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Post by cuthbertbeckett on Mar 24, 2021 10:53:24 GMT
Precisely the opposite. Charade being in the story is a great way to involve Bethany and Carver. First off the link is fixed and second Bioware prefers to bring not quantum characters like Bethany and Carver because of their different fates. Like i said they could be dead (extra death option lets Meredith kill Bethany), circle mage, templar and warden. And don´t forgot the different faces options!!!
Also your Bethany or Carver might be a warden but for many others she / he is not. And in canon world state without importing from the DA Keep which were many (mostly new players) use Carver is a templar.
And this possibilities Bioware have to consider if its worth to bring Bethany and Carver back.
To Charade: Yes they are cousins but Charade also works on her own like gervaise21 already pointed out.
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Post by mattjamho on Mar 25, 2021 18:53:49 GMT
I’d like to see a Fenris cameo, and I could see Isabela showing up again. Varric is a given after the trailer.
Outside of those, I’m not interested in seeing anyone else in Tevinter/Northern Thedas. To many returning characters can make a world feel small.
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Post by fairdragon on Mar 28, 2021 12:43:58 GMT
Mostly due to the reaction of what happened with Mass Effect 3 where there were a lot of complaints about how many characters returned for I just don't think a simple cameo would suffice. In my opinion Bioware did a fine job with Mass Effect 3 in this regard. Of course everyone wants her favourites back but almost all apperances are good. Some more than others but overall i personal
was only really let down with Zaeed and Morinth.
Also they did a fine job with the replacements. Wreav and especially Padok Wiks are on their own interessing characters. So i don´t see why i won´t be possible to create an interessing Fog Warrior as replacement for Fenris if he was killed or returned to Danarius.
Edit: Bioware also had done this in DAI with Hawke warden contact who could be Alistair, Loghain or Stroud. The only problem with Stroud was that he hadn´t been that flesh out like Alistair or Loghain. He should have more memorable scenes and lines.
And the best of it. They would use the keep that way. and i would love to have greater differences between the worlds state.
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Post by fairdragon on Mar 28, 2021 13:09:33 GMT
Yeah, why not? It's Merrill, being naïve and credulous is her strong suit. And she is also too Dalish to join forces with Fen´Harel / Solas. Also tell me why DA 4 need more Merrill drama? If Merrill joins Solas what do you expect to happen? Of course we have to kill Merrill and so no just no to this idea.
a stupid question from me: how is merrill supposed to know that Solas is fen'harel? I think i forgot somethink from trespasser. Can you help me please. The only people who know this are the Inquisition main responsible and they won't reveal it to everyone.
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Post by Buckeldemon on Mar 28, 2021 13:49:12 GMT
how is merrill supposed to know that Solas is fen'harel? I think i forgot somethink from trespasser. Can you help me please. The only people who know this are the Inquisition main responsible and they won't reveal it to everyone. One could argue that Varric told her. TN also gave me personally the impression that there is a fair number of people that have been informed beyond just the Inquisition's Inner Circle of party members+advisers+Charter.
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cuthbertbeckett
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Post by cuthbertbeckett on Mar 28, 2021 13:50:34 GMT
a stupid question from me: how is merrill supposed to know that Solas is fen'harel? I think i forgot somethink from trespasser. Can you help me please. The only people who know this are the Inquisition main responsible and they won't reveal it to everyone.
Isn´t the obvious? Of course Varric or Isabela will warn Merrill. Both are very protective in regard to Merrill. Varric is befriended with almost every DA 2 party member so yeah he will inform everyone except Anders / Justice and Sebastian. But maybe he has a very good day then he will talk with Sebastian.
I don´t think that Solas = Fen´Harel is during DA 4 a big secret.
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Post by wright1978 on Mar 28, 2021 14:55:35 GMT
how is merrill supposed to know that Solas is fen'harel? I think i forgot somethink from trespasser. Can you help me please. The only people who know this are the Inquisition main responsible and they won't reveal it to everyone. One could argue that Varric told her. TN also gave me personally the impression that there is a fair number of people that have been informed beyond just the Inquisition's Inner Circle of party members+advisers+Charter. Varric probably told the enitety of the Hanged Man.
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Post by cuthbertbeckett on Mar 28, 2021 15:12:46 GMT
Leliana will very likely also infom Zevran & Sketch (if he isn´t a Solas spy) plus the (elven) Warden & family. Also the Inquisition allies maybe King Alistair / Queen Anora plus Celene, Briala and / or Gaspard.
So yeah everyone will know who Solas is.
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Post by fairdragon on Mar 28, 2021 15:36:06 GMT
So yeah everyone will know who Solas is. i doubt that, the more you inform, the more solas has in mind. And maybe you can't control what happens, if people take own action and make it worse.
Yes i get by now that they will inform some, but all. I think solas spies are not to be underestimated and when you want someone to live in peace, maybe as protection. I don't know. But thanks to all for the answers.
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Post by Buckeldemon on Mar 28, 2021 16:01:32 GMT
So yeah everyone will know who Solas is. i doubt that, the more you inform, the more solas has in mind. And maybe you can't control what happens, if people take own action and make it worse
Yeah, this. To wit, I care less about Solas than more about what some humans or Qunari might do if the they go "elves=Solas worshippers". Also the Inquisition allies maybe King Alistair / Queen Anora plus Celene, Briala and / or Gaspard. ... oh, and that's where I usually check out. Briala, okay. But Gaspard? Or Celene who probably still has the smell of burned alienage in stuck in her hair? Nah. The less andrastian nobles know about it, the lower the chance of full-blown elficide. Sure, there are some people who should not get ideas as well ("nice bigots" such as Cassandra), but that's kinda too late.
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Post by gervaise21 on Mar 28, 2021 20:39:00 GMT
how is merrill supposed to know that Solas is fen'harel? i doubt that, the more you inform, the more solas has in mind. And maybe you can't control what happens, if people take own action and make it worse. This is what the epilogue said: After the events at the Winter Palace, elves left the Inquisition under mysterious circumstances, as did elven servants across Thedas. None could say where they went, but those who believed the Inquisitor's story about Fen'Harel wondered just how large the Dread Wolf's forces were... and what the ancient elven rebel had plannedClearly more people were told than just the inner circle because I hardly think they would have doubted the Inquisitor's word. However, of those beyond the inner circle clearly it was something not readily believed. Clearly they couldn't miss elves disappearing and may well have thought the idea of some crazy elf claiming to be a god was believable but the rest of it? I think quite a few people would find that a rather hard truth to swallow, particularly since the Chantry has been pushing their version of history down everyone's throat for the last 900 years and that doesn't have a place in it for elves or their heretical myths. Likewise, would the majority of Tevinter Altus be willing to credit that not only their conquest of Arlathan wasn't against the might of the elven empire but a poor remnant of it but that a survivor of the ancient elves had credited himself with creating the Veil. Still, I agree with others that those connected with Varric would likely be told and that would include Merrill. It has also been apparent from Tevinter Nights that the agents of Solas have been going around for a number of years trying to recruit likely additions to their number, so Merrill may have been targeted for an approach but had been forewarned by Varric and so did not fall for their propaganda. Various groups have also had run-ins with either agents of Fen'Harel or the Dread Wolf himself and so an awareness of him would have spread through gossip. Even if people didn't believe his claim to be an elven god, the evidence is there that he does have command of many spirits of the Fade and is capable of the old Dreamer ability to slay his enemies in their sleep, so it is likely that more astute mages will be warding themselves from his influence. Whilst knowledge of Fen'Harel could cause a backlash against elves, wise rulers would do better to actively cultivate their loyalty. If the original message was passed on that all modern races were going to die if his plans reach fruition, that might well give the city elves pause for thought provided their situation wasn't so dire it made no difference either way. I would have thought any Dalish would heed their own legends and remember that Fen'Harel is known as a trickster who cannot be trusted. Seeing as his own story confirmed he was responsible for shutting away the elven gods, they would be well advised to treat any friendly approaches by his agents with caution.
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Post by legbamel on Mar 31, 2021 16:29:37 GMT
I would argue that Solas is smart enough to act through intermediaries and that not everyone who is "helping" him knows it. This is where I can see Merrill getting roped in, thinking she's helping the Dalish. I got the impression from other media that this is the case for other elves, though I can't remember if it's explicitly stated anywhere.
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Post by gervaise21 on Mar 31, 2021 17:58:14 GMT
I got the impression from other media that this is the case for other elves, though I can't remember if it's explicitly stated anywhere. According to the Carta dwarf telling the story, there was that Dalish elf in The Dread Wolf Take You who claimed that he knew about the idol from a dream. I'm not entirely sure if the elf was knowingly working with the agents of Fen'Harel or not. So it could have been a Dalish elf thinking he was working towards freeing his gods based entirely on his dream, without knowing who gave him that dream, or it could have just been a story that he came up with for the Carta that had been suggested to him by his fellow Wolf Pack members, since they seemed saddened by his death and one of them said "May the Dread Wolf guide your soul to peace, brother", which definitely makes it seem like he was one of their own.
We know from the previous story, Half Up Front, that Fen'Harel cultists had been going round trying to recruit modern elves, although in this case it was a city elf rather than a Dalish. It did seem to be with the promise of restoring Elvhenan, without necessarily explaining exactly how this is going to be accomplished.
It would seem Dalish have been heading in the direction of Arlathan Forest for some time, if Strife's clan actually was a true Dalish one and not simply a "free elf" clan, which could point to them joining up with Fen'Harel. However, in the short story Ruin of Reality it would seem they are being influenced by other forces, may be even those in opposition to Fen'Harel, so I suppose we shall just have to wait and see.
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Post by Remmirath on Apr 3, 2021 21:16:18 GMT
The only ones that I would want to see are characters who, no matter what happened in DA2, still make sense to be showing up again in any capacity without contradicting possible endings... and that's not very many. My preference would be none of them, but given the role that he played in Inquisition, I could see Varric making sense.
I certainly don't want to see another previous-PC cameo unless possibly we're actually put in control of them again. Cameos for any of the NPCs I could see, although hopefully less bug-ridden than in DA2, but really I'd rather only read about what they're doing.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Apr 3, 2021 21:57:23 GMT
The only ones that I would want to see are characters who, no matter what happened in DA2, still make sense to be showing up again in any capacity without contradicting possible endings... and that's not very many. My preference would be none of them, but given the role that he played in Inquisition, I could see Varric making sense. I certainly don't want to see another previous-PC cameo unless possibly we're actually put in control of them again. Cameos for any of the NPCs I could see, although hopefully less bug-ridden than in DA2, but really I'd rather only read about what they're doing. Agree with the part about the former PCs. Disagree about Varric making sense, since last we saw he is running a city.
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Post by cuthbertbeckett on Apr 5, 2021 14:56:15 GMT
Well with the latest trailer and the line: "I´ve got your back" is pretty hard to imagine that Varric isn´t featured in DA 4 at all. Therefore i would say that Varric is official confirmed to return. But i hope that he has a small cameo. If Bioware really needs a DA 2 character and Inquisition member / agent to return why not Isabela? Of course not as returning companion because she is a romance in DA 2 but she won´t feel overused like Varric.
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Post by gervaise21 on Apr 5, 2021 16:35:58 GMT
If Bioware really needs a DA 2 character and Inquisition member / agent to return why not Isabela? Of course not as returning companion because she is a romance in DA 2 but she won´t feel overused like Varric. I really can't see any reason why we need a character from a previous game with the next one set up north, well away from our previous haunts, so you wouldn't expect to see any former companions there, apart from Dorian because they made sure he was sent back to his homeland. It is now so long since the previous game most casual players will have all but forgotten characters from the other games anyway, whilst they will mean nothing to people totally new to the setting. she won´t feel overused like Varric. And yet there he is again, narrating the trailer and promising that "I've got your back". I find it ironic to think that had the Exalted March not been cancelled, Varric wouldn't be in a position to return because he would be dead. It is amazing how he could transform from "expendable character we can kill off" to "indispensable character you can't manage without." You know I never really understood why Cassandra needed to bring him to the Conclave. Why did he need to tell his story in person? Doesn't the Divine trust the word of her own right hand? As for the alternative story that the Divine was a fan of his work and wanted to meet him personally. Well, surely that would have been more appropriate when she was back in Val Royeaux and an easier journey for him from Kirkwall, rather than dragging him up to Haven during such an important set of negotiations? So I hope they come up with a better reason to involve him if he does turn up in Tevinter.
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Post by cuthbertbeckett on Apr 5, 2021 16:47:37 GMT
I really can't see any reason why we need a character from a previous game with the next one set up north, well away from our previous haunts, so you wouldn't expect to see any former companions there, apart from Dorian because they made sure he was sent back to his homeland We aren´t talking about a Aveline who doesn´t make sense in Tevinter but Isabela already had connections in Tevinter and maybe her homestate of Rivain could be a possible place to explore in DA 4. I really don´t think that DA 4 will only feature Tevinter.
Seheron and Weisshaupt are also very likely places to visit.
So yeah Isabela with her Rivain and Qunari connections could come back.
You can make the same argument for DAI why bring character XYZ back?
Of course every returning character will (hopeful) get a proper introduction.
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Post by gervaise21 on Apr 5, 2021 18:03:29 GMT
You can make the same argument for DAI why bring character XYZ back? That is what I mean. It would be better to have a clean slate of entirely new characters but Dorian at least makes sense given the focus of the action is likely going to be Tevinter and the fact that he always goes back there no matter what and is always made a Magister regardless of how you left things with his father, would seem to suggest they intend using him. I don't believe that Isabella had connections with Tevinter, apart from Maevaris/Varric which was only tenuous. Whilst they had the Crow characters sailing off back home in Tevinter Nights, I can only assume this was before the Qunari invaded because after that I would have thought the seaways would have been very dangerous indeed, particularly for those trying to sail round to and from Antiva. So Isabella would need a very strong incentive to risk her ship again. Still, I do concede that she has a better connection with people in Tevinter than most other characters from the previous games. The other one with the strongest connection from DA2 is, of course, Fenris but unlike Isabella he can be dead,, so notwithstanding his appearance in the comic series, I wouldn't expect to see him there except possibly in a cameo role, with an alternative placeholder character if he didn't survive and the plot requires it.
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Post by yarus on Apr 6, 2021 5:01:20 GMT
Please, no more Varric. It's bad enough that he stole the Viscount's seat from Hawke but Trespasser ruined his character via flanderization. "Hey Inquisitor, he's a key to the city! Who cares about Kirkwall's sovereignty and the key to the Harbor, aren't I silly and friendly?" I hope Fenris will appear in some capacity but if he does, I hope he has romance specific dialogue if Hawke is alive/dead. Honestly: both Merrill and Fenris should play some part, even if it's more wartably/sidequesty than being a full fledged companion. I agree with posters above who argued that Merrill wouldn't ever side with the dread wolf. She would never do that, especially after potentially losing her clan and seeing the cost of dealing with spirits
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Post by cuthbertbeckett on Apr 6, 2021 13:58:15 GMT
That is what I mean. It would be better to have a clean slate of entirely new characters but Dorian at least makes sense given the focus of the action is likely going to be Tevinter and the fact that he always goes back there no matter what and is always made a Magister regardless of how you left things with his father, would seem to suggest they intend using him. Of course Bioware want to use lesser quantum characters and focus more on those characters who aren´t quantum characters and also made sense to appear in Northern Thedas but i believe that are a good mix between old and new.
I think we can all agree that Solas, Dorian, Varric, Sten / Arishok, Calpernia, Harding, Charter and Fenris are official comfirmed or almost comfirmed to appear in someway in DA 4.
I would argue that The Iron Bull (mainly because of Dorian), Tallis, Gatt, Shale, Isabela and even Sera (why did she mentioned that she was in Minrathous after DAI?) have good chances.
And don´t forget the comic or the book characters like Maevaris, Archon Radonis , Rasaan or the Weisshaupt Last Flight characters. Its true that Isabela hasn´t that much connections with Tevinter but this wasn´t my point. Isabela is more connected with the Qunari.
Her own "mother" Hari is even a Qunari.
I agree but i think its pointless to discuss if Varric is in DA 4 or not after the latest trailer. Varric didn´t stole Viscount seat from Hawke because nobody wanted the job after Hawke left. Even Hawke. Also it was more the fault of the red templars not Varric that Hawke isn´t Vicomte anymore.
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Post by gervaise21 on Apr 6, 2021 17:02:26 GMT
Varric didn´t stole Viscount seat from Hawke because nobody wanted the job after Hawke left "Hey Inquisitor, he's a key to the city! Who cares about Kirkwall's sovereignty and the key to the Harbor, aren't I silly and friendly?" This was the part that I found most irritating about the Viscount Varris set up. I thought it was fair enough that once Hawke left the city probably no one else wanted the job, although in DA2 Act 3 it wasn't the fact that no one wanted to do it as much as Meredith wouldn't let them. However, having agreed to take on the role would anyone, much less an astute operator like Varric, just give away something integral to Kirkwall's security? I would argue that The Iron Bull (mainly because of Dorian) Except he can also be dead and in my world states wasn't in a romance with Dorian, so usual rule applies. As for the rest, if they all turn up in the next game, wouldn't it make the world seem rather small? Plus, for those with whom people are more familiar, and thus the voice actor, would it really warrant the resources to bring them back in a voiced cameo?
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Post by cuthbertbeckett on Apr 6, 2021 17:56:42 GMT
Except he can also be dead and in my world states wasn't in a romance with Dorian, so usual rule applies. Who said that Bull should be more than a cameo? Like the previous games? I have no problems to see character again if they made sense to appear in this area. Also Thedas isn´t our real world so i don´t mind if we are see some characters back in a small area. You can say the same thing about every returning character in the past? Why bring Loghain back in DAI if only a handful will ever see him in DAI?
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