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Post by Son of Dorn on Jan 13, 2021 17:45:08 GMT
Lol, I'm still trying to work out how this supposed "indestructible skeleton" would even exist in the lore. Cause that should be impossible given how the technological trap in Mass Effect is supposed to keep everyone on the same level. Well In Mass Effect, We do have Eldritch Abominations that override our sense of reality. Our definition of Indestructible is borderline meaningless compared to Reapers and their tier of Technology. Reaper can basicly say to Milk way Galaxy species to shut up and sit down. Logic doesn't apply to Eldritch Abominations in general for they no-sell Logic. Also You can write a story of the underdogs winning logically against Eldritch Abominations with or without Deus Ex Machina aka something like the Crucible without negating the nature of said Eldritch Abomination or the Lore of the Story. Lol, while we're at it why not write in that everyone has a unicorn gun that shoots out rainbows out of its rear end and makes a cartoon farting sound every time you fire it. That'd make the game more fun. 😆🤣
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Post by Little Bengel on Jan 13, 2021 17:50:30 GMT
The level of pedantry I'm seeing here is absolutely lul-worthy. Only on the BSN do I get to see this. I consider internal consistency to be important to the setting. I wouldn't call it "pendantry". The Crucible itself is inconsistent enough in its function as it is. Let's not make it any worse. Cool. Wasn't talking about the Crucible. That shit was already played out half a year after ME3 dropped. Shepard's skeleton was the subject, and whether or not "indestructible" qualifies as a literal statement or as a manner of speaking. Which leads to potential pedantry.
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Post by feuerrabe on Jan 13, 2021 18:05:07 GMT
But in order to be classed as the best, you'd need to surpass the one before you. That statement does not make sense. Anderson might have been the best special forces soldier that mankind had to offer, but he isn't any more. Shepard is the best. We know that from Anderson as he put pitches Shepard, which is the first thing that happens in Mass Effect. Besides that, it's not strictly relevant whether Shepard is the best special forces soldier or amongst the best to determine that he's clearly amongst the absolute elite right from the start of the game. If you don't like the term super soldier, fine, call it something else. The point was to examine the differences between Ryder and Shepard - Ryder is just an average guy or gal who stumbles into shoes way too big for them, by inheriting the connection to SAM and thus becoming the Pathfinder, even though Kora should have been next in line. Ryder is nowhere near as experienced and confident. Ryder has some military training (there are some dialogue options that suggest that, anyway, even though they seemed optional), but is not anywhere near Shepard's level at the beginning of the game.
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Post by LogicGunn on Jan 13, 2021 18:11:40 GMT
I'm open minded, but skeptical that they could pull off having Shepard come back. I'm also skeptical of whatever contrived resolution they would have to come up with to explain away the possible endings to the trilogy, and the hoo-ha that would com from Bioware picking a canon choice.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Jan 13, 2021 18:14:46 GMT
But in order to be classed as the best, you'd need to surpass the one before you. That statement does not make sense. Anderson might have been the best special forces soldier that mankind had to offer, but he isn't any more. Shepard is the best. We know that from Anderson as he put pitches Shepard, which is the first thing that happens in Mass Effect. Besides that, it's not strictly relevant whether Shepard is the best special forces soldier or amongst the best to determine that he's clearly amongst the absolute elite right from the start of the game. If you don't like the term super soldier, fine, call it something else. The point was to examine the differences between Ryder and Shepard - Ryder is just an average guy or gal who stumbles into shoes way too big for them, by inheriting the connection to SAM and thus becoming the Pathfinder, even though Kora should have been next in line. Ryder is nowhere near as experienced and confident. Ryder has some military training (there are some dialogue options that suggest that, anyway, even though they seemed optional), but is not anywhere near Shepard's level at the beginning of the game. You can't claim be the best if someone else is already considered to be the best, otherwise every one would say that they're the best at everything. Shepard's only done, what, one noticeable thing in their carrier (good or bad depending on what background you pick for Shepard). How many has Anderson done in his carrier?
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Post by Phantom on Jan 13, 2021 18:25:12 GMT
Well In Mass Effect, We do have Eldritch Abominations that override our sense of reality. Our definition of Indestructible is borderline meaningless compared to Reapers and their tier of Technology. Reaper can basicly say to Milk way Galaxy species to shut up and sit down. Logic doesn't apply to Eldritch Abominations in general for they no-sell Logic. Also You can write a story of the underdogs winning logically against Eldritch Abominations with or without Deus Ex Machina aka something like the Crucible without negating the nature of said Eldritch Abomination or the Lore of the Story. Lol, while we're at it why not write in that everyone has a unicorn gun that shoots out rainbows out of its rear end and makes a cartoon farting sound every time you fire it. That'd make the game more fun. 😆🤣 Well that would be fun.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Jan 13, 2021 18:28:11 GMT
Lol, while we're at it why not write in that everyone has a unicorn gun that shoots out rainbows out of its rear end and makes a cartoon farting sound every time you fire it. That'd make the game more fun. 😆🤣 Well that would be fun. Plus it's already been done (there's a gun in Red Fraction 4 that you can find that does that).
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Post by Cyberstrike on Jan 13, 2021 18:38:47 GMT
Indestructible adj. not able to be destroyed. So....? The level of pedantry I'm seeing here is absolutely lul-worthy. Only on the BSN do I get to see this.
You want to see some real funny pedantry go find a debate about classic vs. modern Star Trek, Star Wars, or Doctor Who here or on forums dedicated to those franchises and you will see this thread becomes a well though out and nuanced debate over Mass Effect, Dragon Age, and BioWare games (and/or video games in general) goes.
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Post by Little Bengel on Jan 13, 2021 18:45:35 GMT
Are you forgetting the fact that Shepard was basically brought back to life as a super soldier? ME2 basically gives you multiple implants and cybernetics you can place into your body to make you a LITERAL super soldier. The Black Widow sniper rifle you get halfway through the game even says that the recoil is so strong, there's no way anyone but Shepard would be able to use it. No I'm not. Those implants don't class Shepard as a super soldier. Do they make him faster? No. Do they make Shepard able to punch a krogan so hard that they'll go flying? No. Can Shepard tank hits that'll kill a normal human? No. So Shepard can fire the Widow, so what? Every weapon in Mass Effect fires a round that is the size of a grain of sand. It's not like it's firing a 20mm anti tank round. So that's most likely Bioware not knowing how weapon recoil works. Edit: I almost forgot, Ryder can also fire a Widow sniper rifle and yet they don't have Shepard's cybernetics, as well as Ashley and Garrus in ME3. So that info that they said about Shepard being the only one that can use a Widow sniper rifle is BS. Shepard can headbutt a krogan in ME2 and send him reeling from it. I very much doubt a normal human could do it. Also, the lore for the Widow in ME3 and Andromeda states that a considerable fortune went into figuring out a way to have it retain its firepower while reducing its recoil to acceptable levels for regular old organics. Sure, it's a way to have it work for everyone in gameplay, but it works. The level of pedantry I'm seeing here is absolutely lul-worthy. Only on the BSN do I get to see this. You want to see some real funny pedantry go find a debate about classic vs. modern Star Trek, Star Wars, or Doctor Who here or on forums dedicated to those franchises and you will see this thread becomes a well though out and nuanced debate over Mass Effect, Dragon Age, and BioWare games (and/or video games in general) goes.
Please... I'd rather not lower my standards even more than I already have reading these lovely conversations.
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Post by feuerrabe on Jan 13, 2021 18:51:13 GMT
You can't claim be the best if someone else is already considered to be the best, otherwise every one would say that they're the best at everything. Shepard's only done, what, one noticeable thing in their carrier (good or bad depending on what background you pick for Shepard). How many has Anderson done in his carrier? No. For example: Once he's forty, Usain Bolt is not going to be the world's best sprinter any more, even if nobody beats his world record (and it doesn't seem likely that this record will be broken any time soon), there will be others that can sprint faster than him. With 34 it is already doubtful, if not outright impossible, for him to run as fast as he used to during past Olympic games.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Jan 13, 2021 18:58:46 GMT
You can't claim be the best if someone else is already considered to be the best, otherwise every one would say that they're the best at everything. Shepard's only done, what, one noticeable thing in their carrier (good or bad depending on what background you pick for Shepard). How many has Anderson done in his carrier? No. For example: Once he's forty, Usain Bolt is not going to be the world's best sprinter any more, even if nobody beats his world record, there will be others that can sprint faster than him. With 34 it is already doubtful, if not outright impossible, for him to run as fast as he used to during past Olympic games. The average lifespan in Mass Effect is increased due to modern medicine being improved (Ashley makes a comment about living past 120 to Liara in ME1).
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Post by Phantom on Jan 13, 2021 18:59:13 GMT
Plus it's already been done (there's a gun in Red Fraction 4 that you can find that does that). true. And game should be fun even if they don't make sense.
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Post by ahglock on Jan 13, 2021 19:12:44 GMT
It is not super clear either when you play through it, like I don't think you get Sams voice back until you arrive on Meridean. But Sam gets removed from Ryder1 via the bad guy, Sam begins talking to Ryder2 on the station and explains what is going on that without SAM Ryder1 will die. Ryder1 is twitching on the floor doing nothing. Ryder2 fights through the station to SAMS console hits a button and then it cut scenes back to Ryder1 who can stand but is jacked up and not fully in control.
They never explain it, but my take on it was SAM was basically back but focusing on repairs to get RYDER1 alive again, but its consciousness was stuck with RYDER2 though its processing power was available to RYDER1. But since they never explain it I think almost anything can be interpreted from the scenes.
On my last playthrough I made out a difference for the first time. My powers functioned well during the last mission - of course - but the profile (infiltrator) didn't. No seeing of enemies highlighted in red when zooming... So I think, the connection to SAM is still not fully "repaired" during the final mission. Also in the epilogue it's said that Ryder technically doesn't need SAM anymore, but that SAM of course helps him/her. Interesting, I never noticed that. But I was playing adept and its easy to miss a lack of echos, or that your jetpack is back as opposed to biotic "flight". That he no longer needs him part is a bit vague as previously he needed him just to live. Is that the only part he no longer needs? Been probably 2 years since I finished the game its starting to get fuzzy.
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Post by Little Bengel on Jan 13, 2021 19:15:03 GMT
On the superhuman argument: I am also befuddled at the fact that CG apparently forgot that Shepard punches a yahg in LotSB. The idiocy of it all.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Jan 13, 2021 19:20:20 GMT
On the superhuman argument: I am also befuddled at the fact that CG apparently forgot that Shepard punches a yahg in LotSB. The idiocy of it all. No I didn't because I didn't care for that DLC. Plus I never played it. Also, Shepard punched a yahg, so what? I bet that yahg's are just another weak race that's supposed to be tough. The idiocy of not asking. 😆
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Post by Little Bengel on Jan 13, 2021 19:24:13 GMT
On the superhuman argument: I am also befuddled at the fact that CG apparently forgot that Shepard punches a yahg in LotSB. The idiocy of it all. No I didn't because I didn't care for that DLC. Plus I never played it. Also, Shepard punched a yahg, so what? I bet that yahg's are just another weak race that's supposed to be tough. The idiocy of not asking. 😆 Wow, that was fast. Google it.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Jan 13, 2021 19:27:41 GMT
No I didn't because I didn't care for that DLC. Plus I never played it. Also, Shepard punched a yahg, so what? I bet that yahg's are just another weak race that's supposed to be tough. The idiocy of not asking. 😆 Wow, that was fast. Google it. Nah, I've got better things to do then waste my time. Plus I'm not invested in your beloved franchise anymore.
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Post by themikefest on Jan 13, 2021 19:28:43 GMT
ah yes, punching the yahg. What about arrival? Shepard punches guards wearing helmets knocking them out. Hmmm. That's it. The ending to ME3. Shepard defeats reapers by using the power of the punch. Never needed some stupid looking giant microphone to stop the reapers.
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Post by traks on Jan 13, 2021 20:07:47 GMT
On my last playthrough I made out a difference for the first time. My powers functioned well during the last mission - of course - but the profile (infiltrator) didn't. No seeing of enemies highlighted in red when zooming... So I think, the connection to SAM is still not fully "repaired" during the final mission. Also in the epilogue it's said that Ryder technically doesn't need SAM anymore, but that SAM of course helps him/her. Interesting, I never noticed that. But I was playing adept and its easy to miss a lack of echos, or that your jetpack is back as opposed to biotic "flight". That he no longer needs him part is a bit vague as previously he needed him just to live. Is that the only part he no longer needs? Been probably 2 years since I finished the game its starting to get fuzzy. Yeah, it's vague. A vid I could find, but unfortunately not the option taken I was referencing to:
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Post by biggydx on Jan 13, 2021 20:41:32 GMT
Wow, that was fast. Google it. Nah, I've got better things to do then waste my time. Plus I'm not invested in your beloved franchise anymore. At this point, you're definitely fucking with us (lol). I'm still partially tilted about you thinking Shepard isn't superhuman. Like, for real. Heres three different cybernetic upgrades he gets: Skeleton LatticeBy reinforcing the skeleton with a synthetic weave, bones can be made almost unbreakable. In the event of bone trauma, medi-gel conduits allow for bone regenerations in a matter of days. Microfiber WeavePerforating the muscles with micro-fibers increases overall strength and decreases the potential for muscle damage from exertion. Lattice ShuntingStrong synthetic fibers can be woven through the skin, dramatically reducing damage taken from most attacks. These fibers also act as a medi-gel conduit, improving healing. How does none of this scream supersoldier?
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Post by Son of Dorn on Jan 13, 2021 20:49:47 GMT
Nah, I've got better things to do then waste my time. Plus I'm not invested in your beloved franchise anymore. At this point, you're definitely fucking with us (lol). I'm still partially tilted about you thinking Shepard isn't superhuman. Like, for real. Heres three different cybernetic upgrades he gets: Skeleton LatticeBy reinforcing the skeleton with a synthetic weave, bones can be made almost unbreakable. In the event of bone trauma, medi-gel conduits allow for bone regenerations in a matter of days. Microfiber WeavePerforating the muscles with micro-fibers increases overall strength and decreases the potential for muscle damage from exertion. Lattice ShuntingStrong synthetic fibers can be woven through the skin, dramatically reducing damage taken from most attacks. These fibers also act as a medi-gel conduit, improving healing. How does none of this scream supersoldier? About being invested in the franchise? No, that ship sailed 9 years ago. Shepard being a supersoldier? Also no. If you don't know I'm a big fan of the Astartes (Space Marines), and those guys are supersoldiers. Shepard doesn't hold a candle to them in terms of ability and bio tech force enhancement. You may call Shepard a supersoldier (which is cool), but in my eyes all I see is a cyborg.
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Post by biggydx on Jan 13, 2021 20:52:25 GMT
At this point, you're definitely fucking with us (lol). I'm still partially tilted about you thinking Shepard isn't superhuman. Like, for real. Heres three different cybernetic upgrades he gets: Skeleton LatticeBy reinforcing the skeleton with a synthetic weave, bones can be made almost unbreakable. In the event of bone trauma, medi-gel conduits allow for bone regenerations in a matter of days. Microfiber WeavePerforating the muscles with micro-fibers increases overall strength and decreases the potential for muscle damage from exertion. Lattice ShuntingStrong synthetic fibers can be woven through the skin, dramatically reducing damage taken from most attacks. These fibers also act as a medi-gel conduit, improving healing. How does none of this scream supersoldier? About being invested in the franchise? No, that ship sailed 9 years ago. Shepard being a supersoldier? Also no. If you don't know I'm a big fan of the Astartes (Space Marines), and those guys are supersoldiers. Shepard doesn't hold a candle to them in terms of ability and bio tech force enhancement. You may call Shepard a supersoldier (which is cool), but in my eyes all I see is a cyborg. Its all good man. I know some people just didnt like how things ended. At this point, I'm just trying to have some fun since today's work is kinda boring. Now I'm just being silly. Edit: To put this whole super soldier thing to rest, it's not that I dont get what you're saying. But you're also comparing apples to oranges. Also, when I think of supersoldier, I'm thinking of someone who exceeds what is possible for a typical human (even at peak performance). Now is Shepard the stronger super soldier across all forms of media? No.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Jan 13, 2021 20:57:50 GMT
About being invested in the franchise? No, that ship sailed 9 years ago. Shepard being a supersoldier? Also no. If you don't know I'm a big fan of the Astartes (Space Marines), and those guys are supersoldiers. Shepard doesn't hold a candle to them in terms of ability and bio tech force enhancement. You may call Shepard a supersoldier (which is cool), but in my eyes all I see is a cyborg. Its all good man. I know some people just didnt like how things ended. At this point, I'm just trying to have some fun since today's work is kinda boring. Now I'm just being silly. Cool beans. I basically just mainline my old hobby since the days of ME3. So I'm not really bothered about it anymore.
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Post by Little Bengel on Jan 13, 2021 21:01:38 GMT
You may call Shepard a supersoldier (which is cool), but in my eyes all I see is a cyborg. And what's the difference?
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Post by feuerrabe on Jan 13, 2021 21:11:23 GMT
The one is a person with synthetic spare parts and/or extended capabilities, the other is an outstanding soldier
Curiously, pop culture changed our understanding of the word "cyborg" changed drastically since it was first introduced. I heard a definition once that it might simply refer to a human wearing a space suit and by extension a human wearing glasses, the idea that the enhancement had to built in came later.
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