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Post by DragonKingReborn on Apr 25, 2018 20:42:48 GMT
Watched The Last Jedi on the flight home from Dubai. Don't get the hate that it seems to attract. I thought it was OK. Better than Force Awakens and Rogue One, anyway. And a lot better than the prequels. From the fact that you just happened to watch it on a flight I'm guessing that you only have marginal interest in the franchise? Correct. I loved the OT when I was a kid, but time and prequels have mostly dampened enthusiasm for new content. An Old Republic movie might get my attention, though. By the 'politics', do you mean the fact that the lead is woman and the older women leaders of the Resistance are clearer smarter than the young men and that the bad guys leaders are two white guys? Or something else? All of the above?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 25, 2018 21:24:40 GMT
From the fact that you just happened to watch it on a flight I'm guessing that you only have marginal interest in the franchise? Correct. I loved the OT when I was a kid, but time and prequels have mostly dampened enthusiasm for new content. An Old Republic movie might get my attention, though. By the 'politics', do you mean the fact that the lead is woman and the older women leaders of the Resistance are clearer smarter than the young men and that the bad guys leaders are two white guys? Or something else? All of the above? Sure there is the fact that all male characters are dumb ör scared ör put döwn ör ön the evil side and all the females are the leaders ör the brave heröic önes. And dö yöu nöt remember the Casinö planet? Yöu knöw all rich peöple are evil because well capitalism is evil. Which is hilariöus because Disney is öne öf the biggest cömpanies in the whöle fucking wörld and they engage in capitalism every secönd öf the every day and used capitalism tö buy the IP fröm Lucas. What a löad of SJW's hörse shit.
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Post by DragonKingReborn on Apr 25, 2018 22:47:17 GMT
Correct. I loved the OT when I was a kid, but time and prequels have mostly dampened enthusiasm for new content. An Old Republic movie might get my attention, though. Yup, same here. By the 'politics', do you mean the fact that the lead is woman and the older women leaders of the Resistance are clearer smarter than the young men and that the bad guys leaders are two white guys? Or something else? All of the above? Err... no. Or rather, not any element on its own, it's a lot of small things adding up (and various statements made by the people in charge), in addition to how the movie stands in relation to its predecessors. There's a reason why I asked if you only have marginal interest in the franchise, I mean, I'm more or less the same when it comes to super-hero movies, I come for the nice visuals, and half an hour later I move on. With SW I'm much more invested (or rather, I was) so I expect more. I doubt we'd agree anyway, largely the opinions about the movie seems to be positive on the "progressive" side of the political spectrum, and vice versa on the more conservative side, so, while I'm happy to discuss various topics related to the movie, I don't see the point in trying and convince you one way or the other. No problem - I wasn't actually looking for a debate on the matter or to be convinced of anything; more trying to understand what the 'politics issue' was. But I have an answer of sorts, so that's fine.
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Post by mybudgee on Apr 26, 2018 7:41:00 GMT
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Post by mybudgee on Apr 26, 2018 16:00:11 GMT
So... Lucasfilm announced they have a new "anime-inspired" cartoon show coming to their kids channel in the Fall or something. It Does NOT take place in the Old Republic era, but (of course) during the dipshit sequels. *exasperated sigh*
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Post by Iakus on Apr 26, 2018 16:00:45 GMT
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Post by mybudgee on Apr 26, 2018 16:55:57 GMT
more trying to understand what the 'politics issue' was. Personally I think that the political side of the issue is fairly minor in comparison to the problems I have with the writing and the movie itself
Indeed. Just awful decisions, one after the next. It felt like a "Fuck you" to the audience (which was apparently not an accident)
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Post by colfoley on Apr 26, 2018 18:21:26 GMT
Discussing politics in movies is always an interesting thought experiment. All movies, especially serious ones, tends to deal with politics and political themes but then if you bring it up you get "what do you mean you think my politics are those of Kylo Ren?!"
In short, with this in mind, I found TLJ to be maybe the least progressive movie...ever.
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Post by alanc9 on Apr 26, 2018 18:41:50 GMT
Personally I think that the political side of the issue is fairly minor in comparison to the problems I have with the writing and the movie itself
Indeed. Just awful decisions, one after the next. It felt like a "Fuck you" to the audience (which was apparently not an accident) Why should Johnson or anybody else have cared about the fans' theorizing?
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Post by mybudgee on Apr 26, 2018 19:14:16 GMT
Indeed. Just awful decisions, one after the next. It felt like a "Fuck you" to the audience (which was apparently not an accident) Why should Johnson or anybody else have cared about the fans' theorizing? No. Automobile manufacturers shouldn't give a fuck about what potential buyers want in new vehicles, nor should Chefs care about people's food allergies. Their smart-ass opinions about "what people need" are what are truly important...
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Post by smilesja on Apr 26, 2018 20:03:57 GMT
So... Lucasfilm announced they have a new "anime-inspired" cartoon show coming to their kids channel in the Fall or something. It Does NOT take place in the Old Republic era, but (of course) during the dipshit sequels. *exasperated sigh* That's not surprising, it's been rumored that they've been wanting to do an animated show that takes place during the sequel era.
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Post by smilesja on Apr 26, 2018 20:05:03 GMT
Indeed. Just awful decisions, one after the next. It felt like a "Fuck you" to the audience (which was apparently not an accident) Why should Johnson or anybody else have cared about the fans' theorizing? If you're going to subvert the audiences expectations, at least make your version satisfying for the fans.
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Post by colfoley on Apr 26, 2018 20:37:57 GMT
Why should Johnson or anybody else have cared about the fans' theorizing? If you're going to subvert the audiences expectations, at least make your version satisfying for the fans. Tsk. Hasn't Andromeda taught us anything about over generalizing audience reaction to a given piece of fiction? Some love TLJ, some hate TLJ, I imagine most fall in the middle.
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Post by Iakus on Apr 26, 2018 20:45:50 GMT
If you're going to subvert the audiences expectations, at least make your version satisfying for the fans. Tsk. Hasn't Andromeda taught us anything about over generalizing audience reaction to a given piece of fiction? Some love TLJ, some hate TLJ, I imagine most fall in the middle. Yeah p*ssing off the people who grew up with the original cast is a surefire way to grow an audience Must be why the old EU totally failed
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Post by colfoley on Apr 26, 2018 20:51:03 GMT
Tsk. Hasn't Andromeda taught us anything about over generalizing audience reaction to a given piece of fiction? Some love TLJ, some hate TLJ, I imagine most fall in the middle. Yeah p*ssing off the people who grew up with the original cast is a surefire way to grow an audience I grew up with the original cast and I am not pissed. The OT was probably one of my first ententrainment loves. Or at least Jedi since ESB kinda freaked me out as a kid. And Luke was one of my childhood heroes.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2018 20:53:00 GMT
The mere thought of Disney doing anything in the Old Republic era terrifies me. Why? They'll somehow manage to totally and utterly butcher the source material. But seeing as Disney shot themselves in the foot when then made The Old Republic era and %99 of Star Wars lore 'Legends' I think we're fairly safe.
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Post by colfoley on Apr 26, 2018 21:02:03 GMT
The mere thought of Disney doing anything in the Old Republic era terrifies me. Why? They'll somehow manage to totally and utterly butcher the source material. But seeing as Disney shot themselves in the foot when then made The Old Republic era and %99 of Star Wars lore 'Legends' I think we're fairly safe. I'm sure people will be shocked but I thought Disney went about the legends thing about the best way they could.
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Post by Andrew Waples on Apr 26, 2018 21:06:14 GMT
Tsk. Hasn't Andromeda taught us anything about over generalizing audience reaction to a given piece of fiction? Some love TLJ, some hate TLJ, I imagine most fall in the middle. Yeah p*ssing off the people who grew up with the original cast is a surefire way to grow an audience Must be why the old EU totally failed But isn't true that Lucas never even considered the EU canon?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2018 21:07:42 GMT
The mere thought of Disney doing anything in the Old Republic era terrifies me. Why? They'll somehow manage to totally and utterly butcher the source material. But seeing as Disney shot themselves in the foot when then made The Old Republic era and %99 of Star Wars lore 'Legends' I think we're fairly safe. I'm sure people will be shocked but I thought Disney went about the legends thing about the best way they could. I can understand making most things after the end of Return of the Jedi 'Legends' but everything before The Phantom Menace? That was kind of a dumb move.
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Post by HK90210 on Apr 26, 2018 22:37:00 GMT
Indeed. Just awful decisions, one after the next. It felt like a "Fuck you" to the audience (which was apparently not an accident) Why should Johnson or anybody else have cared about the fans' theorizing? Yeah, those pesky fans. What are their opinions and feelings worth, right? I mean, it's not like Snoke was this big mystery box with a lot of power but little to no explanation about his history or how he managed to corrupt the heir to the Skywalker Legacy. Disney would have to be quite the lot of asshats to create something like that and have it detonate in fans faces with no payoff. We all know that Disney is too kindhearted and intelligent to do something like that.
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Post by colfoley on Apr 26, 2018 23:03:05 GMT
I'm sure people will be shocked but I thought Disney went about the legends thing about the best way they could. I can understand making most things after the end of Return of the Jedi 'Legends' but everything before The Phantom Menace? That was kind of a dumb move. Perhaps. Especially in light of the whole reason they 'nuked' the EU in the first place was because they didn't want to 'explain' Chewbaca's loss to the audience. If that were the case then the ideal situation probably would have been to do a 'soft reboot' and just ignore everything from the Yuuzhan Vong war on. But, they still would have had the difficult task of 'adapting' beloved characters like Jaina Solo and Mara Jade to the big screen, which would have carried the risk of #notmyjaina.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2018 23:32:20 GMT
I can understand making most things after the end of Return of the Jedi 'Legends' but everything before The Phantom Menace? That was kind of a dumb move. Perhaps. Especially in light of the whole reason they 'nuked' the EU in the first place was because they didn't want to 'explain' Chewbaca's loss to the audience. If that were the case then the ideal situation probably would have been to do a 'soft reboot' and just ignore everything from the Yuuzhan Vong war on. But, they still would have had the difficult task of 'adapting' beloved characters like Jaina Solo and Mara Jade to the big screen, which would have carried the risk of #notmyjaina. Would have been better than the questionable films we've gotten so far.... And as I only know the basics of the EU I'd have found that perhaps more enjoyable that what we've been given.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2018 23:33:34 GMT
Discussing politics in movies is always an interesting thought experiment. All movies, especially serious ones, tends to deal with politics and political themes but then if you bring it up you get "what do you mean you think my politics are those of Kylo Ren?!" In short, with this in mind, I found TLJ to be maybe the least progressive movie...ever. This is either a tröll cömment ör yöu are insane. What mövie are yöu cömparing it tö? Moönlight?
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Post by colfoley on Apr 27, 2018 1:35:10 GMT
Discussing politics in movies is always an interesting thought experiment. All movies, especially serious ones, tends to deal with politics and political themes but then if you bring it up you get "what do you mean you think my politics are those of Kylo Ren?!" In short, with this in mind, I found TLJ to be maybe the least progressive movie...ever. This is either a tröll cömment ör yöu are insane. What mövie are yöu cömparing it tö? Moönlight? All movies I have ever seen. Granted it is a bit of a bold statement given there are so many movies out there dealing with the dangers of totalitarinism or various forms of big governments so I am probably missing something. But, no movie comes as readily to mind in attacking some of the specific (albeit extremist) tennants of progressivism. "Let the past die, kill it if you have to." Was uttered by the BAD GUY of the piece, Kylo Ren, and that would not sound the least bit out of place amongst certain American politicos. And the protagonists of the piece (Luke, Yoda, Rey and Poe) go out of their way to counter that idea by honoring and learning from the past all in their specific ways.
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Post by Nayawk on Apr 27, 2018 2:26:14 GMT
This is either a tröll cömment ör yöu are insane. What mövie are yöu cömparing it tö? Moönlight? All movies I have ever seen. Granted it is a bit of a bold statement given there are so many movies out there dealing with the dangers of totalitarinism or various forms of big governments so I am probably missing something. But, no movie comes as readily to mind in attacking some of the specific (albeit extremist) tennants of progressivism. "Let the past die, kill it if you have to." Was uttered by the BAD GUY of the piece, Kylo Ren, and that would not sound the least bit out of place amongst certain American politicos. And the protagonists of the piece (Luke, Yoda, Rey and Poe) go out of their way to counter that idea by honoring and learning from the past all in their specific ways. I can't say for sure but I don't think he meant Progressivism with a captial P, I think he was just using the word progressive to mean liberal in the American sense. I come from a very liberal country so these movies barely ping the old liberalmeter for me.
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