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Post by masseffectfanforlife on Jun 4, 2018 3:39:09 GMT
True isn't the right word. Truth pertains to fact. Saying that Rey is. or isn't (in my case) a "Mary Sue" (My God, I hate this term) is in the realm of opinion. If someone thinks thinks Rey is said term, then it's their opinion (even though it's annoying after seeing it thousands of times [no offense]). To me, she isn't a Mary Sue. I think you're wrong. Because opinions can be right or wrong. Not everything is subjective, and people's opinions can be mistaken or poorly-informed. A racist might think that Barack Obama was a bad president because of his skin color. That opinion, though they have right to have it, is objectively wrong in my view. I doubt you think any differently. So what makes this opinion objectively wrong, and the thought that Rey is/isn't a Mary-Sue just something subjective, where right and wrong have no meaning? Sooooo....no matter how many times I defend my opinion, and not matter the good points I make, it can still be wrong? What? Why is that? If that were the case, then my opinion for so many movies in all my years of being alive would be false, because someone wanted to rain on my parade and "prove" why I should rethink my own point of you. For example: I may say The Last Jedi is a good, then some douche comes along, and ruins my day by saying "You are dead wrong, and here is why! Rejoice and claim my point of view as the honest truth! " What's next? Are you gonna tell me I'm wrong for saying that I prefer Return Of The Jedi more than The Empire Strikes Back???? Sorry, if there is some invisible objective BS with film, I'd rather disobey this so called law, than be unhappy without my own individuality & opinion.
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Post by HK90210 on Jun 4, 2018 3:50:24 GMT
I think you're wrong. Because opinions can be right or wrong. Not everything is subjective, and people's opinions can be mistaken or poorly-informed. A racist might think that Barack Obama was a bad president because of his skin color. That opinion, though they have right to have it, is objectively wrong in my view. I doubt you think any differently. So what makes this opinion objectively wrong, and the thought that Rey is/isn't a Mary-Sue just something subjective, where right and wrong have no meaning? Sooooo....no matter how many times I defend my opinion, and not matter the good points I make, it can still be wrong? What? Why is that? If that were the case, then my opinion for so many movies in all my years of being alive would be false, because someone wanted to rain on my parade and "prove" why I should rethink my own point of you. For example: I may say The Last Jedi is a good, then some douche comes along, and ruins my day by saying "You are dead wrong, and here is why! Rejoice and claim my point of view as the honest truth! " Sorry, if there is some invisible objective BS with film, I'd rather disobey this so called law, than be unhappy without my own individuality & opinion. Welcome to the human race. There is no opinion upon which everyone is going to agree. There is no opinion you have that won't have someone, somewhere, who will find your stance faulty. Luckily, a person calling you wrong doesn't mean you're wrong! You might be right, and they might be wrong. Or you both could be wrong. Hell, you could both be right. Do you believe what you believe, or is it all subjective? Does right and wrong change because of what people say? Thing is, you might very well be wrong. One should always be prepared to change their opinions based on new evidence or a well-constructed argument. But you are not obligated to agree with anyone, and no one is obligated to agree with you, no matter how many good/bad points either side makes. They can still think you're wrong, and you can think likewise of them. That's the nature of debate. All sides can hear every argument from every angle, and still disagree with what is the correct view of things. You can respect your opponents right to have their own opinion, all while thinking they are wrong. Those two things are not in conflict.
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Post by masseffectfanforlife on Jun 4, 2018 4:03:11 GMT
Sooooo....no matter how many times I defend my opinion, and not matter the good points I make, it can still be wrong? What? Why is that? If that were the case, then my opinion for so many movies in all my years of being alive would be false, because someone wanted to rain on my parade and "prove" why I should rethink my own point of you. For example: I may say The Last Jedi is a good, then some douche comes along, and ruins my day by saying "You are dead wrong, and here is why! Rejoice and claim my point of view as the honest truth! " Sorry, if there is some invisible objective BS with film, I'd rather disobey this so called law, than be unhappy without my own individuality & opinion. Welcome to the human race. There is no opinion upon which everyone is going to agree. There is no opinion you have that won't have someone, somewhere, who will find your stance faulty. Luckily, a person calling you wrong doesn't mean you're wrong! You might be right, and they might be wrong. Or you both could be wrong. Hell, you could both be right. Do you believe what you believe, or is it all subjective? Does right and wrong change because of what people say? Thing is, you might very well be wrong. One should always be prepared to change their opinions based on new evidence or a well-constructed argument. But you are not obligated to agree with anyone, and no one is obligated to agree with you, no matter how many good/bad points either side makes. They can still think you're wrong, and you can think likewise of them. That's the nature of debate. All sides can hear every argument from every angle, and still disagree with what is the correct view of things. You can respect your opponents right to have their own opinion, all while thinking they are wrong. Those two things are not in conflict. So if I say with a heavy heart that ROTJ is greatest Star Wars movie of all time, I cant? I have to look at "evidence" and say it's not (even though every single complaint towards the movie is o-p-i-n-i-o-n, not fact. i'm sorry if you didn't like the Ewoks taking down your precious wittle Empire.), and give the crown to ESB like the majority of. I don't say that they wrong for their choice of what is the best Star Wars movie of all time. In return, they shouldn't tell me that I'm wrong. It's stupid. If I am told that my point of view is wrong about any movie, and is shown "proof" as to why I should "convert," then I would be a human being who is devoid of happiness. It's like saying "I think the prequels are bad, and here are reasons why you should think like me, and be part of the 'superior intellect.'" Just because someone says that a film is a bad one, doesn't make it so for someone else, and no one should berate them and say they're wrong for having the opposite reaction.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 4, 2018 4:04:20 GMT
I've watched Solo and it was much better than I expected it to be honestly...
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Post by HK90210 on Jun 4, 2018 4:12:21 GMT
Welcome to the human race. There is no opinion upon which everyone is going to agree. There is no opinion you have that won't have someone, somewhere, who will find your stance faulty. Luckily, a person calling you wrong doesn't mean you're wrong! You might be right, and they might be wrong. Or you both could be wrong. Hell, you could both be right. Do you believe what you believe, or is it all subjective? Does right and wrong change because of what people say? Thing is, you might very well be wrong. One should always be prepared to change their opinions based on new evidence or a well-constructed argument. But you are not obligated to agree with anyone, and no one is obligated to agree with you, no matter how many good/bad points either side makes. They can still think you're wrong, and you can think likewise of them. That's the nature of debate. All sides can hear every argument from every angle, and still disagree with what is the correct view of things. You can respect your opponents right to have their own opinion, all while thinking they are wrong. Those two things are not in conflict. So if I say with a heavy heart that ROTJ is greatest Star Wars movie of all time, I cant? I have to look at "evidence" and say it's not (even though every single complaint towards the movie is o-p-i-n-i-o-n, not fact. i'm sorry if you didn't like the Ewoks taking down your precious wittle Empire.), and give the crown to ESB like the majority of. I don't say that they wrong for their choice of what is the best Star Wars movie of all time. In return, they shouldn't tell me that I'm wrong. It's stupid. If I am told that my point of view is wrong about any movie, and is shown "proof" as to why I should "convert," then I would be a human being who is devoid of happiness. It's like saying "I think the prequels are bad, and here are reasons why you should think like me, and be part of the 'superior intellect.'" Just because someone says that a film is a bad one, doesn't make it so for someone else, and no one should berate them and say they're wrong for having the opposite reaction. Did you read a single word I wrote? No one is obligated to agree with you or validate your opinion, and the same is true for you. Stop giving a damn what other people think about your opinions. Starting with me, if you feel like it. Focus only on whether or not their arguments are compelling. If they are, investigate further. If they are not, stick to your guns and actually believe what you believe. Agree to disagree. Stop trying to get people to stop calling you wrong. They won't. Especially if...you're wrong. By the way, ROTJ IS the greatest Star Wars movie of all time.
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Post by Obadiah on Jun 4, 2018 4:26:29 GMT
Isn't there a ship of horrors floating around out there haunted by 2 rathtars because Rey hit the wrong fuse?
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Post by colfoley on Jun 4, 2018 4:30:15 GMT
Isn't there a ship of horrors floating around out there haunted by 2 rathtars because Rey hit the wrong fuse? maybe they've died?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 4, 2018 4:30:26 GMT
That is all.
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Post by masseffectfanforlife on Jun 4, 2018 4:30:36 GMT
So if I say with a heavy heart that ROTJ is greatest Star Wars movie of all time, I cant? I have to look at "evidence" and say it's not (even though every single complaint towards the movie is o-p-i-n-i-o-n, not fact. i'm sorry if you didn't like the Ewoks taking down your precious wittle Empire.), and give the crown to ESB like the majority of. I don't say that they wrong for their choice of what is the best Star Wars movie of all time. In return, they shouldn't tell me that I'm wrong. It's stupid. If I am told that my point of view is wrong about any movie, and is shown "proof" as to why I should "convert," then I would be a human being who is devoid of happiness. It's like saying "I think the prequels are bad, and here are reasons why you should think like me, and be part of the 'superior intellect.'" Just because someone says that a film is a bad one, doesn't make it so for someone else, and no one should berate them and say they're wrong for having the opposite reaction. Stop trying to get people to stop calling you wrong. They won't. Especially if...you're wrong. But it would be fair considering I don't think that they're wrong? It would be a one way attack. They're telling me I'm wrong, when I--at the same time--said nothing like that to them, bearing no ill will to their views. They would only look like pretentious jackasses.
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Post by Obadiah on Jun 4, 2018 4:32:42 GMT
Isn't there a ship of horrors floating around out there haunted by 2 rathtars because Rey hit the wrong fuse? maybe they've died? Its only been a week.
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Post by HK90210 on Jun 4, 2018 5:05:53 GMT
Stop trying to get people to stop calling you wrong. They won't. Especially if...you're wrong. But it would be fair considering I don't think that they're wrong? It would be a one way attack. They're telling me I'm wrong, when I--at the same time--said nothing like that to them, bearing no ill will to their views. They would only look like pretentious jackasses. They might. Or they may be right. Again, just because you don't think right/wrong or correct/incorrect apply in a debate doesn't mean your opponents will think the same way. They may think that right/wrong or correct/incorrect DO apply, and you trying to tell them that they can't call you wrong are unfair attempts to moderate their opinions. In any debate, the only thing you get to decide is how you act and respond. You can shoot back, if you like. You can turn the other cheek. You can disengage. But trying to control how the other side thinks and acts won't work, and worse will make your side look like it can't succeed on its own merits. "See, they can't win the argument, so now they're trying to control the debate!" Anyway, on to Star Wars. Apparently Solo made less than $30 million in its second weekend. I expected this film to underperform, but DAMN, not that badly. Is still think the #1 reason is the backlash from TLJ. I don't think Lucasfilm has really grasped how much that has affected the brand. I remember thinking as I was watching the movie, "If this film had come out before The Last Jedi, there's no way it doesn't crack $800 million." Every comment section of every article I visit about Solo, it's just full of people pointing to one thing that kept them from buying Solo tickets. Until that gets sorted out, I don't think any of the upcoming Anthology movies, be they Obi-Wan, Boba Fett or anything else, are going to be successful. They might make money, but they'll never top Rogue One.
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Post by Arijon van Goyen on Jun 4, 2018 5:24:56 GMT
By the way, ROTJ IS the greatest Star Wars movie of all time.
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Post by Arijon van Goyen on Jun 4, 2018 5:27:50 GMT
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Post by masseffectfanforlife on Jun 4, 2018 5:30:10 GMT
If I say that Return Of The Jedi is the best, then that is my opinion, no matter who (or what) tries to do in an attempt to convince me otherwise.
Return Of The Jedi The Empire Strikes Back Star Wars (aka A New Hope) The Last Jedi The Force Awakens Rogue One Revenge Of The Sith The Phantom Menace Attack Of The Clones (haven't seen Solo yet...)
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Post by Hier0phant on Jun 4, 2018 5:49:41 GMT
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Post by Obadiah on Jun 4, 2018 5:50:37 GMT
So, in the new films, Luke's hand, when did this metal hand business start? In Empire Strikes Back he received a flesh covered prosthetic that got shot in Return of the Jedi during Han's rescue, so he put on the glove to cover it for the rest of the film, and to save on special effects costs. Why is he walking around with a skeletal-looking metal hand in the academy massacre and in The Last Jedi?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 4, 2018 6:11:47 GMT
So, in the new films, Luke's hand, when did this metal hand business start? In Empire Strikes Back he received a flesh covered prosthetic that got shot in Return of the Jedi during Han's rescue, so he put on glove to cover it for the rest of the film, and so save on special effects costs. Why is he walking around with an skeletal-looking metal hand in the academy massacre and in The Last Jedi? Lazy film making that's why.
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Post by Pearl on Jun 4, 2018 6:42:05 GMT
boy how about that star wars huh
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Post by Terminator Force on Jun 4, 2018 10:03:21 GMT
boy how about that star wars huh Sorry, kid, Star Wars is dead, didn't you know?
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Post by Andrew Waples on Jun 4, 2018 10:29:40 GMT
boy how about that star wars huh Sorry, kid, Star Wars is dead, didn't you know? Yet, here you are talking about it...🙄
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Post by HK90210 on Jun 4, 2018 12:47:39 GMT
Sorry, kid, Star Wars is dead, didn't you know? Yet, here you are talking about it...🙄 He's just giving his respects to the dearly departed.
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Post by HK90210 on Jun 4, 2018 12:56:33 GMT
By the way, ROTJ IS the greatest Star Wars movie of all time.
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Post by Terminator Force on Jun 4, 2018 13:26:12 GMT
Brother likes ROTJ best too.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 4, 2018 13:34:41 GMT
This whöle thing started because yöu claimed anyöne whö didn't like Mary Sue is because she is a female. Yes. This is lamentable. That the culture war has brought us to this. The explanation for the false assumption in this case is probably that KK, Disney and journalists have from the start dismissed criticism against TLJ as coming from sexists and racists. The usual SJW narrative. (Makes you wonder why they think 'Wonder Woman' and 'Black Panther' escapes any problems.) Well here are my thoughts about Lucasfilm: even though I do like the new movies so far, there are problems in Lucasfilm that need to be fixed (especially when not seeing eye to eye with other directors). They shouldn't stay too much on nostalgia, even though nostalgia can be good sometimes. However there are some people among the more reasonable fans (whether the more decent fans like or dislike the new movies) who are toxic and out of control (what's so bad about female lead for example?). They too need to stop. These are two sides of the same coin. And then döubled döwn ön it here. Rey knew how to fight, because she had to, in order to survive (Jakku isn't very friendly, ya know???). She knew how to operate complex machinery, because it was a way for her to have food (small portions) on the table. If none of that happened, she would have ended up as another corpse in the sands of Jakku not long after she was abandoned there. Her connection with the force was raw, and powerful. So what if she was able to communicate with the force, and defeat Kylo Ren in TFA? First off, he was badly wounded by Chewie's Bowcaster. Secondly (and this goes back to her survival on Jakku), she wanted to survive, so she used everything she learned on Jakku to fight back (instinct), or defend herself as much as possible, or she would have have been killed. There was also anger in her, possibly. My favorite Star Wars character is Luke Skywalker. He knew how to fly a T-16. So, okay, he's a formidable pilot. However, I may not be an expert on the military, but I'm pretty sure he didn't have any combat pilot training before Yavin. Even though he didn't have any training, he was allowed to join the Rebels (even though his lack of military training would have made him a liability) and destroyed the Death Star using the force after little training. He had less Jedi training than Anakin, and he still became a powerful Jedi. All this, and yet I never complained. I didn't complain about Anakin destroying the Droid Control Ship. Why the heck am I going to complain about Rey? What, because she's a female? Absolutely not. Now, I know that so many would disagree with this. This is just my opinion & my own interpretation. You do not have to see it my way, but my opinion is still as relevant as others here. The pröblem with the "nöt Mary Sue" cröwd is that they use head cannön tö explain it all. Lets gö thröugh yöur defense shall we? I agree with her knöwing höw tö fight and the mövie did a goöd jöb of shöwing it. That's the key, have a line of dialög ör actually shöw that Mary Sue can dö sömething with a scene. The pröblem is fighting with a metal stick is cömpletely different than fighting a trained Jedi with a lightsaber. It wöuld be a like if someöne whö was a goöd marksmen with a rifle then picked up a böw and arröw för the first time and was then beating everyöne at archery töurnaments. Where in the mövie is it shöwn ör stated that she knew höw tö öperate machinery? She is a scavenger. She cöllects parts and sells them för foöd. Nöthing tö dö with using them. Beföre the Disney mövies öne had tö train tö use the förce. Sö having a "raw connectiön" döesn't add up tö the löre öf the series. Luke uses the förce twice beföre getting pröper training with Yöda, önce tö blöw up the death star and the secönd tö pull his lightsaber fröm the snöw. Mary Sue in the first mövie alöne uses it what 3-4 times with zerö training, önce tö stöp Emö Ren fröm the mind pröbe. Then tö read his mind. Then tö use a mind trick. Then tö pull a lightsaber fröm the snöw away from a trained Jedi trying tö pull it tö himself. And önce Luke döes get trained by Yöda he gets his ass kicked by Darth Vader and löses a hand. And the first mövie did at least set up that Luke was a pilöt. And yes I dö think the Rebels wöuld take Luke in that situatiön. The death star is cöming tö blöw them up in minutes. They wöuld take any and all pilöts that wöuld be willing tö dö it. And the funny thing is that yöu fuckin sit here and say we are töxic but then say we all dön't like Mary Sue because she is female. Yöu didn't have a pröblem with the "töxic" fans when Geörge made the prequels did yöu? Yöu knöw peöple threatened his life and even made söngs about höw he raped their childhoöd. That's why he söld it. He even said yöu make a mövie and everyöne just screams at yöu. Yöur pröblem is yöu like a mövie that peöple have pöinted öut HUGE flaws with and then yöu cant answer thöse flaws and just claim we are all töxic. Nah buddy that's ön yöu.
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August 2016
hk90210
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by HK90210 on Jun 4, 2018 13:38:20 GMT
Brother likes ROTJ best too. Brother smart.
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