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Post by colfoley on Apr 13, 2017 5:25:37 GMT
So first off a disclaimer. I really liked the Witcher 3. It is oe of my favorite games of all time and it might wind up being the better of the two games between it and Andromeda. This is not in the spirit of trying to pick a fight between the two communities. Rather, acknowledging that BioWare stuck to their guns.
So that being said...
Thank you BioWare. It would have been so easy, so very very very easy, to ape Witcher 3. To just make Mass Effect Andromeda a carbon copy of it, a dark, depressing, universe where the player character gets almost nothing right and can't really stand on their own two feet and one of the choices you make truly matter at the end. A dark game, sure, a mature game, sure, but a game which does not pause to examine or consider any of the issues it brings up with any depth. But given the commercial and critical success of the Witcher it would have been easy to just copy it. Or have EA copy it.
Yet Andromeda is very much its own thing. With its own tone. Not too dark, not too light, like Inquisition before it, it has moments of both which provides depth and context. Its a game which borrowed from the success of the Witcher, namely in how BioWare approached the side quests, took that element, put a BioWare stamp on it, and even managed to improve on it in some areas. This is especially noteworthy because you still see a lot of posters on this board complaining that the game is nothing but a collection of fetch quests. Well, I cannot speak to that. But I can speak to feeling overwhelmed at the quality quests and content in the game. A feeling I have never gotten in a game. I have bee overwhelmed by the amount of sheer quests and things to do in a game, Skyrim, until the point it became boring and I turned it off, but I have never been overwhelmed by the feeling there is so much quality content to do in any game that it is almost paralyzing. Especially after missions like Sleeping Dragons and Contagion and the Firefighters. The Loyalty Missions. Ryder Family Secrets. And many others, it encourages me to play the others because....I do not know when the next great moment is.
Anyways, this game has been getting a lot of flack recently, and some of it is well earned. But I can appreciate that they did not give into the industry hype of the day.
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Post by Revan Reborn on Apr 13, 2017 5:36:25 GMT
Truth be told, I'm not even sure how BioWare could have done a copy/paste of The Witcher 3. Mass Effect is an entirely different kind of experience, focused on the rise of humanity and its journey through the stars. The Witcher is about Geralt and his friends, as well as the cruel, harsh world that they live in. They are very different kinds of experiences, even if there is some overlap in terms of game design philosophy.
BioWare has always put its own spin on concepts and I didn't expect MEA would be any different. It's not a perfect game, but I do believe that BioWare does improve and perfect their game design with every new installment. I'm looking forward to the DLC, the new IP, the inevitable DA4, and of course MEA2.
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Post by unwanted on Apr 13, 2017 5:37:45 GMT
Yeah! And it would have been sooo easy to just ape No man's sky.
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Post by KaiserShep on Apr 13, 2017 5:38:33 GMT
Yeah! And it would have been sooo easy to just ape No man's sky. Well, good thing they didn't then!
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Post by colfoley on Apr 13, 2017 5:38:48 GMT
Truth be told, I'm not even sure how BioWare could have done a copy/paste of The Witcher 3. Mass Effect is an entirely different kind of experience, focused on the rise of humanity and its journey through the stars. The Witcher is about Geralt and his friends, as well as the cruel, harsh world that they live in. They are very different kinds of experiences, even if there is some overlap in terms of game design philosophy. BioWare has always put its own spin on concepts and I didn't expect MEA would be any different. It's not a perfect game, but I do believe that BioWare does improve and perfect their game design with every new installment. I'm looking forward to the DLC, the new IP, the inevitable DA4, and of course MEA2. Exactly,. I don't think they would have been very successful in making a Witcher clone neccessarily, just that I think it would have been oh so tempting of them to pretty much try and do exactly that. But yet Andromeda...despite how much the side quests are a general improvement over the ones in Inquisition and how much those sometimes mirror the Witcher 3s...is very much its own thing.
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Post by colfoley on Apr 13, 2017 5:43:29 GMT
I also should note another thing that I really appreciate about the game is how it pretty much clearly identifies, by and large, what the 'fetch quests' are. The 'Tasks'. I have been pretty much avoiding them like the plague because I know...while Fetch quests aren't neccessarily 'bad'...they aren't always my cup of tea. And yet I have still managed to put over 40 hours into the game, have the last two quests to finish, and I am still not even close to being ready to start either one of them.
In Witcher 3 the Fetch Quests were kind of out in the open in a russian roulette, lucky if you get good ones, damned if you get bad ones, god forsaken question marks. If I ever do another run through the Witcher I just might ignore the question marks in the base game, some of them were good and fun, like the bandit camps and abandoned sites, but yet some of them were just so mind numbingly tedious. Yet Andromeda, clearly marks, 'here there be fetch quests'.
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Post by Revan Reborn on Apr 13, 2017 5:45:32 GMT
Truth be told, I'm not even sure how BioWare could have done a copy/paste of The Witcher 3. Mass Effect is an entirely different kind of experience, focused on the rise of humanity and its journey through the stars. The Witcher is about Geralt and his friends, as well as the cruel, harsh world that they live in. They are very different kinds of experiences, even if there is some overlap in terms of game design philosophy. BioWare has always put its own spin on concepts and I didn't expect MEA would be any different. It's not a perfect game, but I do believe that BioWare does improve and perfect their game design with every new installment. I'm looking forward to the DLC, the new IP, the inevitable DA4, and of course MEA2. Exactly,. I don't think they would have been very successful in making a Witcher clone neccessarily, just that I think it would have been oh so tempting of them to pretty much try and do exactly that. But yet Andromeda...despite how much the side quests are a general improvement over the ones in Inquisition and how much those sometimes mirror the Witcher 3s...is very much its own thing. I think part of the benefit of having BioWare Montreal make the game is many of them had never worked on a Mass Effect game before. They were fans first and developers second, so they were able to provide a very clear picture of what Mass Effect meant to them from a fan's perspective. Trying to copy/paste another game's design is never a good approach for development. You can borrow similar philosophies, but ultimately you have to put your own spin on things to truly be successful. It's why The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild is universally praised. Open world RPGs are nothing new to the industry. However, Nintendo put a unique spin on the genre with Zelda in a way only Nintendo could. That game is unlike any other open world game I've played, and that's truly how you successfully design an experience. Take something that people like, but build it in a way that's refreshing and exciting. BioWare wasn't as successful in that regard, but MEA is still very much a fun Mass Effect experience.
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Post by friffy on Apr 13, 2017 5:46:16 GMT
Agreed. And also from me a big THANK YOU Bioware not to do a Sci Fi Witcher. So refreshing.
BTW and forgive my curiousity - since I read that so oftern, why is Witcher considered a mature game?
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Post by colfoley on Apr 13, 2017 5:51:12 GMT
Agreed. And also from me a big THANK YOU Bioware not to do a Sci Fi Witcher. So refreshing. BTW and forgive my curiousity - since I read that so oftern, why is Witcher considered a mature game? I don't know honestly sometimes. Its something I plan on covering more in depth later...but being grim dark and moody, by itself, does not a mature game make.
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Post by Revan Reborn on Apr 13, 2017 6:04:15 GMT
Agreed. And also from me a big THANK YOU Bioware not to do a Sci Fi Witcher. So refreshing. BTW and forgive my curiousity - since I read that so oftern, why is Witcher considered a mature game? The Witcher series has always been known to grapple with very dark and unpleasant social issues most games would never touch. Ranging from rape, to racism, to drug and alcohol abuse, it tackles the ugliness that is the human experience and gives the players control over how they overcome these challenges. No one in The Witcher franchise is truly innocent or evil. There are shades of grey to everyone, and it's up to you to determine how you will ultimately judge them as you move forward. CDPR has largely been successful in dealing with these very sensitive issues in a respectful and appropriate manner. I also give them a lot of credit for having the courage to address these issues in gaming, rather than focus purely on entertainment and what sells.
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Post by VanSinn on Apr 13, 2017 6:27:38 GMT
After 75 hours and 90% completion, I'd have to say that I fully agree with the OP on this one.
There are definitely some issues in how ME:A handled some aspects, but it's more they "bobbled the catch" rather than "dropped the ball," if you'll forgive my American Football analogy.
However, I have really yet to come across even a Task I haven't enjoyed on some level. Some of them are fetch quests, kinda, but more fleshed out than pure "go here, kill them, get this, bring back" fetch quests that are the tedium of the "side" content of many games. There has always been some story, whether self contained that affects nothing except world building, or even more integrated into other quests. Granted, I haven't done many of the "hitting rocks for science" or "scan these bodies" or the various "find X at 3 locations on the map to unlock another waypoint..." missions, but I plan on being quite a bit more diligent on my second playthrough.
Every task I've done has been at least decent, with most in the "good to pretty darned good" range, and I'm hoping the ones I didn't do the first time around give me even more good moments. I've had a blast, and while this game definitely has its issues, there are WAAAAAAAY more good things going on that the criticisms I could hand out, while deserved, hardly detract from my enjoyment of the experience as a whole.
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Post by Marduk on Apr 13, 2017 6:35:51 GMT
Witcher developers are a fan of Bioware and specially Mass Effect. Bioware even lend an engine to CDPR for Witcher 1. they are different games however. one is about the journey of a monster slayer, the other is to a party based game about your bonds which is why when it comes to character development Bioware has the advantage.
From a technical point of view however it is hard to copy what Witcher 3 had. it didn't offer anything new but CDPR polished what we had before to a great extent. for example as tech junkies they managed to make the best conversation system in the industry so far so even fodders easily show meaningful facial emotions during a regular conversation. it is just one example though. try jumping in water in Andromeda and do the same in Witcher 3. in former you get a "you are leaving the mission area" instead of at least getting a proper animation for getting out of the water (i am not asking for the ability to swim in Andromeda). CDPR gone all out with Witcher 3.
Also Witcher 3 did separate fetch quests from regular ones if i recall. they even separated expansion quests from the vanilla ones. even the fetch quests in Witcher 3 are detailed though. the build up till you reach each different creature (and there are many) with their own weaknesses is well done but can get repetitive of course. also Witcher 3 feels more mature cause they tackle darker matters more head on even though it may not be that deep.
With all my praises for Witcher 3 one might believe i think it is the best game ever, yet i don't think so despite loving it since i really care about character development. Geralt spent three games to reach the end of his story as a follow up to the books and if you ask about his journey from the trilogy, most are gonna talk about the Baron while not even remembering who for example Vesemir is. if there is a mod that switches Keira's skin,voice and name with Triss, most are probably not gonna even realize the difference cause as characters they are not presented uniquely enough in the game and don't have enough development despite Triss being in all 3 Witcher games. of course this is just my opinion. Ciri and Yennefer finally having their big debut in the trilogy was a great thing honestly cause they are at least more unique.
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Post by kino on Apr 13, 2017 6:41:43 GMT
...but it's more they "bobbled the catch" rather than "dropped the ball," if you'll forgive my American Football analogy. That's actually a brilliant analogy about the game. Well put.
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Post by PillarBiter on Apr 13, 2017 8:47:55 GMT
I liked how they mixed the ME1 atmosphere and sense of 'discovery' with a new generation of game design. I hope they continue with the light tone. We've had enough of these 'dark days are coming' sillyness in the OT.
Definitely A+ for effort and creativity overall. Just sad that it wasn't worked out to perfection.
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Post by ArabianIGoggles on Apr 13, 2017 9:00:26 GMT
I liked how they mixed the ME1 atmosphere and sense of 'discovery' with a new generation of game design. I hope they continue with the light tone. We've had enough of these 'dark days are coming' sillyness in the OT. Definitely A+ for effort and creativity overall. Just sad that it wasn't worked out to perfection. Not me. Andromeda was too much Citadel DLC. I don't like being some sort of Bob Saget like comedian.
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Post by parnashwind on Apr 13, 2017 9:31:38 GMT
Actually Bioware said they are going to "copy" how the Witcher 3 does its side quests. They never said they were going to copy Witcher 3 entirely. Although I wish they would "copy" the business practices of CDPR more; like proper full size expansion dlc rather than some 2 hours long DLC but that remains to be seen. There are a lot of complains about the side quests in ME:A; fetch quests, busy work, etc. To some extend that is true but it is a huge improvement over DA2, DA:I and ME2~3. Unfortunately, some of these quest are seriously poorly written and executed. For example, the First Murder quest. Nice twist but poor conclusion - who the hell wrote that? A lot of quest gives players ambient information about the lives of the colonist, some in the form of datapads and some you can read about in the terminals. In this regard, it is very similar to how Witcher 3 uses small side quests to give player insights into the lives of the common folks, to create atmosphere. Kadara Port for example tries to show how hard life is for the exiles, how innocent folks are caught in the cross fire, the ugly things that people will do when survival is at stake. How well these quest are being presented is another topic but in general, these busy work/fetch quest has context. Context that fits the setting of the story. Where Bioware fell on their faces this time is that these quest did not show impact, did not have impact. So I choose A over B ... and nothing is different. So I did this instead of that... nothing is different. No matter what I choose, the outcome is always the same, somehow things will always work itself out. There is a difference between a lighter tone and simply being juvenile. Some of the writings and presentation in ME:A are simply juvenile.
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Post by Marduk on Apr 13, 2017 9:54:01 GMT
Actually Bioware said they are going to "copy" how the Witcher 3 does its side quests. They never said they were going to copy Witcher 3 entirely. Although I wish they would "copy" the business practices of CDPR more; like proper full size expansion dlc rather than some 2 hours long DLC but that remains to be seen. There are a lot of complains about the side quests in ME:A; fetch quests, busy work, etc. To some extend that is true but it is a huge improvement over DA2, DA:I and ME2~3. Unfortunately, some of these quest are seriously poorly written and executed. For example, the First Murder quest. Nice twist but poor conclusion - who the hell wrote that? A lot of quest gives players ambient information about the lives of the colonist, some in the form of datapads and some you can read about in the terminals. In this regard, it is very similar to how Witcher 3 uses small side quests to give player insights into the lives of the common folks, to create atmosphere. Kadara Port for example tries to show how hard life is for the exiles, how innocent folks are caught in the cross fire, the ugly things that people will do when survival is at stake. How well these quest are being presented is another topic but in general, these busy work/fetch quest has context. Context that fits the setting of the story. Where Bioware fell on their faces this time is that these quest did not show impact, did not have impact. So I choose A over B ... and nothing is different. So I did this instead of that... nothing is different. No matter what I choose, the outcome is always the same, somehow things will always work itself out. There is a difference between a lighter tone and simply being juvenile. Some of the writings and presentation in ME:A are simply juvenile. Prior to EA they had the right business model. with EA though...and with their improvements regarding side quests it didn't work that well cause regardless they weren't trying to copy, but rather it was just a quick response to the backlash or Witcher 3's success or both, just like the forced semi open world since DAI after the success of Skyrim. as for the impact of our decision, it really felt like a Telltale game more than ever which is not a compliment even though i like some of their works xD. there are certain choices that ultimately do affect the game but very few. Since Witcher and Mass Effect are ultimately different there was no need to worry regarding one turning into another but it is not like companies can't get inspired by one another when it comes to certain aspects and CDPR do it seamlessly, like Witcher 3 actually has it's own version of "loyalty quests" where by helping important NPCs they help you back.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 13, 2017 12:29:28 GMT
I have not played That Polish Game, and I certainly would like to thank BioWare for daring to release a sci-fi and lighthearted game instead of another Modern Dark Ages spin-off. And for being the only company that still lets the player to customize the protagonist and getting flack for it when all the other games do not, and don't even make their games for PC, and get their games praised with 90+ critic scores.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 13, 2017 12:35:55 GMT
Thank you OP for making a thread that actually appreciates the game. No doubt the haters will turn up, along with the constructive criticism of course, but until then it was nice to read the thoughts of someone else who's enjoying the world.
I hate open world games and was mad when they announced it for Andromeda, yet it's ended up being the most enjoyable and satisfying open world experience I've had.
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Post by cheeseandonion on Apr 13, 2017 12:42:21 GMT
And now I really want a Space Witcher. Thanks OP.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 13, 2017 13:04:39 GMT
Also, I wanted to add, that I foresee Andromeda to share the fate of DA2 and ME3. Initially, there will be the whole lot of outrage and vows to never play a Bio game again, and how the developpers betrayed their loyal fan base to do a totally wrong game that is not exactly the same, and it is terrible and awful, then five years down the road, some ardents who'd never replayed the game, and seared the seal of hatred right onto their hearts, will still claim it's the worst, while the rest of us, particularly the latecomers will be like: Huh? I think it's great. Actually, I kinda like it the most... heh.
I always liked ME3 ending, for example, but I know they are rather tragic on the surface of it, and lamented how all DA games ended so unhappily for my three protagonists... but despite finally, finally getting a cool epic happy ending in Andromeda, with my LI not dumping my PC and her being alive and a hero, and me loving it all, I've still missed that moment of trying to pick my tri-coloured path and all the tragic angst. Ah-hah.
Thanks for the happy end too, btw. We do need variety!
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Post by VanSinn on Apr 13, 2017 13:36:21 GMT
Actually Bioware said they are going to "copy" how the Witcher 3 does its side quests. They never said they were going to copy Witcher 3 entirely. Although I wish they would "copy" the business practices of CDPR more; like proper full size expansion dlc rather than some 2 hours long DLC but that remains to be seen. There are a lot of complains about the side quests in ME:A; fetch quests, busy work, etc. To some extend that is true but it is a huge improvement over DA2, DA:I and ME2~3. Unfortunately, some of these quest are seriously poorly written and executed. For example, the First Murder quest. Nice twist but poor conclusion - who the hell wrote that? A lot of quest gives players ambient information about the lives of the colonist, some in the form of datapads and some you can read about in the terminals. In this regard, it is very similar to how Witcher 3 uses small side quests to give player insights into the lives of the common folks, to create atmosphere. Kadara Port for example tries to show how hard life is for the exiles, how innocent folks are caught in the cross fire, the ugly things that people will do when survival is at stake. How well these quest are being presented is another topic but in general, these busy work/fetch quest has context. Context that fits the setting of the story. Where Bioware fell on their faces this time is that these quest did not show impact, did not have impact. So I choose A over B ... and nothing is different. So I did this instead of that... nothing is different. No matter what I choose, the outcome is always the same, somehow things will always work itself out. There is a difference between a lighter tone and simply being juvenile. Some of the writings and presentation in ME:A are simply juvenile. In my opinion, the "decisions mean nothing" complaint rings a bit hollow. Let me explain. ME:A, to me, is VERY MUCH a "journey over destination" type of game. The "major decisions" of the original trilogy did lead to differences, but those difference didn't really matter in the long run. And in many ways, trying to herd all of the divergent paths into a manageable direction could lead to some coding nightmares if they DID make huge differences in the game. Which is why if we let the council die in ME1, we still wind up with the same council, just different names. I think even the same VA's, so it was a cosmetic difference at best. The only decision that truly affected your playthrough of the trilogy was the Virmire Survivor, and that didn't affect the whole story itself, just which squadmember was with us during that story. We don't know yet if any of the smaller decision will have any impact in future sequels (Sloane vs Charlatan on Kadara, for example) but even if they don't, they serve to define how you handled each situation. Contagion quest: Did you save the woman and let the angaran go? Or did you let her die (since she was dying anyway) to prevent the Roekkar from gaining a potentially devastating bioweapon? Neither outcome made any real difference within the game itself, but they do have different outcomes. And even if the outcomes aren't fully fleshed out in sequels, I still maintain that in ME:A, the journey is more important than the destination. How you choose in that moment is more important than the results of the decision. I really liked that Bioware gave us MANY of these decision points that helped us to define our Ryder a little more. Pragmatic or altruistic? You don't see it as much in the conversation options for much of the game, one of the weaker points of ME:A to be honest (although I didn't find most of the conversations bad, per se, but improvements are always welcome) but you saw that dichotomy in many of the choices we're presented with. I thought it was a fairly fluid, fitting way to bring that kind of thing into the game. Implementation could definitely improve, no arguments here, but I think some people (not necessarily you) take this point and blow it too far out of proportion. As far as juvenile writing goes, I will admit some of the dialogue was a bit cringey, but overall I would put the writing on par with the original trilogy. I wonder why this idea of bad writing and childish/juvenile/teen fanfic levels of writing came from. I honestly would like specific examples of this, so I can see where people are coming from.
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myalzalean
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Don't tell my wife I'm here
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by myalzalean on Apr 13, 2017 13:56:05 GMT
I liked how they mixed the ME1 atmosphere and sense of 'discovery' with a new generation of game design. I hope they continue with the light tone. We've had enough of these 'dark days are coming' sillyness in the OT. Definitely A+ for effort and creativity overall. Just sad that it wasn't worked out to perfection. Not me. Andromeda was too much Citadel DLC. I don't like being some sort of Bob Saget like comedian. I'm not sure I can agree with this. Unlike Bon Saget, MEA made me laugh every once in awhile.
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Post by Serza on Apr 13, 2017 14:18:31 GMT
I also should note another thing that I really appreciate about the game is how it pretty much clearly identifies, by and large, what the 'fetch quests' are. The 'Tasks'. I have been pretty much avoiding them like the plague because I know...while Fetch quests aren't neccessarily 'bad'...they aren't always my cup of tea. And yet I have still managed to put over 40 hours into the game, have the last two quests to finish, and I am still not even close to being ready to start either one of them. In Witcher 3 the Fetch Quests were kind of out in the open in a russian roulette, lucky if you get good ones, damned if you get bad ones, god forsaken question marks. If I ever do another run through the Witcher I just might ignore the question marks in the base game, some of them were good and fun, like the bandit camps and abandoned sites, but yet some of them were just so mind numbingly tedious. Yet Andromeda, clearly marks, 'here there be fetch quests'. Wait, are you telling me you actually did all those question marks? Because they were the true stupid MMO fetchquests, and Inquisition actually did better by not having those in. *spit* but yeah, Witcher has no faults whatsoever, folks. Nope, not a single one.
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Post by parnashwind on Apr 13, 2017 14:34:04 GMT
Actually Bioware said they are going to "copy" how the Witcher 3 does its side quests. They never said they were going to copy Witcher 3 entirely. Although I wish they would "copy" the business practices of CDPR more; like proper full size expansion dlc rather than some 2 hours long DLC but that remains to be seen. There are a lot of complains about the side quests in ME:A; fetch quests, busy work, etc. To some extend that is true but it is a huge improvement over DA2, DA:I and ME2~3. Unfortunately, some of these quest are seriously poorly written and executed. For example, the First Murder quest. Nice twist but poor conclusion - who the hell wrote that? A lot of quest gives players ambient information about the lives of the colonist, some in the form of datapads and some you can read about in the terminals. In this regard, it is very similar to how Witcher 3 uses small side quests to give player insights into the lives of the common folks, to create atmosphere. Kadara Port for example tries to show how hard life is for the exiles, how innocent folks are caught in the cross fire, the ugly things that people will do when survival is at stake. How well these quest are being presented is another topic but in general, these busy work/fetch quest has context. Context that fits the setting of the story. Where Bioware fell on their faces this time is that these quest did not show impact, did not have impact. So I choose A over B ... and nothing is different. So I did this instead of that... nothing is different. No matter what I choose, the outcome is always the same, somehow things will always work itself out. There is a difference between a lighter tone and simply being juvenile. Some of the writings and presentation in ME:A are simply juvenile. In my opinion, the "decisions mean nothing" complaint rings a bit hollow. Let me explain. ME:A, to me, is VERY MUCH a "journey over destination" type of game. The "major decisions" of the original trilogy did lead to differences, but those difference didn't really matter in the long run. And in many ways, trying to herd all of the divergent paths into a manageable direction could lead to some coding nightmares if they DID make huge differences in the game. Which is why if we let the council die in ME1, we still wind up with the same council, just different names. I think even the same VA's, so it was a cosmetic difference at best. The only decision that truly affected your playthrough of the trilogy was the Virmire Survivor, and that didn't affect the whole story itself, just which squadmember was with us during that story. We don't know yet if any of the smaller decision will have any impact in future sequels (Sloane vs Charlatan on Kadara, for example) but even if they don't, they serve to define how you handled each situation. Contagion quest: Did you save the woman and let the angaran go? Or did you let her die (since she was dying anyway) to prevent the Roekkar from gaining a potentially devastating bioweapon? Neither outcome made any real difference within the game itself, but they do have different outcomes. And even if the outcomes aren't fully fleshed out in sequels, I still maintain that in ME:A, the journey is more important than the destination. How you choose in that moment is more important than the results of the decision. I really liked that Bioware gave us MANY of these decision points that helped us to define our Ryder a little more. Pragmatic or altruistic? You don't see it as much in the conversation options for much of the game, one of the weaker points of ME:A to be honest (although I didn't find most of the conversations bad, per se, but improvements are always welcome) but you saw that dichotomy in many of the choices we're presented with. I thought it was a fairly fluid, fitting way to bring that kind of thing into the game. Implementation could definitely improve, no arguments here, but I think some people (not necessarily you) take this point and blow it too far out of proportion. As far as juvenile writing goes, I will admit some of the dialogue was a bit cringey, but overall I would put the writing on par with the original trilogy. I wonder why this idea of bad writing and childish/juvenile/teen fanfic levels of writing came from. I honestly would like specific examples of this, so I can see where people are coming from. Firstly, I am comparing "decision impact" against Witcher 3 because I was talking about how Bioware incorporated Witcher 3 like " side quest" into ME:A. Immediate impact is important and there is no planned future squeal planned as of now. Kadara for instance, I am expecting to see immediate impact of the decision. If the Charlatan took over, how are the lives of people living in the port affected during the siege? How are the people doing under the new leadership? What changes was made? etc etc. These are the immediate impact that needs to be addressed. You are hoping for something to happen in future squeals (which BW already said they have no idea about yet) but the fact is, Bioware didnt follow up with a decision/change that would have direct impact on the lives of many and simply brush it aside and pretend that everything is the same. It is both unrealistic and juvenile. Oh a coup and life goes on just like that? I simply dont buy that. Remember Dragon age Origins? Your decision has an immediate impact on the lives of the people of Redcliff. Just.. ambient information. This is however to me a very important part of proper story telling in a narrative RPG.
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