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Post by mybudgee on Jun 30, 2018 22:22:44 GMT
Just a refresher, since many of you seem to have forgotten (or never knew what this term meant in the 1st place, yet used it ad nauseum because you heard someone else using it) Plot-Hole n. In fiction, a plot hole, plot-hole or plot error is a gap or inconsistency in a storyline that goes against the flow of logic established by the story's plot. Such inconsistencies include such things as illogical or impossible events, and statements/actions or events that contradict earlier events in the storyline (or established lore) Examples from episode 8: - Ma-Rey Sue/Leia knowing how to use the Force with mastery simply because they possess magical ovaries - Luke not giving a shit about anything but fresh breast-milk - Bombs "falling" in a low/zero gravity environment - Ma-Rey Sue resisting the Dark Side anus by sheer willpower & a dash of self-righteous feminism - Snoke being killed by a David Blaine street magic trick, despite being a very intelligent & powerful Force user - An entire resistance Army forgetting to get gas in all of their ships - An execution needing 5 minutes of "lining up the laser-axe" before chopping - Meeting a spy/hacker in person when everyone else in the galaxy uses Holo-Skype - Setting space-horses free but leaving the human slaves in chains for no reason - Saving someone's life who was about to sacrifice themselves nobly by attempting to sacrifice oneself foolishly and then miraculously surviving in order to deliver the dumbest line in Sci-Fi history - No using the Force AT ALL during a viscous duel in which you are outnumbered (also dropping your weapon instead of stabbing Ma-Rey with it when you have a chance) - Killing your nephew while he sleeps because he had a moment of violent fantasizing/lusting for power - Standing over said nephew with a LOUD laser sword for several moments so he can wake & defend himself stupidly - A lightsaber is torn in half, knocking out cold a very powerful, highly trained Force-user while a novice merely shakes it off and walks away - I can name more but I am sick to my stomach...  |
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Post by Darth Dennis on Jun 30, 2018 22:51:18 GMT
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Post by mybudgee on Jun 30, 2018 22:53:47 GMT
With a ridiculöus statement like that it deserves a reply like mine. I have nöt pöinted öut the plöt höles in that statement. If I did yöu wöuld have nö answer för them. But saying there is zerö plöt höles even if yöu like the mövie is ridiculöus, I think even yöu wöuld agree. I admit there are plöt höle in the öt. Depends on what you call a plot hole. Something not seen before does not equal a plot hole.  |
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Post by Andrew Waples on Jun 30, 2018 22:53:54 GMT
Just a refresher, since many of you seem to have forgotten (or never knew what this term meant in the 1st place, yet used it ad nauseum because you heard someone else using it) Plot-Hole n. In fiction, a plot hole, plot-hole or plot error is a gap or inconsistency in a storyline that goes against the flow of logic established by the story's plot. Such inconsistencies include such things as illogical or impossible events, and statements/actions or events that contradict earlier events in the storyline (or established lore) Examples from episode 8: - Ma-Rey Sue/Leia knowing how to use the Force with mastery simply because they possess magical ovaries - Luke not giving a shit about anything but fresh breast-milk - Bombs "falling" in a low/zero gravity environment - Ma-Rey Sue resisting the Dark Side anus by sheer willpower & a dash of self-righteous feminism - Snoke being killed by a David Blaine street magic trick, despite being a very intelligent & powerful Force user - An entire resistance Army forgetting to get gas in all of their ships - An execution needing 5 minutes of "lining up the laser-axe" before chopping - Meeting a spy/hacker in person when everyone else in the galaxy uses Holo-Skype - Setting space-horses free but leaving the human slaves in chains for no reason - Saving someone's life who was about to sacrifice themselves nobly by attempting to sacrifice oneself foolishly and then miraculously surviving in order to deliver the dumbest line in Sci-Fi history - No using the Force AT ALL during a viscous duel in which you are outnumbered (also dropping your weapon instead of stabbing Ma-Rey with it when you have a chance) - Killing your nephew while he sleeps because he had a moment of violent fantasizing/lusting for power - Standing over said nephew with a LOUD laser sword for several moments so he can wake & defend himself stupidly - A lightsaber is torn in half, knocking out cold a very powerful, highly trained Force-user while a novice merely shakes it off and walks away - I can name more but I am sick to my stomach...  What are they gonna do with a bunch of kids, exactly? Put them to War? Are you talking about the Throne Room scene? I don't even know what your talking about. |
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Post by mybudgee on Jun 30, 2018 23:01:47 GMT
Just a refresher, since many of you seem to have forgotten (or never knew what this term meant in the 1st place, yet used it ad nauseum because you heard someone else using it) Plot-Hole n. In fiction, a plot hole, plot-hole or plot error is a gap or inconsistency in a storyline that goes against the flow of logic established by the story's plot. Such inconsistencies include such things as illogical or impossible events, and statements/actions or events that contradict earlier events in the storyline (or established lore) Examples from episode 8: - Ma-Rey Sue/Leia knowing how to use the Force with mastery simply because they possess magical ovaries - Luke not giving a shit about anything but fresh breast-milk - Bombs "falling" in a low/zero gravity environment - Ma-Rey Sue resisting the Dark Side anus by sheer willpower & a dash of self-righteous feminism - Snoke being killed by a David Blaine street magic trick, despite being a very intelligent & powerful Force user - An entire resistance Army forgetting to get gas in all of their ships - An execution needing 5 minutes of "lining up the laser-axe" before chopping - Meeting a spy/hacker in person when everyone else in the galaxy uses Holo-Skype - Setting space-horses free but leaving the human slaves in chains for no reason - Saving someone's life who was about to sacrifice themselves nobly by attempting to sacrifice oneself foolishly and then miraculously surviving in order to deliver the dumbest line in Sci-Fi history - No using the Force AT ALL during a viscous duel in which you are outnumbered (also dropping your weapon instead of stabbing Ma-Rey with it when you have a chance) - Killing your nephew while he sleeps because he had a moment of violent fantasizing/lusting for power - Standing over said nephew with a LOUD laser sword for several moments so he can wake & defend himself stupidly - A lightsaber is torn in half, knocking out cold a very powerful, highly trained Force-user while a novice merely shakes it off and walks away - I can name more but I am sick to my stomach... What are they gonna do with a bunch of kids, exactly? Put them to War? Are you talking about the Throne Room scene? I don't even know what your talking about. Yeah, it would have been better than nothing. Yes *You're You'll figure out homonyms someday. I believe in you Andy  |
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Post by aglomeracja on Jun 30, 2018 23:12:24 GMT
What plot holes you ask?
Here's 5 hour long critique of the movie. Plot holes included:
Apparently one can make a movie analysys that doesn't come down to "you didn't like the movie because you had wrong preconceptions"
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Post by griffith82 on Jun 30, 2018 23:21:26 GMT
Just a refresher, since many of you seem to have forgotten (or never knew what this term meant in the 1st place, yet used it ad nauseum because you heard someone else using it) Plot-Hole n. In fiction, a plot hole, plot-hole or plot error is a gap or inconsistency in a storyline that goes against the flow of logic established by the story's plot. Such inconsistencies include such things as illogical or impossible events, and statements/actions or events that contradict earlier events in the storyline (or established lore) Examples from episode 8: - Ma-Rey Sue/Leia knowing how to use the Force with mastery simply because they possess magical ovaries - Luke not giving a shit about anything but fresh breast-milk - Bombs "falling" in a low/zero gravity environment - Ma-Rey Sue resisting the Dark Side anus by sheer willpower & a dash of self-righteous feminism - Snoke being killed by a David Blaine street magic trick, despite being a very intelligent & powerful Force user - An entire resistance Army forgetting to get gas in all of their ships - An execution needing 5 minutes of "lining up the laser-axe" before chopping - Meeting a spy/hacker in person when everyone else in the galaxy uses Holo-Skype - Setting space-horses free but leaving the human slaves in chains for no reason - Saving someone's life who was about to sacrifice themselves nobly by attempting to sacrifice oneself foolishly and then miraculously surviving in order to deliver the dumbest line in Sci-Fi history - No using the Force AT ALL during a viscous duel in which you are outnumbered (also dropping your weapon instead of stabbing Ma-Rey with it when you have a chance) - Killing your nephew while he sleeps because he had a moment of violent fantasizing/lusting for power - Standing over said nephew with a LOUD laser sword for several moments so he can wake & defend himself stupidly - A lightsaber is torn in half, knocking out cold a very powerful, highly trained Force-user while a novice merely shakes it off and walks away - I can name more but I am sick to my stomach... None of those are plot holes. |
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Post by Andrew Waples on Jun 30, 2018 23:22:26 GMT
What are they gonna do with a bunch of kids, exactly? Put them to War? Are you talking about the Throne Room scene? I don't even know what your talking about. Yeah, it would have been better than nothing. Yes *You're You'll figure out homonyms someday. I believe in you Andy   |
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Post by mybudgee on Jun 30, 2018 23:26:11 GMT
Just a refresher, since many of you seem to have forgotten (or never knew what this term meant in the 1st place, yet used it ad nauseum because you heard someone else using it) Plot-Hole n. In fiction, a plot hole, plot-hole or plot error is a gap or inconsistency in a storyline that goes against the flow of logic established by the story's plot. Such inconsistencies include such things as illogical or impossible events, and statements/actions or events that contradict earlier events in the storyline (or established lore) Examples from episode 8: - Ma-Rey Sue/Leia knowing how to use the Force with mastery simply because they possess magical ovaries - Luke not giving a shit about anything but fresh breast-milk - Bombs "falling" in a low/zero gravity environment - Ma-Rey Sue resisting the Dark Side anus by sheer willpower & a dash of self-righteous feminism - Snoke being killed by a David Blaine street magic trick, despite being a very intelligent & powerful Force user - An entire resistance Army forgetting to get gas in all of their ships - An execution needing 5 minutes of "lining up the laser-axe" before chopping - Meeting a spy/hacker in person when everyone else in the galaxy uses Holo-Skype - Setting space-horses free but leaving the human slaves in chains for no reason - Saving someone's life who was about to sacrifice themselves nobly by attempting to sacrifice oneself foolishly and then miraculously surviving in order to deliver the dumbest line in Sci-Fi history - No using the Force AT ALL during a viscous duel in which you are outnumbered (also dropping your weapon instead of stabbing Ma-Rey with it when you have a chance) - Killing your nephew while he sleeps because he had a moment of violent fantasizing/lusting for power - Standing over said nephew with a LOUD laser sword for several moments so he can wake & defend himself stupidly - A lightsaber is torn in half, knocking out cold a very powerful, highly trained Force-user while a novice merely shakes it off and walks away - I can name more but I am sick to my stomach... None of those are plot holes. Your mind-numbing posts are going against the flow of my established logic ... I'll be back later  |
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Post by Andrew Waples on Jun 30, 2018 23:27:47 GMT
None of those are plot holes. Your mind-numbing posts are going against the flow of my established logic ... I'll be back later Proving my point that I said earlier... |
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HK90210
N4
Expletive: Damn it, master, I am an assassination droid... not a dictionary!
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by HK90210 on Jun 30, 2018 23:32:48 GMT
Just a refresher, since many of you seem to have forgotten (or never knew what this term meant in the 1st place, yet used it ad nauseum because you heard someone else using it) Plot-Hole n. In fiction, a plot hole, plot-hole or plot error is a gap or inconsistency in a storyline that goes against the flow of logic established by the story's plot. Such inconsistencies include such things as illogical or impossible events, and statements/actions or events that contradict earlier events in the storyline (or established lore) Examples from episode 8: - Ma-Rey Sue/Leia knowing how to use the Force with mastery simply because they possess magical ovaries - Luke not giving a shit about anything but fresh breast-milk - Bombs "falling" in a low/zero gravity environment - Ma-Rey Sue resisting the Dark Side anus by sheer willpower & a dash of self-righteous feminism - Snoke being killed by a David Blaine street magic trick, despite being a very intelligent & powerful Force user - An entire resistance Army forgetting to get gas in all of their ships - An execution needing 5 minutes of "lining up the laser-axe" before chopping - Meeting a spy/hacker in person when everyone else in the galaxy uses Holo-Skype - Setting space-horses free but leaving the human slaves in chains for no reason - Saving someone's life who was about to sacrifice themselves nobly by attempting to sacrifice oneself foolishly and then miraculously surviving in order to deliver the dumbest line in Sci-Fi history - No using the Force AT ALL during a viscous duel in which you are outnumbered (also dropping your weapon instead of stabbing Ma-Rey with it when you have a chance) - Killing your nephew while he sleeps because he had a moment of violent fantasizing/lusting for power - Standing over said nephew with a LOUD laser sword for several moments so he can wake & defend himself stupidly - A lightsaber is torn in half, knocking out cold a very powerful, highly trained Force-user while a novice merely shakes it off and walks away - I can name more but I am sick to my stomach...  None of those are plot holes. Got any arguments to back that up? Like explaining why ALL of the stated plotholes are not plotholes as defined in mybudgee's post? It's fine if you don't, but if that's the case, don't engage. Personally, I don't think ALL of them are plotholes. But there are definitely more than a few in there. |
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Post by griffith82 on Jun 30, 2018 23:43:23 GMT
None of those are plot holes. Got any arguments to back that up? Like explaining why ALL of the stated plotholes are not plotholes as defined in mybudgee's post? It's fine if you don't, but if that's the case, don't engage. Personally, I don't think ALL of them are plotholes. But there are definitely more than a few in there. Maybe the execution one and the bombs but the later is imo not really as I dong expect proper science in sci-fi. The rest are simply the plot and are explained by the characters actions. Rey is strong in the force that’s how it comes so easy to her. Luke’s actions are understandable. Most of these are simply things he doesn’t like. Doesn’t make them plot holes. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2018 23:46:07 GMT
Got any arguments to back that up? Like explaining why ALL of the stated plotholes are not plotholes as defined in mybudgee's post? It's fine if you don't, but if that's the case, don't engage. Personally, I don't think ALL of them are plotholes. But there are definitely more than a few in there. Maybe the execution one and the bombs but the later is imo not really as I dong expect proper science in sci-fi. The rest are simply the plot and are explained by the characters actions. Rey is strong in the force that’s how it comes so easy to her. Luke’s actions are understandable. Most of these are simply things he doesn’t like. Doesn’t make them plot holes. How was attempting to kill an innocent boy understandable? |
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Post by griffith82 on Jun 30, 2018 23:50:27 GMT
Maybe the execution one and the bombs but the later is imo not really as I dong expect proper science in sci-fi. The rest are simply the plot and are explained by the characters actions. Rey is strong in the force that’s how it comes so easy to her. Luke’s actions are understandable. Most of these are simply things he doesn’t like. Doesn’t make them plot holes. How was attempting to kill an innocent boy understandable? Because he isn’t. He saw the next Anakin and was going to stop it before it started. He didn’t do it and that was because Luke knew he shouldn’t. |
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 30, 2018 23:50:57 GMT
Maybe the execution one and the bombs but the later is imo not really as I dong expect proper science in sci-fi. The rest are simply the plot and are explained by the characters actions. Rey is strong in the force that’s how it comes so easy to her. Luke’s actions are understandable. Most of these are simply things he doesn’t like. Doesn’t make them plot holes. How was attempting to kill an innocent boy understandable? He's already killed millions of innocent people if you think about it. What's one more? A more serious answer is as he discusses in the movie that for a moment the fear of Kylo becoming a Sith and bringing untold death and destruction to the galaxy caused him to subconsciously act that way, but he snapped out of it a moment later. I don't really see it as any different than the 'visions' Anakin had involving his mother and Padme causing him to act in a way that helped Palpatine's plan, just this time it was Snoke's plan. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2018 23:51:59 GMT
How was attempting to kill an innocent boy understandable? Because he isn’t. He saw the next Anakin and was going to stop it before it started. He didn’t do it and that was because Luke knew he shouldn’t. But with Anakin he actually allowed him to have a chance to go to the lightside tho… I think him even attempting to kill Kylo was a great error and completely out of character based on what we've seen with him in other movies. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2018 23:54:43 GMT
How was attempting to kill an innocent boy understandable? A more serious answer is as he discusses in the movie that for a moment the fear of Kylo becoming a Sith and bringing untold death and destruction to the galaxy caused him to subconsciously act that way, but he snapped out of it a moment later. I don't really see it as any different than the 'visions' Anakin had involving his mother and Padme causing him to act in a way that helped Palpatine's plan, just this time it was Snoke's plan. Baseless speculation. We don't know what he did or how many he killed before TLD. Yes but he actually out acted out of character because Luke was well known for brining Anakin to the lightside. The fact he honestly mistrusted Kylo that much is kind of not what Luke did. At all. |
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 30, 2018 23:55:26 GMT
He's already killed millions of innocent people if you think about it. A more serious answer is as he discusses in the movie that for a moment the fear of Kylo becoming a Sith and bringing untold death and destruction to the galaxy caused him to subconsciously act that way, but he snapped out of it a moment later. I don't really see it as any different than the 'visions' Anakin had involving his mother and Padme causing him to act in a way that helped Palpatine's plan, just this time it was Snoke's plan. Baseless speculation. We don't know what he did or how many he killed before TLD. Yes but he actually out acted out of character because Luke was well known for brining Anakin to the lightside. The fact he honestly mistrusted Kylo that much is kind of not what Luke did. At all. I was jokingly saying Luke already killed millions of innocent people at that point.  Because he isn’t. He saw the next Anakin and was going to stop it before it started. He didn’t do it and that was because Luke knew he shouldn’t. But with Anakin he actually allowed him to have a chance to go to the lightside tho… I think him even attempting to kill Kylo was a great error and completely out of character based on what we've seen with him in other movies. I disagree. When Vader threatened Leia in RotJ, Luke went into a rage then as well and tried to kill Vader. He completely abandoned trying to turn his father back to the light at that moment. It was only after Vader was on the ground and Palpatine was talking him into finishing his father off and replacing him did Luke snap out of it. Luke has a history of losing control when his loved ones are threatened, being even willing to kill a family member one whom he swore to help to do it. |
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Post by griffith82 on Jun 30, 2018 23:55:44 GMT
Because he isn’t. He saw the next Anakin and was going to stop it before it started. He didn’t do it and that was because Luke knew he shouldn’t. But with Anakin he actually allowed him to have a chance to go to the lightside tho… I think him even attempting to kill Kylo was a great error and completely out of character based on what we've seen with him in other movies. I see it as two different situations. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2018 0:02:44 GMT
But with Anakin he actually allowed him to have a chance to go to the lightside tho… I think him even attempting to kill Kylo was a great error and completely out of character based on what we've seen with him in other movies. I disagree. When Vader threatened Leia in RotJ, Luke went into a rage then as well and tried to kill Vader. He completely abandoned trying to turn his father back to the light at that moment. It was only after Vader was on the ground and Palpatine was talking him into finishing his father off and replacing him did Luke snap out of it. Luke has a history of losing control when his loved ones are threatened, being even willing to kill a family member one whom he swore to help to do it. Kylo didn't even do ANYTHING to deserve what Luke did. Nothing. All he felt was a darkside influence and somehow he bounced to some far-fetched conclusion that he had to kill his own nephew because of it. Who knows how Kylo would've ended up if only Luke didn't do that (something that's completely out of character) and If Kylo is one of his loved ones, like you say, than he would've gone after Snoke or something... idk, but what he did was completely out of character. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2018 0:05:57 GMT
But with Anakin he actually allowed him to have a chance to go to the lightside tho… I think him even attempting to kill Kylo was a great error and completely out of character based on what we've seen with him in other movies. I see it as two different situations. One of an trying to kill an innocent boy and the other was about Luke thinking that his father (a murderer and a former Jedi) was completely gone but still yet finding light in him. |
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Post by Son of Dorn on Jul 1, 2018 0:06:40 GMT
I disagree. When Vader threatened Leia in RotJ, Luke went into a rage then as well and tried to kill Vader. He completely abandoned trying to turn his father back to the light at that moment. It was only after Vader was on the ground and Palpatine was talking him into finishing his father off and replacing him did Luke snap out of it. Luke has a history of losing control when his loved ones are threatened, being even willing to kill a family member one whom he swore to help to do it. Kylo didn't even do ANYTHING to deserve what Luke did. Nothing. All he felt was a darkside influence and somehow he bounced to some far-fetched conclusion that he had to kill his own nephew because of it. Who knows how Kylo would've ended up if only Luke didn't do that (something that's completely out of character) and If Kylo is one of his loved ones, like you say, than he would've gone after Snoke or something... idk, but what he did was completely out of character. Not to mention that it's something that a Sith would do. And also cowardly, killing someone in their sleep. |
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Post by griffith82 on Jul 1, 2018 0:06:53 GMT
I see it as two different situations. One of an trying to kill an innocent boy and the other was about Luke thinking that his father (a murderer and a former Jedi) was completely gone but still yet finding light in him. He’s not innocent! |
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Post by griffith82 on Jul 1, 2018 0:07:22 GMT
Kylo didn't even do ANYTHING to deserve what Luke did. Nothing. All he felt was a darkside influence and somehow he bounced to some far-fetched conclusion that he had to kill his own nephew because of it. Who knows how Kylo would've ended up if only Luke didn't do that (something that's completely out of character) and If Kylo is one of his loved ones, like you say, than he would've gone after Snoke or something... idk, but what he did was completely out of character. Not to mention that it's something that a Sith would do. And also cowardly, killing someone in their sleep. Which is why he didn’t do it. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2018 0:10:41 GMT
One of an trying to kill an innocent boy and the other was about Luke thinking that his father (a murderer and a former Jedi) was completely gone but still yet finding light in him. He’s not innocent! Okay so what did Kylo did back than that deserved his death by Luke? Besides for having a couple of visions of the darkside? Care to explain? |
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