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Post by themikefest on Nov 10, 2022 18:03:48 GMT
While I agree about the sam voice thing, but would the refugees, I mean Initiative, have gone to Andromeda without the golden world thing? Wasn't that information provided by a quarian who infiltrated the geth telescope? That would mean the golden worlds were wrecked over a fairly short time period. This actually isn't out of line (time-wise) with things mentioned in MEA. So without the info provided, they would have blindly travelled to Andromeda crossing their fingers hoping for the best? It sounds like whatever funding he might have had was nothing compared to what the Benefactor provided. And without the Benefactor, the sam voice thing would likely not have been completed. I would not be surprised if Cerberus is involved in some way. What bothers me about that is why not supply Shepard with the voice thing as well? Imagine having the sam voice thing when getting the IFF? Yes the hologram provided a bit of information, but with a sam voice thing, it's likely more information would have been given that might help with dealing with the reapers.
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Post by Iakus on Nov 10, 2022 21:05:43 GMT
What's interesting is it appears Alec was the only one in the galaxy to have the brain power to do this. Of course the Benefactor stepped in to help finish the job. With the intelligence the salarians have, I wouldn't have been surprised if they came up with that long ago. I believe Alec had backing all along. We know humanity was working on AI as far back as when Anderson and Saren first met (despite what they said) and we know they were working on it during the time of ME1 (despite what they say about it). I'd say Alec had secret funding all along. I wouldn't at all be surprised if Cerberus were part of the funding, or at least the people who threw money at Cerberus. I don't think AI were illegal in the Milky Way, just EXTREMELY regulated, and certainly kept tightly shackled. Something like SAM would have been illegal as hell though. And rightly so. Still, given EDI, I'm pretty sure even Cerberus wouldn't be that crazy.
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Post by Iakus on Nov 10, 2022 21:08:52 GMT
I'm afraid R/G/B will still be a thing. I can't imagine how. How do you implement the Reapers being there/not being there, or AI (bots, not MEA) being alive/organics being greenish tinted? Unless the Reapers went somewhere else, and I'd have a hard time buying into that one. Or if the obvious effects (green tint) went away and the nature of AI just isn't discussed. But then why bother having RGB at all? Oh, I'm sure they'll find a way to keep it, if for no other reason than a ham-fisted way to lecture the audience on how much BETTER things are now. Hell, the Ryder-SAM thing always struck me as a not so subtle jab at how Synthesis is AWESOME!
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Post by Phantom on Nov 10, 2022 22:33:08 GMT
I believe Alec had backing all along. We know humanity was working on AI as far back as when Anderson and Saren first met (despite what they said) and we know they were working on it during the time of ME1 (despite what they say about it). I'd say Alec had secret funding all along. I wouldn't at all be surprised if Cerberus were part of the funding, or at least the people who threw money at Cerberus. I don't think AI were illegal in the Milky Way, just EXTREMELY regulated, and certainly kept tightly shackled. Something like SAM would have been illegal as hell though. And rightly so. Still, given EDI, I'm pretty sure even Cerberus wouldn't be that crazy. Well it is true that Cerberus is about bleed edge technology. But that level of insanity is beyond them
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Post by Iakus on Nov 11, 2022 0:04:05 GMT
I don't think AI were illegal in the Milky Way, just EXTREMELY regulated, and certainly kept tightly shackled. Something like SAM would have been illegal as hell though. And rightly so. Still, given EDI, I'm pretty sure even Cerberus wouldn't be that crazy. Well it is true that Cerberus is about bleed edge technology. But that level of insanity is beyond them Right, they kept EDI shackled, and Miranda was seriously p*ssed when Joker released her.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Nov 11, 2022 2:31:07 GMT
I believe Alec had backing all along. We know humanity was working on AI as far back as when Anderson and Saren first met (despite what they said) and we know they were working on it during the time of ME1 (despite what they say about it). I'd say Alec had secret funding all along. I wouldn't at all be surprised if Cerberus were part of the funding, or at least the people who threw money at Cerberus. I don't think AI were illegal in the Milky Way, just EXTREMELY regulated, and certainly kept tightly shackled. Something like SAM would have been illegal as hell though. And rightly so. Still, given EDI, I'm pretty sure even Cerberus wouldn't be that crazy. Correct. In ME1 we learn that there were four groups allowed by the Council to work on AI technology. The Andromeda Initiative is almost certainly one of those four since they were developing everything by that time.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Nov 11, 2022 8:20:54 GMT
I believe Alec had backing all along. We know humanity was working on AI as far back as when Anderson and Saren first met (despite what they said) and we know they were working on it during the time of ME1 (despite what they say about it). I'd say Alec had secret funding all along. I wouldn't at all be surprised if Cerberus were part of the funding, or at least the people who threw money at Cerberus. I don't think AI were illegal in the Milky Way, just EXTREMELY regulated, and certainly kept tightly shackled. Something like SAM would have been illegal as hell though. And rightly so. Still, given EDI, I'm pretty sure even Cerberus wouldn't be that crazy. I don't know about that.... After all they were founded by a guy who is a meat puppet of the robo squids and do experiments on humans (on the orders of said meat puppet) when they could use the council races for those experiments instead...
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Post by hulluliini on Nov 11, 2022 8:32:04 GMT
I don't think AI were illegal in the Milky Way, just EXTREMELY regulated, and certainly kept tightly shackled. Something like SAM would have been illegal as hell though. And rightly so. Still, given EDI, I'm pretty sure even Cerberus wouldn't be that crazy. Correct. In ME1 we learn that there were four groups allowed by the Council to work on AI technology. The Andromeda Initiative is almost certainly one of those four since they were developing everything by that time. Where in the game do we learn that?
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Nov 11, 2022 9:15:35 GMT
Correct. In ME1 we learn that there were four groups allowed by the Council to work on AI technology. The Andromeda Initiative is almost certainly one of those four since they were developing everything by that time. Where in the game do we learn that? We learn it when talking to Gianna in ME1. You have to ask her about the corporations on Noveria. Shepard then mentions hearing about Synthetic Insights in the news and Gianna says they are one of four groups the Council allows to work on AI.
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Post by dmc1001 on Nov 12, 2022 0:36:44 GMT
I don't think AI were illegal in the Milky Way, just EXTREMELY regulated, and certainly kept tightly shackled. Something like SAM would have been illegal as hell though. And rightly so. From the wiki: "Anderson arrives at the Citadel, to meet with Ambassador Anita Goyle, the Alliance representative on the Citadel. Ambassador Goyle informs Anderson that the Sidon facility was researching AI. This is illegal under the Citadel Conventions after an incident 300 years ago, when the quarians created an artificial race—the geth—that eventually turned on them. She sends Anderson to locate Kahlee Sanders, who may know who was behind the attack and the whereabouts of Dr. Shu Qian, the brilliant scientist in charge of the Sidon facility." masseffect.fandom.com/wiki/Storyline#The_SpectreStill, given EDI, I'm pretty sure even Cerberus wouldn't be that crazy. True. Javik tells about the zha / zha'til. The organics and AI had merged. The AI part rebelled against them and joined the Reapers. It's a significant threat.
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Post by Iakus on Nov 12, 2022 16:47:55 GMT
I don't think AI were illegal in the Milky Way, just EXTREMELY regulated, and certainly kept tightly shackled. Something like SAM would have been illegal as hell though. And rightly so. From the wiki: "Anderson arrives at the Citadel, to meet with Ambassador Anita Goyle, the Alliance representative on the Citadel. Ambassador Goyle informs Anderson that the Sidon facility was researching AI. This is illegal under the Citadel Conventions after an incident 300 years ago, when the quarians created an artificial race—the geth—that eventually turned on them. She sends Anderson to locate Kahlee Sanders, who may know who was behind the attack and the whereabouts of Dr. Shu Qian, the brilliant scientist in charge of the Sidon facility." masseffect.fandom.com/wiki/Storyline#The_SpectreRight, you need specials permission from the Citadel Council to research AIs. Thus far, only four groups have that permission (and they take extreme precautions to make sure they can't escape)
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Post by dmc1001 on Nov 13, 2022 4:53:08 GMT
From the wiki: "Anderson arrives at the Citadel, to meet with Ambassador Anita Goyle, the Alliance representative on the Citadel. Ambassador Goyle informs Anderson that the Sidon facility was researching AI. This is illegal under the Citadel Conventions after an incident 300 years ago, when the quarians created an artificial race—the geth—that eventually turned on them. She sends Anderson to locate Kahlee Sanders, who may know who was behind the attack and the whereabouts of Dr. Shu Qian, the brilliant scientist in charge of the Sidon facility." masseffect.fandom.com/wiki/Storyline#The_SpectreRight, you need specials permission from the Citadel Council to research AIs. Thus far, only four groups have that permission (and they take extreme precautions to make sure they can't escape) I guess I'm missing something. Where does it say that anyone can research AI? And which four races?
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Post by Iakus on Nov 13, 2022 17:15:12 GMT
Right, you need specials permission from the Citadel Council to research AIs. Thus far, only four groups have that permission (and they take extreme precautions to make sure they can't escape) I guess I'm missing something. Where does it say that anyone can research AI? And which four races? Researching AI is heavily restricted, and requires special permission form the Citadel Council. At the time of ME1, there were four organizations that had such permission. We don't know what the other three are ( I believe) but one of them was the company Synthetic Insights., which is mentioned in ME1 and ME2
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Post by dmc1001 on Nov 13, 2022 17:27:31 GMT
I guess I'm missing something. Where does it say that anyone can research AI? And which four races? Researching AI is heavily restricted, and requires special permission form the Citadel Council. At the time of ME1, there were four organizations that had such permission. We don't know what the other three are ( I believe) but one of them was the company Synthetic Insights., which is mentioned in ME1 and ME2 I know what you're saying. What I'm outright asking is where was it said. Did it happen on Noveria? Did the Council mention it? Did Anderson say a line? The wiki is usually very accurate and informative so I'm wondering where the information came from.
Edit: I found it. It says four corporations had permission and one was Synthetic Insights. This was mentioned in Revelation. It's been years since I read the book so I didn't remember.
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Post by Iakus on Nov 13, 2022 17:33:26 GMT
Researching AI is heavily restricted, and requires special permission form the Citadel Council. At the time of ME1, there were four organizations that had such permission. We don't know what the other three are ( I believe) but one of them was the company Synthetic Insights., which is mentioned in ME1 and ME2 I know what you're saying. What I'm outright asking is where was it said. Did it happen on Noveria? Did the Council mention it? Did Anderson say a line? The wiki is usually very accurate and informative so I'm wondering where the information came from.
Edit: I found it. It says four corporations had permission and one was Synthetic Insights. This was mentioned in Revelation. It's been years since I read the book so I didn't remember.
It's also mentioned in a conversation with Gianna Parasini in ME1 (since Synthetic insights had an office on Noveria)
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Nov 13, 2022 19:39:29 GMT
I know what you're saying. What I'm outright asking is where was it said. Did it happen on Noveria? Did the Council mention it? Did Anderson say a line? The wiki is usually very accurate and informative so I'm wondering where the information came from.
Edit: I found it. It says four corporations had permission and one was Synthetic Insights. This was mentioned in Revelation. It's been years since I read the book so I didn't remember.
It's also mentioned in a conversation with Gianna Parasini in ME1 (since Synthetic insights had an office on Noveria) Assuming the Andromeda Initiative is one of those four, I wonder who the other two are.
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Post by Iakus on Nov 14, 2022 3:43:29 GMT
It's also mentioned in a conversation with Gianna Parasini in ME1 (since Synthetic insights had an office on Noveria) Assuming the Andromeda Initiative is one of those four, I wonder who the other two are. Was SAM supposed to be a true AI, or was that something Alec worked on on the side?
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Post by ahglock on Nov 14, 2022 4:49:54 GMT
It's also mentioned in a conversation with Gianna Parasini in ME1 (since Synthetic insights had an office on Noveria) Assuming the Andromeda Initiative is one of those four, I wonder who the other two are.
I may be misremembering the MEA flashbacks but I was under the impression the AI stuff Ryder senior was doing was illegal, maybe that was before he joined the initiative but I always assumed they did that under the table.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Nov 14, 2022 5:58:53 GMT
Assuming the Andromeda Initiative is one of those four, I wonder who the other two are.
I may be misremembering the MEA flashbacks but I was under the impression the AI stuff Ryder senior was doing was illegal, maybe that was before he joined the initiative but I always assumed they did that under the table.
When Alec was working with SAM under the Alliance it was illegal. That’s what got him dishonorably discharged and Scott and Sara blacklisted. After that he continued his research, reaching out to people like the ones we see, and eventually the Mysterious Benefactor approached Alec with the offer to join the Andromeda Initiative and continue his research. The true potential of this particular SAM was kept under wraps, but the others were allowed since they were extremely shackled.
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Post by hulluliini on Nov 14, 2022 8:23:12 GMT
Where in the game do we learn that? We learn it when talking to Gianna in ME1. You have to ask her about the corporations on Noveria. Shepard then mentions hearing about Synthetic Insights in the news and Gianna says they are one of four groups the Council allows to work on AI. I wish this had been elaborated on. What is the basis for letting those corporations work on AI but not Alec Ryder? What is the crucial difference? Those corporations being able to pay for the privilege?
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Nov 14, 2022 9:12:51 GMT
We learn it when talking to Gianna in ME1. You have to ask her about the corporations on Noveria. Shepard then mentions hearing about Synthetic Insights in the news and Gianna says they are one of four groups the Council allows to work on AI. I wish this had been elaborated on. What is the basis for letting those corporations work on AI but not Alec Ryder? What is the crucial difference? Those corporations being able to pay for the privilege? I think it can be two main differences: 1. Security. Groups like Synthetic Insights or the Andromeda Initiative develop their AIs in very controlled environments where they can’t pose a threat. Meanwhile Alec was creating SAM with seemingly none of those security measures. 2. Reason: Synthetic Insights works with AIs to develop VI systems for mechs or things like the greybox which had the goal of being a way to defeat diseases like Alzheimer’s. The Andromeda Initiative works with AIs to serve as a tool to react to any situation, from almost instantaneously understanding new species to problems or situations that need to be addressed immediately when colonizing. Both proved that they needed AIs in order to do these things. Meanwhile Alec was talking about merging AIs into people which could be seen as a way to make an army of super soldiers, unleash AI into the galaxy, etc. Hence why he keeps his work on our SAM secret even from pretty much everyone in the Initiative.
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Post by Iakus on Nov 14, 2022 16:32:49 GMT
I may be misremembering the MEA flashbacks but I was under the impression the AI stuff Ryder senior was doing was illegal, maybe that was before he joined the initiative but I always assumed they did that under the table.
When Alec was working with SAM under the Alliance it was illegal. That’s what got him dishonorably discharged and Scott and Sara blacklisted. After that he continued his research, reaching out to people like the ones we see, and eventually the Mysterious Benefactor approached Alec with the offer to join the Andromeda Initiative and continue his research. The true potential of this particular SAM was kept under wraps, but the others were allowed since they were extremely shackled. I suspect Alec's work with the AI was still illegal, but the Benefactor was willing to keep it under wraps and not tell the Council
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Post by dmc1001 on Nov 15, 2022 20:17:08 GMT
I can't imagine how. How do you implement the Reapers being there/not being there, or AI (bots, not MEA) being alive/organics being greenish tinted? Unless the Reapers went somewhere else, and I'd have a hard time buying into that one. Or if the obvious effects (green tint) went away and the nature of AI just isn't discussed. But then why bother having RGB at all? Oh, I'm sure they'll find a way to keep it, if for no other reason than a ham-fisted way to lecture the audience on how much BETTER things are now. Hell, the Ryder-SAM thing always struck me as a not so subtle jab at how Synthesis is AWESOME! Which is weird because synthesis is directly at odds with what Javik told them about a race in his own time. The AI/organic meld ended with the organics dead. But them I'm a proponent that Reapers can't be trusted to exist and I think they had a hand in the zha/zha'til mess.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Nov 16, 2022 6:39:57 GMT
Oh, I'm sure they'll find a way to keep it, if for no other reason than a ham-fisted way to lecture the audience on how much BETTER things are now. Hell, the Ryder-SAM thing always struck me as a not so subtle jab at how Synthesis is AWESOME! Which is weird because synthesis is directly at odds with what Javik told them about a race in his own time. The AI/organic meld ended with the organics dead. But them I'm a proponent that Reapers can't be trusted to exist and I think they had a hand in the zha/zha'til mess. Hmm... Starkid does say that it tried something similar in the past and that it failed.
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Post by themikefest on Nov 16, 2022 12:46:34 GMT
Which is weird because synthesis is directly at odds with what Javik told them about a race in his own time. The AI/organic meld ended with the organics dead. But them I'm a proponent that Reapers can't be trusted to exist and I think they had a hand in the zha/zha'til mess. Hmm... Starkid does say that it tried something similar in the past and that it failed. I'm willing to bet it didn't try anything. It found the solution that is currently in place and stuck with it. It's too bad Shepard couldn't ask dumb dumb about that.
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