas again, they make no secret of their plans, but they never put their money where their mouths are. The fact that they resort to subterfuge and secret missions that they can disavow if thwarted tells me that they likely do not possess the capacity to wage open war as they would obviously prefer. I don't think the combined might of Thedas "pushed them back", I suspect it absolutely annihilated them. I think they are afraid to face the full might of Thedas head-on again. I think, barring some dramatic calamity, the eternal skirmish with Tevinter is pretty much all they can manage, and a second force joining the fight would overwhelm them. I don't know...seemed to me like the Qunari bit off more than they could chew. The qunari have a lot going for them: a willingness to be well-trained, religious fervor, a willingness to learn from other cultures, superior technology, etc. By all means they have the skill, wit and power to take over any nation they please and then some. But I expect that taking over an entire continent would prove troublesome even for them. Especially if Thedosians prove to be more tenacious than initially believed. They may have started unbelievably strong, but even a united qunari force can get tired if they get stretched too thin or pushed too hard.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Feb 13, 2019 6:33:51 GMT
I'm not that concerned about the Qunari. They talk a big game about invading Thedas again, they make no secret of their plans, but they never put their money where their mouths are. The fact that they resort to subterfuge and secret missions that they can disavow if thwarted tells me that they likely do not possess the capacity to wage open war as they would obviously prefer. I don't think the combined might of Thedas "pushed them back", I suspect it absolutely annihilated them. I think they are afraid to face the full might of Thedas head-on again. I think, barring some dramatic calamity, the eternal skirmish with Tevinter is pretty much all they can manage, and a second force joining the fight would overwhelm them. I don't know...seemed to me like the Qunari bit off more than they could chew. The qunari have a lot going for them: a willingness to be well-trained, religious fervor, a willingness to learn from other cultures, superior technology, etc. By all means they have the skill, wit and power to take over any nation they please and then some. But I expect that taking over an entire continent would prove troublesome even for them. Especially if Thedosians prove to be more tenacious than initially believed. They may have started unbelievably strong, but even a united qunari force can get tired if they get stretched too thin or pushed too hard. Well I can't speak to what the Qunari have, only what I've observed vs what we've been told. All I've ever seen are a lot of claims about the strength the Qunari possess, which, without firsthand evidence, could just as easily be rumours and/or posturing. It's a lot of tell without any show, and Thedas has assets enough of its own as well, hence the need to sow chaos through sabotage and assassination. Looking at a map of Thedas, I don't see how the Qunari could possibly even have the numbers to conquer the continent. Such a force would need more far more territory just to support itself. I also don't think the Qunari are all that united. They have lobotomy potion for a reason: because dissension exists. Their philosophy allows them to do some cute little mental gymnastics ("Tal Vashoth were never real Qunari in the first place, therefore we lost nothing, and remain as strong as we ever were"), but that doesn't change the observable reality that people defect from the Qun, and fairly often too, from the sound of things.
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Post by Blaze on Feb 13, 2019 8:22:27 GMT
hopefully it will play a big part in the next game. i hope that the choices we make will have an indirect effect on the outcome rather than a direct "we choose which side wins" sort of thing.
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Post by Ieldra on Feb 13, 2019 10:33:28 GMT
Agreed this conflict is ripe for some good lore and game play. As for me? I'd like to take it to the horned devils. Create an alliance with tevinter and other areas and invade par vollen and deal out a bit of justice. (Then again I am a fan of sister Petrice. ) Eh...not a fan of religious fundamentalists...but that also means I'm not a fan of the qunari. They're a political *and* an ideological enemy, and I'd like to defeat them, if not for good, then at least soundly and for the foreseeable future. The horned devils might need the Qun to keep sane (well, they're horned devils, what did you expect but a Lawful Evil ideology ), but everyone else certainly doesn't.
Meanwhile, I like Tevinter culture and I'd like to see some positive developments there so that I can ally with them without feeling too bad about it. Heck, I'll take feeling bad and ally with them anyway if it means I can stick it to the qunari, though I hope Dorian, Maevaris and their Lucerni have some success with their efforts.
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Post by Heimdall on Feb 13, 2019 15:30:32 GMT
While I hope the plot engages with the invasion, I hope it’s actually more of a background element that shapes the circumstances of the game rather than it’s resolution being a main plot point.
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Post by simit on Feb 13, 2019 16:34:10 GMT
The War could easily be a game in itself an i dont think the pursuit of Solas an his plans would warrant much interference in that pursuit so i could see them doing a W3 style with Geralts pursuit of Ciri with War raging an him seeing, and at times participating, but it actually not the center of the story, this story after all will be centered on Solas i believe, now maybe the war will play a big part in that but im guessing like Heimdall said it be more background
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Post by Andraste_Reborn on Feb 14, 2019 0:09:09 GMT
Eh...not a fan of religious fundamentalists...but that also means I'm not a fan of the qunari. They're a political *and* an ideological enemy, and I'd like to defeat them, if not for good, then at least soundly and for the foreseeable future. The horned devils might need the Qun to keep sane (well, they're horned devils, what did you expect but a Lawful Evil ideology ), but everyone else certainly doesn't. I'm pretty sure that's all Qun propaganda - Adaar does just fine without it, after all.
(Mind you, it could be like player blood mages vs. NPC blood mages, but we've seen enough Tal'Vashoth and Vashoth who are no more violent than the rest of the people of Thedas that I think it's nonsense.)
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Post by Frost on Feb 14, 2019 1:22:59 GMT
The War could easily be a game in itself an i dont think the pursuit of Solas an his plans would warrant much interference in that pursuit so i could see them doing a W3 style with Geralts pursuit of Ciri with War raging an him seeing, and at times participating, but it actually not the center of the story, this story after all will be centered on Solas i believe, now maybe the war will play a big part in that but im guessing like Heimdall said it be more background This sounds good to me. I would like the focus to be on the Solas plot.
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Post by colfoley on Feb 14, 2019 1:28:44 GMT
The War could easily be a game in itself an i dont think the pursuit of Solas an his plans would warrant much interference in that pursuit so i could see them doing a W3 style with Geralts pursuit of Ciri with War raging an him seeing, and at times participating, but it actually not the center of the story, this story after all will be centered on Solas i believe, now maybe the war will play a big part in that but im guessing like Heimdall said it be more background I really hope the opposite. I want the war with the Qun plus the Tevinter politics to be the foreground main thrust of the story while the Solas stuff happens in the background...and you will need to resolve both plotlines before continuing on.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Feb 14, 2019 2:15:04 GMT
The only thing I want to know about the Qunari is where they come from and why they left.
I REALLY want it to be that their society expelled them for being puritanical whackjobs. Lol.
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Post by Ieldra on Feb 14, 2019 6:14:59 GMT
The War could easily be a game in itself an i dont think the pursuit of Solas an his plans would warrant much interference in that pursuit so i could see them doing a W3 style with Geralts pursuit of Ciri with War raging an him seeing, and at times participating, but it actually not the center of the story, this story after all will be centered on Solas i believe, now maybe the war will play a big part in that but im guessing like Heimdall said it be more background I really hope the opposite. I want the war with the Qun plus the Tevinter politics to be the foreground main thrust of the story while the Solas stuff happens in the background...and you will need to resolve both plotlines before continuing on. Indeed so. For me the politics were nearly always the most interesting aspects of Bioware's games.
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Post by colfoley on Feb 14, 2019 7:58:19 GMT
I really hope the opposite. I want the war with the Qun plus the Tevinter politics to be the foreground main thrust of the story while the Solas stuff happens in the background...and you will need to resolve both plotlines before continuing on. Indeed so. For me the politics were nearly always the most interesting aspects of Bioware's games.
Well that is true and I certainly agree... But what I mean is I feel like that the Solas threat is, by its very nature, a high-level epic threat. Or at least in the context of the overall stories that they can tell. No matter how much I love Inquisition the Inquisitor did feel a bit...isolated sometimes I guess. So I want the DA 4 protagonist to be down in the muck and actually participating in things...hence the war and the Tevinter reform movement and our decisions in both of those will entertwine with and effect the Solas plot.
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Post by Ieldra on Feb 14, 2019 9:52:11 GMT
Indeed so. For me the politics were nearly always the most interesting aspects of Bioware's games.
Well that is true and I certainly agree... But what I mean is I feel like that the Solas threat is, by its very nature, a high-level epic threat. Or at least in the context of the overall stories that they can tell. No matter how much I love Inquisition the Inquisitor did feel a bit...isolated sometimes I guess. So I want the DA 4 protagonist to be down in the muck and actually participating in things...hence the war and the Tevinter reform movement and our decisions in both of those will entertwine with and effect the Solas plot. An interesting viewpoint. I'm somewhat at the opposite end. I think for someone like the Warden, who's always "down in the muck", it makes no sense to make decisions that affect the big picture because you lack perspective. Meanwhile, in DAI you were sort of a ruler and efforts were made to bring the big picture home to you, so it made more sense to make such decisions for the Inquisitor - which is why the Inquisitor felt *way* more believable that way than any other Bioware protagonist to date. Since I want decisions that affect the big picture, I also want a character who can be played as having a reasonable grasp of it. If isolation is the price, then so be it, though there are situations where it need not be.
So I want to be involved in the politics, but to some degree that's incompatible with being "down in the muck" all the time. You may start there, but you must get out of there eventuelly if you're going to make politics.
Meanwhile, Solas is a more philosophical problem. There are no practicalities involved here, it's a question of how you want the world to be, and if you don't want it to be like Solas wants, what you can do at all in order to prevent it. There is no strategy you can think about in advance because the problem is unprecedented. You can only react. Being pro-active is, of course, is a typical antagonist's prerogative, but I prefer an arena where I can be pro-active, too, and Tevinter politics and the war could be that.
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Post by colfoley on Feb 14, 2019 10:15:09 GMT
Well that is true and I certainly agree... But what I mean is I feel like that the Solas threat is, by its very nature, a high-level epic threat. Or at least in the context of the overall stories that they can tell. No matter how much I love Inquisition the Inquisitor did feel a bit...isolated sometimes I guess. So I want the DA 4 protagonist to be down in the muck and actually participating in things...hence the war and the Tevinter reform movement and our decisions in both of those will entertwine with and effect the Solas plot. An interesting viewpoint. I'm somewhat at the opposite end. I think for someone like the Warden, who's always "down in the muck", it makes no sense to make decisions that affect the big picture because you lack perspective. Meanwhile, in DAI you were sort of a ruler and efforts were made to bring the big picture home to you, so it made more sense to make such decisions for the Inquisitor - which is why the Inquisitor felt *way* more believable that way than any other Bioware protagonist to date. Since I want decisions that affect the big picture, I also want a character who can be played as having a reasonable grasp of it. If isolation is the price, then so be it, though there are situations where it need not be.
So I want to be involved in the politics, but to some degree that's incompatible with being "down in the muck" all the time. You may start there, but you must get out of there eventuelly if you're going to make politics.
Meanwhile, Solas is a more philosophical problem. There are no practicalities involved here, it's a question of how you want the world to be, and if you don't want it to be like Solas wants, what you can do at all in order to prevent it. There is no strategy you can think about in advance because the problem is unprecedented. You can only react. Being pro-active is, of course, is a typical antagonist's prerogative, but I prefer an arena where I can be pro-active, too, and Tevinter politics and the war could be that.
to parot. An intetesting viewpoint. I'm not sure I'd want the protag to stay down in the muck either the entire game... But then i really liked how they did Ryder and Hawk. I suppose to borrow another phrase from them, bioware devs stated they wanted you to found the jedi order. Something could work again for DA 4...but maybe stay smaller longer. So, in essence, you dont get to make world shaping choices in Act 2 (like with DAI) but save it till Act 3. So things are more gragual and things have time to develop.
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Post by Absafraginlootly on Feb 14, 2019 11:01:31 GMT
They've been building towards the next Qun invasion in every game so I don't think I want to be able to end it in da4 ala the Orlesian Civil War - Where it's just a thing you resolve in one quest in order to go after/thwart the real threat.
Be affected by it and effect it? Absolutely, just not resolve it necesarily. Like maybe in the war between Tevinter/Qun you liberate a town or affect which faction controls Seheron at the end of the game. But then in da5 the invasion is in full swing, not just impacting tevinter anymore, have it be the focus/big bad of that game with a more hawkelike protagonist (as in a regular person up against non world ending threats).
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