Adhin
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Post by Adhin on Nov 30, 2016 20:51:48 GMT
Well I can try to explain it. In Mass Effect 1 you basically had sticky/snap cover but no button to activate the different mode. What's where the 'automatic' comes in, it had to automatically engage in the cover mechanic it's self (which is a completely separate 'mode' of movement then normal'. So in short, automatic, or snap cover (same system, different means of engagement) are different movement modes.
Dynamic isn't a different movement mode. Instead of pressing a button to 'snap' into low cover, you just walk/run up to it and your character automatically gets lower to the ground in proximity. Theres no mode shift, no alteration in your movement. You still move just as fast in any direction you would normally. Aiming your weapon will 'pop you up' same as you'd be used too (you'll stand up and to shoot over). If blind fire is in it'll work same way, you just 'shoot' while your near cover and they'd hold their gun up to shoot over with crappy aim and all that.
Dynamic cover isn't a movement mode change, so you keep your normal movement but you can still engage with cover. It's just more natural and doesn't require you disengage with the cover to resume normal movement.
Just a bit more rambling on an example. Take ME2 and your in cover. Enemies advance up, you'd have to press a button, or try to 'walk away' and hope the game registers it. It was pretty good at it though, and in ME3 they added in dodging so most people just 'dodged away' to force it and get in movement in the direction they wanted.
With Dynamic cover since your not stuck to anything you just, you know... move lol. It's the least intrusive thing there is when it comes to cover systems.
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Post by Sailears on Nov 30, 2016 21:12:37 GMT
That sounds fantastic. I will use the appropriate term now and refer to Dynamic rather than automatic cover.
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Post by SofaJockey on Nov 30, 2016 22:32:48 GMT
I'd rather it be manual, and have a keybind too. I do not wish to see my character get into hard cover because I got too close to a wall while dodging an ennemy or something. I also would rather being able to stay in soft cover even if my character is close to a wall. This. I find I can run Right Hand Advantage much more elegantly using soft cover...
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Post by goishen on Dec 1, 2016 2:39:31 GMT
If they have aiming down sights (a la BF1 or TF2 or CoD) I really will cancel my pre-order. And then wonder what other games I can play and wonder WTF I just did with the previous years of my life.
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Post by Adhin on Dec 1, 2016 3:06:07 GMT
I'd rather it be manual, and have a keybind too. I do not wish to see my character get into hard cover because I got too close to a wall while dodging an ennemy or something. I also would rather being able to stay in soft cover even if my character is close to a wall. This. I find I can run Right Hand Advantage much more elegantly using soft cover... That's the best part about actual Dynamic cover - it's all soft cover. edit: goishen: ADS just refers to pulling the left trigger to get better 'aim'. Doesn't mean it goes into first person view for it. It's just an easier all catch term for that concept of a button that improves your aim (since they're technically aiming down the sights, but your not as the player).
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Post by RoboticWater on Dec 1, 2016 3:09:11 GMT
If they have aiming down sights (a la BF1 or TF2 or CoD) I really will cancel my pre-order. And then wonder what other games I can play and wonder WTF I just did with the previous years of my life. Wait, you mean first person ADS, right? Because Mass Effect has always had ADS. It's that button that makes your reticle get smaller. In fact, scoped weapons have always had first person ADS as well. But also... what? How could first person aiming be so utterly repulsive a mechanic that it not only ruins Andromeda but also retroactively every other Mass Effect game?
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Post by goishen on Dec 1, 2016 4:42:31 GMT
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Post by Atemporal Vanguardian-Debugger on Dec 1, 2016 6:10:12 GMT
I hope that auto cover is not going to be our only option. Auto cover never works out well for me I always get or take myself out of cover but never on purpose. Don't know or care if anyone remembers that mess of a game Quantum Break but that is one of the absolute WORST auto cover system in gaming.
So IF they make ME:A have Quantum Break auto cover they had better give the option of manual in the options or I will not be playing (till at least can mod it in).
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Post by 10k on Dec 1, 2016 6:52:22 GMT
Here's a full game in TLoU MP, no button prompts pop ups, no nothing. You just move and go. Fluid and easy. These are real people I'm playing with, so if hiding into cover using this system worked playing against real people. I assume it will definitely work while playing against AI opponents. Especially BW AI, looking at previous games, not too smart if you ask me LOL.
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Post by Adhin on Dec 1, 2016 7:31:49 GMT
I hope that auto cover is not going to be our only option. Auto cover never works out well for me I always get or take myself out of cover but never on purpose. Don't know or care if anyone remembers that mess of a game Quantum Break but that is one of the absolute WORST auto cover system in gaming. So IF they make ME:A have Quantum Break auto cover they had better give the option of manual in the options or I will not be playing (till at least can mod it in). The problem you had with Qauntum Break is it's not a cover shooter. It has some semblance of a dynamic cover system but it's designed for you to be running around using powers. Anyone who tried to just hunker down anywhere was going to die rather quickly. Especially considering a LOT of 'cover' wasn't really cover, it just broke or got shot through and none of the enemies sat around hiding. Either way it's not automatic cover. Can read my other replies as to why its not.
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Post by The Elder King on Dec 1, 2016 8:52:37 GMT
I hope that auto cover is not going to be our only option. Auto cover never works out well for me I always get or take myself out of cover but never on purpose. Don't know or care if anyone remembers that mess of a game Quantum Break but that is one of the absolute WORST auto cover system in gaming. So IF they make ME:A have Quantum Break auto cover they had better give the option of manual in the options or I will not be playing (till at least can mod it in). Based on what they said, I doubt the manual option will be there. I doubt it'll be like QB, but if you feel that strongly about it I think it'd better for you to wait and see how the cover works.
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Post by Pounce de León on Dec 1, 2016 10:44:42 GMT
Ye, but why would they change from TPS to FPS in the first place?
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Post by fade9wayz on Dec 1, 2016 10:57:27 GMT
This. I find I can run Right Hand Advantage much more elegantly using soft cover... That's the best part about actual Dynamic cover - it's all soft cover. edit: goishen : ADS just refers to pulling the left trigger to get better 'aim'. Doesn't mean it goes into first person view for it. It's just an easier all catch term for that concept of a button that improves your aim (since they're technically aiming down the sights, but your not as the player). Well, then, I will wait to see how it is implemented. If it's actually done as you describe it, I'll be okay with it. Can't wait to see actual MP gameplay, this is what will definitely sell the game to me, more than anything else.
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Post by The Elder King on Dec 1, 2016 12:06:53 GMT
This. I find I can run Right Hand Advantage much more elegantly using soft cover... That's the best part about actual Dynamic cover - it's all soft cover. edit: goishen : ADS just refers to pulling the left trigger to get better 'aim'. Doesn't mean it goes into first person view for it. It's just an easier all catch term for that concept of a button that improves your aim (since they're technically aiming down the sights, but your not as the player). Isn't this already present in Mass Effect? You can shoot normally of pulling a trigger to get a closer look as you aim.
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Post by Pounce de León on Dec 1, 2016 13:38:36 GMT
That's the best part about actual Dynamic cover - it's all soft cover. edit: goishen : ADS just refers to pulling the left trigger to get better 'aim'. Doesn't mean it goes into first person view for it. It's just an easier all catch term for that concept of a button that improves your aim (since they're technically aiming down the sights, but your not as the player). Isn't this already present in Mass Effect? You can shoot normally of pulling a trigger to get a closer look as you aim. Yes, that's how it already is. You can ADS in TPS. You should use the sniper rifle some more.
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Post by The Elder King on Dec 1, 2016 13:49:40 GMT
Isn't this already present in Mass Effect? You can shoot normally of pulling a trigger to get a closer look as you aim. Yes, that's how it already is. You can ADS in TPS. You should use the sniper rifle some more. I know that. I didn't know the name of the feature, but the description is basically what happens in the trilogy when using the various weapons. I was just making sure it was the same thing people were talking about in the last posts.
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Post by revanshep78 on Dec 1, 2016 16:07:21 GMT
One thing I find interesting with this cover system that no one has mentioned thus far (that I've seen at least) is that with the removal of the cover entry button (or keybind) it frees up a button to add a power to. Which should translate to 3 or 4 powers being mapped. Thoughts?
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Post by RoboticWater on Dec 1, 2016 16:16:53 GMT
One thing I find interesting with this cover system that no one has mentioned thus far (that I've seen at least) is that with the removal of the cover entry button (or keybind) it frees up a button to add a power to. Which should translate to 3 or 4 powers being mapped. Thoughts? Well, we have more actions to account for as well, e.g. jetpack and scan actions, so we might not actually have a new power slot. I think the jetpack is taking the combat roll slot, but scanning could be using that newly freed button.
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Post by Sailears on Dec 1, 2016 17:40:30 GMT
One thing I find interesting with this cover system that no one has mentioned thus far (that I've seen at least) is that with the removal of the cover entry button (or keybind) it frees up a button to add a power to. Which should translate to 3 or 4 powers being mapped. Thoughts? There aren't many keybinds in previous ME games anyway - I usually ended up duplicating some keybinds for alternate finger movement and hand comfort. Unless they've added the ability to crouch, jump and so on...
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Post by revanshep78 on Dec 1, 2016 18:06:02 GMT
One thing I find interesting with this cover system that no one has mentioned thus far (that I've seen at least) is that with the removal of the cover entry button (or keybind) it frees up a button to add a power to. Which should translate to 3 or 4 powers being mapped. Thoughts? There aren't many keybinds in previous ME games anyway - I usually ended up duplicating some keybinds for alternate finger movement and hand comfort. Unless they've added the ability to crouch, jump and so on... I'm strictly a console player so I unfortunately don't know much about how ME plays on PC. I was just assuming keybinding is similar to abilities being mapped to a button! Sorry, that what happens when you assume! I also haven't played TLoU yet so I'm not familiar with it's cover system. It's on my backlog along with the entire UC series... And like RoboticWater said, the cover button could be used for the new jetpack mechanic. I'm interested/anxious to see how the gameplay is tonight. Could be a make or break moment for the March release date. Hopefully, it doesn't get pushed back.
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Post by fade9wayz on Dec 1, 2016 19:43:47 GMT
I'm strictly a console player so I unfortunately don't know much about how ME plays on PC. I was just assuming keybinding is similar to abilities being mapped to a button! Sorry, that what happens when you assume! I also haven't played TLoU yet so I'm not familiar with it's cover system. It's on my backlog along with the entire UC series... And like RoboticWater said, the cover button could be used for the new jetpack mechanic. I'm interested/anxious to see how the gameplay is tonight. Could be a make or break moment for the March release date. Hopefully, it doesn't get pushed back. Oh it is, it's just we have so many more buttons available. We need to map abilities for the maximum comfort and efficiency possible, so as not to end up with a tendinitis, or repeatedly hitting the wrong keys. I generally bind all the powers on my mouse, while everything concerning movement and interaction is on keyboard. The disparition of tactical pause will free a button too.
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Post by Adhin on Dec 1, 2016 20:08:22 GMT
That's the best part about actual Dynamic cover - it's all soft cover. edit: goishen : ADS just refers to pulling the left trigger to get better 'aim'. Doesn't mean it goes into first person view for it. It's just an easier all catch term for that concept of a button that improves your aim (since they're technically aiming down the sights, but your not as the player). Isn't this already present in Mass Effect? You can shoot normally of pulling a trigger to get a closer look as you aim. Yeah, it's been in all of them. It's one of those things that's not a new feature, but some thirst person games have added a 'first person' view (always optional in every game I've seen so far) when ADS'ing. So while it's not even a remotely new feature for Mass Effect (getting better aim with a button for slower movement) some people will freak out at the idea they might do it differently. I can't really see that happening outside of maybe low power scopes being added to items with out scopes by default like in ME3. The weapon designs don't really lend them selves to first person view. Which, I dunno, maybe having the option (not forced) would cause them to actually make their guns function in a manner that would let people actually aim with them. Who knows... Back to the original topic though about cover. One thing I'd like to point out is i think the last of us doesn't duck for you like tomb raider does. Which is where my only question actually comes in. I'm pretty confident we're getting a button to swap shoulders but we might be getting a button to crouch. And if we're getting a button to crouch we may have to manually crouch our selves to take advantage of low cover. Personally, i think Tomb Raiders system of no crouch and her getting low to the ground when combat starts (she takes a different, hunched stance when in combat) is the faster paced one. Last of Us is a pretty slow game in that regard, but it's designed as a stealth survival game. Erm, I guess so is Tomb Raider lol. It's just I dunno, faster passed, she doesn't actually get any slower when shes crouched. Also always liked her dodge where she scampers with on all 4's to get really low with out rolling. So yeah, very curious where they actually go with that exactly. My guess is closer to Tomb Raider, but maybe we actually have a crouch button now.
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Post by Element Zero on Dec 1, 2016 23:38:09 GMT
I think those worried about this will find that they actually love the new system once they see it in action. Dynamic cover is light-years better than the clunky old way of doing things. Also, this isn't even truly the dynamic cover we've experienced in other games to date.
Tomb Raider has done it best, of all of the games I've played, but Laura doesn't have a jet-boosted dodge and mass effect defensive powers. The devs have talked about how we will continually face a variety of foes that force us to constantly move. Some foes are designed to force us into cover, while others are designed to force us out of cover, and these are generally thrown at us in tandem. No more will default fights be "whack a mole" contests, with two opposing lines hunkered down in cover.
Ian has said that fights are, by design, fast paced affairs, now, conducted on the move. We will employ cover, jet-boosted dodge maneuvers and defensive powers to stay alive. I can't wait to get a look in a few hours.
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Post by sosolaris on Dec 2, 2016 9:47:40 GMT
Cover looks dynamic from the very brief snippets I caught. There's an indicator for when you slip into cover -- the little shield that pops up at the center of the UI in between the squadmates' icons. Apologies for the poor gif quality in advance.
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Post by 10k on Dec 2, 2016 14:12:26 GMT
Cover looks dynamic from the very brief snippets I caught. There's an indicator for when you slip into cover -- the little shield that pops up at the center of the UI in between the squadmates' icons. Apologies for the poor gif quality in advance. It looks good so much better than manual cover system.
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