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Post by colfoley on Dec 5, 2020 1:34:57 GMT
Well, time to put any hopes about the future of BioWare I had down. I agree this looks like damage control on EA's part (IMO) Hudson and Darrah forced departure, me? my expectations are little in the coming future they have a lot to prove to me before i will buy another game from them, Oh! by the way Hanako nice selection on your vid I love the Railgun/Accelerator series Its taken me two times through this to figure out what you meant by 'damage control'...but that seems unlikely in the extreme. It has been discussed over in the other thread, and while we do not know the exact time line of this, that Darrah and Hudson probably deicded to leave awhile ago but its just being announced now because it is the end of their year. Likewise the game awards has been in the works for awhile and so has probably their plans to show something at it. I mean it would strike me as insane if this was not the sequence of events here. Now while I am annoyed at them for not flipping the announcements, or wait until after TGAs to announce their departure, I just don't see any way under the sun that one is a 'panicked' damage controlled reaction to the other. These things take time to approve. Takes time to make a trailer, takes time for marketing to get on it and approve everything, and I would be shocked if TGAs just let them slide in last minute...so yeah even if these events are announced now they've probably been talked about for weeks or months.
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Post by Andrew Waples on Dec 5, 2020 1:54:25 GMT
I agree this looks like damage control on EA's part (IMO) Hudson and Darrah forced departure, me? my expectations are little in the coming future they have a lot to prove to me before i will buy another game from them, Oh! by the way Hanako nice selection on your vid I love the Railgun/Accelerator series Its taken me two times through this to figure out what you meant by 'damage control'...but that seems unlikely in the extreme. It has been discussed over in the other thread, and while we do not know the exact time line of this, that Darrah and Hudson probably deicded to leave awhile ago but its just being announced now because it is the end of their year. Likewise the game awards has been in the works for awhile and so has probably their plans to show something at it. I mean it would strike me as insane if this was not the sequence of events here. Now while I am annoyed at them for not flipping the announcements, or wait until after TGAs to announce their departure, I just don't see any way under the sun that one is a 'panicked' damage controlled reaction to the other. These things take time to approve. Takes time to make a trailer, takes time for marketing to get on it and approve everything, and I would be shocked if TGAs just let them slide in last minute...so yeah even if these events are announced now they've probably been talked about for weeks or months. Nah dude, doesn't fit the narrative of "EA bad". Honestly, if it was a "forced departure" there would be no reason to do it now... right before you're about to show something. It also doesn't look good when both leave at the same time. It doesn't make sense from a "EA bad" point of view.
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∯ Interjector in Chief
Staff Mini-Profile Theme: Heimdall
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition, Dragon Age The Veilguard
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Post by Heimdall on Dec 5, 2020 2:22:21 GMT
It would have to be the Inquisitor for only very limited sections, probably without combat, but they could be heavy on plot, character interaction, some revelations that can be relayed to Tevinter via Dorian’s sending Stone. I feel like that might work better as a DLC add-on? Think of it more as a story in parallel. As the new character advances their plot, we get sections where the Inquisitor uncovers related mysterious and such, heading toward a converging point at the end of the game.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Dec 5, 2020 2:24:52 GMT
Nah dude, doesn't fit the narrative of "EA bad". I've said how the situation was relayed to me and it doesn't look like an "EA bad". At least, not in this case. And I've no love for EA. It's just that EA is worried and when the management is worried, they want changes and those didn't clash well with the priorities that Casey had.
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The Elder King
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Post by The Elder King on Dec 5, 2020 4:18:41 GMT
Baldur's Gate 3 will have multiple pc options (1 blank slate/custom pc + 8 origin characters). If Larian can have 9 pc options, then Bioware could have 2, especially as it was Bioware that left the Inquisitor with a cliffhanger ending. I don’t really see it working in the context of DA4. The ‘origins’ plus blank slate in BG3 aren’t going to offer (as far as I know) a wildly different experience between each others. It wouldn’t be that different from the Origins system in DAO. A new PC offers a completely different experience from the Inquisitor. I’d say it’s far harder to implement it. Now, I do agree that the situation was complicated by themselves, with Trespasser. While I think a small part of the DAI players would’ve still be annoyed with a new PC, Tresspasser increase that number, obviously. They have an advantage in the fact that the game will be released years and years after DAI, and the vast majority of people won’t really care. I don’t think DA4 would be necessarily bad (or good, for that matter) with a new PC, but I can relate to those that wanted the Inquisitor, and I feel bad for them. I was always neutral either way, so this decision wasn’t going to affect me, but it sucks for the people in the first group.
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Post by Frost on Dec 5, 2020 5:31:25 GMT
I don’t really see it working in the context of DA4. The ‘origins’ plus blank slate in BG3 aren’t going to offer (as far as I know) a wildly different experience between each others. It wouldn’t be that different from the Origins system in DAO. A new PC offers a completely different experience from the Inquisitor. I’d say it’s far harder to implement it. I think if it would be harder or not depends on if BG3 ends up having fully voiced pcs or not. If it does, then that would mean 8 different pc voices for the origin characters + 4 for the blank slate (2 male + 2 female). If BG3 has silent pcs, then it would probably be less work.
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The Elder King
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Post by The Elder King on Dec 5, 2020 5:47:21 GMT
I don’t really see it working in the context of DA4. The ‘origins’ plus blank slate in BG3 aren’t going to offer (as far as I know) a wildly different experience between each others. It wouldn’t be that different from the Origins system in DAO. A new PC offers a completely different experience from the Inquisitor. I’d say it’s far harder to implement it. I think if it would be harder or not depends on if BG3 ends up having fully voiced pcs or not. If it does, then that would mean 8 different pc voices for the origin characters + 4 for the blank slate (2 male + 2 female). If BG3 has silent pcs, then it would probably be less work. Well, my reasoning wasn’t about the cost of VA, but more about the different situations of the two backgroujds for DA4, a new one and the Inquisitor. But yes, I was assuming the protagonist in BG3 will be silent. If they’re voiced, the cost would be quite high.
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Post by andydandymandy on Dec 5, 2020 7:18:44 GMT
I wonder if we are going to get a cinematic trailer that reveals who the protagonist is and who our companions are.
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The Elder King
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Post by The Elder King on Dec 5, 2020 7:32:16 GMT
I wonder if we are going to get a cinematic trailer that reveals who the protagonist is and who our companions are. For a trailer, a cinematic one is the best bet. I'd be really, really surprised if they'll give us actual in-game footage. I don't think they'll show us the full party. At best, the'll give some glimpse of possible ones.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Dec 5, 2020 8:14:19 GMT
I think that is most likely. A playable secondary protagonist costs too much time and money to include also newcomers won´t care.
Also the Inquisitor is only needed at the final Solas confrontation. I really doubt that most player want to play through minor stuff as Inquisitor to get to this point.
Honestly I have adopted an 'all or nothing' approach' when it comes to this. Either the Inquisitor will be all the protagonist all the time or the new protagonist will be the protagonist all the time. Given the reaction to Hawke's appearance in DAI I really think BioWare would be best served by having the Inquisitor not actually physically appear in DA 4, especially when it comes to the costs and some other issues with it to. At best now that it looks EXTREMELY likely we will get a new protagonist at best all I want from my Inquisitor is a letter to the newbie. Otherwise let them stay the hell away from Tevinter. *** I am oging to be mildly annoyed that after all this hype and waiting the new title for DA 4 will be...Dragon Age 4. So they still utterly bastardize the previous protagonist from how they were, this time making them a useless lying bum going from wanting to stop Solas to “Eh, you take care of it.”
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Post by colfoley on Dec 5, 2020 8:25:55 GMT
Honestly I have adopted an 'all or nothing' approach' when it comes to this. Either the Inquisitor will be all the protagonist all the time or the new protagonist will be the protagonist all the time. Given the reaction to Hawke's appearance in DAI I really think BioWare would be best served by having the Inquisitor not actually physically appear in DA 4, especially when it comes to the costs and some other issues with it to. At best now that it looks EXTREMELY likely we will get a new protagonist at best all I want from my Inquisitor is a letter to the newbie. Otherwise let them stay the hell away from Tevinter. *** I am oging to be mildly annoyed that after all this hype and waiting the new title for DA 4 will be...Dragon Age 4. So they still utterly bastardize the previous protagonist from how they were, this time making them a useless lying bum going from wanting to stop Silas to “Eh, you take care of it.” No.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Dec 5, 2020 8:28:03 GMT
So they still utterly bastardize the previous protagonist from how they were, this time making them a useless lying bum going from wanting to stop Silas to “Eh, you take care of it.” No. Yes. That’s exactly what you described wanting to become of them.
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Post by colfoley on Dec 5, 2020 8:31:42 GMT
Yes. That’s exactly what you described wanting to become of them. No it isnt either. My Inquisitor is off enjoying semi retirement with Cullen. And since they weren't a Templar... No lyrium addiction. And since they already fought against one god, yes they are quite willing to let someone do.the heavy lifting next time.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Dec 5, 2020 8:34:20 GMT
Yes. That’s exactly what you described wanting to become of them. No it isnt either. My Inquisitor is off enjoying semi retirement with Cullen. And since they weren't a Templar... No lyrium addiction. And since they already fought against one god, yes they are quite willing to let someone do.the heavy lifting next time. So as I said, they went from wanting to stop Solas to being a liar and now being a useless bum letting someone else save the world (that includes their retirement place btw). So thank you for proving my point.
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Post by gervaise21 on Dec 5, 2020 8:56:09 GMT
Yes. That’s exactly what you described wanting to become of them. I still think the Inquisitor is going to be involved in some way but more likely one step removed the majority of the time with Dorian acting as intermediary. (Although they would need to explain how that worked with an Inquisitor who Dorian hated and never gave a sending crystal to). We know the Shadow Inquisition is still an entity and that Solas knows they are working against him. So the declaration at the end of Trespasser that they need to find people that Solas doesn't know does make a new PC fit with that. What I have always wondered is how and when they will be connected to the Inquisitor and/or discover about Solas and his plans. I've speculated before that the Inquisitor could be like TIM in ME2 with a visual presence and definitely pulling the strings, including sending dossiers about people they recommend trying to get as part of their team. You are then left free to decide how much you develop those relationships and that will impact on the ultimate success of your mission to stop Solas. At the end of ME2 TIM also wanted Shepard to act in one way but you could go against that and cut your ties. In this case this decision would be made before your final confrontation. May be the Inquisitor would even join the story in person at that time but either as an ally or trying to resolve things in a different way. It is also possible that if the team are being given code names to hide them from Solas, the Inquisitor could also return under a different name.
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Post by ClarkKent on Dec 5, 2020 9:11:40 GMT
Solas told the Inquisitor to go home and be a family man.
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Post by Andraste_Reborn on Dec 5, 2020 10:01:57 GMT
Hey, there's always a chance DA4 opens with Solas deciding the Inquisitor is too much trouble and killing them after all!
(Or - and this is my current pet theory and favourite option - turning them to stone. Takes them out of the narrative and explains why a new protagonist is needed, and that way they can be un-stoned at the end. We already know the process is potentially survivable from Isabela's side-quest during Mark of the Assassin.)
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The Elder King
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Post by The Elder King on Dec 5, 2020 10:07:15 GMT
Hey, there's always a chance DA4 opens with Solas deciding the Inquisitor is too much trouble and killing them after all! (Or - and this is my current pet theory and favourite option - turning them to stone. Takes them out of the narrative and explains why a new protagonist is needed, and that way they can be un-stoned at the end. We already know the process is potentially survivable from Isabela's side-quest during Mark of the Assassin.) While I think that both are possible, I doubt that many that wanted the Inquisitor back would be fine with them, especially the first. The second feels a bit like a cheap solution to the problem. I doubt we’ll know the Inquisitor’s fate before release, though. Well, unless they want to shock everyone by having them killed/stoned in the reveal trailer.
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cuthbertbeckett
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Post by cuthbertbeckett on Dec 5, 2020 10:43:21 GMT
I still think the Inquisitor is going to be involved in some way but more likely one step removed the majority of the time with Dorian acting as intermediary. (Although they would need to explain how that worked with an Inquisitor who Dorian hated and never gave a sending crystal to). Simple because this intermediary isn´t Dorian. I believe its a lot more likely that this person is Charter and or Harding. I can imagine that Charter is the leader of the Inquisition forces in Tevinter and Harding is our party connection to the Inquisition. This works for all of the possible world states unlike Dorian who can like you said hate the Inquisitor or never be recruited.
Dorian´s DA 4 role is that the he is the leader of the Lucerni faction and therefore he can´t join the DA 4 party. I know that you can say the same thing about Maevaris but i am sure Bioware find a way to explain why she joins the DA 4 party unlike Dorian.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Dec 5, 2020 13:07:58 GMT
Yes. That’s exactly what you described wanting to become of them. I still think the Inquisitor is going to be involved in some way but more likely one step removed the majority of the time with Dorian acting as intermediary. (Although they would need to explain how that worked with an Inquisitor who Dorian hated and never gave a sending crystal to). We know the Shadow Inquisition is still an entity and that Solas knows they are working against him. So the declaration at the end of Trespasser that they need to find people that Solas doesn't know does make a new PC fit with that. What I have always wondered is how and when they will be connected to the Inquisitor and/or discover about Solas and his plans. I've speculated before that the Inquisitor could be like TIM in ME2 with a visual presence and definitely pulling the strings, including sending dossiers about people they recommend trying to get as part of their team. You are then left free to decide how much you develop those relationships and that will impact on the ultimate success of your mission to stop Solas. At the end of ME2 TIM also wanted Shepard to act in one way but you could go against that and cut your ties. In this case this decision would be made before your final confrontation. May be the Inquisitor would even join the story in person at that time but either as an ally or trying to resolve things in a different way. It is also possible that if the team are being given code names to hide them from Solas, the Inquisitor could also return under a different name. Sounds awful. Except that last part of it means protagonist, but it doesn’t.
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Post by gervaise21 on Dec 5, 2020 14:03:54 GMT
Dorian´s DA 4 role is that the he is the leader of the Lucerni faction and therefore he can´t join the DA 4 party. I do think he will be our Tevinter contact if nothing else. They were so determined to send him back to Tevinter, even killing off his father to give him a personal reason and increase his status. As you say, Maevaris could have been left as the sole founder of the Lucerni and our Magister contact, so I'm sure they have some sort of role planned for Dorian other than as a returning companion (which I think highly unlikely and I personally wouldn't want). He is far more likely to be in an advisory capacity and quest setter, either on behalf of the Inquisition or Lucerni.
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Post by Buckeldemon on Dec 5, 2020 14:09:12 GMT
What I have always wondered is how and when they will be connected to the Inquisitor and/or discover about Solas and his plans. I've speculated before that the Inquisitor could be like TIM in ME2 with a visual presence and definitely pulling the strings, including sending dossiers about people they recommend trying to get as part of their team. You are then left free to decide how much you develop those relationships and that will impact on the ultimate success of your mission to stop Solas. At the end of ME2 TIM also wanted Shepard to act in one way but you could go against that and cut your ties. In this case this decision would be made before your final confrontation. May be the Inquisitor would even join the story in person at that time but either as an ally or trying to resolve things in a different way. If this is at least vaguely like ME2 and we are getting a TIMquisitor and I could decide how TIMquisitor acts, I have a ton of ideas what my Lavellan would do to shoehorn people into falling for pointless traps and railroading them with hackjob dialogue apart from all the assassination of player character agency that could be possible. New PC: "Yes, imma stop Solas at all costs!!!!!" TIMquisitor: "Yup. There's the outfit Solas likes for lovemaking over there. Get going."
If it is more like what I think Bioware would do (and what is more in-line with TIM), we would surely get a ridiculously zealous andrastian human muggle who experiments on mages and qunari for the lolz, who uses us to have all elves and tons of infidels exterminated by the end of DA4. And in the back, we would have characters like Sister Mother Petrice and Lam(e)bert fume in jealousy.
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Post by cuthbertbeckett on Dec 5, 2020 14:15:58 GMT
I'm sure they have some sort of role planned for Dorian other than as a returning companion (which I think highly unlikely and I personally wouldn't want). He is far more likely to be in an advisory capacity and quest setter, either on behalf of the Inquisition or Lucerni If Dorian hasn´t a romance in DAI of course he would be back as our returning companion but Bioware won´t use former romances as companions. So Dorian has to be a major NPC.
And to Maevaris: if both Dorian and Mae are Lucerni leaders and allies to Inquisition as major NPCs one of them would feel redundant because they both are too similiar to eachother. Also i believe its time that we get our first transgender companion in a Bioware game. And is there any better character than Mae? I don´t think so. The greatest thing about besides been herself is that already exists for many years and therefore that she doesn´t looked forced like a new character.
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Post by swbrandt on Dec 5, 2020 16:39:30 GMT
I don’t really see it working in the context of DA4. The ‘origins’ plus blank slate in BG3 aren’t going to offer (as far as I know) a wildly different experience between each others. It wouldn’t be that different from the Origins system in DAO. A new PC offers a completely different experience from the Inquisitor. I’d say it’s far harder to implement it. I think if it would be harder or not depends on if BG3 ends up having fully voiced pcs or not. If it does, then that would mean 8 different pc voices for the origin characters + 4 for the blank slate (2 male + 2 female). If BG3 has silent pcs, then it would probably be less work. I've been playing a lot of BG3 in Early Access and so far (granted it's at least a year from release) it doesn't look to have a fully voiced PC. The PC's dialog is almost exclusively text only. I can remember one spot where my PC had voiced lines that were animated (and it wasn't chosen dialog, it was a scripted remark). There are also places that the PC voices a reaction to their environment. But if they're going to make all the dialog voiced for all those potential origin characters plus the four (2 male, 2 female) custom PC voices... this game is not going to come out in a year. I don't think it's at all likely, given the design they have implemented so far.
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frost
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire
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Post by Frost on Dec 5, 2020 16:55:28 GMT
I've been playing a lot of BG3 in Early Access and so far (granted it's at least a year from release) it doesn't look to have a fully voiced PC. The PC's dialog is almost exclusively text only. I can remember one spot where my PC had voiced lines that were animated (and it wasn't chosen dialog, it was a scripted remark). There are also places that the PC voices a reaction to their environment. But if they're going to make all the dialog voiced for all those potential origin characters plus the four (2 male, 2 female) custom PC voices... this game is not going to come out in a year. I don't think it's at all likely, given the design they have implemented so far. The Reddit AMA made it seem like BG3 pcs would be fully voiced, but maybe they changed their mind or I misunderstood?
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