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Post by gervaise21 on Sept 6, 2021 12:34:06 GMT
The Magisterium had foci back then, did they use one? Did they use some other artifact? They used both blood magic and lyrium, those don't usually mix. There's a lot of questions. Yep, you're right there. There had to be something more than just the size of the sacrifice if it could take them precisely to where they wanted to go, i.e. the Golden City. The mages of the Imperium had apparently spent huge resources trying to map the Fade to no avail. Surely that must have included trying to get to the City, even if it was only through the projection of their minds rather physically setting foot there? So you could be right. May be they did use a foci. That would account for why Corypheus was likely seeking another one, when Solas so conveniently arranged for the Venatori to find his orb, because he knew it wasn't enough just to make a big sacrifice; he needed something to ensure he got to the right destination. He also knew that the last time they weren't able to stay long, which is why discovering how to make the anchor was just what he needed. I wonder why they got burped out the first time? Was it just a case of the magic used running out on them or was it something due to the nature of the wards that had been placed on it? Or was Andraste right and it was the direct action of the Maker? (As opposed to something left there by him) Mind you, why didn't he object to us entering the Fade? Or was it only the City on which there was a prohibition? Definitely lots of questions. Incidentally, do you think the Black City is going to have anything to do with cleansing the world of the Blight? For example, you have to find a way back there in order to release a "cure" on the world (a bit like the cure of the Genophage in ME3, which you can sabotage if you so wish).
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Post by sjsharp2010 on Sept 6, 2021 15:12:10 GMT
Depends on which part of the continent we're talking about. Places more devout like Orlais and Antiva I can definitely see remembering them, while places like Tevinter never really bought into it so they'll be forgotten. Yeah this plus I think whatever they do in he future will likely decide how they will be remembered. After all the Inquisitor can kind of completel ydismiss the thought of being call;ed Herald even if your companions and advisors still call you by it or they can accep tit and asy they're kind of honoured t obe given such a lofty title. I suspect it'lllikel ybe left to our headcanon somewhat. Though it could in a way still be shaped by events that happen in DA4 but we won't likely know that until we play the game.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition, Dragon Age The Veilguard
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Post by sjsharp2010 on Sept 6, 2021 15:26:55 GMT
I have trouble believing that even a previously extremely devout one wouldn't at least have their faith somewhat shaken and be questioning it. Yet there isn't an option in the Keep under the section for Trespasser for you to indicate whether your Inquisitor had their faith shaken by the revelations, or conversely, for an elven Inquisitor, if that actually reinforced their faith in their own lore if not their gods, so they clearly decided to sweep that entire issue under the carpet. Unless they give us the option of fully controlling a returning Inquisitor, with various options for them to say how they feel, I think it is more likely it will just be a case of how other people speak about them. I think you are right that having a returning Inquisitor would be a programming nightmare for them, what with the variety of races, classes and VA you could have chosen for them. The only reason it is going to happen is if they have devoted a substantial chunk of the game to them independently of the new PC. However, given the trailer made it quite clear it was "time for a new hero", that seems unlikely. The Keep will simply be used to inform the conversation about the Inquisitor or what codices say about them.In terms of the faith of returning characters, like Dorian and Varric, well they were never devoted to the Chantry line anyway. Dorian has a vague belief in the Maker, which was probably not shaken that much either way, whilst Cassandra says that Varric won't so much as poke his nose inside a Chantry, so he probably doesn't know much of the actual Chant either. I dare say neither of them went anywhere near the Skyhold garden, even if you did make it a Chantry garden. Yeah it's likely they'llgo down the sme route as what they did for the warden and maybe have them write a lette rt ous wit hinfo o rinstructions if we need it o rsomething like that if we'er working for them or something.
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Post by duskwanderer on Sept 6, 2021 16:14:00 GMT
The Magisterium had foci back then, did they use one? Did they use some other artifact? They used both blood magic and lyrium, those don't usually mix. There's a lot of questions. Yep, you're right there. There had to be something more than just the size of the sacrifice if it could take them precisely to where they wanted to go, i.e. the Golden City. The mages of the Imperium had apparently spent huge resources trying to map the Fade to no avail. Surely that must have included trying to get to the City, even if it was only through the projection of their minds rather physically setting foot there? So you could be right. May be they did use a foci. That would account for why Corypheus was likely seeking another one, when Solas so conveniently arranged for the Venatori to find his orb, because he knew it wasn't enough just to make a big sacrifice; he needed something to ensure he got to the right destination. He also knew that the last time they weren't able to stay long, which is why discovering how to make the anchor was just what he needed. I wonder why they got burped out the first time? Was it just a case of the magic used running out on them or was it something due to the nature of the wards that had been placed on it? Or was Andraste right and it was the direct action of the Maker? (As opposed to something left there by him) Mind you, why didn't he object to us entering the Fade? Or was it only the City on which there was a prohibition? Definitely lots of questions. Incidentally, do you think the Black City is going to have anything to do with cleansing the world of the Blight? For example, you have to find a way back there in order to release a "cure" on the world (a bit like the cure of the Genophage in ME3, which you can sabotage if you so wish). Was Corypheus seeking a foci? It makes sense because it gives him the power to do what he wanted, but I thought it was just that Solas allowed him to find it. I do not believe that the Black City is the "cure" to the Blight. I think that genie is out of its bottle and it cannot be put back. Hmm...emissaries have abilities similar to blood magic, but Solas and Vivienne both state that the Blight is not blood magic itself. I think the Blight will end after the Old Gods are destroyed. The wildly chaotic darkspawn will simply fight each other, probably held up by various emissaries. This will weaken them until they are winnowed out.
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Post by gervaise21 on Sept 6, 2021 17:23:07 GMT
Was Corypheus seeking a foci? It makes sense because it gives him the power to do what he wanted, but I thought it was just that Solas allowed him to find it. He seemed to be generally looking for magical items, so I suppose it could just have been another random item that the Venatori found for him that proved to be very useful indeed. However, if its power was only unlocked by the explosion at the Conclave, how did he know what to do with it? He also mentioned you undoing a ritual that had been "years" in the making. So if he had been planning it for some years, it would seem there must have been specific items he needed for it to be successful. A foci would make sense. We know, from the short story about Calpernia, that he did visit Minrathous. May be he was hoping to find a foci there; I can't think why else he would bother. When he didn't (unless that is where he found Solas' orb), he started looking elsewhere. It came to the attention of Solas that a bunch of cultists were searching for a foci and he thought this would be the ideal way to get his orb unlocked without risking himself, so he had his agents place it where they could find it. So, whilst it is never said explicitly that is what happened, it does have a certain logic to it.
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Post by duskwanderer on Sept 9, 2021 3:04:53 GMT
Was Corypheus seeking a foci? It makes sense because it gives him the power to do what he wanted, but I thought it was just that Solas allowed him to find it. He seemed to be generally looking for magical items, so I suppose it could just have been another random item that the Venatori found for him that proved to be very useful indeed. However, if its power was only unlocked by the explosion at the Conclave, how did he know what to do with it? He also mentioned you undoing a ritual that had been "years" in the making. So if he had been planning it for some years, it would seem there must have been specific items he needed for it to be successful. A foci would make sense. We know, from the short story about Calpernia, that he did visit Minrathous. May be he was hoping to find a foci there; I can't think why else he would bother. When he didn't (unless that is where he found Solas' orb), he started looking elsewhere. It came to the attention of Solas that a bunch of cultists were searching for a foci and he thought this would be the ideal way to get his orb unlocked without risking himself, so he had his agents place it where they could find it. So, whilst it is never said explicitly that is what happened, it does have a certain logic to it. I find your assertion perfectly plausible. According to Dorian, they had orbs like that in some vaults in Minrathous, although he's quick to say they were "similar" and not "the same." We've only ever seen the one, so the Orb of Falon'Din might indeed look different for example. Or it could be a different thing. Of course, we could be reading too much into it: One of the things I always disliked was the end of Act I siding with the mages was "Pour a bunch of magic into the Anchor and maybe shut the Fade or something." (Step three:Profit). At least with the templars there was a lore reason (The Breach was a tear in the Fade that was different in size. Reinforcing the real world would weaken it until it could be dealt with.
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Post by gervaise21 on Sept 9, 2021 11:12:46 GMT
Of course, we could be reading too much into it: One of the things I always disliked was the end of Act I siding with the mages was "Pour a bunch of magic into the Anchor and maybe shut the Fade or something." (Step three:Profit). At least with the templars there was a lore reason (The Breach was a tear in the Fade that was different in size. Reinforcing the real world would weaken it until it could be dealt with. I have to agree that I always found the explanation as to why these opposites would both work was rather simplistic. As you say, the Templar one had more logic to it; the Templars reinforcing reality, pushing back against the Breach so the Anchor would have enough power to seal it. I assume that with the mages it was a case of combining their power with that of the Anchor to give it the strength to heal it that it did not have on its own. However, it did require a great deal of trust that Solas knew what he was talking about. Obviously, as Fen-Harel he did, but we didn't know that. He was just meant to be an apostate mage with a lot of magical theory which he claimed he got from talking with spirits in the Fade. Whereas, with the Templar path we had the reassurance of actual practitioners who had been dealing with rogue magic for years. I have to admit, it made a great deal more sense to go with the Templars.
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Post by xerrai on Sept 11, 2021 22:51:47 GMT
Of course, we could be reading too much into it: One of the things I always disliked was the end of Act I siding with the mages was "Pour a bunch of magic into the Anchor and maybe shut the Fade or something." (Step three:Profit). At least with the templars there was a lore reason (The Breach was a tear in the Fade that was different in size. Reinforcing the real world would weaken it until it could be dealt with. I have to agree that I always found the explanation as to why these opposites would both work was rather simplistic. As you say, the Templar one had more logic to it; the Templars reinforcing reality, pushing back against the Breach so the Anchor would have enough power to seal it. I assume that with the mages it was a case of combining their power with that of the Anchor to give it the strength to heal it that it did not have on its own. However, it did require a great deal of trust that Solas knew what he was talking about. Obviously, as Fen-Harel he did, but we didn't know that. He was just meant to be an apostate mage with a lot of magical theory which he claimed he got from talking with spirits in the Fade. Whereas, with the Templar path we had the reassurance of actual practitioners who had been dealing with rogue magic for years. I have to admit, it made a great deal more sense to go with the Templars. See, I was the reverse in thought the mage approach made the most sense. Templars "reinforcing reality" was only something brought up by Solas/Cassandra banter, something that isn't immediately apparent to some players even when they play through the entire game. But when asked in the relevant conversation about why templars would be a better approach at closing the breach as opposed to mages, Cullen just says "I was a templar. I know what they are capable of..." and that told me absolutely nothing about how they were helping. Even the "weakening the breach" argument made in that same conversation was curtailed when Leliana rightly pointed out that the method was "pure speculation" when it came to the breach. Meanwhile, Cassandra (who is notably suspicious of magic even under normal circumstances) advocates for using mages to power the mark--y'know the thing that's been confirmed to actually work? That made sense to me, even if Cullen was rightfully afraid it would come with consequences. It was basically a 'power the thing that's proven to work' approach. But when compared to Cullen's faith-based argument and Leliana's/Cassandra's pragmatic skepticism, it seemed like the most logical choice between the two. It gets even worse when one considers the breach sealing scene itself, where nothing really changes except for replacing the models depending on the Inquisitor's choice. Even the critical instruction is the same for both parties: "Focus past the herald, let his will draw from you!" which, in the mages case, seems like a legit way of going about things. Just keep the spellwork the minimal and just provide the Inquisitor raw mana to power up. But in the templar's case it sounds less like they trying to weaken the breach as we were lead to believe and more like they are being instructed to weaken the Inquisitor, of all things. To be clear here, the "focus past the herald" part is fine. That's what we want them to do, let the herald do their magic and suppress the breach's magic. It's the "let his will draw from you" that makes no sense. So it is the Inquisitor having to focus on suppressing magic? Why can't the templars do that? They will probably do a better job anyway. And how would the Inquisitor be able to do all of that focusing without hampering the ability of their mark unintentionally? The scene would have been better off saying "Focus past the herald, suppress only what is coming out of the fade!". Now one could argue that the templars were allowing the Inquisitor to 'reinforce a reality where the mark is stronger', but we, and more importantly the templars themselves, are given no real reason to believe that such a thing was even possible. We certainly never see or hear of a templar enhancing magic, after all, despite lyrium's contradictory effects. They are just taught that their power comes from the maker and is only good for suppressing magic.
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Post by gervaise21 on Sept 12, 2021 8:19:45 GMT
It gets even worse when one considers the breach sealing scene itself, where nothing really changes except for replacing the models depending on the Inquisitor's choice. Even the critical instruction is the same for both parties: "Focus past the herald, let his will draw from you!" which, in the mages case, seems like a legit way of going about things. Just keep the spellwork the minimal and just provide the Inquisitor raw mana to power up. But in the templar's case it sounds less like they trying to weaken the breach as we were lead to believe and more like they are being instructed to weaken the Inquisitor, of all things. This always seemed a bit of nonsense with no real thought to it. Clearly it was written for the mage path, which as you say makes some sort of sense, and they couldn't be bothered to come up with a different dialogue for the Templars. As you say, it seems odd to suggest that the Herald is drawing on their abilities through projecting this into their willpower rather than them directing their power past the Herald into the Breach to dampen down the magic enough to allow the Anchor to do its job. To be honest, though, I never thought the Inquisitor's willpower was really the way the Anchor worked. I thought it was simply a case of point and shoot, so all your mind does is control how long it stays active but all the power came from the Anchor itself. After all, the first time we use it, we don't even know we can; Solas simply grabs our hand and holds it up to the tear, so surely that was his willpower as much as ours? At this point, we don't even know him, so we have hardly made a mental connection that allows him to combine his will with our own. To be honest, they never really explained how the Anchor works apart from the fact that it is a key that can both lock and unlock access to the Fade. So presumably the willpower part is being able to focus on which way you want it to work. Once again, when we are falling to our death, how did we know to use the Anchor to save us? Did we consciously think "open sesame" or was the Anchor simply reacting to our sub-conscious desire not to die? As for the "reinforcing reality", I admit that you haven't been given that explanation of why it it should work at the time you make your decision but if you know a bit about Templars (or may be ask around as to how they deal with magic) it is clear they can suppress it, even if they don't know fully how their powers work. So, it did make sense to take along a bunch of Templars on the basis that they could combine their powers of suppression on the Breach and allow you to heal it. That did seem far less risky than pouring yet more magic into the Breach and hope that does the trick. Whilst it seems as though the Templar part is an act of faith in them, the mages path is an act of blind faith in the idea that pouring magic into a magical rift is going to heal rather than blow it wide open. One of the problems I had with DAI (and DG's novels and comic series) was them introducing reality changing magical concepts without really coming up with a proper explanation of how and why they worked. You just had to accept "it's magic, just go with it". The Anchor, the Veil as an artificial construct, time travel were all beyond the realms of magic we had been used to encountering in the setting. There was also the magical item in the Calling that could allegedly turn everyone in the world into darkspawn or the Magrellen that could control the minds of everyone in Thedas. I thought it was lore breaking when Meredith suddenly started leaping around like giant flea and animating statues but it would seem that was only the start of it. I was hoping they might dial back a bit on the reality changing magic in the future but from what was revealed in Tevinter Nights, I don't think that is going to be the case.
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Post by swbrandt on Sept 12, 2021 18:26:30 GMT
It gets even worse when one considers the breach sealing scene itself, where nothing really changes except for replacing the models depending on the Inquisitor's choice. Even the critical instruction is the same for both parties: "Focus past the herald, let his will draw from you!" which, in the mages case, seems like a legit way of going about things. Just keep the spellwork the minimal and just provide the Inquisitor raw mana to power up. But in the templar's case it sounds less like they trying to weaken the breach as we were lead to believe and more like they are being instructed to weaken the Inquisitor, of all things. Once again, when we are falling to our death, how did we know to use the Anchor to save us? Did we consciously think "open sesame" or was the Anchor simply reacting to our sub-conscious desire not to die?
After the fall at Adamant, in conversation with Dorian (at least with romanced Dorian) the Inquisitor can say, "I didn't open that rift on purpose, you know. Might be handy if I could."
So it seems that we don't know how to use the anchor to open rifts on purpose. It seems to have been a subconscious or reflexive action, and not one the Inquisitor knows how to repeat.
It also seems that how the anchor works is not explained to us as players because no one in-game (other than presumably Solas and Corphyeus) knows how it works, either. And the two people who know aren't telling.
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Post by xerrai on Sept 12, 2021 21:34:21 GMT
[...] At this point, we don't even know him, so we have hardly made a mental connection that allows him to combine his will with our own. To be honest, they never really explained how the Anchor works apart from the fact that it is a key that can both lock and unlock access to the Fade. So presumably the willpower part is being able to focus on which way you want it to work. Once again, when we are falling to our death, how did we know to use the Anchor to save us? Did we consciously think "open sesame" or was the Anchor simply reacting to our sub-conscious desire not to die? As for the "reinforcing reality", I admit that you haven't been given that explanation of why it it should work at the time you make your decision but if you know a bit about Templars (or may be ask around as to how they deal with magic) it is clear they can suppress it, even if they don't know fully how their powers work. So, it did make sense to take along a bunch of Templars on the basis that they could combine their powers of suppression on the Breach and allow you to heal it. That did seem far less risky than pouring yet more magic into the Breach and hope that does the trick. Whilst it seems as though the Templar part is an act of faith in them, the mages path is an act of blind faith in the idea that pouring magic into a magical rift is going to heal rather than blow it wide open. [...] I was always under the impression that while the mark primarily operated on autopilot to close/open rifts, but it was always possible for the Inquisitor to 'learn' how to better wield it whether this exerting will or the mark itself somehow giving impressions to the Inquisitor when certain conditions are met (ex. like meeting with a spirit in the Frostback basin to learn Aegis of the Rift). But that's more theory than anything else. Also the plan wasn't to pour the mage's magic directly into the breach but to power the Inquisitor's mark, something that has already been proven to close small rifts and even stall the expansion of the breach itself. Templar abilities in comparison have had no confirmed effects on the rift themselves, despite the fledgling Inquisition having access to both a Seeker and a few former members of the Order. Even one line stating that they had limited success in slowing down or affecting a minor rift would have done wonders in showing the templar plan's validity, but we don't get that. Just speculation that they could if there were enough of them. Which seems like a real missed opportunity, seeing as how in the gameplay itself we know that templar abilities can at least block the rift's demon summoning ruptures if they act pre-emptively. Its not affecting the rift directly, but allowing Cullen to say something like "We know we can restrict the magic around the rifts, perhaps if there are enough of us there we can weaken it" would have done wonders for plan presentation. But again, that's not what we get. All we have is what we know of that the time, mainly being that the mark is the only confirmed way to seal rifts. The random magical mcguffin that we know nothing about and is embedded in our hand is apparently the only thing that is confirmed to work on the rifts in any capacity. If there were any attempts to seal them with another method, they either didn't mention it or they all failed. The real crux of my issue with the templar plan as presented is the lack of evidence. Not a single crumb of a codex or a line dialogue showing or even hinting that their abilities could work on a rift except in a single bit of ambient companion dialogue. But the mark? Confirmed to work. The idea of powering up artifacts or specific magical effects with magic? Been shown numerous times in the series, and the game's intro quest even alludes to the possibility of magic (via lyrium) being used to power up whatever happened at the temple. And that's even counting the presumed blood magic sacrifice we interrupt at the very beginning of the game, with the player naturally being lead to believe that the sacrifice would have been used to power up whatever the then monster-man was holding. So the idea of powering up the mark to achieve a stronger affect? It has a lot going for it to back up the line of reasoning well beyond Cullen's templar plan that primarily relies on faith. Which is fitting given the templar's religious motif, I suppose. Would the mage plan come with consequences? Possibly, but barring a breach expansion I was willing to bet the consequences would have been much less severe than just letting the breach remain and fester as opposed to relying on a plan that players were lead to believe may not work at all. In terms of the logic and evidence presented, the main draw of the templar plan was this: there minimal to no chance of the breach/mark being made worse. If we weren't being told explicitly by bold war table text that the other group would be made unavailable once I made a choice, I honestly would have gone with the templar route under the premise that they seem like the safest option. We would try sealing the breach via templars and if it worked, great! Mission accomplished, the game has its nice message about belief and faith, etc. But it didn't, as we were lead to believe, then the templars would have at least been good at keeping the effects of the breach in check in case the mark's growth stalling effect wore off. In which case we're back to the mage plan and would have gone to recruit the mages Redcliffe. Or at least approach some powerful mages who did not affiliate with the rebellion. God knows the war table missions alone confirmed that there were unaffiliated mage groups... But alas, the game all but broadcasted that I could only choose one group and implies that this one choice was the only choice I was going to get in regards to the breach...
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Post by bloodmagereaver on Sept 12, 2021 23:40:02 GMT
Well...
It all depends on how you set up the future of the Chantry and how you'll set up the future of the world in the next game.
If you didn't go through with Leliana's revolution then the Chantry will likely try to manipulate history again to fit the Inquisitor into their power narrative. I mean, without a major shift the southern Chantry will inevitably preach that the Herald of Andraste was a human female without magic who didn't romance anyone and fully dedicated herself to faith both before and after being choosen by Andraste herself.
If you do go through Leliana's crazy agenda then history will acknowledge the race, gender, romance and faith of the Inquisitor at least until some other crazy divine tries to undo what Leliana did.
More important than what the Chantry does is what your protagonist will do in DA4. If you choose to keep the Veil dissolved and become some sort of godlike figure through the Black City's power then not!Corypheus MC will likely stamp out most of Andrastianism an preach that the Inquisitor was her herald instead.
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Post by Iddy on Sept 13, 2021 2:44:37 GMT
Well... It all depends on how you set up the future of the Chantry and how you'll set up the future of the world in the next game. If you didn't go through with Leliana's revolution then the Chantry will likely try to manipulate history again to fit the Inquisitor into their power narrative. I mean, without a major shift the southern Chantry will inevitably preach that the Herald of Andraste was a human female without magic who didn't romance anyone and fully dedicated herself to faith both before and after being choosen by Andraste herself. If you do go through Leliana's crazy agenda then history will acknowledge the race, gender, romance and faith of the Inquisitor at least until some other crazy divine tries to undo what Leliana did. More important than what the Chantry does is what your protagonist will do in DA4. If you choose to keep the Veil dissolved and become some sort of godlike figure through the Black City's power then not!Corypheus MC will likely stamp out most of Andrastianism an preach that the Inquisitor was her herald instead. This never was about accuracy regarding the Inquisitor's origins and traits. My question was whether people will still believe that the Inquisitor was the "Herald of Andraste" or that such a thing existed at all.
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Post by bloodmagereaver on Sept 13, 2021 2:59:12 GMT
Well... Well... It all depends on how you set up the future of the Chantry and how you'll set up the future of the world in the next game. If you didn't go through with Leliana's revolution then the Chantry will likely try to manipulate history again to fit the Inquisitor into their power narrative. I mean, without a major shift the southern Chantry will inevitably preach that the Herald of Andraste was a human female without magic who didn't romance anyone and fully dedicated herself to faith both before and after being choosen by Andraste herself. If you do go through Leliana's crazy agenda then history will acknowledge the race, gender, romance and faith of the Inquisitor at least until some other crazy divine tries to undo what Leliana did. More important than what the Chantry does is what your protagonist will do in DA4. If you choose to keep the Veil dissolved and become some sort of godlike figure through the Black City's power then not!Corypheus MC will likely stamp out most of Andrastianism an preach that the Inquisitor was her herald instead. This never was about accuracy regarding the Inquisitor's origins and traits. My question was whether people will still believe that the Inquisitor was the "Herald of Andraste" or that such a thing existed at all. On the short term absolutely, people won't forget that the world nearly ended and that a huge ass army named Inquisition saved it under an Inquisitor that walked out of the Fade. Gamewise no matter how much we deny being sent by Andraste there is always widespread rumor and belief that we were sent by Andraste wether directly or indirectly and that would take centuries to weather down. Ultimately it's in the Chantry's interest to harbor the image of the Herald Inquisitor for the sake of inspiring the faithful and attracting new converts hence our character will be like one of those Saints born long after Jesus and his Apostles left the world but whom the Church elects as messengers of God who perform miracles by interceding between mortals and their Deity.
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Post by gervaise21 on Sept 13, 2021 7:32:15 GMT
My question was whether people will still believe that the Inquisitor was the "Herald of Andraste" or that such a thing existed at all. As I've said before, it all depends on whether people believed they were the Herald of Andraste's return to the world or simply her/the Maker's Chosen One to deal with Corypheus. If the latter, then I assume their faith would be reinforced by the fact that they did in fact deal with Corypheus and, as Trespasser points out, there is a scar in the sky to remind them of how near the world came to disaster before the Herald was sent to rescue them. If the former, then there may be some who are slightly disillusioned that Andraste did not immediately return to set the world to rights but will continue to live in hope that they do not have long to wait. Nevertheless, for them the fact that the Herald did deal with Evil One on behalf of Andraste will probably be sufficient for them to go on believing in them. As for the skeptics, of which you can be one, it is clear that the truth was never going to get in the way of propaganda. At the beginning we are told that regardless of what Leliana/Cassandra or our PC think on the matter, they have decided to let the belief continue in order to encourage support for the Inquisition. When we appear to return from the dead, even though we deny it or any faith in our title, Giselle promptly steps in to encourage continued belief among the rank and file of our organisation. We are frequently told it is good for morale to let people think we are the Herald. After returning from the Fade at Adamant even Hawke is saying that it would be better not to tell the truth (I was definitely not happy about that one). Then in the Arbor Wilds the call to arms is in the name of the Herald and Morrigan notes how the PC has now acquired near divine status. Plus if you rub Solas up the wrong way and founded the Inquisition on faith, he has some very scathing things to say about this, calling you a "false god" but it is clear that voices like his are drowned out by the general approbation. So it is likely that belief in the Herald will continue but as the years go by it is likely people will be remembering their own or the Chantry's idea of who the Herald was rather than the actual person.
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Post by xerrai on Sept 13, 2021 16:55:03 GMT
My question was whether people will still believe that the Inquisitor was the "Herald of Andraste" or that such a thing existed at all. [...] As for the skeptics, of which you can be one, it is clear that the truth was never going to get in the way of propaganda. At the beginning we are told that regardless of what Leliana/Cassandra or our PC think on the matter, they have decided to let the belief continue in order to encourage support for the Inquisition. When we appear to return from the dead, even though we deny it or any faith in our title, Giselle promptly steps in to encourage continued belief among the rank and file of our organization. We are frequently told it is good for morale to let people think we are the Herald. After returning from the Fade at Adamant even Hawke is saying that it would be better not to tell the truth (I was definitely not happy about that one). Then in the Arbor Wilds the call to arms is in the name of the Herald and Morrigan notes how the PC has now acquired near divine status. Plus if you rub Solas up the wrong way and founded the Inquisition on faith, he has some very scathing things to say about this, calling you a "false god" but it is clear that voices like his are drowned out by the general approbation. So it is likely that belief in the Herald will continue but as the years go by it is likely people will be remembering their own or the Chantry's idea of who the Herald was rather than the actual person. Actually this bring to mind one thing the Herald may have going for them that the former one didn't: a Divine that actually worked beside them. Assuming the candidate in question actually had a good relationship with the Inquisitor, there is actually a good chance that at least some documentation of the "real" Inquisitor will exist preserved in the Grand Cathedral for quite some time (assuming the world doesn't blow up). After all, it is clear that the Divine does have at least some interest in preserving the legacy of the Inquisition for some reason or another. Political expedience? Genuine fondness? A belief that they need to preserve the past? The reasons may vary. But until Regret showed up at Skyhold, we know steps were being taken to take care of the fortress despite its remote location, so perhaps there is a hope, however slight, that the Divine will write down something that can hold a better picture of the 'real' Inquisitor. Whether this documentation will be available enough for academics to comment on it though will be another matter... Also, does anyone else think the Herald will reach Anointed status?
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Post by gervaise21 on Sept 13, 2021 18:35:23 GMT
Also, does anyone else think the Herald will reach Anointed status? Again, this would depend on how much of the real person is taken into consideration. If you embraced the title of Herald of Andraste and expressed belief that you were the Maker's Chosen (even saying as much to Corypheus at the end), then chances are you could be elevated to Anointed status at some point in the future. If you consistently denied belief in the Maker and your title of Herald, then it might be rather more problematic. Also, I think you are more likely to be Anointed if you are human, although I suppose if you expressed belief that you were the Chosen One and better still declared the Inquisition to be founded on faith, then that would probably override the negatives because of your race.
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Post by DragonEffect on Sept 20, 2021 1:47:19 GMT
Once Solas' plan to destroy the world is set in motion, tragedies with global repercussion will happen all over Thedas. Who will southern thedosians turn to in their desperation? The new Divine and the Inquisition.
DA4 will force the Inquisitor aka Herald of Andraste to take action to save the people once again. If, however, too much death happens and some tragedies cannot be prevented in time, then the faith in the Herald will waver and possibly disappear. So yes, there's a possibility the Inquisitor will stop being seen as the Herald of Andraste. The people might interpret their failure as the Maker once again abandoning His people and they will blame the Inquisitor for not having saved them in time. Someone must be blamed when tragedies befall the common folk, and the scapegoat of choice is usually some form of authority or leadership.
Therefore, the faith in the Herald will depend on the Inquisitor' success in stopping Solas' plan in DA4/5/whatever-game-this-happens.
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