Heimdall
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Post by Heimdall on Jun 20, 2020 12:05:23 GMT
Jackdaw’s breakdown brings up an interesting idea, what if this is the Temple of Sacred Ashes after Corypheus shook up the landscape?
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Post by gervaise21 on Jun 20, 2020 17:37:48 GMT
Jackdaw’s breakdown brings up an interesting idea, what if this is the Temple of Sacred Ashes after Corypheus shook up the landscape? Why would they take us back there again? For a start of they've made a big show in the epilogue to Trespasser that they're sending us north next game. Then in Tevinter Nights, with the exception of Callback, all the stories are concerned with locations either in or under Tevinter, Nevarra, the Anderfels and Antiva. So I'd really like to go there too. Plus the Imperium was meant to have been built on the ruins of Elvhenan and so logically the answers are more likely to be found under one of the three main kingdoms that made up the Imperium than down south in Ferelden which was always on the fringes and usually the last to start experiencing the effects of the Blights, apart from the 5th of course. To be honest my money is still on a corrupted titan or possibly the sunken Arlathan, which includes a corrupted titan. However, if it is the site of the origins of the Blight then that may be further over in the direction of the Anderfels as that would appear to be where it first began and has been constantly beset by darkspawn down the years, or possibly deep within the Tirashan, which is relatively close to it in the south. You know we never really found out where the majority of Trespasser was set on the surface but it has to be somewhere with a lot of mountains and few native inhabitants, which rules out the Frostbacks, but the Hunterhorn Mountains to the north of the Tirashan would be just about right. It's pretty close to Kal-Sharok too and we know there is something odd about those dwarven survivors.
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Post by smudjygirl on Jun 20, 2020 18:46:20 GMT
Jackdaw’s breakdown brings up an interesting idea, what if this is the Temple of Sacred Ashes after Corypheus shook up the landscape? Why would they take us back there again? For a start of they've made a big show in the epilogue to Trespasser that they're sending us north next game. Then in Tevinter Nights, with the exception of Callback, all the stories are concerned with locations either in or under Tevinter, Nevarra, the Anderfels and Antiva. I agree, but if we are going to be spies and hunting Solas becomes part of our goal i don't find it hard to believe we will at least return to Haven or Skyhold to find information. While i agree it looks like Haven and such I don't know if i believe we'll go there or not, to be honest.
It could be that the breach can be seen from anywhere?
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Post by gervaise21 on Jun 20, 2020 19:00:57 GMT
It could be that the breach can be seen from anywhere?
From what I recall I think that was said to be the case. The scar in the sky could definitely be seen in Halamshiral even though the Temple of Sacred Ashes was on the other side of the Frostbacks. Where was Vivienne in that trailer when the explosion caused the windows to be blown out in the palace where she was located? She definitely wasn't in Haven and when we go to her party she is in northern Orlais, so could the effects of the explosion be felt even there? My memory is a bit shaky on this but didn't the Viddasala say the breach could even be seen up in Par Vollen?
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Post by smudjygirl on Jun 20, 2020 19:04:02 GMT
It could be that the breach can be seen from anywhere? From what I recall I think that was said to be the case. The scar in the sky could definitely be seen in Halamshiral even though the Temple of Sacred Ashes was on the other side of the Frostbacks. My memory is a bit shaky on this but didn't the Viddasala say the breach could even be seen up in Par Vollen? I remember that too. So we can't guess at location based on visability of the breach, as far as i'm aware. But i wouldn't count out the possibility it is Haven, since i also thought that first time around too.
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Post by midnight tea on Jun 21, 2020 1:31:53 GMT
Jackdaw’s breakdown brings up an interesting idea, what if this is the Temple of Sacred Ashes after Corypheus shook up the landscape? Why would they take us back there again? For a start of they've made a big show in the epilogue to Trespasser that they're sending us north next game. Then in Tevinter Nights, with the exception of Callback, all the stories are concerned with locations either in or under Tevinter, Nevarra, the Anderfels and Antiva. So I'd really like to go there too. Plus the Imperium was meant to have been built on the ruins of Elvhenan and so logically the answers are more likely to be found under one of the three main kingdoms that made up the Imperium than down south in Ferelden which was always on the fringes and usually the last to start experiencing the effects of the Blights, apart from the 5th of course. It's only at the end of DAI that we got a hint that there's more to that place than it was previously assumed (thanks to Mythal's mural peeking out). And given that we've been told by John Epler via Twitter that - at the end of Trespasser, in the last scene with new Inner Circle - the location they chose is *actually* the dug out cellar of the Haven's Chantry it means Inquisition is back near Temple Of Sacred Ashes anyway, at least for a time being. Also, given how Solas has disappeared immediately and completely after battle with Corypheus, there's actually a chance that there may be a hidden eluvian there somewhere. And considering that eluvian travel is practically guaranteed, I don't see any reason why we wouldn't be able to revisit old places thanks to near-instant travel. Alternatively, as I suggested when I mused whether these were actually scenes from Ferelden from times of DAO, it's entirely possible that we may be back to the Temple Of Sacred Ashes as a reconstruction in the Fade. We WERE at reconstructed Dream Haven in DAI after all. The Blight infestation may then either reflect state of the world as it would be at certain point of the game, or perhaps it could symbolize the infestation of the Fade by the Blight. We did see red lyrium crystals in the Fade after all.
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Post by colfoley on Jun 21, 2020 7:22:07 GMT
Why would they take us back there again? For a start of they've made a big show in the epilogue to Trespasser that they're sending us north next game. Then in Tevinter Nights, with the exception of Callback, all the stories are concerned with locations either in or under Tevinter, Nevarra, the Anderfels and Antiva. So I'd really like to go there too. Plus the Imperium was meant to have been built on the ruins of Elvhenan and so logically the answers are more likely to be found under one of the three main kingdoms that made up the Imperium than down south in Ferelden which was always on the fringes and usually the last to start experiencing the effects of the Blights, apart from the 5th of course. It's only at the end of DAI that we got a hint that there's more to that place than it was previously assumed (thanks to Mythal's mural peeking out). And given that we've been told by John Epler via Twitter that - at the end of Trespasser, in the last scene with new Inner Circle - the location they chose is *actually* the dug out cellar of the Haven's Chantry it means Inquisition is back near Temple Of Sacred Ashes anyway, at least for a time being. Also, given how Solas has disappeared immediately and completely after battle with Corypheus, there's actually a chance that there may be a hidden eluvian there somewhere. And considering that eluvian travel is practically guaranteed, I don't see any reason why we wouldn't be able to revisit old places thanks to near-instant travel. Alternatively, as I suggested when I mused whether these were actually scenes from Ferelden from times of DAO, it's entirely possible that we may be back to the Temple Of Sacred Ashes as a reconstruction in the Fade. We WERE at reconstructed Dream Haven in DAI after all. The Blight infestation may then either reflect state of the world as it would be at certain point of the game, or perhaps it could symbolize the infestation of the Fade by the Blight. We did see red lyrium crystals in the Fade after all. midnight tea, talking me off the edge since 9:45 Dragon.
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Post by gervaise21 on Jun 21, 2020 8:04:58 GMT
Alternatively, as I suggested when I mused whether these were actually scenes from Ferelden from times of DAO, it's entirely possible that we may be back to the Temple Of Sacred Ashes as a reconstruction in the Fade. We WERE at reconstructed Dream Haven in DAI after all. This is a possibility I have considered as well. This would explain the moon in the sky since in our Haven Fade landscape everything looked as direct reflection of the real world, including the sky. I've always thought that regardless of what Solas said at the time, now we know who he is and how powerful he can be in the Fade, that he was responsible for us seeing the Fade in that way. So it is a possibility that at some point our PC could encounter Solas, challenge him once again as to why his plan is necessary and he says: "Let me show you." Whereupon he takes their hand and we are shown that sequence of images, with Solas telling us that this has already started in XXXX. Hell, he doesn't even have to be there physically but could just invade our dreams and instead of killing us, just shows those images as the reason why we should back off.
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Post by colfoley on Jun 21, 2020 8:09:51 GMT
Alternatively, as I suggested when I mused whether these were actually scenes from Ferelden from times of DAO, it's entirely possible that we may be back to the Temple Of Sacred Ashes as a reconstruction in the Fade. We WERE at reconstructed Dream Haven in DAI after all. This is a possibility I have considered as well. This would explain the moon in the sky since in our Haven Fade landscape everything looked as direct reflection of the real world, including the sky. I've always thought that regardless of what Solas said at the time, now we know who he is and how powerful he can be in the Fade, that he was responsible for us seeing the Fade in that way. So it is a possibility that at some point our PC could encounter Solas, challenge him once again as to why his plan is necessary and he says: "Let me show you." Whereupon he takes their hand and we are shown that sequence of images, with Solas telling us that this has already started in XXXX. Hell, he doesn't even have to be there physically but could just invade our dreams and instead of killing us, just shows those images as the reason why we should back off. wish we got this kind of interaction with Corypheus.
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Post by gervaise21 on Jun 21, 2020 13:43:04 GMT
I still wish we had got what was promised in this original trailer. At the beginning it says there is actual gameplay footage but ultimately none made it through to the final version. I also think it would still be a very appropriate trailer if Solas is actually going to be able to tear down the Veil and we then have to deal with the consequences, particularly if he screws up in some way over his plan for the Evanuris. Unlike the hole in the sky in DAI, this one shows the Veil tearing across from horizon to horizon, fire raining down from the sky and a dragon appearing out of the Fade.
"None shall be untouched by the fires above." "Darkness closes in. Will you stand against it or lead this world to its bitter end?"
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Post by Unicephalon 40-D on Jun 21, 2020 14:29:52 GMT
Those vases...
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Post by linksocarina on Jun 22, 2020 0:24:00 GMT
I knew this would be a thread...
Honestly, my personal thoughts is what we saw is something created by Solas to force the breach. But honestly, I don't really see the point in speculating on my end personally. I do enjoy hearing others thoughts though.
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Post by colfoley on Jun 23, 2020 6:13:21 GMT
Was reading a game front article and it was drawing comparisons between the creepy tree in the WIP artwork and the one in the mural from the TGAs...and have not been following this thread too closely so do not know if anyone has made similar comparisons but it could be worthy of conversations especially since it seems we have seen that tree in a few other places. Much like Heleus's Black Hole in the marketing for Andromeda....but lets hope this one ends up relevant to the plot this time.
But I also realized in re looking at it I know I had a lot of speculation...and others...that Solas will be fighting himself because it seems him and the Dread Wolf were facing off against one another, not to mention his final tarot card in Inquisition. But this time I realized...the idol is in the middle of it. So seems Solas will be fighting with the Dread Wolf over the idol just as much as we will be fighting with him. Hell now that I am musing about this I wonder how much of a split personality Solas actually has on this. Also, Solas would seem to be protecting said tree.
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Post by Heimdall on Jun 23, 2020 12:14:14 GMT
Sometimes I feel like I’m the only person that thinks the tree is insignificant.
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Post by midnight tea on Jun 23, 2020 13:05:11 GMT
Sometimes I feel like I’m the only person that thinks the tree is insignificant. This particular tree in the w-i-p scene may not be, but I think trees will become more and more relevant, literally and figuratively. Mostly because of this: Ok crazy theory- any chance the burning tree is the brecilian forest. Huge part of lore! Elves and especially ancient elves have some sort of special thing going on with the trees. It could be symbolic or it could be any of the GIGANTIC trees that seem to have some sort of special place in elvhen society. A reminder that there's a GINORMOUS tree in Temple of Mythal (it's so large we're travelling between its roots when we're heading towards TOM): It was actually depicted by Solas on Skyhold frescos (see its trunk, branches and leaves between the Sentinels?): Worth noting that the Well OF Sorrows is inside its trunk, and it seems like the tree's roots are serving as a way to pump the 'blue stuff'/magic connected to the Well from the ground... I'd say there's a connection to Titans/lyrium there. Also, there is a GINORMOUS tree in Jaws Of Hakkon (close to where the ancient temple and mysterious crater is) that was actually cut (not visible without free-flying camera, can't find the screenshot), but the leftover trunk sprouted branches and leaves again.
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Post by gervaise21 on Jun 23, 2020 13:20:52 GMT
Also, Solas would seem to be protecting said tree. Well if the tree can be equated with the Vhenadahl tree, its name means "Tree of the People", so if you understand by this that instead of belonging to the People, it is symbolic of the People, then Solas is protecting the People, which is what he in fact claims he is doing. In which case, if the tree in the picture has been infected and is being gradually destroyed by the Blight, then it would tie in with Solas believing the only way he can save the world and his People is cleansing it/them of the Blight and he thinks that this can only be accomplished with a massive injection of magical energy. Also the proliferation of urns, possibly containing ashes, at its base is also symbolic of the fact that his People are currently mortal and many have died and been buried at the base of trees over the millennia. Sometimes I feel like I’m the only person that thinks the tree is insignificant. Or as Felassan would say: "Let it just be a nice tree." (Or in this case a dead tree)
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Post by The Elder King on Jun 23, 2020 13:41:22 GMT
I think that, especially considering how far we are from release, those shots meant to show mostly the corruption due to red lyrium, given that even from the teaser, it seems to be a prominent theme in the game. Considering that we might explore the lore of the ancient elves, and elven cultures in general in Thedas seem to have connections with trees, it’s quite possible that they might be a prominent symbolism of the game.
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Post by biggydx on Jun 23, 2020 16:28:58 GMT
If this was all they had to show at EA’s show, I’m guessing BioWare isn’t going to have anything to show until 2021, sadly. Maybe I'm the asshole for saying this... but good. I want as much of this games story and gameplay mechanics locked in before the start spilling the beans. I dont want another Anthem nightmare where marketing didnt line up with the finished product.
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Post by nova on Jun 23, 2020 17:02:41 GMT
Throwing this codex into the mix: "Constellation: Fervenial Commonly referred to as "the Oak," the constellation Fervanis is generally represented by a towering tree with leafless branches. Many scholars believe this is a representation of nature that harkens back to the lore of the early Neromenians, whose beliefs largely aligned with animism, prior to the rise of Old God worship and the creation of the Tevinter Imperium. Others, however, believe Fervanis was originally a constellation of the elven people - specifically, a depiction of Andruil, goddess of the Hunt. "Vir Tanadhal," or "Way of Three Trees," is a central tenet of Andruil, and some think that Fervanis originally represented this concept.—From A Study of Thedosian Astronomy by Sister Oran Petrarchius" This description is spot on for the tree in the mural. If it does represent the Vir Tanadhal, I'd wager it's meant to symbolize that Solas is on the hunt, or on the war path (in contrast to the Vir Atish'an). He's hunting for the idol. He's at war with himself over what to do with it, as colfoley said. That or Andruil is going to make a surprise appearance. xD As for the w-i-p tree, it's winter in the scene and many of the trees are leafless, as to be expected. So, I'm less inclined to read any major symbolism there. Other than the usual winter=death, ominous red lyrium is ominous.
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Post by gervaise21 on Jun 23, 2020 17:47:02 GMT
This description is spot on for the tree in the mural. If it does represent the Vir Tanadhal, I'd wager it's meant to symbolize that Solas is on the hunt, or on the war path (in contrast to the Vir Atish'an). He's hunting for the idol. He's at war with himself over what to do with it, as colfoley said. Or it could be nod to the fact that it was Andruil who originally brought the taint to Thedas from the Void. It is said she brought plague with her and it caused a madness in her that made even the other Evanuris afraid, which sounds a bit like a proto-archdemon. Mythal was able to deal with this and it is possible that when she sapped her strength and stole her memories, she also nullified the taint in some way but only so long as she lived. I still think the tree in the mural is symbolic of the elven People but am willing to concede we may be reading too much into the W-I-P tree.
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Post by colfoley on Jun 23, 2020 19:10:21 GMT
Sometimes I feel like I’m the only person that thinks the tree is insignificant. oh don't worry, you are probably right.
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Post by necrowaif on Jun 23, 2020 19:15:27 GMT
Sometimes I feel like I’m the only person that thinks the tree is insignificant. You’re probably right. However, it’s important in the sense that it’s surrounded by assets from DAI (the skull-top urns and bearded statues), which signals that this is definitely a Dragon Age-related screenshot. Even the red lyrium coral isn’t necessarily tied to DA; after all, Dragon Age is hardly the only series with organic-looking glowing red crystals.
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Post by Absafraginlootly on Jun 24, 2020 2:47:37 GMT
I'm disinclined to think that this tree is meant to be the same as the one in the Dread Wolf Rises teaser, primarily because burnt tdwr tree bears more in common with the burnt vhenadahl tree of Vyrantium. And that tree we know is significant where as this just looks like a tree. In Vyrantium City(Minrathous's sharp dressed sister) there was a slave rebellion after which the vhenadahl tree was burnt. Then a statue of a burnt vhenadahl was commissioned by the Masters to remind the slaves of what happened when they rebelled. But whoever built the statue included a mechanism to open an entrance to a network of secret passages. So it looks like the elves weren't cowed. It seems likely tdwr teaser tree was referencing this rebellion, this tree, or the movement that uses the passages hidden by it. Also the elf guiding individuals through the passage in TN is wearing a scarlet coat - coincidence or red jenny involvment?
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Post by sandwichtern on Jun 24, 2020 7:46:43 GMT
Also, Solas would seem to be protecting said tree. Well if the tree can be equated with the Vhenadahl tree, its name means "Tree of the People", so if you understand by this that instead of belonging to the People, it is symbolic of the People, then Solas is protecting the People, which is what he in fact claims he is doing. In which case, if the tree in the picture has been infected and is being gradually destroyed by the Blight, then it would tie in with Solas believing the only way he can save the world and his People is cleansing it/them of the Blight and he thinks that this can only be accomplished with a massive injection of magical energy. Also the proliferation of urns, possibly containing ashes, at its base is also symbolic of the fact that his People are currently mortal and many have died and been buried at the base of trees over the millennia. Sometimes I feel like I’m the only person that thinks the tree is insignificant. Or as Felassan would say: "Let it just be a nice tree." (Or in this case a dead tree) Anyone want to give me the odds that DA4 will reveal that words 'heart' and 'people' were homonyms (same spelling and pronunciation, in this case vhen) in ancient elven language and the etymology of the word vhenadahl is actually a 'heart tree'? My personal pet theory is that vhenan (which means 'heart' in colloquial elven language) that Solas uses as a pet name for romanced Lavellan is actually formed from an older form of the word: VHEN with a suffix AN attached to it, the AN being perhaps a diminutive suffix (so vhen+an means "a little heart, a heartlet"), a vestigial possessive suffix ("my heart"), or a dummy pronoun like in Welsh language (so, following Welsh grammar rules, ma vhenan 'my heart' that Solas also uses could be construed as MA ("my") + VHEN ("heart") + AN("I")).
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Post by gervaise21 on Jun 24, 2020 8:04:42 GMT
Anyone want to give me the odds that DA4 will reveal that words 'heart' and 'people' were hononyms (same spelling and pronunciation, in this case vhen) in ancient elven language and the etymology of the word vhenadahl is actually a 'heart tree'? Good spot. It does actually fit with the idea of what the Vhenadahl tree represents to the city elves, as they say it reminds them of Arlathan and that was said to be the centre/heart of elven civilisation. It is the "heart" of their community and symbol of unity in the face of adversity in the alienage, which is why those who wish to demoralise them always seem to start by destroying the Vhenadahl tree. In which case there could be a great deal of symbolism in that sequence of WIP images considering we start off with a dead (or winter hibernating: elves in uthenera) tree and end with an actual corrupted beating heart.
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