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Post by Iddy on Jun 15, 2020 6:00:31 GMT
What was that moment for you?
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Post by sageoflife on Jun 16, 2020 10:12:01 GMT
Most conversations where Vivienne shows herself to be a selfish hypocrite who doesn't know nearly as much as she thinks she does.
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LadyofNemesis
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by LadyofNemesis on Jun 16, 2020 10:56:25 GMT
When you can't tell a character you know everything they're telling you even when your character is part of a certain group or demographic *cough* "who's Mythal?" *cough*
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Post by Gileadan on Jun 16, 2020 11:10:20 GMT
When I have to pick between two variants of stupid and can't tell them to go frak themselves, most notably at the ending of DA2.
Whenever the protagonist accepts a quest without my input and it's something I wholeheartedly don't care about, like the beginning of the Qunari plot in DA2. But thou must.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Jun 16, 2020 11:27:07 GMT
It was infuriating to never be able to address Vivienne's hypocrisy and ignorance. Cassandra and Cullen I also wish I could have been harsher to. At no point in the game are you able to confront them properly for their complicity in the abusive system of the Chantry. Cullen especially gets treated a lot gentler than I feel he should.
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Post by Buckeldemon on Jun 16, 2020 11:55:53 GMT
Most conversations where Vivienne shows herself to be a selfish hypocrite who doesn't know nearly as much as she thinks she does. It was infuriating to never be able to address Vivienne's hypocrisy and ignorance. Bonus points for her lectures about how Vashoth and Dalish are supposedly handling their magic. Also leads back to what LadyofNemesis mentioned. Unsolicited "shemsplanation" from someone who has half-knowledge at best.
---
In case of DA2's binary ending, I'd think Meredith is setting up the binary standard here; "If you are not 111% with me, you are on my kill list!". Of course, it would have been nice to, as she demand's Hawke's obedience, remind her that the perpetrator just sits over there and has already confessed and why she does not adress him. If she insists on "kill them all", fight her right there and put her down, then asking "Anyone else?" to the other bucket helmets and if they are reasonable, shift attention to where it belongs: Anders.
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All this "choose between three equally dumb things" is... I don't know if it bled over from Mass Effect. Sometimes it appears as if everytime certain characters enter the stage (TIM being a prime example), Shepard's IQ seens to drop drastically. Honestly, the only response I found appropriate and memorable of all the nonsensical Shepard-TIM arguments in ME3 was that "Go to hell" on Mars.
---
To be fair, even DAO has this at times. I met Genitivi in Haven the other day, and at some point I was rather annoyed that I got a few answers which seemed either too nice for my warden's mindset or "something with Maker".
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Post by pessimistpanda on Jun 16, 2020 12:22:25 GMT
Speaking of Anders, I would have loved to have the option for Hawke to openly say he supported blowing up the Chantry. Lol.
For that matter, it would be fun if the Inquisitor could weigh in too: "Elthina? Oh yeah, I heard that she had a tendency to... blow up."
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LadyofNemesis
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by LadyofNemesis on Jun 16, 2020 12:36:43 GMT
Speaking of Anders, I would have loved to have the option for Hawke to openly say he supported blowing up the Chantry. Lol. For that matter, it would be fun if the Inquisitor could weigh in too: "Elthina? Oh yeah, I heard that she had a tendency to... blow up." heh, reminds me of an interview with Mark Hamill (Luke Skywalker) about the "hottest couple" in Star Wars apparently he replied "uncle Owen and aunt Beru, they were smoking hot...literally" link
but yeah, I agree with you that there should've been an option to openly support Anders, not just with saying it but actively helping him do the deed so that at least the stories about them starting a war were correct, and not just "I stood there and it just sorta happened"
Coupled with an achievement of course
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Post by Iddy on Jun 16, 2020 19:48:19 GMT
Speaking of Anders, I would have loved to have the option for Hawke to openly say he supported blowing up the Chantry. Lol. For that matter, it would be fun if the Inquisitor could weigh in too: "Elthina? Oh yeah, I heard that she had a tendency to... blow up." heh, reminds me of an interview with Mark Hamill (Luke Skywalker) about the "hottest couple" in Star Wars apparently he replied "uncle Owen and aunt Beru, they were smoking hot...literally" link
but yeah, I agree with you that there should've been an option to openly support Anders, not just with saying it but actively helping him do the deed so that at least the stories about them starting a war were correct, and not just "I stood there and it just sorta happened"
Coupled with an achievement of course Yeah, it is kinda funny that Hawke is given so much credit for something s/he barely participated in.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 16, 2020 19:56:12 GMT
heh, reminds me of an interview with Mark Hamill (Luke Skywalker) about the "hottest couple" in Star Wars apparently he replied "uncle Owen and aunt Beru, they were smoking hot...literally" link
but yeah, I agree with you that there should've been an option to openly support Anders, not just with saying it but actively helping him do the deed so that at least the stories about them starting a war were correct, and not just "I stood there and it just sorta happened"
Coupled with an achievement of course Yeah, it is kinda funny that Hawke is given so much credit for something s/he barely participated in. Or didn’t participate in at all, if you refuse to do the quest or kick Anders out of the group in Act 2.
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Post by Nightscrawl on Jun 16, 2020 21:13:49 GMT
Cullen especially gets treated a lot gentler than I feel he should. After doing some recent thinking on the issue, I've determined that my inquisitor has more negative feelings toward Cullen, so on my next play I'm going to see how it plays out with the dialogue options. However, I don't feel that the game is "gentle" with him over it. The PC wasn't there, so only has to go on whatever they have learned from third-party sources. Part of my headcanon is that my inquisitor learns about more of the terrible details at the conclave; he's a Trevelyan noble, so quite frankly, never gave it much thought. (While he's a man of faith, like Dorian, he has little use for the Chantry as an institution.) It seems to me that the game presents the information and allows the player to feel and respond as they will. Unless you think the lack of critical dialogue options in and of themselves indicates game/writer bias. Keep in mind that some players say the same thing about not being allowed to have bigoted dialogue options as well, such as not being allowed to use "knife ear" if their RP is an asshole human and other such things.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Jun 17, 2020 1:48:06 GMT
Cullen especially gets treated a lot gentler than I feel he should. After doing some recent thinking on the issue, I've determined that my inquisitor has more negative feelings toward Cullen, so on my next play I'm going to see how it plays out with the dialogue options. However, I don't feel that the game is "gentle" with him over it. The PC wasn't there, so only has to go on whatever they have learned from third-party sources. Part of my headcanon is that my inquisitor learns about more of the terrible details at the conclave; he's a Trevelyan noble, so quite frankly, never gave it much thought. (While he's a man of faith, like Dorian, he has little use for the Chantry as an institution.) It seems to me that the game presents the information and allows the player to feel and respond as they will. Unless you think the lack of critical dialogue options in and of themselves indicates game/writer bias. Keep in mind that some players say the same thing about not being allowed to have bigoted dialogue options as well, such as not being allowed to use "knife ear" if their RP is an asshole human and other such things. I have no problem with 'writer bias', in and of itself. Only writer bigotry. In fact, I wish BioWare would more clearly take a side on some the issues it presents in its games. As it is, I think the writers are already showing bias in favour of Cullen, possibly because they are aware of his massive fanbase (as if anyone here could possibly not be).
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Post by alanc9 on Jun 17, 2020 2:40:01 GMT
Suddenly I'm imagining an alternate DAI where Cullen's entire plotline is about his realization that he and his colleagues were the bad guys all along.
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Post by sageoflife on Jun 17, 2020 10:39:57 GMT
Most conversations where Vivienne shows herself to be a selfish hypocrite who doesn't know nearly as much as she thinks she does. Bonus points for her lectures about how Vashoth and Dalish are supposedly handling their magic. Also leads back to what LadyofNemesis mentioned. Unsolicited "shemsplanation" from someone who has half-knowledge at best. Hell, even Trevelyan can make it clear that their Circle experience was very different from the rosy time she had, but that apparently doesn't mean anything.
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Post by Iddy on Jun 17, 2020 11:46:59 GMT
Catilina should be here anytime now
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Post by SofaJockey on Jun 17, 2020 12:47:07 GMT
It's worth remembering that none of the characters are 'your' character. I see people complain sometimes when 'their character' isn't allowed to be 'fully evil' and watch the world burn. DAI is not a sandbox. The paths may on occasion have multiple branches, but there being a path is inevitable. Though I would have been pleased to have seen it be easier to lose characters who disagreed. I never lost anyone.
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Post by Iddy on Jun 17, 2020 13:03:48 GMT
It's worth remembering that none of the characters are 'your' character. I see people complain sometimes when 'their character' isn't allowed to be 'fully evil' and watch the world burn. DAI is not a sandbox. The paths may on occasion have multiple branches, but there being a path is inevitable. Though I would have been pleased to have seen it be easier to lose characters who disagreed. I never lost anyone. Mmm... yeah, the character you play is more like half yours, half the writer team's. I've seen someone complain that they couldn't choose to ignore the Qunari in DA2. But Hawke is meant to be the hero who saved Kirkwall from the Qunari, so you should accept that.
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Post by SofaJockey on Jun 17, 2020 13:09:51 GMT
Mmm... yeah, the character you play is more like half yours, half the writer team's. I've seen someone complain that they couldn't choose to ignore the Qunari in DA2. But Hawke is meant to be the hero who saved Kirkwall from the Qunari, so you should accept that. There's also a wider issue here about how you play. I never self-insert. The character is never 'me' and I prefer 3rd person games for that reason: I 'direct' the action within the boundaries set. That also means I can play a character who is not 'me' and who does things that 'I' would not do (but that make sense for the character).
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: Tuldabar
XBL Gamertag: Shadow Quickpaw
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Post by Quickpaw on Jun 18, 2020 0:59:12 GMT
Two main instances come to mind (that haven't already been said anyway): Not being able to refute Minaeve or Iron Bull's "Three mage per clan" theory, and the first quartermaster having a hard-on for Mr. Insane powermonger Loghain. I get that the Herald wasn't there and couldn't have said for certain what happened, but COME ON. They had to have had an opinion on the subject.
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Post by Shinobu on Jun 18, 2020 4:32:31 GMT
I felt that way about pretty much the entirety of DA2, unfortunately.
In DA:O we got 5 options pretty regularly and I tended to choose the bemused middle ground, which didn't exist in DA2.
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Post by colfoley on Jun 18, 2020 19:50:45 GMT
Honestly probably the biggest one for me happens in Tresspasser. A lot of the philosophical wait of the DLC is driven home by us not telling the Council of the Qunari. And while I can't be a hundred percent sure since the option doesen't exist I am fairly sure Kara would've told them from the beginning.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 18, 2020 20:07:17 GMT
Honestly probably the biggest one for me happens in Tresspasser. A lot of the philosophical wait of the DLC is driven home by us not telling the Council of the Qunari. And while I can't be a hundred percent sure since the option doesen't exist I am fairly sure Kara would've told them from the beginning. Yeah I hated that. I would definitely have told them, especially with my Inquisitors who romance Josephine since they would agree with her even more.
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Post by colfoley on Jun 18, 2020 20:32:37 GMT
Honestly probably the biggest one for me happens in Tresspasser. A lot of the philosophical wait of the DLC is driven home by us not telling the Council of the Qunari. And while I can't be a hundred percent sure since the option doesen't exist I am fairly sure Kara would've told them from the beginning. Yeah I hated that. I would definitely have told them, especially with my Inquisitors who romance Josephine since they would agree with her even more. still I love the look she gives the Inquisitor when the Inquisitor is uppity with the two Councilors.
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Post by Sokemis on Jun 22, 2020 1:17:46 GMT
Not being able to refute Minaeve or Iron Bull's "Three mage per clan" theory Same with the conversation with Vivienne in Haven. I believe the reason my Inquisitor (Dalish mage) doesn't correct anyone that this isn't true (or at the very least isn't true in all clans) is that the "three mages per clan" is a fallacy that the Dalish let outsiders continue to believe as another way to protect the clans.
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Post by Iddy on Jun 22, 2020 6:37:52 GMT
Not being able to refute Minaeve or Iron Bull's "Three mage per clan" theory Same with the conversation with Vivienne in Haven. I believe the reason my Inquisitor (Dalish mage) doesn't correct anyone that this isn't true (or at the very least isn't true in all clans) is that the "three mages per clan" is a fallacy that the Dalish let outsiders continue to believe as another way to protect the clans. Here is the thing, though: Minaeve tells us that it happened to her. Are you saying she lied to the Inquisitor?
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