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Post by Hier0phant on Apr 13, 2021 0:03:40 GMT
One more thing, i finished reading Attack on Titan's final chapter, and it's conclusion is a bigger shitshow than Disney's handling of the sequel trilogy. Never before have i seen an ending that retroactively added so many plotholes, and then there's the terrible dialogue. I'd say they're pretty much on par with each other in that regard. Which doesn't reflect well on the one with the billion dollar budget and half-dozen collaborating professional writers and directors. Not counting the story group. And Exar Kun's lightsaber looks hilariously impractical. Way worse than an ordinary lightsaber, or even Maul's and Satele's longer-hilted versions. He looks like he should be cleaving himself in two in both panels where he attacks with it. I'd classify it as an embarrassing, garishly colored experiment and leave it at that. Scenes like that make me glad that I've never been a consummate fan of either Star Wars or comic books. This is why i liked Lucas' old lore team. Exar Kun not bisecting himself was explained away as him using Trakata which is the deactivation of the saber during combat for feints and strikes. Luckily for the old lore team the comic artist depicted Kun using a single bladed saber for the majority of the books, while during the one shown duel with his new twin-bladed saber he only strikes with one blade ignited, like in the panel he killed his master. That sounds silly but it's a far more reasonable than Admiral Holdo using a hyperspace jump to set off a chain reaction explosion that uses the Radus' never before mentioned dual phase shield to encase the ship's plasma charged hull into a makeshift blaster bolt, and launch said plasma charged mass at lightspeed with a second hyper jump.
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Post by Noxluxe on Apr 13, 2021 10:45:08 GMT
This is why i liked Lucas' old lore team. Exar Kun not bisecting himself was explained away as him using Trakata which is the deactivation of the saber during combat for feints and strikes. Luckily for the old lore team the comic artist depicted Kun using a single bladed saber for the majority of the books, while during the one shown duel with his new twin-bladed saber he only strikes with one blade ignited, like in the panel he killed his master. That sounds silly but it's a far more reasonable than Admiral Holdo using a hyperspace jump to set off a chain reaction explosion that uses the Radus' never before mentioned dual phase shield to encase the ship's plasma charged hull into a makeshift blaster bolt, and launch said plasma charged mass at lightspeed with a second hyper jump. Totally disagree with that. If Johnson's script had made a point of the Raddus being some kind of prototype ship with really weird and impractical and expensive experimental technology that ultimately made it unexpectedly suitable for just that... and the First Order had whittled down the Resistance's resources over time to the point of explicitly having to flee their last base using the shittiest dumb science experiment and cargo ships they had left... and the tactical situation leading up to the Holdo Maneuver moment had actually made sense... ...then that scene could have been a really awesome payoff without breaking anything at all within the Star Wars canon. Except for potentially having to excuse it not being used more in future movies, which could certainly be done, and much better than just "it's a million to one, dummy!". It'd still have been a bad idea, but bad ideas can be very well-executed. Unfortunately, not a single one of those things is in the actual movie Star Wars: The Last Jedi. So yeah, it's just a terrible story moment with good visuals and garbage retroactive excuses cowardly scattered around the supplemental materials after the fact. A stellar example of true modern filmmaking.
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Post by Hier0phant on Apr 13, 2021 12:37:44 GMT
This is why i liked Lucas' old lore team. Exar Kun not bisecting himself was explained away as him using Trakata which is the deactivation of the saber during combat for feints and strikes. Luckily for the old lore team the comic artist depicted Kun using a single bladed saber for the majority of the books, while during the one shown duel with his new twin-bladed saber he only strikes with one blade ignited, like in the panel he killed his master. That sounds silly but it's a far more reasonable than Admiral Holdo using a hyperspace jump to set off a chain reaction explosion that uses the Radus' never before mentioned dual phase shield to encase the ship's plasma charged hull into a makeshift blaster bolt, and launch said plasma charged mass at lightspeed with a second hyper jump. Totally disagree with that. If Johnson's script had made a point of the Raddus being some kind of prototype ship with really weird and impractical and expensive experimental technology that ultimately made it unexpectedly suitable for just that... and the First Order had whittled down the Resistance's resources over time to the point of explicitly having to flee their last base using the shittiest dumb science experiment and cargo ships they had left... and the tactical situation leading up to the Holdo Maneuver moment had actually made sense... ...then that scene could have been a really awesome payoff without breaking anything at all within the Star Wars canon. Except for potentially having to excuse it not being used more in future movies, which could certainly be done, and much better than just "it's a million to one, dummy!". It'd still have been a bad idea, but bad ideas can be very well-executed. Unfortunately, not a single one of those things is in the actual movie Star Wars: The Last Jedi. So yeah, it's just a terrible story moment with good visuals and garbage retroactive excuses cowardly scattered around the supplemental materials after the fact. A stellar example of true modern filmmaking. Exactly, needing a novel that was released months afterwards to make sense of a film's plot point is not good. The Raddus's experimental shields wasn't in any pre-existing script draft, and is basically a retcon that was introduced afterwards in TLJ's novelisation in order to explain away how Rian depicted the physics of Star Trek's Warp Drive engine instead of Star War's hyperdrive jumps, where a ship massively decelerates when leaving hyperspace. Then JJ said fuck it, and had another ship perform the exact same maneuver that required the Raddus' unique one of a kind experimental shield system in order to achieve the amount of destruction that was depicted in TLJ. Mind you the retcon's explanation is still sketchy because if the Raddus' mass was converted to plasma upon the first impact then the hyperdrive computer/engine should have been destroyed after being converted to plasma too, and should render the second jump impossible. The scene looks nice but due to the lore that was presented in ANH it would fit better in a Star Trek film. By comparison Lucas's old lore team used basic Occam's Razor to explain away the impracticality of Kun's dual-blade saber while KK's story group employed a convoluted explanation that required a novel, but still left people scratching their heads after the fact. Chee and Hidalgo are hacks, but tbf cleaning up after Rian within whatever guidelines KK set is probably like being given a broom and dustpan, and be expected to clean up Tokyo's post Godzilla rampaged streets in a month.
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Post by Noxluxe on Apr 13, 2021 13:01:23 GMT
Exactly, needing a novel that was released months afterwards to make sense of a film's plot point is not good. The Raddus's experimental shields wasn't in any pre-existing script draft, and is basically a retcon that was introduced afterwards in TLJ's novelisation in order to explain away how Rian depicted the physics of Star Trek's Warp Drive engine instead of Star War's hyperdrive jumps where a ship massively decelerates when leaving hyperspace. Then JJ said fuck it, and had another ship perform the exact same maneuver that required the Raddus' unique one of a kind experimental shield system in order to achieve the amount of destruction that was depicted in TLJ. Mind you the retcon's explanation is still sketchy because if the Raddus' mass was converted to plasma upon the first impact then the hyperdrive computer/engine should have been destroyed after being converted to plasma too, and should render the second jump impossible. The scene looks nice but due to the lore that was presented in ANH it would fit better in a Star Trek film. By comparison Lucas's old lore team used basic Occam's Razor to explain away the impracticality of Kun's dual-blade saber while KK's story group employed a convoluted explanation that required a novel, but still leaves people scratching their heads after the fact. Chee and Hidalgo are hacks, but tbf cleaning up after Rian within whatever guidelines KK set is like being given a broom and dustpan, and be expected to clean up Tokyo's post Godzilla rampaged streets in a month. I honestly don't care what the explanations are or aren't. No movie studio in the world has earned enough goodwill to inspire me to read a novel in order to retroactively understand a Star Wars movie. So far as I'm concerned, the Holdo Maneuver is just a spaceship moving very very fast powered by shit writing, and Exar Kun's lightsaber is weird. End of story. *shrugs* Replaying Mass Effect 2 is really getting me in the mood to start Kotor again, though I've kind of run the gamut when it comes to builds in that game. Consular was really fun last time.
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Post by Hier0phant on Apr 13, 2021 15:08:26 GMT
I'd say they're pretty much on par with each other in that regard. Which doesn't reflect well on the one with the billion dollar budget and half-dozen collaborating professional writers and directors. Not counting the story group. And Exar Kun's lightsaber looks hilariously impractical. Way worse than an ordinary lightsaber, or even Maul's and Satele's longer-hilted versions. He looks like he should be cleaving himself in two in both panels where he attacks with it. I'd classify it as an embarrassing, garishly colored experiment and leave it at that. Scenes like that make me glad that I've never been a consummate fan of either Star Wars or comic books. Hey, at least he didn't twirl it around and try flying with it
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Post by smilesja on Apr 14, 2021 20:00:34 GMT
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Post by smilesja on Apr 15, 2021 3:38:22 GMT
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Post by Energizer Bunny 211 on Apr 15, 2021 15:21:36 GMT
It might be a "kids show" but I thoroughly enjoyed it.
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Post by smilesja on Apr 15, 2021 16:55:50 GMT
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Post by Noxluxe on Apr 15, 2021 17:40:22 GMT
It might be a 'kids show' but I thoroughly enjoyed it. My original biggest disappointment at the news that Disney had purchased Star Wars was the realization that we're never ever going to get an R-rated lightsaber fight. As a boy I remember dreaming about how indescribably cool it would be to watch two trained Jedi/Sith absolutely try to murder each other with those things instead of swinging them around like baseball bats, or one go up against a bunch of mooks and just send limbs flying left and right with a flick of his wrist. Like John Wick, but with fewer headshots and more cauterized flesh. And it always seemed kind of hypocritical. Anyone else remember those shots of Aunt Beru and Uncle Owen burnt to a crisp, or Vader sicking that disgusting torture droid on what we later find out is his own teenage daughter(*), or those Imperial officers slowly realizing that they're spontaneously chocking to death in the middle of their command rooms? Star Wars was definitely never 'just for kids'. And from what I've seen, Clone Wars is great about setting a mature tone when appropriate in a story about war and child soldiers and brainwashed slave soldiers and story. I've never been interested in watching the show for real, but I'm glad it's out there. *At some point I read a review of A New Hope that made a point of summarizing how Leia's and Vader's first scene together has just gotten progressively sillier in retrospect as Star Wars has gone on as a franchise. Namely, first we see a teenage politician mouthing off at an imposing enforcer for a tyrannical government. Then we find out that they're father and daughter and neither of them is aware of it. Then the prequels come out and we find out that she specifically got all her brattiness and belligerence from him, and then Rogue One comes out and we find out that she's trying to bullshit him about being on a diplomatic errand when he almost boarded the ship himself and saw it leave a combat zone with vital stolen information with his own goddamn eyes ten minutes before the movie opens.
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Post by Iakus on Apr 15, 2021 20:45:41 GMT
It might be a 'kids show' but I thoroughly enjoyed it. My original biggest disappointment at the news that Disney had purchased Star Wars was the realization that we're never ever going to get an R-rated lightsaber fight. As a boy I remember dreaming about how indescribably cool it would be to watch two trained Jedi/Sith absolutely try to murder each other with those things instead of swinging them around like baseball bats, or one go up against a bunch of mooks and just send limbs flying left and right with a flick of his wrist. Like John Wick, but with fewer headshots and more cauterized flesh. And it always seemed kind of hypocritical. Anyone else remember those shots of Aunt Beru and Uncle Owen burnt to a crisp, or Vader sicking that disgusting torture droid on what we later find out is his own teenage daughter(*), or those Imperial officers slowly realizing that they're spontaneously chocking to death in the middle of their command rooms? Star Wars was definitely never 'just for kids'. And from what I've seen, Clone Wars is great about setting a mature tone when appropriate in a story about war and child soldiers and brainwashed slave soldiers and story. I've never been interested in watching the show for real, but I'm glad it's out there. *At some point I read a review of A New Hope that made a point of summarizing how Leia's and Vader's first scene together has just gotten progressively sillier in retrospect as Star Wars has gone on as a franchise. Namely, first we see a teenage politician mouthing off at an imposing enforcer for a tyrannical government. Then we find out that they're father and daughter and neither of them is aware of it. Then the prequels come out and we find out that she specifically got all her brattiness and belligerence from him, and then Rogue One comes out and we find out that she's trying to bullshit him about being on a diplomatic errand when he almost boarded the ship himself and saw it leave a combat zone with vital stolen information with his own goddamn eyes ten minutes before the movie opens. Lucas's original vision for the movies was that they would be, while not for "kids", strictly speaking, would be nostalgic of the childhoods of the adults of the 1970s. Star Wars was based on the adventure serials of the '30s and '40s like Flash Gordon.
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Post by smilesja on Apr 16, 2021 6:07:12 GMT
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Post by rewindbutton on Apr 16, 2021 6:21:09 GMT
[snip] *At some point I read a review of A New Hope that made a point of summarizing how Leia's and Vader's first scene together has just gotten progressively sillier in retrospect as Star Wars has gone on as a franchise. Namely, first we see a teenage politician mouthing off at an imposing enforcer for a tyrannical government. Then we find out that they're father and daughter and neither of them is aware of it. Then the prequels come out and we find out that she specifically got all her brattiness and belligerence from him, and then Rogue One comes out and we find out that she's trying to bullshit him about being on a diplomatic errand when he almost boarded the ship himself and saw it leave a combat zone with vital stolen information with his own goddamn eyes ten minutes before the movie opens. This is very accurate. I hate it when a sequel/prequel/whatever messes the original movie.
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Post by Iakus on Apr 16, 2021 14:26:03 GMT
[snip] *At some point I read a review of A New Hope that made a point of summarizing how Leia's and Vader's first scene together has just gotten progressively sillier in retrospect as Star Wars has gone on as a franchise. Namely, first we see a teenage politician mouthing off at an imposing enforcer for a tyrannical government. Then we find out that they're father and daughter and neither of them is aware of it. Then the prequels come out and we find out that she specifically got all her brattiness and belligerence from him, and then Rogue One comes out and we find out that she's trying to bullshit him about being on a diplomatic errand when he almost boarded the ship himself and saw it leave a combat zone with vital stolen information with his own goddamn eyes ten minutes before the movie opens. This is very accurate. I hate it when a sequel/prequel/whatever messes the original movie. You want to know what's REALLY funny? In the radio drama, when Leia was under the influence of the drugs the interrogation droid gave her, and was hallucinating, Vader pretended to be her father to get her to reveal where the Death Star plans were!
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Post by rewindbutton on Apr 16, 2021 17:41:12 GMT
You want to know what's REALLY funny? In the radio drama, when Leia was under the influence of the drugs the interrogation droid gave her, and was hallucinating, Vader pretended to be her father to get her to reveal where the Death Star plans were! I didn't know they made adaptations for radio, or that they were canon until 2014. Apparently Leia and Bail Organa had an earlier scene together, where they discussed the Death Star plans. That is all very interesting and quite bonkers.
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Post by Iakus on Apr 16, 2021 18:28:18 GMT
You want to know what's REALLY funny? In the radio drama, when Leia was under the influence of the drugs the interrogation droid gave her, and was hallucinating, Vader pretended to be her father to get her to reveal where the Death Star plans were! I didn't know they made adaptations for radio, or that they were canon until 2014. Apparently Leia and Bail Organa had an earlier scene together, where they discussed the Death Star plans. That is all very interesting and quite bonkers. Yup, Mark Hamill and Anthony Daniels even reprised their roles for it. Of course, how they got the plans directly contradicted Rogue One, so ultimately it had to go...
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Post by Hier0phant on Apr 16, 2021 19:50:18 GMT
This is very accurate. I hate it when a sequel/prequel/whatever messes the original movie. You want to know what's REALLY funny? In the radio drama, when Leia was under the influence of the drugs the interrogation droid gave her, and was hallucinating, Vader pretended to be her father to get her to reveal where the Death Star plans were!
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Post by Hier0phant on Apr 17, 2021 15:12:16 GMT
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Post by smilesja on Apr 17, 2021 16:06:24 GMT
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Post by smilesja on Apr 17, 2021 20:04:52 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2021 1:48:49 GMT
just a reminder that the last jedi is the worst movie ever made
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Post by smilesja on Apr 19, 2021 5:36:31 GMT
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Post by rewindbutton on Apr 19, 2021 7:42:19 GMT
I didn't know they made adaptations for radio, or that they were canon until 2014. Apparently Leia and Bail Organa had an earlier scene together, where they discussed the Death Star plans. That is all very interesting and quite bonkers. Yup, Mark Hamill and Anthony Daniels even reprised their roles for it. Of course, how they got the plans directly contradicted Rogue One, so ultimately it had to go... Yeah, I actually looked it up and read about it. 'Cause you know, Star Wars stuff I hadn't heard about.
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