inherit
975
0
1,681
cloud9
3,876
Aug 14, 2016 11:41:22 GMT
August 2016
cloud9
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2
sicklyhour015
|
Post by cloud9 on Apr 29, 2020 1:45:11 GMT
Joker cracked jokes and they didn't killed him off in the game. That is just a poor excuse to kill off a character because they're are a "gag character." If anything, they could've made him die in a heroic way, like sacrificing himself to save the colonists from a horde of Geth and mutated husks, or saved a little girl from being mutilated from husks/indoctrinated humans. But they have to kill him off to get a new character in their team, which it was very stupid decision. Jenkins didn’t crack jokes; he was a joke. The whole point of his existence was to die. Agree or no, but there’s no heroic death that would’ve been meaningful. It would be too soon and no one cares. That doesn't make any sense. They just bump him off just for the sake of having a new character to the team, where they could've design a 4 man team. Not because he's the joke.
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inherit
Scribbles
185
0
Nov 17, 2024 22:23:52 GMT
31,578
Hanako Ikezawa
22,991
August 2016
hanakoikezawa
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Apr 29, 2020 1:59:25 GMT
KaiserShep I don't think cloud is aware of the thing they are referencing with that: The Man, the myth, the legend known as Leroy Jenkins!
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inherit
1227
0
3,700
Phantom
2,668
August 2016
deathscepter
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, KOTOR, Jade Empire
|
Post by Phantom on Apr 29, 2020 2:52:18 GMT
KaiserShep I don't think cloud is aware of the thing they are referencing with that: The Man, the myth, the legend known as Leroy Jenkins! you have to realize that cloud9 does across with no sense of humor. Side note: No matter how dark it gets, humor is very important. Even if Bioware asks me to buy one of my player characters ideas, I would request that their respective stories has a healthy dose of humor.
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inherit
265
0
Nov 15, 2024 18:18:41 GMT
12,048
Pounce de León
Praise the Justicat!
7,945
August 2016
catastrophy
caustic_agent
|
Post by Pounce de León on Apr 29, 2020 7:29:49 GMT
Probably taken up by spamming other forums with YT links about stuff that's 8 years old. Are they wrong, tho? Do you know how much I care?
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inherit
6864
0
1,975
aglomeracja
1,178
April 2017
aglomeracja
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Post by aglomeracja on Apr 29, 2020 9:10:50 GMT
Jenkins isn't just a joke, his death raises stakes and shows that your squadmates might die.
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inherit
♨ Retired
24
0
26,308
themikefest
15,636
August 2016
themikefest
21,655
15,426
|
Post by themikefest on Apr 29, 2020 11:34:32 GMT
Jenkins didn’t crack jokes; he was a joke. The whole point of his existence was to die. Agree or no, but there’s no heroic death that would’ve been meaningful. It would be too soon and no one cares. That doesn't make any sense. They just bump him off just for the sake of having a new character to the team, where they could've design a 4 man team. Not because he's the joke. Jenkins was a good guy. There was no reason for him to die. Before he's killed, Shepard has him move forward. Why isn't that seen in the rest of the trilogy? What could have happened is once Williams shows up, Jenkins heads back to a rendezvous point where the SR1 picks him up. When talking with Anderson, after waking up, Shepard learns that Jenkins will be reassigned to another unit while Williams is assigned to the SR1. In ME3, She3pard encounters Jenkins on the Citadel who has been assigned to security detail for the council. Instead of A/K being seriously injured on Mars, they stay on the SR2 for the whole game. During the Citadel coup, Shepard has a standoff with Jenkins. Do you know why this could not have happened? It's because of ME3. Remember? It's the best place to start playing a trilogy.
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inherit
9459
0
Nov 24, 2021 20:18:46 GMT
5,628
SirSourpuss
7,694
Oct 16, 2017 16:19:07 GMT
October 2017
sirpetrakus
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, SWTOR
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Post by SirSourpuss on Apr 29, 2020 14:17:39 GMT
The design was very crappy on their part. What would be the point of killing off a character, other than having Ashley in your team? They could easily set up a 4 man team, and make Verner a kid that looks up to Shepard because he wanted to be a soldier. Because it sets the beat that anybody can die at any time, therefore you need to be on your toes and super certain of your choices. Until you make it into ME3.
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inherit
10160
0
Nov 16, 2024 16:06:57 GMT
4,911
burningcherry
1,336
May 18, 2018 21:58:48 GMT
May 2018
burningcherry
Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
burningcherry97
|
Post by burningcherry on Apr 29, 2020 18:14:52 GMT
The design was very crappy on their part. What would be the point of killing off a character, other than having Ashley in your team? They could easily set up a 4 man team, and make Verner a kid that looks up to Shepard because he wanted to be a soldier. Because it sets the beat that anybody can die at any time, therefore you need to be on your toes and super certain of your choices. Until you make it into ME3. And what does change then?
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inherit
9459
0
Nov 24, 2021 20:18:46 GMT
5,628
SirSourpuss
7,694
Oct 16, 2017 16:19:07 GMT
October 2017
sirpetrakus
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, SWTOR
|
Post by SirSourpuss on Apr 29, 2020 18:15:43 GMT
And what does change then? The consequences.
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inherit
10160
0
Nov 16, 2024 16:06:57 GMT
4,911
burningcherry
1,336
May 18, 2018 21:58:48 GMT
May 2018
burningcherry
Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
burningcherry97
|
Post by burningcherry on Apr 29, 2020 18:26:10 GMT
And what does change then? The consequences. You mean that you mostly reap the consequences of ME1&2's choices instead of some new choices'?
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inherit
9459
0
Nov 24, 2021 20:18:46 GMT
5,628
SirSourpuss
7,694
Oct 16, 2017 16:19:07 GMT
October 2017
sirpetrakus
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, SWTOR
|
Post by SirSourpuss on Apr 29, 2020 18:29:01 GMT
You mean that you mostly reap the consequences of ME1&2's choices instead of some new choices'? No. Not really.
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|
inherit
975
0
1,681
cloud9
3,876
Aug 14, 2016 11:41:22 GMT
August 2016
cloud9
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2
sicklyhour015
|
Post by cloud9 on Apr 29, 2020 23:43:51 GMT
That doesn't make any sense. They just bump him off just for the sake of having a new character to the team, where they could've design a 4 man team. Not because he's the joke. Jenkins was a good guy. There was no reason for him to die. Before he's killed, Shepard has him move forward. Why isn't that seen in the rest of the trilogy? What could have happened is once Williams shows up, Jenkins heads back to a rendezvous point where the SR1 picks him up. When talking with Anderson, after waking up, Shepard learns that Jenkins will be reassigned to another unit while Williams is assigned to the SR1. In ME3, She3pard encounters Jenkins on the Citadel who has been assigned to security detail for the council. Instead of A/K being seriously injured on Mars, they stay on the SR2 for the whole game. During the Citadel coup, Shepard has a standoff with Jenkins. Do you know why this could not have happened? It's because of ME3. Remember? It's the best place to start playing a trilogy. That'll work.
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inherit
Glorious Star Lord
822
0
16,819
KaiserShep
Party like it's 2023!
9,233
August 2016
kaisershep
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by KaiserShep on Apr 30, 2020 1:55:03 GMT
That doesn't make any sense. They just bump him off just for the sake of having a new character to the team, where they could've design a 4 man team. Not because he's the joke. Jenkins was a good guy. There was no reason for him to die. Before he's killed, Shepard has him move forward. Why isn't that seen in the rest of the trilogy? What could have happened is once Williams shows up, Jenkins heads back to a rendezvous point where the SR1 picks him up. When talking with Anderson, after waking up, Shepard learns that Jenkins will be reassigned to another unit while Williams is assigned to the SR1. In ME3, She3pard encounters Jenkins on the Citadel who has been assigned to security detail for the council. Instead of A/K being seriously injured on Mars, they stay on the SR2 for the whole game. During the Citadel coup, Shepard has a standoff with Jenkins. Do you know why this could not have happened? It's because of ME3. Remember? It's the best place to start playing a trilogy. Obviously he died for a similar reason as the companion on Virmire, to have the danger of the enemy hit closer to home. The deaths in Mass Effect (or just about anywhere really), don’t really matter when we have no idea who they are. On Eden Prime, that random person getting turned into a huskibob doesn’t really matter either, at least in terms of the impact of the death itself. It’s just to introduce us to the horror of geth reaper technology. If anything, the mistake I feel was that Jenkins died too quickly. He should’ve taken part in a bit of a battle, but got too cocksure at some point and did something stupid to get himself killed. It would’ve played better to the Leeroy Jenkins reference he was based on, and it would’ve at least given us an intro to the 3-person squad mechanic before he got disposed of, especially since you can invest points in his skill tree.
|
|
inherit
♨ Retired
24
0
26,308
themikefest
15,636
August 2016
themikefest
21,655
15,426
|
Post by themikefest on Apr 30, 2020 2:20:36 GMT
Jenkins was a good guy. There was no reason for him to die. Before he's killed, Shepard has him move forward. Why isn't that seen in the rest of the trilogy? What could have happened is once Williams shows up, Jenkins heads back to a rendezvous point where the SR1 picks him up. When talking with Anderson, after waking up, Shepard learns that Jenkins will be reassigned to another unit while Williams is assigned to the SR1. In ME3, She3pard encounters Jenkins on the Citadel who has been assigned to security detail for the council. Instead of A/K being seriously injured on Mars, they stay on the SR2 for the whole game. During the Citadel coup, Shepard has a standoff with Jenkins. Do you know why this could not have happened? It's because of ME3. Remember? It's the best place to start playing a trilogy. Obviously he died for a similar reason as the companion on Virmire, to have the danger of the enemy hit closer to home. The deaths in Mass Effect (or just about anywhere really), don’t really matter when we have no idea who they are. On Eden Prime, that random person getting turned into a huskibob doesn’t really matter either, at least in terms of the impact of the death itself. It’s just to introduce us to the horror of geth reaper technology. If anything, the mistake I feel was that Jenkins died too quickly. He should’ve taken part in a bit of a battle, but got too cocksure at some point and did something stupid to get himself killed. It would’ve played better to the Leeroy Jenkins reference he was based on, and it would’ve at least given us an intro to the 3-person squad mechanic before he got disposed of, especially since you can invest points in his skill tree. I believe the reason for the death is the same as some of the deaths in ME3, for the feels. The lead up to his death and others was lame. Having the enemy kill squadmates/crewmembers doesn't have to happen. Seeing/hearing about the deaths of others at the hands of the enemy can hit home just as well. Look at Moreau's father and sister.
|
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inherit
Glorious Star Lord
822
0
16,819
KaiserShep
Party like it's 2023!
9,233
August 2016
kaisershep
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by KaiserShep on Apr 30, 2020 3:11:40 GMT
Obviously he died for a similar reason as the companion on Virmire, to have the danger of the enemy hit closer to home. The deaths in Mass Effect (or just about anywhere really), don’t really matter when we have no idea who they are. On Eden Prime, that random person getting turned into a huskibob doesn’t really matter either, at least in terms of the impact of the death itself. It’s just to introduce us to the horror of geth reaper technology. If anything, the mistake I feel was that Jenkins died too quickly. He should’ve taken part in a bit of a battle, but got too cocksure at some point and did something stupid to get himself killed. It would’ve played better to the Leeroy Jenkins reference he was based on, and it would’ve at least given us an intro to the 3-person squad mechanic before he got disposed of, especially since you can invest points in his skill tree. I believe the reason for the death is the same as some of the deaths in ME3, for the feels. The lead up to his death and others was lame. Having the enemy kill squadmates/crewmembers doesn't have to happen. Seeing/hearing about the deaths of others at the hands of the enemy can hit home just as well. Look at Moreau's father and sister. Emotional impact was obviously the primary motivator for forcing us to lose a companion on Virmire, but a character named “Jenkins” who gets the Red Shirt treatment in the prologue...not so much. He was given very little to work with to establish any kind of emotional bond, and has nothing to tell us other than about Eden Prime. I guess we could go into cockamamie territory like caring for our fellow man and such, but I don’t think that this was truly the intention with Jenkins. Jenkins died to serve a pop culture reference, and he will be remembered as such. I just wish he yelled his own name as the drones killed him. Joker’s family is a different story, since this is a character that is with us across the trilogy, and the emotional impact relies on our attachment to that character, not the people who died. It’s interesting though that Joker can never really be told the truth by Shepard. We learn the information passively by eavesdropping, but have to keep it to ourselves while he wonders.
|
|
inherit
975
0
1,681
cloud9
3,876
Aug 14, 2016 11:41:22 GMT
August 2016
cloud9
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2
sicklyhour015
|
Post by cloud9 on Apr 30, 2020 7:04:49 GMT
Jenkins was a good guy. There was no reason for him to die. Before he's killed, Shepard has him move forward. Why isn't that seen in the rest of the trilogy? What could have happened is once Williams shows up, Jenkins heads back to a rendezvous point where the SR1 picks him up. When talking with Anderson, after waking up, Shepard learns that Jenkins will be reassigned to another unit while Williams is assigned to the SR1. In ME3, She3pard encounters Jenkins on the Citadel who has been assigned to security detail for the council. Instead of A/K being seriously injured on Mars, they stay on the SR2 for the whole game. During the Citadel coup, Shepard has a standoff with Jenkins. Do you know why this could not have happened? It's because of ME3. Remember? It's the best place to start playing a trilogy. Obviously he died for a similar reason as the companion on Virmire, to have the danger of the enemy hit closer to home. The deaths in Mass Effect (or just about anywhere really), don’t really matter when we have no idea who they are. On Eden Prime, that random person getting turned into a huskibob doesn’t really matter either, at least in terms of the impact of the death itself. It’s just to introduce us to the horror of geth reaper technology. If anything, the mistake I feel was that Jenkins died too quickly. He should’ve taken part in a bit of a battle, but got too cocksure at some point and did something stupid to get himself killed. It would’ve played better to the Leeroy Jenkins reference he was based on, and it would’ve at least given us an intro to the 3-person squad mechanic before he got disposed of, especially since you can invest points in his skill tree. Speaking of horror, it was poorly executed because it just feel like a bland experience of seeing impaled people turning into husks. It doesn't feel like it was dark and horrifying like how evil Reapers can really be. They should learn from Origins to design a proper tone, because the darkspawn are beyond evil and they are the very concept of it. Because it corrupts everything it touches, and players can get to see how evil the Blight really is. And they could learn how to use horrors of war from Spec Ops: The Line of the white phosphorus walkthrough.
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inherit
4588
0
Nov 25, 2024 20:19:45 GMT
3,170
therevanchist25
1,826
Mar 15, 2017 23:07:06 GMT
March 2017
therevanchist25
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem
|
Post by therevanchist25 on Apr 30, 2020 8:13:16 GMT
As great as Spec Ops is, no other game is ever going to take that approach. The game beats you over the head with how shit you are for everything you are doing, from every line of dialogue, every cutscene, every loading screen. The game judges and condemns you for being a soulless monster by virtue of just continuing to play. That is not exactly an approach you can take and expect big blockbuster sales like EA does.
Meanwhile, Enkindle THIS!
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inherit
10160
0
Nov 16, 2024 16:06:57 GMT
4,911
burningcherry
1,336
May 18, 2018 21:58:48 GMT
May 2018
burningcherry
Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
burningcherry97
|
Post by burningcherry on Apr 30, 2020 14:36:06 GMT
Skimmed through the Tuchanka&Rannoch parts and saw no mention of the krogan&geth whitewashing. Not even the wrongest of ME3 is in this video, 0/10.
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inherit
975
0
1,681
cloud9
3,876
Aug 14, 2016 11:41:22 GMT
August 2016
cloud9
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2
sicklyhour015
|
Post by cloud9 on Apr 30, 2020 18:38:37 GMT
As great as Spec Ops is, no other game is ever going to take that approach. The game beats you over the head with how shit you are for everything you are doing, from every line of dialogue, every cutscene, every loading screen. The game judges and condemns you for being a soulless monster by virtue of just continuing to play. That is not exactly an approach you can take and expect big blockbuster sales like EA does. Meanwhile, Enkindle THIS! I don't mean that they should copy it, but to learn from it so they can use the horrors of war theme properly. And it will be times when Shepard will eventually make tough decisions that'll cost lives, making the best out of the bad situations, and how it could affect the story of the game.
|
|
inherit
4588
0
Nov 25, 2024 20:19:45 GMT
3,170
therevanchist25
1,826
Mar 15, 2017 23:07:06 GMT
March 2017
therevanchist25
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem
|
Post by therevanchist25 on Apr 30, 2020 21:19:33 GMT
As great as Spec Ops is, no other game is ever going to take that approach. The game beats you over the head with how shit you are for everything you are doing, from every line of dialogue, every cutscene, every loading screen. The game judges and condemns you for being a soulless monster by virtue of just continuing to play. That is not exactly an approach you can take and expect big blockbuster sales like EA does. Meanwhile, Enkindle THIS! I don't mean that they should copy it, but to learn from it so they can use the horrors of war theme properly. And it will be times when Shepard will eventually make tough decisions that'll cost lives, making the best out of the bad situations, and how it could affect the story of the game. To be fair, I saw nothing wrong with how ME3 handled Shepard sabotaging the cure for the greater "good" of the war effort. The game makes you feel awful for it if you did it while Wrex is in charge.
|
|
inherit
975
0
1,681
cloud9
3,876
Aug 14, 2016 11:41:22 GMT
August 2016
cloud9
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2
sicklyhour015
|
Post by cloud9 on Apr 30, 2020 23:01:22 GMT
I don't mean that they should copy it, but to learn from it so they can use the horrors of war theme properly. And it will be times when Shepard will eventually make tough decisions that'll cost lives, making the best out of the bad situations, and how it could affect the story of the game. To be fair, I saw nothing wrong with how ME3 handled Shepard sabotaging the cure for the greater "good" of the war effort. The game makes you feel awful for it if you did it while Wrex is in charge. Its more of an asshole move than a tough decision. And the Salarian dalatrass promised to join the war effort against the Reapers, if the Genophage cure is sabotaged. I mean, that twat is so stupid and idiotic that she get her head out her own ass. Because the Reapers will eventually invade her homeworld at any moment, and the Krogan may be their best chance of turning the tide.
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inherit
3439
0
Member is Online
9,678
alanc9
Old Scientist Contrarian
8,062
February 2017
alanc9
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Post by alanc9 on May 1, 2020 0:18:36 GMT
Sure, she's an idiot. But telling an idiot to "please stop being an idiot" isn't a strategy with a very high success rate. Shepard has to deal with her as she is.
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inherit
4588
0
Nov 25, 2024 20:19:45 GMT
3,170
therevanchist25
1,826
Mar 15, 2017 23:07:06 GMT
March 2017
therevanchist25
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem
|
Post by therevanchist25 on May 1, 2020 1:51:06 GMT
To be fair, I saw nothing wrong with how ME3 handled Shepard sabotaging the cure for the greater "good" of the war effort. The game makes you feel awful for it if you did it while Wrex is in charge. Its more of an asshole move than a tough decision. And the Salarian dalatrass promised to join the war effort against the Reapers, if the Genophage cure is sabotaged. I mean, that twat is so stupid and idiotic that she get her head out her own ass. Because the Reapers will eventually invade her homeworld at any moment, and the Krogan may be their best chance of turning the tide. War isn't just about gory tragedy, it's also about making impossible decisions. From a math standpoint, the salarians are crucial, their one of the three council races. They have significant numbers. from the cold aspect of calculus, screwing the krogan is the smartest move. That scene with Wrex symbolizes the horror of war without showing mangled bodies.
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inherit
Glorious Star Lord
822
0
16,819
KaiserShep
Party like it's 2023!
9,233
August 2016
kaisershep
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by KaiserShep on May 1, 2020 6:50:31 GMT
Its more of an asshole move than a tough decision. And the Salarian dalatrass promised to join the war effort against the Reapers, if the Genophage cure is sabotaged. I mean, that twat is so stupid and idiotic that she get her head out her own ass. Because the Reapers will eventually invade her homeworld at any moment, and the Krogan may be their best chance of turning the tide. War isn't just about gory tragedy, it's also about making impossible decisions. From a math standpoint, the salarians are crucial, their one of the three council races. They have significant numbers. from the cold aspect of calculus, screwing the krogan is the smartest move. That scene with Wrex symbolizes the horror of war without showing mangled bodies. Really, the only reason sabotaging the cure would benefit in the story is because there’s still sufficient krogan support regardless of your decision, or even who’s clan leader. Some krogan support dissolves, but it would’ve made more sense if the krogan pulled out completely and told the turians to drop dead, thereby leaving everyone else high and dry. If that happened, any support the salarians might offer would no longer be relevant. The war effort would simply collapse, and we’d get a mission critical failure because Wrex found out. The mistake I feel the game made was having Wrex somehow having access to your “secure” comms link to the Dalatrass, likely a traitor in the midst of the STG feeding info to them beyond Mordin/Padok. In any case, I think it could be argued that there’s a case for sabotaging the cure being the greater risk, and that the salarians would be stupid and short-sighted to stay out just because they don’t agree with the genophage cure, just like the asari were stupid to stay out of the summit. In the broader scheme of things, the genophage cure is really small potatoes. Even Shepard said it best when they say that the consequences “are nothing compared to if the reapers win”. If I had to choose between guaranteed extinction now and the possibility of a protracted war sometime in an undetermined future, I think the latter would be the sensible option. Heck, post-war, what kind of resources do the krogan even have at their disposal that would make them even remotely a threat for even a generation? If, say, Wreav decided to take this newfound revitalization of his species as a call to arms to fight the rest of the galaxy, what’s he gonna do it with? They can’t just march on every planet. They don’t even have their own ships, and it’s a fair bet that turian and salarian observatory outposts would monitor their progress and respond accordingly. The effects of their being demilitarized would hamstring their efforts to expand and invade other worlds, and their ability to storm other planets with sheer numbers mean nothing if they get blown out of the sky before they can make it anywhere.
|
|
inherit
975
0
1,681
cloud9
3,876
Aug 14, 2016 11:41:22 GMT
August 2016
cloud9
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2
sicklyhour015
|
Post by cloud9 on May 1, 2020 10:38:04 GMT
Sure, she's an idiot. But telling an idiot to "please stop being an idiot" isn't a strategy with a very high success rate. Shepard has to deal with her as she is. I know that. But calling the extinction of the Krogan, and losing allies that can help turn the tide is beyond stupid. But I'll keep the sequence of either cure or sabotage the cure, and outcomes because it is one of the best moments of ME3. And its well written.
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