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Post by General Mahad on Aug 24, 2016 18:53:26 GMT
Yep and Jemisin said some controversial things in the past, but like Heir, doesn't matter unless she injects her ideology into her work. Indeed so. I've read the Inheritance Cycle and The Fifth Season and they're all very readable books. The Inheritance cycle even has this rare thing: an ending I love. I never noticed any elements in her books that didn't feel natural. So whatever ideology she has IRL, she knows how to write good stories. I respect that. Even if she does inject her ideology into her work - I don't think any writer can avoid that completely btw - as long as it feels natural to the setting, it's ok with me. Edit: I am reminded again of Tolkien's famous comments on allegory and applicability. I don't mind it if stories set in fictional worlds have application for real-world issues, because that's in the hand of the reader. I don't like it, though, if they appear to be explicitly written to send a message about real-world issues. For the same reason, I applaud it how elements of Thedas are applicable to real-world racism while remaining perfectly in their own world (example: the city elves), while I do mind that in DAI, some of Thedas' characters look - completely without precedent in this long-running world - exactly like real-world Africans. Jemisin appears to understand the difference and she writes her stories so that whatever applicability they may have, they remain in their own world. Edit2: If the claims about her "controversial comments" are aimed at her comments about Theodore Beale, they appear to be completely spot-on. See I'm fine with games tackling contemporary issues as long as there is moral ambiguity; Games that force you to think instead of spoon-feeding you.
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Post by Arcian on Aug 24, 2016 20:25:38 GMT
You don't care about the how because there is no satisfactory answer to the how, so you would rather damage the logical integrity of the ME universe than question BioWare's dubious judgment. I don't think one would get very far trying to argue for the logical integrity of the MEverse. The setting establishes from the get-go that technology can function for thousands of years somehow, so it's much easier to accept that a ship can travel between two galaxies than it is to accept that a person can be brought back to life after falling from orbit, or that a plant can rapidly produce clones that possess both biotics and weapons. The problem isn't that the tech can't function for X amount of years, that's solved by self-maintaining hardware, the problem is that FTL becomes exponentially more expensive and less efficient the bigger the ship is, so to store enough energy for an Ark to last the entire journey to Andromeda, you'd have to massively expand the Arks energy and fuel storage capacity... but that means adding more mass to be reduced by the FTL drive, which makes FTL even less efficient, which requires even more energy and fuel storage capacity, and so on. Basically, there's only really one solution to this problem, which is to build vastly more efficient FTL drives, the likes of which not even the Reapers possess. There's also the issue with the Arks being built in an incredibly small timespan between the end of ME1 and the beginning of ME3 - even if they had the technology, it's not nearly enough time to build the Arks, which almost look to rival the Mass Relays in size. How they funded them and kept them secret from the public are additional questions that need answering. The ideal scenario would be to set the exodus to Andromeda a bunch of centuries AFTER Mass Effect 3, that way the galaxy has time to discover the necessary technology for them to make the journey, and ample time to build the Arks without having to keep them a secret. But then you lose the entire impetus for leaving the galaxy in the first place - the impending Reaper War - and even the goal of exploring the Andromeda for the pure purpose of knowledge makes very little sense when 99.99% of the Milky Way remains unexplored and likely will remain largely unexplored for tens of thousands of years to come. And going with a "They discovered ancient technology"-explanation obviously doesn't work either when not even the Reapers can go faster than 30 light years a day, a speed at which it would take them 228 years of constant FTL to reach Andromeda. Also, just to clarify: When I'm talking about the logical integrity of the Mass Effect universe, I'm not demanding they make it a 1:1 replica of real life - that's not what fiction is about. I'm just asking them to hold themselves to the standards they themselves set in the first game, to keep the universe consistent. For some reason people seem to think that is too much to ask for.
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Post by helios969 on Aug 24, 2016 21:21:28 GMT
Well, I haven't read anything by her...or have even heard of her beyond the random rants of BSNers, but unless the selection process standards have been significantly reduced, that's major kudos for sci-fi writers. Most of my favorite writers/books won or were finalists for the Hugo...and I've never been disappointed by anything I've read in the Hugo-class. When the reading bug strikes me again I'll give her a look.
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Post by Sartoz on Aug 24, 2016 21:23:41 GMT
You don't care about the how because there is no satisfactory answer to the how, so you would rather damage the logical integrity of the ME universe than question BioWare's dubious judgment. I don't think one would get very far trying to argue for the logical integrity of the MEverse. The setting establishes from the get-go that technology can function for thousands of years somehow, so it's much easier to accept that a ship can travel between two galaxies than it is to accept that a person can be brought back to life after falling from orbit, or that a plant can rapidly produce clones that possess both biotics and weapons. <<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> Plus there is nothing preventing the discovery of another means of travels between point A and B. Tech, ideas and inventions have always existed. (ie: the horse, chariot, car, train, airplane, missiles, ion drives... etc. Scientific discoveries in science have occurred by accident, a few times). So, I won't be surprised if the prequel novel says the Alliance discovered something new.
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Post by straykat on Aug 24, 2016 21:30:24 GMT
Eezo cores are supposed to be dumped and can't run indefinitely.
Why change that.. when those early trailers suddenly have some instant travel mechanism now? It looks like some point to point thing without even relays. I'd sooner accept this than messing with what they already wrote about the very nature of Mass Effect drives.
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Post by KirkyX on Aug 24, 2016 22:07:52 GMT
Eezo cores are supposed to be dumped and can't run indefinitely. Why change that.. when those early trailers suddenly have some instant travel mechanism now? It looks like some point to point thing without even relays. I'd sooner accept this than messing with what they already wrote about the very nature of Mass Effect drives. "Unlike Citadel ships, Reapers do not appear to discharge static buildup from their drive cores, although they sometimes appear wreathed in static discharge when they land on planets." Considering that little bit of lore, it sounds less like a flaw inherent to the very nature of Mass Effect drives, and more like a limitation the Reapers intentionally built in to the Mass Effect drive technology they left for organics to find. (Or simply an unintentional consequence of their having a greater understanding of Mass Effect technology - their technology - than any other race.) I'm thinking the Andromeda expedition Ark-ship drives are based on drive core tech reverse-engineered from the wreckage of Sovereign. Going by the speculated travel time of about 600 years, the Ark drives are probably a half-step between the Citadel races' drives and Reaper drives. They can manage about twelve light years per day - top speed of the best Citadel drives during the Reaper War, but less than half a Reaper's top speed - but don't have to be discharged. It's not that much of a stretch, lore-wise. Nowhere near as egregious as the whole thermal clip thing. (Which, truth be told, didn't really bother me either...) Codex link for quote: masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Codex/The_Reapers#Reaper_Capabilities
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Post by straykat on Aug 24, 2016 22:32:32 GMT
Eezo cores are supposed to be dumped and can't run indefinitely. Why change that.. when those early trailers suddenly have some instant travel mechanism now? It looks like some point to point thing without even relays. I'd sooner accept this than messing with what they already wrote about the very nature of Mass Effect drives. "Unlike Citadel ships, Reapers do not appear to discharge static buildup from their drive cores, although they sometimes appear wreathed in static discharge when they land on planets." Considering that little bit of lore, it sounds less like a flaw inherent to the very nature of Mass Effect drives, and more like a limitation the Reapers intentionally built in to the Mass Effect drive technology they left for organics to find. (Or simply an unintentional consequence of their having a greater understanding of Mass Effect technology - their technology - than any other race.) I'm thinking the Andromeda expedition Ark-ship drives are based on drive core tech reverse-engineered from the wreckage of Sovereign. Going by the speculated travel time of about 600 years, the Ark drives are probably a half-step between the Citadel races' drives and Reaper drives. They can manage about twelve light years per day - top speed of the best Citadel drives during the Reaper War, but less than half a Reaper's top speed - but don't have to be discharged. It's not that much of a stretch, lore-wise. Nowhere near as egregious as the whole thermal clip thing. (Which, truth be told, didn't really bother me either...) Codex link for quote: masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Codex/The_Reapers#Reaper_CapabilitiesThanks for pointing this out.. I guess that's acceptable. On a huge sidenote though, I always hated the idea that hardly anyone develops anything themselves. Now it could be Sovereign bits. Always the scavengers. And even in Andromeda, it appears to be more scavenging of the Remnants or whatever they are. Mass Effect appears like sci-fi, but it never actually explores the key concept behind most sci-fi.... ever since Frankenstein, in fact.
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Innocent Bystander
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
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Post by Innocent Bystander on Aug 25, 2016 1:01:16 GMT
What I would love to see, and never will - for obvious reason - is Mass Effect novel written by R. A. Heinlein. Now that would be interesting.
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Post by straykat on Aug 25, 2016 4:39:03 GMT
What I would love to see, and never will - for obvious reason - is Mass Effect novel written by R. A. Heinlein. Now that would be interesting. Chris L'etoile was apparently a fan.. he was even gonna have Ash quote Heinlein, but I think there were copyright issues. He also wrote Noveria/rachni.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2016 11:30:38 GMT
A Hugo award winning author writing the book might have tempted me to read my first Mass Effect book.
A Hugo award winning author that is Jemisin seals the deal.
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Post by llandwynwyn on Aug 26, 2016 12:26:31 GMT
I think I'll read this one.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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XBL Gamertag: GVArcian
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Post by Arcian on Aug 26, 2016 18:46:33 GMT
<<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> Plus there is nothing preventing the discovery of another means of travels between point A and B. Yes there is, it's called time. No amount of money and manpower can force a discovery. Real life is not Civilization. All money and manpower does is increase the likelihood of *a* discovery, not necessarily the discovery you were looking for. Tech, ideas and inventions have always existed. (ie: the horse, chariot, car, train, airplane, missiles, ion drives... etc. Scientific discoveries in science have occurred by accident, a few times). Sartoz, no piece of technology is the sum of a single scientific discovery. It's not a matter of randomly stumbling upon a new FTL design. Nobody is going to get a sudden surge of inspiration and design a heatsink that is 8 million times more efficient than the commercial standard. Technology is subject to evolution just like we are. You can't just skip a step.
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Post by Sartoz on Aug 26, 2016 19:51:56 GMT
Eezo cores are supposed to be dumped and can't run indefinitely. Why change that.. when those early trailers suddenly have some instant travel mechanism now? It looks like some point to point thing without even relays. I'd sooner accept this than messing with what they already wrote about the very nature of Mass Effect drives. <<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> Hm... Why change? Why not? Why be restricted to old tech? Why can't Bio introduce new tech? This game is a perfect opportunity for removing any fictional science shackles Bio placed on themselves starting from ME1. The prequel novel, according to Titan Books, contains canon text which I believe will make some controversial but needed changes... FTL being one of them. My view is that a Mass Effect game is not about static "fictional science" elements. Rather, it's about the characters, story, the romances, the combat mechanics, the banter, the audio themes, the cinematics and the graphics. MW races and the Mako, in Andromeda, cements that "feeling". I believe you agree that ME:A will remain a Mass Effect game even with Eezo removed or using a "Slip Stream Drive" instead of a standard FTL drive. If you think about it, ME:A is about Ryder's universe and not Shep's and we are, after all, playing in the Andromeda galaxy.
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Post by Wulfram on Aug 26, 2016 20:01:12 GMT
Bioware's treatment of Mass Effect based FTL travel was an inconsistent mess anyway. Rebooting it could be a good thing, if it gives them some consistent rules that apply to both codex and cutscene.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2016 23:08:55 GMT
Eezo cores are supposed to be dumped and can't run indefinitely. Why change that.. when those early trailers suddenly have some instant travel mechanism now? It looks like some point to point thing without even relays. I'd sooner accept this than messing with what they already wrote about the very nature of Mass Effect drives. <<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> Hm... Why change? Why not? Why be restricted to old tech? Why can't Bio introduce new tech? This game is a perfect opportunity for removing any fictional science shackles Bio placed on themselves starting from ME1. The prequel novel, according to Titan Books, contains canon text which I believe will make some controversial but needed changes... FTL being one of them. My view is that a Mass Effect game is not about static "fictional science" elements. Rather, it's about the characters, story, the romances, the combat mechanics, the banter, the audio themes, the cinematics and the graphics. MW races and the Mako, in Andromeda, cements that "feeling". I believe you agree that ME:A will remain a Mass Effect game even with Eezo removed or using a "Slip Stream Drive" instead of a standard FTL drive. If you think about it, ME:A is about Ryder's universe and not Shep's and we are, after all, playing in the Andromeda galaxy. Well said; and I agree completely. It's a great opportunity for them to create something much better than the old lore.
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Post by straykat on Aug 26, 2016 23:17:58 GMT
It's a great opportunity to just make a new setting instead of this cashgrab, that isn't even done without several of the main creators or doctors around.
But hey, whatever.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Aug 26, 2016 23:21:20 GMT
Eezo cores are supposed to be dumped and can't run indefinitely. Why change that.. when those early trailers suddenly have some instant travel mechanism now? It looks like some point to point thing without even relays. I'd sooner accept this than messing with what they already wrote about the very nature of Mass Effect drives. <<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> Hm... Why change? Why not? Why be restricted to old tech? Why can't Bio introduce new tech? This game is a perfect opportunity for removing any fictional science shackles Bio placed on themselves starting from ME1. The prequel novel, according to Titan Books, contains canon text which I believe will make some controversial but needed changes... FTL being one of them. My view is that a Mass Effect game is not about static "fictional science" elements. Rather, it's about the characters, story, the romances, the combat mechanics, the banter, the audio themes, the cinematics and the graphics. MW races and the Mako, in Andromeda, cements that "feeling". I believe you agree that ME:A will remain a Mass Effect game even with Eezo removed or using a "Slip Stream Drive" instead of a standard FTL drive. If you think about it, ME:A is about Ryder's universe and not Shep's and we are, after all, playing in the Andromeda galaxy. Then just make a new science fiction franchise. Literally taking the Mass Effect out of the Mass Effect franchise is ridiculous. Luckilly there are ways they can do this without doing that, since Reaper and Collector ships use Mass Effect drives that have surpassed the limitations ours have so could make the trip.
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Post by straykat on Aug 26, 2016 23:22:12 GMT
<<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> Hm... Why change? Why not? Why be restricted to old tech? Why can't Bio introduce new tech? This game is a perfect opportunity for removing any fictional science shackles Bio placed on themselves starting from ME1. The prequel novel, according to Titan Books, contains canon text which I believe will make some controversial but needed changes... FTL being one of them. My view is that a Mass Effect game is not about static "fictional science" elements. Rather, it's about the characters, story, the romances, the combat mechanics, the banter, the audio themes, the cinematics and the graphics. MW races and the Mako, in Andromeda, cements that "feeling". I believe you agree that ME:A will remain a Mass Effect game even with Eezo removed or using a "Slip Stream Drive" instead of a standard FTL drive. If you think about it, ME:A is about Ryder's universe and not Shep's and we are, after all, playing in the Andromeda galaxy. Then just make a new science fiction franchise. Literally taking the Mass Effect out of the Mass Effect franchise is ridiculous. Like, literally right? lol It seems people just want a logo or something.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Aug 26, 2016 23:25:42 GMT
Then just make a new science fiction franchise. Literally taking the Mass Effect out of the Mass Effect franchise is ridiculous. Like, literally right? lol It seems people just want a logo or something. Yeah. It'd be like there being no more dragons in Dragon Age. Bioware has named their current franchises after a/the defining moment in that franchise. For DA, it was the return of dragons. For ME, it was the discovery of the technology the people of the galaxy call...Mass Effect.
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Post by Vortex13 on Aug 27, 2016 1:10:57 GMT
In regards to the the method of traveling to Andromeda, I've personally always been a fan of the species of the galaxy uniting to create their own version of a Stellar Engine, using existing tech. While trying to move an entire main sequence star and its corresponding solar system would be out of the question, something smaller, like say a brown dwarf, or 'hot' Jupiter would fit the bill nicely. The benefit of using the stellar engine lies in the fact that it is self sustaining; the host star itself providing the thrust. Plus, as an added bonus the system of the star in question will be dragged along with it; which depending on the type of planetary bodies present will mean the Andromeda colonists will be carrying along their own living space and/or fuel source. Clearly, a system rich in ezzo would be the best candidate, like something with a (relatively) small asteroid belt orbiting the star. That will provide the fuel necessary for the maintaining of the mass effect fields, as well as being a perfect place to discharge any static build up and providing ample living space for the colonists. Now the obvious question would be in how the galaxy is going to move a brown dwarf; which despite it's small relative size is still a massive stellar body. The answer of course is the use of mass effect fields, large, mega-industrial sized ones. Now where is the galaxy going to field something that powerful? Easy, with the use of several generators not unlike the ones the Turians used to provide the entire moon of Merene (sp?) with a gravitational field strong enough to hold an earth-like gravity and atmosphere across it's entire surface. Get fifteen to twenty of these generators in position around a target brown dwarf and you would be able to substantially reduce the star's mass, but not it's solar output. All of this combined will mean that the system in question would be able to get 'up to speed' in a reliable time frame, and seeing as how the use of a stellar engine is more or less unlimited in terms of acceleration; due to a constant thrust being applied by the star's own radiation output; would mean that this 'vessel' could reach Andromeda in roughly the same amount of time as it would with BioWare's current method, but wouldn't be relying on the creation of hereto unknown technological advancement. Also, it would provide the colonists a ready built home system to operate out of once they reach their destination. Plus, how much cooler would it be to pull up to Andromeda driving a freaking STAR, than some measly little ark ship?
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Post by Sartoz on Aug 28, 2016 12:33:39 GMT
<<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>>
Book Publishing
With the continuous silence regarding an actual publishing date for the Mass Effect Initiation / Initiative prequel novel, I did some looking around in the net and came across one of my favourite authors David Weber. He was was invited as a speaker to the 2015 National Book Festival. Here he talked about book publishing (among other things) and the trials and tribulations of publishing a book and the reason his first book took so long to get published.
He's quite interesting as a speaker. If you want to dive right in, start at around 05:40
Link:
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Post by Sartoz on Aug 28, 2016 13:48:24 GMT
<<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> Hm... Why change? Why not? Why be restricted to old tech? Why can't Bio introduce new tech? This game is a perfect opportunity for removing any fictional science shackles Bio placed on themselves starting from ME1. The prequel novel, according to Titan Books, contains canon text which I believe will make some controversial but needed changes... FTL being one of them. My view is that a Mass Effect game is not about static "fictional science" elements. Rather, it's about the characters, story, the romances, the combat mechanics, the banter, the audio themes, the cinematics and the graphics. MW races and the Mako, in Andromeda, cements that "feeling". I believe you agree that ME:A will remain a Mass Effect game even with Eezo removed or using a "Slip Stream Drive" instead of a standard FTL drive. If you think about it, ME:A is about Ryder's universe and not Shep's and we are, after all, playing in the Andromeda galaxy. Then just make a new science fiction franchise. Literally taking the Mass Effect out of the Mass Effect franchise is ridiculous. Luckilly there are ways they can do this without doing that, since Reaper and Collector ships use Mass Effect drives that have surpassed the limitations ours have so could make the trip. <<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> What exactly is Mass Effect to you? Element Zero? The Reapers? the Relays? If you read some of Bio's interviews, that is not what a Mass Effect game is to them.
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Post by straykat on Aug 28, 2016 14:43:17 GMT
Then just make a new science fiction franchise. Literally taking the Mass Effect out of the Mass Effect franchise is ridiculous. Luckilly there are ways they can do this without doing that, since Reaper and Collector ships use Mass Effect drives that have surpassed the limitations ours have so could make the trip. <<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>> What exactly is Mass Effect to you? Element Zero? The Reapers? the Relays? If you read some of Bio's interviews, that is not what a Mass Effect game is to them. At this point, barely any of the people who created it are around. I'm still not sure whether I should care what the current group says. But it sure is hell is more than a brand. And personally, I would've been fine with it ending at 3. I was happy enough. But now that it's here, I'd prefer it not get too mangled.
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Post by Fogg on Aug 28, 2016 15:06:42 GMT
It's a placeholder, even the title might end up being different (Mass Effect: Andromeda Initiative).
The armor you see is the armor that belongs to the Pathfinder*. It's the same armor 'N7 guy' has. Ryder isn't N7 guy.
*source (from 19.39):
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Post by malanek on Aug 28, 2016 22:31:36 GMT
Well I needed a few books to read while travelling so, amongst others, I just bought Jemisins The Fifth Season, so will have a trial run to see whether it is worth getting her Andromeda book.
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