mindfane
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Post by mindfane on Apr 3, 2017 6:09:50 GMT
I know this very subjective. But after playing the MP for two weeks, I have grown a disdain toward the Kett faction. They are ridiculously fast. The Fiend for instance is way too fast for his size. SO is the Anointed - He carries a heavy machine gun and still runs around the map like a Cerberus Dragoon. There is no running away from these guys. And Dont get me started on the Ascendant. That thing can creep up on you and sync kill, and he is deadly at any distance - even cover wont help you. And you have to shoot that tiny orb first. Even fi you do that he gets it back up within a few seconds.
On top of it all it is almost impossible to kite them. They are always every where on the map. I cannot remember how many times those guys shred us to pieces on ABC upload objectives.
I feel like they are a level up than the other factions. Bronze Kett = Silver Outlaw/Remnant
So what do you guys think?
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mograximus
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Post by mograximus on Apr 3, 2017 6:45:11 GMT
Yes, they are. While overwhelming compared to the other 2 factions, the broken Fiend sync kill is the most worrisome issue with the Kett.
Why 1 faction gets two sync kills and the other 2 get none just doesn't make any sense from a balance stand point.
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Post by onehitparry on Apr 3, 2017 6:47:31 GMT
But the Hydra has a choke slam!
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ryuji2
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Post by ryuji2 on Apr 3, 2017 6:50:45 GMT
The Fiend off-host is the scariest thing from the Kett faction imo. The Ascendant I get an opportunity(usually) to dodge the orb crushing sync kill. The Fiend's blink-grab-slam sync kill, not so much.
I feel like the Hydra from the Outlaw faction should sync kill though, considering its melee grab can kill you possibly, but you'll just bleed out(am thankful for it but it kinda-sorta eliminates it being a threat).
I honestly don't know if the Remnant do anything scary though. Mostly just lasers and the Destroyers being the koolaid man sometimes.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 3, 2017 6:51:04 GMT
the kett in a nutshell
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Post by xaijin on Apr 3, 2017 6:51:14 GMT
Unreasonably?
No.
Three gold Observers can pretty much erase any character they have LOS to.
The general issue is the special kett are both damage dealers and damage sinks, and add the synergy most of the units have with each other, and voila, Collectors Lite.
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Post by mrfuddyduddy on Apr 3, 2017 6:52:18 GMT
They are absolutely 100% more overdone than the other factions, starting with the fact that half the enemies in there faction have shields, one of there faction has an orb that unless destroyed is literally unkillable, and both that guy and Fiends can sync kill you from 20 feet away.
I stopped playing Kett entirely because I got tired of getting sync killed by sh** I was no where near, even once getting Sync killed through a wall by a Fiend who was attacking a teammate.
Hell its one more reason to play Vanguard or any other class that has Barrier, spec into Saving Barrier or whatever the hell its called and laugh as you get sync'ed and just get right back up like nothing happened.
Only annoying part of Remnent is the damned Observers, those f***ers even on Bronze seem to have unholy amounts of shields and health, and melt you instantly. God forbid you get caught out in the open with more than one Observer focusing on you and your dead before you can run like 20 feet to safety. Not to mention the little bastards can't even be melee'd unless there floating an inch off the ground making them a nightmare to fight if your a Vanguard.
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Post by Crimson Vanguard on Apr 3, 2017 6:54:05 GMT
But the Hydra has a choke slam! Doesn't kill you though. My Krogans have survived that multiple times.
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akots
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Post by akots on Apr 3, 2017 7:30:29 GMT
IMO, really, if a game designer does not play his own game, this is what happens. These days, it is very easy to beat a human player in any game, even without active cheating. I'm not even talking about chess or go, just make some silly AI that has perfect targeting in shooters and voila, you have it. The challenge is to create something that is beatable and has enjoyable process to get that sweet victory. Kett in Meda are subjectively not enjoyable for me for a few reasons. They have insane accuracy, are invisible despite being hit, have glitchy sync kill units, stunlock from the other side of the map, and they all look the same. But yes, ME3 geth is like a joke compared to them. So, I completely agree and fail to see the point. There is some enemy that does not feel cheap and is a fun to play even though it is very tough and there is kett in Meda. IMO, it is just a case of copy pasting from single player without testing and tuning. Considering general lack of reasonable guns and abysmal powers, it makes them very difficult to deal with. But surprisingly, in a few gold games I was able to extract, I did not feel the sense of accomplishment. Outlaws and even remnants are fine, well, kett is just poorly designed. But I don't particularly enjoy roller coasters, there are some people who like it. Another IMO, these are not a majority in Meda multipayer, I have not seen many preset kett lobbies. Some are but then the host usually quits after dieing 5-6 times on waves 3-4 and running out of gel.
Collectors in ME3 were also very tough but defeating them was actually very enjoyable.
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Post by kalil on Apr 3, 2017 7:42:51 GMT
I think the big gap is between Outlaws and the two others. Kett is harder than Remnant for sure, but the difference is significantly less pronounced than between Outlaws and Remnant.
Kett Gold and Outlaws Gold cannot both be the intended difficulty on gold since they are worlds apart. I wonder which one Bioware actually intended?
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Post by gaidax on Apr 3, 2017 7:47:24 GMT
More like outlaws are way too easymode really, they have like whole 1 unit which is actually good.
Remnant is so so really, a decent infiltrator or anything with Vanquisher really can kill off observers pretty fast and destroyers are useless when you take out turrets.
Kett, IMO, is where it should be to begin with. Maybe Fiend sync is a bit too troublesome.
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Post by missileglitcher on Apr 3, 2017 7:53:19 GMT
Perhaps not. For now, they're obviously significantly harder than the other factions but that's because a lot of us have terrible weapons (or can't snipe and get regular headshots). Whether this is unreasonable, I'm not sure. They're not impossible. With a good team, they're beatable, but the objectives can be almost impossible depending on map and of course on your team. So far they're fun, I'm sure in the coming weeks and months we'll figure out ways to trivialise them.
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Post by kalil on Apr 3, 2017 7:58:53 GMT
More like outlaws are way too easymode really, they have like whole 1 unit which is actually good. Remnant is so so really, a decent infiltrator or anything with Vanquisher really can kill off observers pretty fast and destroyers are useless when you take out turrets. Kett, IMO, is where it should be to begin with. Maybe Fiend sync is a bit too troublesome. I do tend to agree with this statement actually. The game has only been out for a few days and we are already farming the highest difficulty, but only against one faction (9/10 quick matches in gold is set to Outlaws nowadays). I would have liked the game to offer more variety and challenge. Basically, gold should IMHO take a coordinated team, preferrably team work and decent weapons to accomplish. Now all it takes is four anythings that aren't afk and not using avengers.
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Post by misguidedworm7 on Apr 3, 2017 8:16:18 GMT
The Outlaws lack a good killer unit. Beserkers force you to move, hydra's force you to move, anarchists force you to move, pariahs force you to move, but nothing on their faction actually punishes you for moving.
The kett have the anointed who will shred you in the open while other units push you around, and the remnant have observers. But outlaws just have a lot of stuff to push you around.
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Post by akots on Apr 3, 2017 8:36:52 GMT
I do tend to agree with this statement actually. The game has only been out for a few days and we are already farming the highest difficulty, but only against one faction (9/10 quick matches in gold is set to Outlaws nowadays). I would have liked the game to offer more variety and challenge. Basically, gold should IMHO take a coordinated team, preferrably team work and decent weapons to accomplish. Now all it takes is four anythings that aren't afk and not using avengers. Sorry, but how are the players expected to get "decent" weapons without playing a lot of gold? Considering the inflated size of the manifest and ridiculous dilution with garbage, including characters and consumables that drop there (did not happen in ME3, you can get there cryo ammo IV only after maxing the rare guns), I'm not sure a lot of people will be interested in playing silver to get their rares to intended level X and that magic 15% bonus to their damage so they can finally play gold. It seems that just playing gold from the very beginning will require about 500 hours to max the current manifest without any DLC items. After DLCs, it will probably jump up to 800 hours. Playing silver will probably at least double this time. It is just not practical. Also, there is neither bonus experience nor credits for playing unknown enemy on unknown map. It can turn into a nasty problem for longevity of the game. People will get tired of playing same enemy/map combination and a significant fraction might just quit all together. Might not be of importance for Meda, as it is going to kill itself through crashes and broken servers plus buggy netcode/lag. ME3 multiplayer has its share of glitches, including infamous triple tap rocket troopers and people's elbow but it never descended into this kind of darkness. Of course, people will find ways to deal with it eventually. But before that happens, farming outlaws/remnants is the reasonable way to advance the manifest.
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Post by kalil on Apr 3, 2017 8:40:48 GMT
The Outlaws lack a good killer unit. Beserkers force you to move, hydra's force you to move, anarchists force you to move, pariahs force you to move, but nothing on their faction actually punishes you for moving. The kett have the anointed who will shred you in the open while other units push you around, and the remnant have observers. But outlaws just have a lot of stuff to push you around. I think maybe the sharpshooters could get a decent buff to their scoping time? Cut it in half or somesuch? They are really pathetic.
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Post by cryosferon on Apr 3, 2017 9:06:51 GMT
I know this very subjective. But after playing the MP for two weeks, I have grown a disdain toward the Kett faction. They are ridiculously fast. The Fiend for instance is way too fast for his size. SO is the Anointed - He carries a heavy machine gun and still runs around the map like a Cerberus Dragoon. There is no running away from these guys. And Dont get me started on the Ascendant. That thing can creep up on you and sync kill, and he is deadly at any distance - even cover wont help you. And you have to shoot that tiny orb first. Even fi you do that he gets it back up within a few seconds. On top of it all it is almost impossible to kite them. They are always every where on the map. I cannot remember how many times those guys shred us to pieces on ABC upload objectives. I feel like they are a level up than the other factions. Bronze Kett = Silver Outlaw/Remnant So what do you guys think? everybody knew already that they are ridiculously OP compared to the other factions. but what you wrote is very interesting because it's exactly what I have noticed, too: THE KETT ARE EVERYWHERE maybe this is even the only thing which makes them OP. you cannot kite them - you are constantly on the run, escaping like a chicken and still die eventually. and of course this makes certain objectives impossible. so, they don't need to get nerfed (in a classic sense). they just need to get slowed down a bit and their spawn behavior needs to change
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vanguard4
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Post by vanguard4 on Apr 3, 2017 9:13:09 GMT
The Kett have the only two special units who put any kind of pressure on your team. Hydras just reinforce the static cover game, with Adhis and Berserker not doing enough to flush you out and Remnants are just too slow overall. I can´t think of any unit with Remnants that are any kind of threat. Them floating around is annoying to vanguards and just make them target blimps.
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Post by vanguard4 on Apr 3, 2017 9:14:50 GMT
you cannot kite them - you are constantly on the run, escaping like a chicken and still die eventually. and of course this makes certain objectives impossible. It just makes objective impossible, because people are irrationally afraid to use cobras. They are either too inconvenient to use or something, I don´t know.
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zorinho20
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Post by zorinho20 on Apr 3, 2017 9:17:39 GMT
Obvious solution is to buff other factions to the level of Kett.
So,give Berserkers and Hydra ability to sync-kill(Berserker with a huge hammer). Destroyer needs big movement buff,ability to pierce cover and chain stagger players.
If anyone from Biower reads this, gimme credits upon successful and happy implementation.
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Post by tatsumaki on Apr 3, 2017 9:18:37 GMT
I do tend to agree with this statement actually. The game has only been out for a few days and we are already farming the highest difficulty, but only against one faction (9/10 quick matches in gold is set to Outlaws nowadays). I would have liked the game to offer more variety and challenge. Basically, gold should IMHO take a coordinated team, preferrably team work and decent weapons to accomplish. Now all it takes is four anythings that aren't afk and not using avengers. Sorry, but how are the players expected to get "decent" weapons without playing a lot of gold? Considering the inflated size of the manifest and ridiculous dilution with garbage, including characters and consumables that drop there (did not happen in ME3, you can get there cryo ammo IV only after maxing the rare guns), I'm not sure a lot of people will be interested in playing silver to get their rares to intended level X and that magic 15% bonus to their damage so they can finally play gold. It seems that just playing gold from the very beginning will require about 500 hours to max the current manifest without any DLC items. After DLCs, it will probably jump up to 800 hours. Playing silver will probably at least double this time. It is just not practical. Also, there is neither bonus experience nor credits for playing unknown enemy on unknown map. It can turn into a nasty problem for longevity of the game. People will get tired of playing same enemy/map combination and a significant fraction might just quit all together. Might not be of importance for Meda, as it is going to kill itself through crashes and broken servers plus buggy netcode/lag. ME3 multiplayer has its share of glitches, including infamous triple tap rocket troopers and people's elbow but it never descended into this kind of darkness. Of course, people will find ways to deal with it eventually. But before that happens, farming outlaws/remnants is the reasonable way to advance the manifest. Suffer like me playing on Silver because: 1. The best weapon I have is Raptor III 2. Not from North America nor Europe but a region with smaller player pool hence PuG is always laggy or nobody due to timezone differences. (See 3) 3. Able to survive on gold decently but cannot carry/solo hence without proper group can't reliably say Gold is on farm, as and when if ever I can get RaptorX then maybe reliably can PuG Gold.
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Post by mindfane on Apr 3, 2017 9:19:22 GMT
everybody knew already that they are ridiculously OP compared to the other factions. but what you wrote is very interesting because it's exactly what I have noticed, too: THE KETT ARE EVERYWHERE maybe this is even the only thing which makes them OP. you cannot kite them - you are constantly on the run, escaping like a chicken and still die eventually. and of course this makes certain objectives impossible. so, they don't need to get nerfed (in a classic sense). they just need to get slowed down a bit and their spawn behavior needs to change When a Kett game turns ugly (which usually do around Wave 6), it is impossible to find some breathing room. No matter where I run to, they are already there like they magically teleported. There is hardly an option to retreat back and re-organize. Kett are especially annoying on Fire-base Derelict, because of the lack of versatility. In other maps, we can at least find some higher ground to breath.
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Post by mindfane on Apr 3, 2017 9:25:36 GMT
It just makes objective impossible, because people are irrationally afraid to use cobras. They are either too inconvenient to use or something, I don´t know. I feel that Cobra is not as effective as it was in ME3. Many times they don't kill all the enemies in the area. I have seen it kill only the Ascendant's orb and leave the Ascendant still standing. Then there were times I pressed the button to equip the Cobra but it was not equipped in time. I mostly PuG due to my region not having enough active players, and so I suffer from signifcant lag. So that might be responsible for these issues. The inability to sprint or walk fast with Cobra active is also an issue.
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Post by kpeter on Apr 3, 2017 9:54:35 GMT
I think the difficulty of the kett is simply right. We play this game only for less then 2 weeks and extract on gold most of the time with our jack shit manifest. ME3 gold with all those phantoms,dragons, banshees scions abombs are harder i think. An Ascendent is a joke compared to a banshee, and even a gold Scion could be a pain in the ass. Not saying kett gold is easy, but not hard either. It will be just easier once we level up everything and will have higher levels of boosters and weapons.
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Post by cryosferon on Apr 3, 2017 10:04:45 GMT
you cannot kite them - you are constantly on the run, escaping like a chicken and still die eventually. and of course this makes certain objectives impossible. It just makes objective impossible, because people are irrationally afraid to use cobras. They are either too inconvenient to use or something, I don´t know. sorry but I think you are wrong. I use it frequently but that's not what can save a gold upload against the KETT. 1) cobra does pitiful damage. last time I used it I could not even kill an anointed!! 2) it is for emergencies but yet taking it out exposes you even more. I died countless times trying to get that fucking cobra out. 3) and then it disappears again if you do anything other than walking slowly!! 4) as op said, it takes the KETT 5 seconds to have you swarmed again
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