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"A person of any mental quality has ideas of his own. This is common sense." Franz Liszt
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Onecrazymonkey1 on Sept 22, 2024 22:19:44 GMT
So would a character like this be curvy enough? (Sofa Jockey was the one who posted it originally) I like personally. But I’ve seen two videos of 2 reviewers trying to max out the ass and the chest, and it was quite pathetic. The ass remained flat, the same as the chest. Seeing this, I wondered what was even the point. For the chest, I think the outfit is the tree hiding the forest. I can’t still see she has a b cup at best and didn't change much. And the ass, from behind we can’t see it, but pretty sure it remained flat, the same as the default with little difference, so I don’t know. We at least know we can have wide hips. Yeah I'm in agreement about the armor, it's kind of hard to tell from the front because it's obscuring a lot, so Idk. That said, she has very nice hips and that's a lot closer to what I would like to make.
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Post by themikefest on Sept 22, 2024 22:25:10 GMT
This isn’t a hair style, or color though. This is an entire body type. And a fairly common one at that. ...and? Actual red haired people are also an entire type of hair which many people have. It was disappointing that Andromeda had a hair out of a can look but didn't really effect the quality of the overall CC. Again limitations are going to be a part of any game and really all the other things people have been worried about not being in the game actually are so it does not do a lot for the strength of this argument. Limitations? Are there other games that have a character creator that let the player adjust the body of a character more than what is seen in Veilguard?
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bierkrug
N3
Games: Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Posts: 521 Likes: 1,094
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Post by bierkrug on Sept 22, 2024 22:27:14 GMT
Limitations? Are there other games that have a character creator that let the player adjust the body of a character more than what is seen in Veilguard? Dragon's Dogma 2. You can even adjust every tooth and the walk cycles.
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Iakus
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Iakus on Sept 22, 2024 22:28:43 GMT
I would be a lot more inclined to have a civilized conversation about this issue if literally every single time it's brought up (as in the very first post of this thread) it didn't also reference the scar thing, because right now the scar thing is the #1 'Bioware is bad/woke' talking point in YouTube comments across the platform. So yeah, I can't take the complaint seriously because of that associated disingenuous idiocy. That well has been poisoned. Most of the people bringing up scars here are posters accusing people who want "more endowed" female characters of being triggered by the presence of scars in the CC.
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Post by flyingovertrout on Sept 22, 2024 22:29:38 GMT
Literally OP in first post (with 13 likes!) lmao
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Post by smilesja on Sept 22, 2024 22:32:50 GMT
I think Bioware should've just done the same thing as Larian did: let us choose face/body presets and that's it. Most people seem to be happy with BG3's CC. When the game was released, some complained that it was very limiting but at this point i've seen more praise for it rather than criticism. Plus not being able to modify your character's body/face also helps with animations, which i believe was the reason why Larian went this route with CC.
Oh, I’ve seen plenty of “why are all the female faces so ugly?” threads. Male too, sometimes. Have you been to the Larian forum? As usual it’s the company’s own site that has the most criticism. That’s even talking about the controversial mods that remove all the “woke” stuff from the game.
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Post by smilesja on Sept 22, 2024 22:34:10 GMT
I would be a lot more inclined to have a civilized conversation about this issue if literally every single time it's brought up (as in the very first post of this thread) it didn't also reference the scar thing, because right now the scar thing is the #1 'Bioware is bad/woke' talking point in YouTube comments across the platform. So yeah, I can't take the complaint seriously because of that associated disingenuous idiocy. That well has been poisoned. Most of the people bringing up scars here are posters accusing people who want "more endowed" female characters of being triggered by the presence of scars in the CC. I mean let’s just say some major right wing influencers have bought up the scar “issue” which led to these flame wars lol.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by biggydx on Sept 22, 2024 22:37:17 GMT
So would a character like this be curvy enough? (Sofa Jockey was the one who posted it originally) I like personally. But I’ve seen two videos of 2 reviewers trying to max out the ass and the chest, and it was quite pathetic. The ass remained flat, the same as the chest. Seeing this, I wondered what was even the point. For the chest, I think the outfit is the tree hiding the forest. I can’t still see she has a b cup at best and didn't change much. And the ass, from behind we can’t see it, but pretty sure it remained flat, the same as the default with little difference, so I don’t know. We at least know we can have wide hips. I mean, how big do you want them? Dragons Dogma 2 your standard I guess? ...and? Actual red haired people are also an entire type of hair which many people have. It was disappointing that Andromeda had a hair out of a can look but didn't really effect the quality of the overall CC. Again limitations are going to be a part of any game and really all the other things people have been worried about not being in the game actually are so it does not do a lot for the strength of this argument. Limitations? Are there other games that have a character creator that let the player adjust the body of a character more than what is seen in Veilguard? If we're keeping it strictly to RPG's, as someone mentioned, Dragons Dogma 2 is one example. Another example, though slightly more obscure, is Rise of the Ronin. That game, I would argue, probably has more total CC options than Veilguard or Dragons Dogma 2 tbh.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Julilla on Sept 22, 2024 22:50:21 GMT
It seems like every day it's a different outrage on the Intarwebs. I'm happy I can finally have curly hair and what look to be good brows. I don't personally care about if I can create a DDD chest size to represent me, because honestly, they're a pain in the ass. I role play smaller booby women because that is my ideal. I can't imagine zipping around in my athletic rogue bod with these massive things. But some people want those proportions, even though breasts like mine break my immersion. I honestly expect this is nothing more than a clipping issue and not some "agenda" regarding "woke" "can't have good looking women anymore" or "Western game".
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Post by Syv on Sept 22, 2024 22:50:48 GMT
I like personally. But I’ve seen two videos of 2 reviewers trying to max out the ass and the chest, and it was quite pathetic. The ass remained flat, the same as the chest. Seeing this, I wondered what was even the point. For the chest, I think the outfit is the tree hiding the forest. I can’t still see she has a b cup at best and didn't change much. And the ass, from behind we can’t see it, but pretty sure it remained flat, the same as the default with little difference, so I don’t know. We at least know we can have wide hips. I mean, how big do you want them? Dragons Dogma 2? For example. I was very happy with Dragon's dogma 2. I felt it allowed total freedom, it was a real " make the character you want " even if of course it had some limitations to a certain point. But you could play a fat, a curvy or a muscular man or woman. That should be the basic thing to have when you have multiple bodies. As broad as possible. I think this CC was universally liked, at least I didn't see any critics, meaning that everyone was happy. Those who wanted to create a very muscular or a curvy woman could do it,. Everyone is happy , nobody gets grumpy.
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MetaTiki
N1
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by MetaTiki on Sept 22, 2024 22:53:09 GMT
I would be a lot more inclined to have a civilized conversation about this issue if literally every single time it's brought up (as in the very first post of this thread) it didn't also reference the scar thing, because right now the scar thing is the #1 'Bioware is bad/woke' talking point in YouTube comments across the platform. So yeah, I can't take the complaint seriously because of that associated disingenuous idiocy. That well has been poisoned. Most of the people bringing up scars here are posters accusing people who want "more endowed" female characters of being triggered by the presence of scars in the CC. Considering that the actual originating post for the thread contains the comment about scars and thus OP was the first to bring up the scars themselves and include them by default in the discussion overall, your response in and of itself is disingenuous as a reaction to my original statement. I noted that I am disinclined to engage in the topic due to the distasteful way that people are choosing to frame this 'complaint' by associating two completely discrete elements of the Character Creation in a way which aligns them with the arguments of those trying to declare Bioware as woke/dead/whatever other ridiculous ideas they have been spoonfed by grifters seeking clicks on their negative videos. Maybe someday I'll see someone bring up this subject without also trying to draw parallels to scars. So far, I have not. So I respond accordingly.
As I said, I would be more inclined to discuss the issue with people who want more T&A expansion options in the character creator because it doesn't have everything I want, either. I'd like to see body hair, a bit more options for both more body fat and more musculature options, and other little nitpicks. However, I also understand that what we are seeing in this CC is an incredible advancement over the previous options available from Bioware, and also understand that engine rendering options can only be pushed so far. A scar is a simple texture modification. Body types require a hell of a lot more under the hood coding to accommodate, and I don't want to see the same weird squash and stretch oddities of armor textures as I see in Elden Ring (as an example) here in Veilguard. So I'm happy to think that they have pushed as far as they can within their limits of budget, resources, and technical tools available to them.
I would much rather ascribe the choices surrounding what is available in the CC to technical and resource limitations rather than malice, and overall I am hella impressed by the advances I have seen. Maybe someday they will be able to give us more. For now, I know that they listened to us and tried to deliver improvements to us as best as they can. The number of feature improvements compared to DAI and MEA are numerous, and I am happy to take all of them. The idea that somehow people haven't learned the lesson of 'perfect is the enemy of good' when it comes to game design saddens me, but I will be making dozens of Rooks and OCs using this CC and count myself as content.
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Ravenfeeder
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Ravenfeeder on Sept 22, 2024 23:05:03 GMT
What annoys me about the scars issue (aside from the horrific transphobia that often goes with it on Xitter and the like), is that there are real-world historical examples of women removing their breasts for non-trans reasons. The Scythians had 'maidens' who removed one breast so they could fire bows from horseback for example. Does no one read Herodotus any more?
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Post by colfoley on Sept 22, 2024 23:10:09 GMT
What annoys me about the scars issue (aside from the horrific transphobia that often goes with it on Xitter and the like), is that there are real-world historical examples of women removing their breasts for non-trans reasons. The Scythians had 'maidens' who removed one breast so they could fire bows from horseback for example. Does no one read Herodotus any more? I think only people who play AC OD even know who Herodotus even is.
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rekkampum
N2
Gui meɖi naneke o, gake ŋudͻwͻnu le eŋu
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Posts: 164 Likes: 253
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rekkampum
Gui meɖi naneke o, gake ŋudͻwͻnu le eŋu
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by rekkampum on Sept 22, 2024 23:19:14 GMT
I remember a time, which was not long ago, when Bioware fans were fighting for options to please as many players as possible. That included gay characters, love interests, storylines, skillsets, even weapon sizes and realism. These days people here fight for limitations. What the hell happened here? You must've forgotten the entire moratorium on posts about Fight For the Love - which I was a part of - due to all of the homophobic comments and arguments against including them as well. Or an entire character's Romance thread being locked down, not to mention the vitriol people spewed toward Jacob - that I still see repeated offsite and in some cases on this forum. While this controversy is disappointing to see, it's par for the course amongst the BSN fandom.
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I don't stir, I work the material.
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Post by slimgrin727 on Sept 22, 2024 23:19:45 GMT
Remember when Andromeda's CC made it well nigh impossible to make attractive characters? You couldn't even make fair skinned ones.
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bierkrug
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Games: Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Posts: 521 Likes: 1,094
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Post by bierkrug on Sept 22, 2024 23:27:47 GMT
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Post by colfoley on Sept 23, 2024 0:20:10 GMT
Remember when Andromeda's CC made it well nigh impossible to make attractive characters? You couldn't even make fair skinned ones. Both of which aren't true since I've done both. Though beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by biggydx on Sept 23, 2024 0:33:07 GMT
I mean, how big do you want them? Dragons Dogma 2? For example. I was very happy with Dragon's dogma 2. I felt it allowed total freedom, it was a real " make the character you want " even if of course it had some limitations to a certain point. But you could play a fat, a curvy or a muscular man or woman. That should be the basic thing to have when you have multiple bodies. As broad as possible. I think this CC was universally liked, at least I didn't see any critics, meaning that everyone was happy. Those who wanted to create a very muscular or a curvy woman could do it,. Everyone is happy , nobody gets grumpy. Gotcha
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rekkampum
N2
Gui meɖi naneke o, gake ŋudͻwͻnu le eŋu
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Posts: 164 Likes: 253
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rekkampum
Gui meɖi naneke o, gake ŋudͻwͻnu le eŋu
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by rekkampum on Sept 23, 2024 0:37:38 GMT
I mean, how big do you want them? Dragons Dogma 2? For example. I was very happy with Dragon's dogma 2. I felt it allowed total freedom, it was a real " make the character you want " even if of course it had some limitations to a certain point. But you could play a fat, a curvy or a muscular man or woman. That should be the basic thing to have when you have multiple bodies. As broad as possible. I think this CC was universally liked, at least I didn't see any critics, meaning that everyone was happy. Those who wanted to create a very muscular or a curvy woman could do it,. Everyone is happy , nobody gets grumpy. I enjoyed being able to make characters and Pawns that shared my body type or others that were atypical as well as literally seeing official characters who shared similar ones.
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RelevantRevenant
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Games: Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by RelevantRevenant on Sept 23, 2024 4:48:45 GMT
What annoys me about the scars issue (aside from the horrific transphobia that often goes with it on Xitter and the like), is that there are real-world historical examples of women removing their breasts for non-trans reasons. The Scythians had 'maidens' who removed one breast so they could fire bows from horseback for example. Does no one read Herodotus any more? Wasn't it just one breast so they could more easily draw back a bow? Or am I thinking of Amazonians?
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Games: Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Posts: 521 Likes: 1,094
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Post by bierkrug on Sept 23, 2024 8:15:51 GMT
Wasn't it just one breast so they could more easily draw back a bow? Or am I thinking of Amazonians? The Scyths were one of the people who inspired the myth of the Amazons. One breast burned off for the bow (ouch) and one left for nursing. That may also be just a myth though.
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RelevantRevenant
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Games: Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Posts: 467 Likes: 1,101
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Post by RelevantRevenant on Sept 23, 2024 8:34:59 GMT
Wasn't it just one breast so they could more easily draw back a bow? Or am I thinking of Amazonians? The Scyths were one of the people who inspired the myth of the Amazons. One breast burned off for the bow (ouch) and one left for nursing. That may also be just a myth though. i think I remembered this one, because as a nurse, it always seemed to me like you would die from sepsis or blood loss. So I hope it was a myth and no one actually had to go through that.
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An unknown possibly hostile flotilla detected at eight hundred astronomical units from the sun!
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Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem
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Post by Unicephalon 40-D on Sept 23, 2024 8:53:55 GMT
It seems like every day it's a different outrage on the Intarwebs. I honestly expect this is nothing more than a clipping issue and not some "agenda" regarding "woke" "can't have good looking women anymore" or "Western game". Yep there are limits how much you can "bulge" or "expand" things before they break (not enough polygons for example) and then put some "clothes" and "armor" on top of the model -> those need to be stretched too and boy it looks awful if it is not done for such. I find this whole thing very laughable and its another outrage on tha intarwebps yes.
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Gileadan
N5
Agent 46
Clearance Level Ultra
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: ALoneGretchin
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Gileadan on Sept 23, 2024 9:18:34 GMT
Not quite sure what's more funny, the outrage or the outrage about the outrage.
But it gives the people trawling the forums for wrong opinions something to do, so there's that.
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Post by dagless on Sept 23, 2024 13:08:00 GMT
It seems like every day it's a different outrage on the Intarwebs. I honestly expect this is nothing more than a clipping issue and not some "agenda" regarding "woke" "can't have good looking women anymore" or "Western game". Yep there are limits how much you can "bulge" or "expand" things before they break (not enough polygons for example) and then put some "clothes" and "armor" on top of the model -> those need to be stretched too and boy it looks awful if it is not done for such. I find this whole thing very laughable and its another outrage on tha intarwebps yes. Not only that, but how they move, and squish up against things (ie love interests). We know there will be some optional nudity (at least semi), hence the underwear options. They’ve incorporated a lot of body sliders, but probably all within limits that don’t mess too much with cut scene animations. So no massive bazookas, no really fat characters (no one seems to be complaining about discrimination on that). Those could take a lot more work to get looking right. Possibly even some advanced flesh physics. I’d bet they just kept the body options to whatever is more manageable for animation purposes. No one needs to play a couple of dozen hours of game before realising that the body customization they’ve gone for makes the romance scenes look like garbage. Adding a scar on the other hand, is practically nothing compared to all the other options, so why not?
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