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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Nov 12, 2016 22:25:52 GMT
Watch the video and agree or disagree, but attempt to do so eloquently or at least without being destructive. If you dislike Smudboy, you can tell me, but please don't driveby shitpost.
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Post by Garo on Nov 12, 2016 22:38:43 GMT
Eeeeeughhh he always has some valid points and whole bunch of whining in his videos.
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Nov 12, 2016 22:44:14 GMT
Yeah, it's overly negative for the most part because he's so high-brow and I don't get why he bothers to counter-address minutiae in BioWare games anymore.
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Post by Garo on Nov 12, 2016 23:00:12 GMT
Question 1: Did the council secretly build Arks with the council races? No, but he has valid point with Andromeda Initiative being just a cover up for running away from the Reapers. Question 2: Why go to another galaxy at all? Looking at promotion of this game the answer is: because we want to move forward (explore), rich people do what they want with their money and maybe some people wanted to go on this because they got scared about reaper threat. Cerberus probably helped with building human Ark. Question 3: What is up with these ships? They build 4 for every council race and Hyperion for everyone so we wouldn't lost whole race. Question 3b: Where will you get element 0? Well I think we can assume Andromeda has it. Question 4: How about the static electric discharge from using Mass Effect fields? Dunno, WI stopping ship for discharge every now and then. Maybe BW will tell us later. Question 5: What's up with the jump in FTL tech? Too much math, I'm out. Probably legit point tho. Question 6: Vaults? Whining.
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Post by bshep on Nov 12, 2016 23:02:08 GMT
Smudboy....really? I should go.
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Post by shechinah on Nov 12, 2016 23:04:33 GMT
Short summary: If you've read the posts on these forums criticising the premise from a lore tech-perspective then you've pretty heard almost all of the points raised in this video.
0:00-3:51: Council and the ARKs as a plan.
3:51-9:12: Tech lore.
9:12 - 11:05: He dislike that there's vaults and enemies. He'd basically would have preferred a complete reboot.
He also assumes the story will fail before it gets off the ground if it cannot answer the questions he raises in the video. I still disagree with this especially because that assessment relies on the assumption that every fan as well as customer will place the same emphasis and importance on these points as he and others do. These points may impact his and others' enjoyment of the game but they almost certainly won't impact every player and fan's enjoyment of the game to the same degree including some lore-lovers like myself.
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Post by SofNascimento on Nov 12, 2016 23:09:37 GMT
There is certainly another reason why we're going to Andromeda. People don't spend fortunes that shoudn't be possible just for the sake of exploration.
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Post by Iakus on Nov 13, 2016 0:15:56 GMT
"Bravo, Bioware, you're still running from the galactic storytelling mess that was Mass Effect 3's ending" So true. So true.
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Post by helios969 on Nov 13, 2016 0:21:53 GMT
Well he raises some valid points but he really should have stayed away from the science. Andromeda is not an antimatter galaxy, and yes, the laws of physics and the periodic table are the same as the MW galaxy. I think maybe he confused going to another universe with going to another galaxy. Still I tend to agree that the story is already broken...based on what has been presented. My only hope is that we as a "lowly member" of the AI have no specific insights to the "real reasons" for escaping to Andromeda, and that over the course of the game those reasons are explored and explained.
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Nov 13, 2016 0:32:23 GMT
Iakus : Yes, but we've known that for a while I think the most important point he made that sort of irritate me now (unless BioWare justifies it) is the fact that escaping unaware of the Reapers makes it really implausible, because while Mac tried to justify it on Twitter by drawing a parallel to humans going to space for the first time, it doens't work the same way when we're talking about probably more population than on the Citadel and multiple species traveling in ARKS. It's not a shuttle that has to carry one or two futuristic space-astronauts to another galaxy, it's a one-way trip with Cryo sleep for an entire fraction of a civilization as if they're escaping from something, and consider how many uncharted worlds are left in Milky Way anyway. What's our rush? And moreover he likened Andromeda to Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri where an ark to save humanity is made where the motivations of each group is the same; Escaping the threat, but they split into multiple arks based on ideologies. Just, considering the scale it's just implausible to me we'll make an expedition as big as the Andromeda Initiative in a time where the galaxy believes it's at peace.
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Post by shechinah on Nov 13, 2016 0:40:54 GMT
"Bravo, Bioware, you're still running from the galactic storytelling mess that was Mass Effect 3's ending" So true. So true. Yeah but that has been apparent since the premise of Andromeda was revealed and honestly, I'm more than fine with it. I don't have to deal with the endings this way but I still get to play the next Mass Effect game: it's a win-win for me especially since I love what I've seen so far of Andromeda's plot.
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Post by helios969 on Nov 13, 2016 0:41:12 GMT
Also, I hadn't really thought about it but it would make more sense to have each ark integrated. Just in case...
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Post by Adhin on Nov 13, 2016 0:49:31 GMT
Just to throw this out there but we are not going to Andromeda with even close to the population of the Citadel. The Citadel has 13.2 million people living on it (not including keepers). Gameinformer said bioware mentioned a population of 100k. Now they weren't sure it that was 'per ship' or in total but I think it's in total (ill go into that later), but even if it's not that's half a million tops. Which anyone can tell you isn't quite reaching that 13.2 million on the Citadel.
Now, why do I think it's 100k total? Ark ships aren't really bigger then the Destiny Ascension which someone pointed out has about 10k people on it. Now you might think 'well there all in cryo so obviously it's more then DA'. Weelll about that, the Arks have to function as an actual ship. It's not one giant flying box filled to the brim with cryostasis pods. It still needs to function as a ship, mess hall, bridge, all that nonsense and it has to accommodate whatever it's taking over so 10k sounds about right at that point. So 10k per ark, leaves 60k on the Nexus (which makes sense, it's a lot bigger).
Keep in mind everyone coming is coming because they want the chance on a new frontier. Which is one of the many reasons they decided not to make it all about the Reapers. Cause the second you make it about the Reapers, that's all it's about 'omg the reapers' and frankly that gets boring fast as everyone you talk to? Same goddamn reason.
As far as 'Tech' the only issue is the 'electrostatic charge buildup' which is kinda a BS premise anyway unless they line all there engines with rubber or something stupid. But we have plenty of ways of dealing with that kind of thing now and days. There's plenty of ways for them to go about 'solving' that issue for MEA. I literally cannot see it as an issue.
Beyond that the FTL 'tech' is the same. If anything it's actually on the slower end of travel for Mass Effect. Top end ships can hit 15 light years a day. Which would come out to 463-4 years to get to Andromeda at that, so we're definitely traveling slower probably to accommodate the whole static build up and diffusing of it (somewhere around 11-12 LR a day).
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Post by 10k on Nov 13, 2016 13:53:03 GMT
Question 3: What is up with these ships? They build 4 for every council race and Hyperion for everyone so we wouldn't lost whole race. I think his point is valid with this one. Each species has it's own ship, but why? Why are the races segregated; each ship for one entire race? If one ship goes down that entire race is basically gone. The ships shouldn't be segregated, that's what he was saying.
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Post by BadgerladDK on Nov 13, 2016 13:57:18 GMT
Question 3: What is up with these ships? They build 4 for every council race and Hyperion for everyone so we wouldn't lost whole race. I think his point is valid with this one. Each species has it's own ship, but why? Why are the races segregated; each ship for one entire race? If one ship goes down that entire race is basically gone. The ships shouldn't be segregated, that's what he was saying. Well, presumably they'd have different destinations based on the needs of each species.
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Post by General Aetius on Nov 13, 2016 14:02:55 GMT
Smudboy? Sounds like a Salarian manwhore on Omega.
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Post by 10k on Nov 13, 2016 14:15:36 GMT
Well, presumably they'd have different destinations based on the needs of each species. Even so, that still is a bit risky. They have no idea what is in the Andromeda galaxy, barely any info. Why would you risk an entire species? It would have been smarter just to integrate each ship and then just wake everyone up when they first arrived in Andromeda and figure out who's going where. Because if one ship goes down, for whatever reason, that's an entire species gone. Also even if the ships did have different destinations I still would think each species could still find a planet that suits there needs in that destination the ship traveled. Andromeda is pretty big after all. There is no good reason to segregate the species.
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Post by Reznore on Nov 13, 2016 14:16:19 GMT
He sometimes make some good point but he can't help but nitpick on everything and gets carried away. I agree overall the premise of MEA is meh and doesn't fit the past universe. A "scientific" exploration kind of thing is not a bad idea per se , but this operation seem huge if it's not secretly motivated by a possible Reaper invasion...*shrug*... Second in the trailer someone is whiny about "peace" being broken.Now I blame Canada rose tinted glass , but the Mass Effect universe and people in it are old enough and been through enough discovery and conquest of territory to not be this naive. You didn't come to Andromeda armed to the teeth just in case the local fauna was dangerous. And I went nitpicky myself.
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Post by The Elder King on Nov 13, 2016 14:17:08 GMT
Iakus : Yes, but we've known that for a while I think the most important point he made that sort of irritate me now (unless BioWare justifies it) is the fact that escaping unaware of the Reapers makes it really implausible, because while Mac tried to justify it on Twitter by drawing a parallel to humans going to space for the first time, it doens't work the same way when we're talking about probably more population than on the Citadel and multiple species traveling in ARKS. It's not a shuttle that has to carry one or two futuristic space-astronauts to another galaxy, it's a one-way trip with Cryo sleep for an entire fraction of a civilization as if they're escaping from something, and consider how many uncharted worlds are left in Milky Way anyway. What's our rush? And moreover he likened Andromeda to Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri where an ark to save humanity is made where the motivations of each group is the same; Escaping the threat, but they split into multiple arks based on ideologies. Just, considering the scale it's just implausible to me we'll make an expedition as big as the Andromeda Initiative in a time where the galaxy believes it's at peace. The Citadel has 17 million of inhabitants. The Arks have either 100k for each one, or the whole projects. It seems to me that the population in Andromeda is a rather really small part of the entire population in the MW (at best around a million people for species that has far more then 10 billions people each).
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Nov 13, 2016 14:39:45 GMT
Question 3: What is up with these ships? They build 4 for every council race and Hyperion for everyone so we wouldn't lost whole race. I think his point is valid with this one. Each species has it's own ship, but why? Why are the races segregated; each ship for one entire race? If one ship goes down that entire race is basically gone. The ships shouldn't be segregated, that's what he was saying. Can't remember if he addressed this, but I think it makes sense if you think about the same criticism over the ME3 ending BioWare hadn't thought of that races being stuck on Earth would be a problem because Earth's ecosystem would make them die if they were stranded there. Having each race on their own ship means being able to simulate their homeworlds' ecosystem or at least give them the right foods and whatnot. Putting them all together is done via the Nexus, but I guess it couldn't be done for as many people that travel to Andromeda if they had to expand the Nexus into one big ship or something. IDK, it depends on what BioWare does with it (probably not much) Reznore: The part about "peace" in the trailer also stood out to me. What, are we escaping from an unpeaceful galaxy to the next to achieve peace? I don't really get it. It's the same problem as how they keep saying they want to "restore order" at the start of DA:I when it hasn't yet come across what that means or how an assembled group of soldiers and refugees is going to do that. I hope they address the premise in ME:A without vague buzzwords and hopefully the mention of "Peace" in the trailer is just some trailer-nonsense.
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Post by MasterJukes on Nov 13, 2016 14:48:44 GMT
If this dude used his free time and his brain capabilities correctly, he could do a lot of amazing things.
BUT NOPE, he decides to spent all of this in being a stupid hater.
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Post by 10k on Nov 13, 2016 14:50:02 GMT
Can't remember if he addressed this, but I think it makes sense if you think about the same criticism over the ME3 ending BioWare hadn't thought of that races being stuck on Earth would be a problem because Earth's ecosystem would make them die if they were stranded there. Having each race on their own ship means being able to simulate their homeworlds' ecosystem or at least give them the right foods and whatnot. Putting them all together is done via the Nexus, but I guess it couldn't be done for as many people that travel to Andromeda if they had to expand the Nexus into one big ship or something. IDK, it depends on what BioWare does with it (probably not much) That still doesn't make sense, given they are ships. If each species can't live on the same ecosystem as one another, why not make the ecosystems of those ships simulated as the ecosystems of the citadel or the nexus. Every species live fine together on the citadel and nexus. Why not do the same for these ships? And given as though everyone is cryo, food isn't really an issue. But given that they could grow different species food on the citadel and presumably the nexus, I still don't see the problem if they gave every ship the same neutral ecosystem as the citadel or nexus. So this idea of every species needs a different ecosystem is ridiculous when they live fine on the citadel and nexus together.
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Nov 13, 2016 15:02:25 GMT
If this dude used his free time and his brain capabilities correctly, he could do a lot of amazing things. BUT NOPE, he decides to spent all of this in being a stupid hater.That's kinda the thing. I heard he was trying to start a game company with some friends at some point though. I think criticism is great when it's constructive which his often is when it's well argued and you can disagree or agree however you want with him, but really, it's also kind of easy to point out all the mistakes as he does it when you're a single person observing the mistakes potentially made due to a 100 man team spiraling their vision off track due to bad cooperation or maybe a great vision skewed by budget-constraints and chopped up content that has been stitched together. Sometimes It's also just BioWare being misguided or too simple minded for some of their biggest mistakes like the ME3 ending for example. Whether the game was rushed or not doesn't matter. Someone discussed those things and approved of them and they spent dozens of work hours animating that big ending cinematic for it.
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Post by Button = Awesome on Nov 13, 2016 15:05:31 GMT
Additionally, it's not like the Arks themselves are transporting colonists down to the planets. We know from the Codex that dreadnought-sized vessels can't land on planets, and Arks are substantially larger than dreadnoughts.
That is of course if Bioware decides to follow their own codex and remain consistent, which isn't a safe bet with Bioware by any means.
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Post by SofNascimento on Nov 13, 2016 15:22:10 GMT
That is of course if Bioware decides to follow their own codex and remain consistent, which isn't a safe bet with Bioware by any means. They aren't didn't, so no problems there if they want to make the Arks land on a planet.
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