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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2021 0:43:22 GMT
Ah yes, "Knowledge".
We have dismissed this claim. Because nobody knows what it really is.
The dearth of knowledge on knowledge is the same as it ever was. Encompassing.
So, in the galactic sense, as well as very specifically in this thread, nobody knows anything about this game. Including the developers. They know parts and pieces, not the whole enchilada, and until it's out they will also be in the dark.
So, no. Nobody knows anything about this game.
See this battery on my shoulder?
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Post by SirSourpuss on Aug 9, 2021 0:45:51 GMT
Really? A new player plays the remaster. Hears the guy say one more story. Sees the teaser showing a character from the trilogy holding an idem with the N7 logo, what other conclusion would that person have? Yes it could be a new character, with N7 being mentioned in the next game, but then why have a character from the trilogy in the teaser? It also shows what appears to be a drell and salarian. Both were on the squad in ME2. Maybe ME4 would feature a drell and salarian squadmate. Players, new and old, had different reactions to the teaser with whatever thoughts they have after seeing it. It would not be hard for any of them to come to the conclusion I mentioned. If I were to have played MEA, and not the trilogy, I would be asking who the character is in the teaser. They show a character from the trilogy that I have no care about. It would tell me Bioware appears to be making another game that will feature that character, and maybe other characters from the trilogy to be in the next game. Even though the Andromeda galaxy is shown for a moment, it still would tell me the next game would be in the Milky Way with character(s) from the trilogy I never played. That is a big amount of assumptions based on what people are thinking they are seeing and not to mention the potential of "that was true at the time" especially with the sequence at the end of Mass Effect 3 since that was created nine to ten years ago. There is no confirmation on what we are seeing in that teaser and the assumptions being made could very well be wrong which is where my issue has been. If you want to speculation that could be Liara go for it, but its the certainty behind the claims that its Liara is where it might not be accurate. The resemblance to Liara could be unintentional or even just like with Andromeda something that starts the adventure off and then leads to a new group of people with what we were seeing in the Sol system at the start of Andromeda. I can see many different possibilities of what that teaser could indicate and I think narrowing down to one thing hurts the conversation. Even if lets say that teaser falls into the truth that 100% that is Liara and 100% claiming what she thinks is a piece of Shepard's gear and 100% of the chance its really Vega's and she clones Vega since he lost piece of his helmet charging Marauder Shields at the end of ME3. Things change a lot during development I am pretty sure I don't need to go into the amount of content that BioWare has told us was to be in the game and content that we found out was part of the plan that has changed significantly or been removed during the length of development. Its the certainty that I am disagreeing with because frankly nobody knows what is really going to happen until about six months prior to launch. Listen, OK, I understand, you want to play devil's advocate, you want to make a case, but this ... everyone, their mother and their cat saw that was Liara. There is no plausibly deniability. I'd have to be blind or have prosap... prospo ... prosopagnosia. What the fuck kind of word is that anyway? The point isn't what Bioware means with that trailer, or even what they wanted to convey as a feel, in that trailer. The problem is the public and their opinion. It's going to be a tough pill to swallow, when after 3-4 years of waiting, with no news, no confirmation or denial from Bioware and allowing the public's mind run wild, to tell them that, no, Shepard and crew are not, in fact, coming back, they are never coming back, here is the new squad, please be excited for them. Most of the press that covered it said that it points to Shepard being back, although they don't know how, twitter posters said the same thing, even as many said the same about it being an Andromeda sequel, though I never could attest to that volume that some claim is/was there, the youtube comments are all about Shepard and even normies that I've talked to seem to thing it's about Shepard. People in communities that understand how Bioware works, like this place, possibly reddit, although they, too, are pushing for a Shepard return, in spite of the Andromeda defense posting, which isn't as popular as it use to be, since the LE was announced, and other communities, know that Shepard isn't coming back. But we are nothing compared to the people that expect Shepard, that don't actually inhabit these communities. And Bioware is going to lose them, the moment they show someone else. To them, this is a bait and switch.
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Post by Guardian on Aug 9, 2021 1:38:22 GMT
Sanunes makes good points, but sirpetrakus is also right. The "normies" that got pulled in by MELE, most of them are saying the same thing - between the MELE and the Trailer, to them, Shepard is returning. And while no one has a clue as to what ME:Next is going to be, to those same "normies", anything but Shep coming back would be a "bait and switch" to them.
I personally would not say it's "bait and switch", but we're not the "normies". This is our fandom, it has been for a long time, and we also know how BioWare has been behaving as of late. Also, a lot of this is speculative because we don't know anything about the next Mass Effect. We don't even really know much about the next Dragon Age...which doesn't really fill me with confidence to be honest.
You can continue to stand on the hill about how, "Oh, Shepard died!" or, "Everyone died!" or even, "Andromeda is the way forward!". Not everyone has a play through where their Shepard died or everyone died. In a game where "choices matter" (I say that loosely), no one should get to just say as a blanket statement - "The Main Character dies no matter what because your ending is invalid". And this goes for any decision, no matter where you fall. But I see where Sanunes is coming from. He raises valid points, because none of us can know what to expect. For all we know, it could be something from another unknown N7 (why would they show Liara in the trailer then you may ask? Because as we all know, anything tied to nostalgia sells, and Liara is tied to Shepard). But from looking at it through the lens of "normies" outside of small communities like this one, they're pretty much saying the same thing - to them Shepard is coming back.
Both sides raise very valid and good points. And until (which I HIGHLY doubt will happen) BioWare is straight with us like the OP stated in the first post, we can just keep discussing about this in circles all day with no concrete direction they're going to start from.
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Post by Iakus on Aug 9, 2021 4:43:39 GMT
Really? A new player plays the remaster. Hears the guy say one more story. Sees the teaser showing a character from the trilogy holding an idem with the N7 logo, what other conclusion would that person have? Yes it could be a new character, with N7 being mentioned in the next game, but then why have a character from the trilogy in the teaser? It also shows what appears to be a drell and salarian. Both were on the squad in ME2. Maybe ME4 would feature a drell and salarian squadmate. Players, new and old, had different reactions to the teaser with whatever thoughts they have after seeing it. It would not be hard for any of them to come to the conclusion I mentioned. If I were to have played MEA, and not the trilogy, I would be asking who the character is in the teaser. They show a character from the trilogy that I have no care about. It would tell me Bioware appears to be making another game that will feature that character, and maybe other characters from the trilogy to be in the next game. Even though the Andromeda galaxy is shown for a moment, it still would tell me the next game would be in the Milky Way with character(s) from the trilogy I never played. That is a big amount of assumptions based on what people are thinking they are seeing and not to mention the potential of "that was true at the time" especially with the sequence at the end of Mass Effect 3 since that was created nine to ten years ago. There is no confirmation on what we are seeing in that teaser and the assumptions being made could very well be wrong which is where my issue has been. If you want to speculation that could be Liara go for it, but its the certainty behind the claims that its Liara is where it might not be accurate. The resemblance to Liara could be unintentional or even just like with Andromeda something that starts the adventure off and then leads to a new group of people with what we were seeing in the Sol system at the start of Andromeda. I can see many different possibilities of what that teaser could indicate and I think narrowing down to one thing hurts the conversation. Even if lets say that teaser falls into the truth that 100% that is Liara and 100% claiming what she thinks is a piece of Shepard's gear and 100% of the chance its really Vega's and she clones Vega since he lost piece of his helmet charging Marauder Shields at the end of ME3. Things change a lot during development I am pretty sure I don't need to go into the amount of content that BioWare has told us was to be in the game and content that we found out was part of the plan that has changed significantly or been removed during the length of development. Its the certainty that I am disagreeing with because frankly nobody knows what is really going to happen until about six months prior to launch. The only thing that's definite about that teaser is that was certainly Liara. The facial markings were quite distinct. (For one thing, she's the only asari we've ever seen with eyebrows) Everything else is only hints. Strong hints, but hints. So they can later say "Hey we never TOLD you Shepard was returning! You can't blame us for your assumptions!" I mean, just because they set up the teaser with all sorts of nostalgia from the original trilogy, why would you think they'd actually bring back a popular protagonist?
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Post by Sanunes on Aug 9, 2021 5:27:25 GMT
That is a big amount of assumptions based on what people are thinking they are seeing and not to mention the potential of "that was true at the time" especially with the sequence at the end of Mass Effect 3 since that was created nine to ten years ago. There is no confirmation on what we are seeing in that teaser and the assumptions being made could very well be wrong which is where my issue has been. If you want to speculation that could be Liara go for it, but its the certainty behind the claims that its Liara is where it might not be accurate. The resemblance to Liara could be unintentional or even just like with Andromeda something that starts the adventure off and then leads to a new group of people with what we were seeing in the Sol system at the start of Andromeda. I can see many different possibilities of what that teaser could indicate and I think narrowing down to one thing hurts the conversation. Even if lets say that teaser falls into the truth that 100% that is Liara and 100% claiming what she thinks is a piece of Shepard's gear and 100% of the chance its really Vega's and she clones Vega since he lost piece of his helmet charging Marauder Shields at the end of ME3. Things change a lot during development I am pretty sure I don't need to go into the amount of content that BioWare has told us was to be in the game and content that we found out was part of the plan that has changed significantly or been removed during the length of development. Its the certainty that I am disagreeing with because frankly nobody knows what is really going to happen until about six months prior to launch. The only thing that's definite about that teaser is that was certainly Liara. The facial markings were quite distinct. (For one thing, she's the only asari we've ever seen with eyebrows) Everything else is only hints. Strong hints, but hints. So they can later say "Hey we never TOLD you Shepard was returning! You can't blame us for your assumptions!" I mean, just because they set up the teaser with all sorts of nostalgia from the original trilogy, why would you think they'd actually bring back a popular protagonist? That is why I think that teaser trailer was more for the Legendary Edition then the next Mass Effect game. To trigger all the nostalgia and to get people to want to play the original three games again for I bet the majority of people are going to completely forget about this teaser when it comes time to start the PR for the next Mass Effect game. Even if its Liara there are still plenty of other things they can do with her that has nothing to do with any of the other conclusions that people are drawing from her presence. It could be that her presence in the game is like Mass Effect 2 or "it was accurate at the time" and things change especially since its this early in development. That said I am still not completely convinced its her, but everyone is welcome to their own opinion. As far as Shepard being popular, just because something is popular doesn't mean its the best approach for there were things in Andromeda that are popular and didn't work there. Making design decisions based on popularity is also one if my biggest gripes about BioWare games for they seem to be going for the popular mechanics and ideas and not making a game centered around what they are known for and then seeing if they can fit the popular things into the game.
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Post by The Arbiter on Aug 9, 2021 9:28:13 GMT
Could well be for both instances it seems to be about making statements to generate interest to generate sales. That preview trailer was suspiciously close to the release of the Legendary Edition, so it sets up hype for a new game and maybe people will buy the remaster since they are thinking of the brand. If I was a new player to the trilogy, I see the teaser showing a character from the trilogy picking up something with the N7 logo. I play the remaster getting the breath scene, and after the guy tells the kid one more story, I would believe Shepard would return for another game. Shhhh.... that's too complex for them to comprehend.
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Post by The Arbiter on Aug 9, 2021 9:31:35 GMT
If I was a new player to the trilogy, I see the teaser showing a character from the trilogy picking up something with the N7 logo. I play the remaster getting the breath scene, and after the guy tells the kid one more story, I would believe Shepard would return for another game. I think a new player wouldn't jump that far down the rabbit hole. If you are reading that much into the teaser trailer and caring about what happened at a game that ended that many years ago you are more then a new inexperienced player and should know that there is a very good chance the two aren't connected. Edit: Now if you play the Legendary Edition for the first time, I would also not be sure they are getting to the conclusions people online are. Not everyone analyzes everything to the nth degree to try and milk everything out of a teaser. I would still say if you are looking that deeply into a teaser to try and figure out what the next game is going to be you are far more then a casual new fan and should know by now how the industry works even if its not from BioWare. So what you are trying to convey here is that the "Mass Effect will continue" is obviously a con, a sham, or puffery and that slapping one of the main poster child of the franchise in the trailer was nothing more to generate "sales".
rrrrrrrrrrrrighhhhhhhhhttt Master Chief is also nothing more but to generate sale since the whole franchise revolves around USNC marines only.
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Post by QuizzyBunny on Aug 9, 2021 10:00:59 GMT
I'm honestly a bit confused how you could play the end of ME3 and think we're going to see Shepard. In all endings it's stated Shepard will die, and in two of them we actually them disintegrate, it's only in a special version of Destroy we see an indication that they might have survived after all. I get that seeing Liara pick up the N7 armor piece makes it more confusing, but I do believe that's more of an homage to the OT than an actual plot indication. At most they might do the whole clone-thing again, but I really doubt it as I struggle to think people would accept this fake-out. Only way we could see Shepard again is a full retcon of the ending of ME3, but that would feel pretty disrespectful to the people who made other choices(and I say this as someone who had a high EMS Destroy ending).
I'm still not sure how they are going to explain the possible extinction of the Quarians (as that is def a thing for a lot of people). Will they just retcon that too? What else would they retcon if so? Feels a bit like a slippery slope if they don't make the story somewhat separated from the OT.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Aug 9, 2021 10:20:57 GMT
I'm honestly a bit confused how you could play the end of ME3 and think we're going to see Shepard. In all endings it's stated Shepard will die, and in two of them we actually them disintegrate, it's only in a special version of Destroy we see an indication that they might have survived after all. I get that seeing Liara pick up the N7 armor piece makes it more confusing, but I do believe that's more of an homage to the OT than an actual plot indication. At most they might do the whole clone-thing again, but I really doubt it as I struggle to think people would accept this fake-out. Only way we could see Shepard again is a full retcon of the ending of ME3, but that would feel pretty disrespectful to the people who made other choices(and I say this as someone who had a high EMS Destroy ending). I'm still not sure how they are going to explain the possible extinction of the Quarians (as that is def a thing for a lot of people). Will they just retcon that too? What else would they retcon if so? Feels a bit like a slippery slope if they don't make the story somewhat separated from the OT. I understand how difficult it may seem and how easy it is to blame the people that think that way, but from the moment they took it as such and ran with it, en masse, with Bioware fully aware of the coverage, the replies and the conversations about it, while also doing nothing to clear it up, is going to backfire. And as we've seen, fan blaming never works well.
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Post by The Arbiter on Aug 9, 2021 13:32:54 GMT
I'm honestly a bit confused how you could play the end of ME3 and think we're going to see Shepard. In all endings it's stated Shepard will die, and in two of them we actually them disintegrate, it's only in a special version of Destroy we see an indication that they might have survived after all. I get that seeing Liara pick up the N7 armor piece makes it more confusing, but I do believe that's more of an homage to the OT than an actual plot indication. At most they might do the whole clone-thing again, but I really doubt it as I struggle to think people would accept this fake-out. Only way we could see Shepard again is a full retcon of the ending of ME3, but that would feel pretty disrespectful to the people who made other choices(and I say this as someone who had a high EMS Destroy ending). I'm still not sure how they are going to explain the possible extinction of the Quarians (as that is def a thing for a lot of people). Will they just retcon that too? What else would they retcon if so? Feels a bit like a slippery slope if they don't make the story somewhat separated from the OT. I understand how difficult it may seem and how easy it is to blame the people that think that way, but from the moment they took it as such and ran with it, en masse, with Bioware fully aware of the coverage, the replies and the conversations about it, while also doing nothing to clear it up, is going to backfire. And as we've seen, fan blaming never works well. Bioware should ignore the fans and pick what's best for the franchise. Whether we see Shepard again or as an "OLD SHEPARD" I don't care as long as it is back in the Milkyway where everything has to be re-built or we see "10 - 40 years" after ME3 FINE BY ME.
They released the next ME trailer, they released bonus materials online, they released the full OST of the trilogy Online on Youtube even! this indicates we really are going back to the same place as the original trilogy despite what others think and Shepard will indeed HAVE TO BE TALKED ABOUT.
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Post by FiendishlyInventive on Aug 9, 2021 13:52:25 GMT
Bioware's only got themselves to blame for all the YouTube videos and articles speculating a return to not only Shepard, but a post destroy Milky Way, and it's the first mainstream buzz I have heard from this fanbase in nearly a decade.
If this does not either fulfil that idea or come out swinging with a strong visual and auditory identity akin to the original Mass Effect with a compelling narrative and gameplay showcase.
People will then say "Oh another Andromeda great..." And Bioware and the intellectual property will die.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Aug 9, 2021 14:05:20 GMT
I understand how difficult it may seem and how easy it is to blame the people that think that way, but from the moment they took it as such and ran with it, en masse, with Bioware fully aware of the coverage, the replies and the conversations about it, while also doing nothing to clear it up, is going to backfire. And as we've seen, fan blaming never works well. Bioware should ignore the fans and pick what's best for the franchise. Whether we see Shepard again or as an "OLD SHEPARD" I don't care as long as it is back in the Milkyway where everything has to be re-built or we see "10 - 40 years" after ME3 FINE BY ME.
They released the next ME trailer, they released bonus materials online, they released the full OST of the trilogy Online on Youtube even! this indicates we really are going back to the same place as the original trilogy despite what others think and Shepard will indeed HAVE TO BE TALKED ABOUT. I don't think you can sell that, after all that "circumstantial" evidence about Shepard, without Shepard. I don't think you can sell ME without Shepard at all, at this point, regardless of evidence, because Bioware assassinated the brand, alongside themselves, that you'd get about as many sales with the next ME as with the LE and if that's a game that costs $100m, it's going to be a fuck huge flop for EA. Remember, for a game to be considered a success, it needs to make 3x its budget, so a $100m budget ME would need to sell ~4-4.5m copies, in its first 6-10 weeks, to be considered a success.
The problem isn't what's going to be "fine for some". This needs to be great for a fuck ton of people.
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Post by themikefest on Aug 9, 2021 17:06:11 GMT
Bioware should ignore the fans and pick what's best for the franchise. Whether we see Shepard again or as an "OLD SHEPARD" I don't care as long as it is back in the Milkyway where everything has to be re-built or we see "10 - 40 years" after ME3 FINE BY ME.
They released the next ME trailer, they released bonus materials online, they released the full OST of the trilogy Online on Youtube even! this indicates we really are going back to the same place as the original trilogy despite what others think and Shepard will indeed HAVE TO BE TALKED ABOUT. I don't think you can sell that, after all that "circumstantial" evidence about Shepard, without Shepard. I don't think you can sell ME without Shepard at all, at this point, regardless of evidence, because Bioware assassinated the brand, alongside themselves, that you'd get about as many sales with the next ME as with the LE and if that's a game that costs $100m, it's going to be a fuck huge flop for EA. Remember, for a game to be considered a success, it needs to make 3x its budget, so a $100m budget ME would need to sell ~4-4.5m copies, in its first 6-10 weeks, to be considered a success.
The problem isn't what's going to be "fine for some". This needs to be great for a fuck ton of people.
So if they make an ME game that is not to your liking, and does 3x it's budget, would you call it a success? Or do you have to like the game for you to consider it a success?
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Post by SirSourpuss on Aug 9, 2021 17:37:08 GMT
So if they make an ME game that is not to your liking, and does 3x it's budget, would you call it a success? Or do you have to like the game for you to consider it a success? I'd like to see a $100m Bioware game make 3x its budget. Do you think it will? I can't see it happening. Like I said, it would have to sell 4-4.5m copies in less than 2.5 months. Resident Evil Village did it. And that game had hype behind it. Even if it was just swatting at giant vampire lady's buttocks, it sold like crazy. 4 million copies worldwide in its first month. The moment someone will see Bioware on the credits of a game, their reaction will be "ew". Maybe Bioware needs to make a giant vampire lady of their own, to sell their game. I can't see an egg, that looks like Arnold Vosloo, selling it. And I already said the LE was a financial success. It most likely made over 10x its budget in revenue.
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Post by KaiserShep on Aug 9, 2021 18:15:28 GMT
I'm honestly a bit confused how you could play the end of ME3 and think we're going to see Shepard. In all endings it's stated Shepard will die, and in two of them we actually them disintegrate, it's only in a special version of Destroy we see an indication that they might have survived after all. I get that seeing Liara pick up the N7 armor piece makes it more confusing, but I do believe that's more of an homage to the OT than an actual plot indication. At most they might do the whole clone-thing again, but I really doubt it as I struggle to think people would accept this fake-out. Only way we could see Shepard again is a full retcon of the ending of ME3, but that would feel pretty disrespectful to the people who made other choices(and I say this as someone who had a high EMS Destroy ending). I'm still not sure how they are going to explain the possible extinction of the Quarians (as that is def a thing for a lot of people). Will they just retcon that too? What else would they retcon if so? Feels a bit like a slippery slope if they don't make the story somewhat separated from the OT. I suspect you're right about the trailer, though honestly, it's kinda tough to gauge. Personally I'm starting to lean on the idea that BioWare is taking as safe a route as they can take with the franchise going forward, though the cost of doing that as far as the original setting is concerned will probably depend on how popular a particular canon ends up being, that being one where Shepard definitely lives to go through this shit all over again. I'm certain that's what it'll take to continue. BioWare will never allow the Quarians and Krogan to disappear. The geth and rachni are so-so, and their lack of any real presence beyond hostile encounters makes them largely disposable, but even then I feel like there's going to be a lot of glossing over, with a judge decreeing: "And none shall speak of these events again.....under penalty of torture."
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Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on Aug 10, 2021 12:07:32 GMT
I think a new player wouldn't jump that far down the rabbit hole. If you are reading that much into the teaser trailer and caring about what happened at a game that ended that many years ago you are more then a new inexperienced player and should know that there is a very good chance the two aren't connected. Edit: Now if you play the Legendary Edition for the first time, I would also not be sure they are getting to the conclusions people online are. Not everyone analyzes everything to the nth degree to try and milk everything out of a teaser. I would still say if you are looking that deeply into a teaser to try and figure out what the next game is going to be you are far more then a casual new fan and should know by now how the industry works even if its not from BioWare. So what you are trying to convey here is that the "Mass Effect will continue" is obviously a con, a sham, or puffery and that slapping one of the main poster child of the franchise in the trailer was nothing more to generate "sales".
rrrrrrrrrrrrighhhhhhhhhttt Master Chief is also nothing more but to generate sale since the whole franchise revolves around USNC marines only. Mass Effect did continue because they made another game and have said they are making another one. The IP is continuing therefore Mass Effect is continuing.
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Post by Phantom on Aug 10, 2021 18:06:32 GMT
I'm honestly a bit confused how you could play the end of ME3 and think we're going to see Shepard. In all endings it's stated Shepard will die, and in two of them we actually them disintegrate, it's only in a special version of Destroy we see an indication that they might have survived after all. I get that seeing Liara pick up the N7 armor piece makes it more confusing, but I do believe that's more of an homage to the OT than an actual plot indication. At most they might do the whole clone-thing again, but I really doubt it as I struggle to think people would accept this fake-out. Only way we could see Shepard again is a full retcon of the ending of ME3, but that would feel pretty disrespectful to the people who made other choices(and I say this as someone who had a high EMS Destroy ending). I'm still not sure how they are going to explain the possible extinction of the Quarians (as that is def a thing for a lot of people). Will they just retcon that too? What else would they retcon if so? Feels a bit like a slippery slope if they don't make the story somewhat separated from the OT. I suspect you're right about the trailer, though honestly, it's kinda tough to gauge. Personally I'm starting to lean on the idea that BioWare is taking as safe a route as they can take with the franchise going forward, though the cost of doing that as far as the original setting is concerned will probably depend on how popular a particular canon ends up being, that being one where Shepard definitely lives to go through this shit all over again. I'm certain that's what it'll take to continue. BioWare will never allow the Quarians and Krogan to disappear. The geth and rachni are so-so, and their lack of any real presence beyond hostile encounters makes them largely disposable, but even then I feel like there's going to be a lot of glossing over, with a judge decreeing: "And none shall speak of these events again.....under penalty of torture." Well you can always send them to a Cerberus Test Lab, they are always need of bodies.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2021 8:04:08 GMT
No real arguments to make, the current direction of the thread is pretty spot-on.
Just want to drop this -
Shepard was hardly the only N7 in the Alliance. Yes, there is iconography with Shepard, and the normies love iconography.
I think the importance of Shepard as a protagonist is hugely overrated for the success of another Mass Effect game. I think the bad reputation they have worked so hard to earn over the last 4 games is well-deserved, and not insurmountable.
If they make a fucking great game, and it is Mass Effect to the core, it will sell massively. It might not be an overnight smash hit, because there is zero trust in the brand, but if it looks good, the god-damned influencers all love it and mean it, and then this group of bellyaching old farts will spread the word that BioWare found magic again.
If the finance department of modern corporations is only happy with overnight sensations, we are well and truly fucked.
Why is my butt so sore?
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Guardian
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Post by Guardian on Aug 13, 2021 12:09:05 GMT
No real arguments to make, the current direction of the thread is pretty spot-on. Just want to drop this - Shepard was hardly the only N7 in the Alliance. Yes, there is iconography with Shepard, and the normies love iconography. I think the importance of Shepard as a protagonist is hugely overrated for the success of another Mass Effect game. I think the bad reputation they have worked so hard to earn over the last 4 games is well-deserved, and not insurmountable. If they make a fucking great game, and it is Mass Effect to the core, it will sell massively. It might not be an overnight smash hit, because there is zero trust in the brand, but if it looks good, the god-damned influencers all love it and mean it, and then this group of bellyaching old farts will spread the word that BioWare found magic again.If the finance department of modern corporations is only happy with overnight sensations, we are well and truly fucked. Why is my butt so sore?
Agreed
It's like I said - it could be an unknown N7 that Liara finds the armor of. The bolded part is exactly it. It could be any N7 (not necessarily Shep) and so long as the game is great, it will be a success. The only problem is that to EA, success is measured differently by them.
Hudson and to an extent Mac pretty much nuked Mass Effect with the debacle that was the end, and as it has been said, this is a radioactive property now. Could Mac right the ship? I think so; will it happen? Who knows?
I think one way to help overcome this is by being transparent. Not letting us know every little detail, but at least a general sense like the direction they're going and stick to it. There's so much uncertainty around DA because things suddenly changed gears without warning. And I know a few friends of mine who is another ME diehard) remember the debacle with the Andromeda Trailer. I know he and a few others in our circle that were rather upset by expecting Alec and getting Ryder in the game (I realize what it was about, and while yes, they do too, they still saw it as deception).
The hill is steep, but they can overcome it. The question is - do they want to/will they?
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
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Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on Aug 13, 2021 12:19:18 GMT
No real arguments to make, the current direction of the thread is pretty spot-on. Just want to drop this - Shepard was hardly the only N7 in the Alliance. Yes, there is iconography with Shepard, and the normies love iconography. I think the importance of Shepard as a protagonist is hugely overrated for the success of another Mass Effect game. I think the bad reputation they have worked so hard to earn over the last 4 games is well-deserved, and not insurmountable. If they make a fucking great game, and it is Mass Effect to the core, it will sell massively. It might not be an overnight smash hit, because there is zero trust in the brand, but if it looks good, the god-damned influencers all love it and mean it, and then this group of bellyaching old farts will spread the word that BioWare found magic again.If the finance department of modern corporations is only happy with overnight sensations, we are well and truly fucked. Why is my butt so sore?
Agreed
It's like I said - it could be an unknown N7 that Liara finds the armor of. The bolded part is exactly it. It could be any N7 (not necessarily Shep) and so long as the game is great, it will be a success. The only problem is that to EA, success is measured differently by them.
Hudson and to an extent Mac pretty much nuked Mass Effect with the debacle that was the end, and as it has been said, this is a radioactive property now. Could Mac right the ship? I think so; will it happen? Who knows?
I think one way to help overcome this is by being transparent. Not letting us know every little detail, but at least a general sense like the direction they're going and stick to it. There's so much uncertainty around DA because things suddenly changed gears without warning. And I know a few friends of mine who is another ME diehard) remember the debacle with the Andromeda Trailer. I know he and a few others in our circle that were rather upset by expecting Alec and getting Ryder in the game (I realize what it was about, and while yes, they do too, they still saw it as deception).
The hill is steep, but they can overcome it. The question is - do they want to/will they?
The problem with game development is that transparency is a bad thing with the way the audience reacts. If anything BioWare was okay with transparency until Inquisition, but with the differences between the demonstrations they were given and the final product the amount of "you lied" I think made them even more secretive with their development. Unless players can understand the basic concept of that things change I am doubtful that developers will share more information for they don't want articles labeled "BioWare conned players" during the first few months. Edit: The other case is the issue around Mass Effect 2 when BioWare released the opening cinematic for the game and the amount of complaints about "spoilers" and "BioWare ruined the game".
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Post by mtheillusive on Aug 13, 2021 19:22:59 GMT
Ya know...it literally just says it "Will Continue". That's it. Essentially we aren't done with Mass Effect yet. But that's all it means.
It almost the equivalent of Marvel movie after credits that say such n such will return. Except in this case its about a brand (Mass Effect) and not a singular character.
Will it be about the Milky Way? Andromeda? A synthesized husk who wants to join the military and reconnect with their family? The First Contact War? A child of Ryder and Cora? The planet of One More Story? The implosion of the universe? None of the above? Who knows....
...but it will continue....
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Post by Iakus on Aug 13, 2021 21:23:43 GMT
Ya know...it literally just says it "Will Continue". That's it. Essentially we aren't done with Mass Effect yet. But that's all it means. It almost the equivalent of Marvel movie after credits that say such n such will return. Except in this case its about a brand (Mass Effect) and not a singular character. Will it be about the Milky Way? Andromeda? A synthesized husk who wants to join the military and reconnect with their family? The First Contact War? A child of Ryder and Cora? The planet of One More Story? The implosion of the universe? None of the above? Who knows.... ...but it will continue.... It will continue, but they chose to make Liara (an OLDER-looking Liara at that) a prominent aspect of the teaser. Which of course leads to "lots of speculation for everyone"
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Post by themikefest on Aug 13, 2021 21:45:05 GMT
Ya know...it literally just says it "Will Continue". That's it. Essentially we aren't done with Mass Effect yet. But that's all it means. It almost the equivalent of Marvel movie after credits that say such n such will return. Except in this case its about a brand (Mass Effect) and not a singular character. Will it be about the Milky Way? Andromeda? A synthesized husk who wants to join the military and reconnect with their family? The First Contact War? A child of Ryder and Cora? The planet of One More Story? The implosion of the universe? None of the above? Who knows.... ...but it will continue.... It will continue, but they chose to make Liara (an OLDER-looking Liara at that) a prominent aspect of the teaser. Which of course leads to "lots of speculation for everyone" How do we know it was the real t'soni? It could be a lookalike on a movie set playing the role of t'soni while the actors for the other characters are rehearsing for the next scene.
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Post by Iakus on Aug 13, 2021 23:45:01 GMT
It will continue, but they chose to make Liara (an OLDER-looking Liara at that) a prominent aspect of the teaser. Which of course leads to "lots of speculation for everyone" How do we know it was the real t'soni? It could be a lookalike on a movie set playing the role of t'soni while the actors for the other characters are rehearsing for the next scene. Sure. And Matt Damon could be playing Loki and Sam Neill could be Odin. But I don't think it's LIKELY.
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Post by mtheillusive on Aug 14, 2021 2:37:11 GMT
It will continue, but they chose to make Liara (an OLDER-looking Liara at that) a prominent aspect of the teaser. Which of course leads to "lots of speculation for everyone" How do we know it was the real t'soni? It could be a lookalike on a movie set playing the role of t'soni while the actors for the other characters are rehearsing for the next scene. And starring Henry Cavill??? It all makes sense now!!!!
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