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Post by leo3abp on Apr 13, 2017 14:42:00 GMT
So first off a disclaimer. I really liked the Witcher 3. It is oe of my favorite games of all time and it might wind up being the better of the two games between it and Andromeda. This is not in the spirit of trying to pick a fight between the two communities. Rather, acknowledging that BioWare stuck to their guns. So that being said... Thank you BioWare. It would have been so easy, so very very very easy, to ape Witcher 3. To just make Mass Effect Andromeda a carbon copy of it, a dark, depressing, universe where the player character gets almost nothing right and can't really stand on their own two feet and one of the choices you make truly matter at the end. A dark game, sure, a mature game, sure, but a game which does not pause to examine or consider any of the issues it brings up with any depth. But given the commercial and critical success of the Witcher it would have been easy to just copy it. Or have EA copy it. Yet Andromeda is very much its own thing. With its own tone. Not too dark, not too light, like Inquisition before it, it has moments of both which provides depth and context. Its a game which borrowed from the success of the Witcher, namely in how BioWare approached the side quests, took that element, put a BioWare stamp on it, and even managed to improve on it in some areas. This is especially noteworthy because you still see a lot of posters on this board complaining that the game is nothing but a collection of fetch quests. Well, I cannot speak to that. But I can speak to feeling overwhelmed at the quality quests and content in the game. A feeling I have never gotten in a game. I have bee overwhelmed by the amount of sheer quests and things to do in a game, Skyrim, until the point it became boring and I turned it off, but I have never been overwhelmed by the feeling there is so much quality content to do in any game that it is almost paralyzing. Especially after missions like Sleeping Dragons and Contagion and the Firefighters. The Loyalty Missions. Ryder Family Secrets. And many others, it encourages me to play the others because....I do not know when the next great moment is. Anyways, this game has been getting a lot of flack recently, and some of it is well earned. But I can appreciate that they did not give into the industry hype of the day. So apparently you just happy that Andromeda ended up being much worse game and thats ok as long as its not a copy of the Witcher 3? I think many people could disagree...
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Post by VanSinn on Apr 13, 2017 14:45:53 GMT
Firstly, I am comparing "decision impact" against Witcher 3 because I was talking about how Bioware incorporated Witcher 3 like " side quest" into ME:A. Immediate impact is important and there is no planned future squeal planned as of now. Kadara for instance, I am expecting to see immediate impact of the decision. If the Charlatan took over, how are the lives of people living in the port affected during the siege? How are the people doing under the new leadership? What changes was made? etc etc. These are the immediate impact that needs to be addressed. You are hoping for something to happen in future squeals (which BW already said they have no idea about yet) but the fact is, Bioware didnt follow up with a decision/change that would have direct impact on the lives of many and simply brush it aside and pretend that everything is the same. It is both unrealistic and juvenile. Oh a coup and life goes on just like that? I simply dont buy that. Remember Dragon age Origins? Your decision has an immediate impact on the lives of the people of Redcliff. Just.. ambient information. This is however to me a very important part of proper story telling in a narrative RPG. Firstly, I'm "hoping" for nothing. I quite like the fact that the decisions we make don't necessarily play out immediately. Lots of them wouldn't have huge differences in the short term, and would only be evident in long term implications. Let me quote you once more here: "(...) Bioware didnt follow up with a decision/change that would have direct impact on the lives of many and simply brush it aside and pretend that everything is the same." YOU are the one assigning such motivations/feelings to the decisions we make, not Bioware. Calling it juvenile that you don't have an immediate reaction to the contagion quest, or Charlatan being in charge (would the everyday lives of people drastically change? Not likely, in my opinion, at least not overnight) is, in my opinion, asinine and borderline "negative nancy" thinking. I said at the start of my post that ME:A is a "journey over destination" game, and many of the decisions we make during the journey could have quite drastic differences...in the long term. Short term? Not so much. Which is why I mentioned a sequel. No, I'm not "hoping" the decisions make a difference in the sequel. I'm saying that they could only REALLY have an impact if a sequel were to take place. You may dislike these kinds of decisions, but they're perfectly valid story telling devices if you look at it from the "journey/destination" perspective. But calling them childish and juvenile because "I didn't like them" is...well, I know full well how text can make things seem more aggressive than intended so I won't finish that phrase, since I'm really not trying to be confrontational.
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Post by parnashwind on Apr 13, 2017 15:00:25 GMT
Firstly, I am comparing "decision impact" against Witcher 3 because I was talking about how Bioware incorporated Witcher 3 like " side quest" into ME:A. Immediate impact is important and there is no planned future squeal planned as of now. Kadara for instance, I am expecting to see immediate impact of the decision. If the Charlatan took over, how are the lives of people living in the port affected during the siege? How are the people doing under the new leadership? What changes was made? etc etc. These are the immediate impact that needs to be addressed. You are hoping for something to happen in future squeals (which BW already said they have no idea about yet) but the fact is, Bioware didnt follow up with a decision/change that would have direct impact on the lives of many and simply brush it aside and pretend that everything is the same. It is both unrealistic and juvenile. Oh a coup and life goes on just like that? I simply dont buy that. Remember Dragon age Origins? Your decision has an immediate impact on the lives of the people of Redcliff. Just.. ambient information. This is however to me a very important part of proper story telling in a narrative RPG. Firstly, I'm "hoping" for nothing. I quite like the fact that the decisions we make don't necessarily play out immediately. Lots of them wouldn't have huge differences in the short term, and would only be evident in long term implications. Let me quote you once more here: "(...) Bioware didnt follow up with a decision/change that would have direct impact on the lives of many and simply brush it aside and pretend that everything is the same." YOU are the one assigning such motivations/feelings to the decisions we make, not Bioware. Calling it juvenile that you don't have an immediate reaction to the contagion quest, or Charlatan being in charge (would the everyday lives of people drastically change? Not likely, in my opinion, at least not overnight) is, in my opinion, asinine and borderline "negative nancy" thinking. I said at the start of my post that ME:A is a "journey over destination" game, and many of the decisions we make during the journey could have quite drastic differences...in the long term. Short term? Not so much. Which is why I mentioned a sequel. No, I'm not "hoping" the decisions make a difference in the sequel. I'm saying that they could only REALLY have an impact if a sequel were to take place. You may dislike these kinds of decisions, but they're perfectly valid story telling devices if you look at it from the "journey/destination" perspective. But calling them childish and juvenile because "I didn't like them" is...well, I know full well how text can make things seem more aggressive than intended so I won't finish that phrase, since I'm really not trying to be confrontational. I am "expecting" something to happen especially in how people will react to these events - people to gossip about things. I am not expecting some huge long term change or anything you are probably thinking. There are both LONG and SHORT term impact when a coup take place - to say otherwise is simply ^%$#@! It could have an impact if a sequel were to take place. If that is at best a possibility and any such expectation is "hope". I dont care what my decisions will bring in the future or any such possibilities but address the present, the immediate. Who the hell is talking about possible future impact here? I dont care about future possibilities. And finally, if you cannot comprehend how I am comparing Bioware's statement of "Making Witcher 3 like side quest" to the side quests in ME:A then there is little else to say. TW3 does not do these childish juvenile quest - and that is an objective fact.
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Origin: VanSinn77
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Post by VanSinn on Apr 13, 2017 15:12:45 GMT
Firstly, I'm "hoping" for nothing. I quite like the fact that the decisions we make don't necessarily play out immediately. Lots of them wouldn't have huge differences in the short term, and would only be evident in long term implications. Let me quote you once more here: "(...) Bioware didnt follow up with a decision/change that would have direct impact on the lives of many and simply brush it aside and pretend that everything is the same." YOU are the one assigning such motivations/feelings to the decisions we make, not Bioware. Calling it juvenile that you don't have an immediate reaction to the contagion quest, or Charlatan being in charge (would the everyday lives of people drastically change? Not likely, in my opinion, at least not overnight) is, in my opinion, asinine and borderline "negative nancy" thinking. I said at the start of my post that ME:A is a "journey over destination" game, and many of the decisions we make during the journey could have quite drastic differences...in the long term. Short term? Not so much. Which is why I mentioned a sequel. No, I'm not "hoping" the decisions make a difference in the sequel. I'm saying that they could only REALLY have an impact if a sequel were to take place. You may dislike these kinds of decisions, but they're perfectly valid story telling devices if you look at it from the "journey/destination" perspective. But calling them childish and juvenile because "I didn't like them" is...well, I know full well how text can make things seem more aggressive than intended so I won't finish that phrase, since I'm really not trying to be confrontational. I am "expecting" something to happen especially in how people will react to these events - people to gossip about things. I am not expecting some huge long term change or anything you are probably thinking. There are both LONG and SHORT term impact when a coup take place - to say otherwise is simply ^%$#@! It could have an impact if a sequel were to take place. If that is at best a possibility and any such expectation is "hope". I dont care what my decisions will bring in the future or any such possibilities but address the present, the immediate. Who the hell is talking about possible future impact here? I dont care about future possibilities. And finally, if you cannot comprehend how I am comparing Bioware's statement of "Making Witcher 3 like side quest" to the side quests in ME:A then there is little else to say. TW3 does not do these childish juvenile quest - and that is an objective fact. Ah. I see. Another "The Witcher 3 was the best game ever and anything different is bad and wrong." Childish and juvenile thinking, in my opinion. I think I've engaged enough with you, so good day.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 13, 2017 15:16:48 GMT
Actually Bioware said they are going to "copy" how the Witcher 3 does its side quests. They never said they were going to copy Witcher 3 entirely. Although I wish they would "copy" the business practices of CDPR more; like proper full size expansion dlc rather than some 2 hours long DLC but that remains to be seen. There are a lot of complains about the side quests in ME:A; fetch quests, busy work, etc. To some extend that is true but it is a huge improvement over DA2, DA:I and ME2~3. Unfortunately, some of these quest are seriously poorly written and executed. For example, the First Murder quest. Nice twist but poor conclusion - who the hell wrote that? :pinched: A lot of quest gives players ambient information about the lives of the colonist, some in the form of datapads and some you can read about in the terminals. In this regard, it is very similar to how Witcher 3 uses small side quests to give player insights into the lives of the common folks, to create atmosphere. Kadara Port for example tries to show how hard life is for the exiles, how innocent folks are caught in the cross fire, the ugly things that people will do when survival is at stake. How well these quest are being presented is another topic but in general, these busy work/fetch quest has context. Context that fits the setting of the story. Where Bioware fell on their faces this time is that these quest did not show impact, did not have impact. So I choose A over B ... and nothing is different. So I did this instead of that... nothing is different. No matter what I choose, the outcome is always the same, somehow things will always work itself out. There is a difference between a lighter tone and simply being juvenile. Some of the writings and presentation in ME:A are simply juvenile. In my opinion, the "decisions mean nothing" complaint rings a bit hollow. Let me explain. ME:A, to me, is VERY MUCH a "journey over destination" type of game. The "major decisions" of the original trilogy did lead to differences, but those difference didn't really matter in the long run. And in many ways, trying to herd all of the divergent paths into a manageable direction could lead to some coding nightmares if they DID make huge differences in the game. Which is why if we let the council die in ME1, we still wind up with the same council, just different names. I think even the same VA's, so it was a cosmetic difference at best. The only decision that truly affected your playthrough of the trilogy was the Virmire Survivor, and that didn't affect the whole story itself, just which squadmember was with us during that story. We don't know yet if any of the smaller decision will have any impact in future sequels (Sloane vs Charlatan on Kadara, for example) but even if they don't, they serve to define how you handled each situation. Contagion quest: Did you save the woman and let the angaran go? Or did you let her die (since she was dying anyway) to prevent the Roekkar from gaining a potentially devastating bioweapon? Neither outcome made any real difference within the game itself, but they do have different outcomes. And even if the outcomes aren't fully fleshed out in sequels, I still maintain that in ME:A, the journey is more important than the destination. How you choose in that moment is more important than the results of the decision. I really liked that Bioware gave us MANY of these decision points that helped us to define our Ryder a little more. Pragmatic or altruistic? You don't see it as much in the conversation options for much of the game, one of the weaker points of ME:A to be honest (although I didn't find most of the conversations bad, per se, but improvements are always welcome) but you saw that dichotomy in many of the choices we're presented with. I thought it was a fairly fluid, fitting way to bring that kind of thing into the game. Implementation could definitely improve, no arguments here, but I think some people (not necessarily you) take this point and blow it too far out of proportion. As far as juvenile writing goes, I will admit some of the dialogue was a bit cringey, but overall I would put the writing on par with the original trilogy. I wonder why this idea of bad writing and childish/juvenile/teen fanfic levels of writing came from. I honestly would like specific examples of this, so I can see where people are coming from. I agree with you. But I did have one moment in Andromeda when I felt writing was really juvenile. It was during PeeBee's mission, and PeeBee exclaimed something like: good thing we can use our friendly Observer droid. Sam made similar comments later in the mission, it really brought to mind Dora the Explorer or The Real Ghostbusters, I.e. Kids cartoons. That was the only time though I felt that way, overall, I enjoyed the upbeat tone of the dialogues. I have not played w3, by a variety of fundamental design choices that make me believe it is not my kind of a game, so I can't compare it to W3.
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Post by parnashwind on Apr 13, 2017 16:19:09 GMT
I am "expecting" something to happen especially in how people will react to these events - people to gossip about things. I am not expecting some huge long term change or anything you are probably thinking. There are both LONG and SHORT term impact when a coup take place - to say otherwise is simply ^%$#@! It could have an impact if a sequel were to take place. If that is at best a possibility and any such expectation is "hope". I dont care what my decisions will bring in the future or any such possibilities but address the present, the immediate. Who the hell is talking about possible future impact here? I dont care about future possibilities. And finally, if you cannot comprehend how I am comparing Bioware's statement of "Making Witcher 3 like side quest" to the side quests in ME:A then there is little else to say. TW3 does not do these childish juvenile quest - and that is an objective fact. Ah. I see. Another "The Witcher 3 was the best game ever and anything different is bad and wrong." Childish and juvenile thinking, in my opinion. I think I've engaged enough with you, so good day. -Facepalm- Another of those who skim read out of context posters? Bioware themselves said: We are taking note on how TW3 does side quest and we look to implement something similar. So, they did. And I cannot comment on their attempt? What they got right and what they got wrong? Before commenting, try to read everything and get the context right.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: VanSinn77
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Post by VanSinn on Apr 13, 2017 17:17:56 GMT
Ah. I see. Another "The Witcher 3 was the best game ever and anything different is bad and wrong." Childish and juvenile thinking, in my opinion. I think I've engaged enough with you, so good day. -Facepalm- Another of those who skim read out of context posters? Bioware themselves said: We are taking note on how TW3 does side quest and we look to implement something similar. So, they did. And I cannot comment on their attempt? What they got right and what they got wrong? Before commenting, try to read everything and get the context right. See, here's the problem. "Similar" doesn't mean "Same." I think Bioware did a good job on the decisions and quests. You don't. You point to TW3 as "how to do it right." ME:A is a different game. Out of context? I think i read the context quite well. Have fun with your salt and dislike of the game. I suggest you find a game that's more to your liking.
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Post by smilesja on Apr 13, 2017 18:09:29 GMT
Witcher and Mass Effect are two different games with different atmosphere and themes. I'm not surprised that Bioware did not copy off of them.
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Post by colfoley on Apr 13, 2017 18:43:31 GMT
So first off a disclaimer. I really liked the Witcher 3. It is oe of my favorite games of all time and it might wind up being the better of the two games between it and Andromeda. This is not in the spirit of trying to pick a fight between the two communities. Rather, acknowledging that BioWare stuck to their guns. So that being said... Thank you BioWare. It would have been so easy, so very very very easy, to ape Witcher 3. To just make Mass Effect Andromeda a carbon copy of it, a dark, depressing, universe where the player character gets almost nothing right and can't really stand on their own two feet and one of the choices you make truly matter at the end. A dark game, sure, a mature game, sure, but a game which does not pause to examine or consider any of the issues it brings up with any depth. But given the commercial and critical success of the Witcher it would have been easy to just copy it. Or have EA copy it. Yet Andromeda is very much its own thing. With its own tone. Not too dark, not too light, like Inquisition before it, it has moments of both which provides depth and context. Its a game which borrowed from the success of the Witcher, namely in how BioWare approached the side quests, took that element, put a BioWare stamp on it, and even managed to improve on it in some areas. This is especially noteworthy because you still see a lot of posters on this board complaining that the game is nothing but a collection of fetch quests. Well, I cannot speak to that. But I can speak to feeling overwhelmed at the quality quests and content in the game. A feeling I have never gotten in a game. I have bee overwhelmed by the amount of sheer quests and things to do in a game, Skyrim, until the point it became boring and I turned it off, but I have never been overwhelmed by the feeling there is so much quality content to do in any game that it is almost paralyzing. Especially after missions like Sleeping Dragons and Contagion and the Firefighters. The Loyalty Missions. Ryder Family Secrets. And many others, it encourages me to play the others because....I do not know when the next great moment is. Anyways, this game has been getting a lot of flack recently, and some of it is well earned. But I can appreciate that they did not give into the industry hype of the day. So apparently you just happy that Andromeda ended up being much worse game and thats ok as long as its not a copy of the Witcher 3? I think many people could disagree... No. For me if it wasn't for ONE questionable design decision it would be a foot race between which game i prefer. And since i hope that decision is easy to patch...
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Post by myalzalean on Apr 13, 2017 18:52:25 GMT
Thank you Bioware for releasing a game I enjoy playing so much that my computer time is straining my marriage.
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Post by brad2240 on Apr 14, 2017 2:26:03 GMT
So first off a disclaimer. I really liked the Witcher 3. It is oe of my favorite games of all time and it might wind up being the better of the two games between it and Andromeda. This is not in the spirit of trying to pick a fight between the two communities. Rather, acknowledging that BioWare stuck to their guns. So that being said... Thank you BioWare. It would have been so easy, so very very very easy, to ape Witcher 3. To just make Mass Effect Andromeda a carbon copy of it, a dark, depressing, universe where the player character gets almost nothing right and can't really stand on their own two feet and one of the choices you make truly matter at the end. A dark game, sure, a mature game, sure, but a game which does not pause to examine or consider any of the issues it brings up with any depth. But given the commercial and critical success of the Witcher it would have been easy to just copy it. Or have EA copy it. Yet Andromeda is very much its own thing. With its own tone. Not too dark, not too light, like Inquisition before it, it has moments of both which provides depth and context. Its a game which borrowed from the success of the Witcher, namely in how BioWare approached the side quests, took that element, put a BioWare stamp on it, and even managed to improve on it in some areas. This is especially noteworthy because you still see a lot of posters on this board complaining that the game is nothing but a collection of fetch quests. Well, I cannot speak to that. But I can speak to feeling overwhelmed at the quality quests and content in the game. A feeling I have never gotten in a game. I have bee overwhelmed by the amount of sheer quests and things to do in a game, Skyrim, until the point it became boring and I turned it off, but I have never been overwhelmed by the feeling there is so m uch quality content to do in any game that it is almost paralyzing. Especially after missions like Sleeping Dragons and Contagion and the Firefighters. The Loyalty Missions. Ryder Family Secrets. And many others, it encourages me to play the others because....I do not know when the next great moment is. Anyways, this game has been getting a lot of flack recently, and some of it is well earned. But I can appreciate that they did not give into the industry hype of the day.
Fully agreed.
Thank you, Bioware.
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Post by Kabraxal on Apr 14, 2017 2:44:45 GMT
I might unlock my twitter just to give some kudos to Bioware... because ai agree that Andromeda ended up a wonderful and fun exoerience that didn't having me sighing in exasperation at the tired attempts of entertainment to focus on suffering and darkness. Outdide of some technical hiccups, I got not only a fun game but the Mass Effect I had been hoping for over the last 5 years.
I hope the strange aversion to lighthearted adventure doesn't change plans fir the franchise and drag it deep into the cliches smothering entertainment right now.
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Post by KaiserShep on Apr 14, 2017 2:57:33 GMT
Thank you Bioware for releasing a game I enjoy playing so much that my computer time is straining my marriage.
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Post by katzenkrimis on Apr 14, 2017 6:57:39 GMT
Ape Witcher 3. To just make Mass Effect Andromeda a carbon copy of it.
The only thing I'd want to steal from Witcher III and put into this game is the writing and cut scene direction.
The rest is just your typical console garbage.
Build a super hero more powerful than Galactus. Obliterate all enemies by level 20.
Simplified skill trees. More skill points than you know what to do with.
Run around with a horrible third person camera, while mashing the search button.
Take a few screenshots because, yes, the environments are pretty. Even in a console game.
---
Fallout 4 is even worse. Every time you go through a door, epic loading screen. Even a little corner store. Epic loading screen.
Total garbage.
And people call it open world.
If Andromeda had captivating writing, if it excelled in the storytelling/dialogue department, and had a lot more variety/content, it would destroy Witcher III.
You don't need perfect facial expressions. Storytelling is one of the purest forms of expression. There's an art form in doing it skillfully. That's where Andromeda truly failed. The writing.
That, and lack of content. And the lack of variety in the content they gave us.
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Post by Kabraxal on Apr 14, 2017 7:11:02 GMT
Ape Witcher 3. To just make Mass Effect Andromeda a carbon copy of it.
The only thing I'd want to steal from Witcher III and put into this game is the writing and cut scene direction.
The rest is just your typical console garbage.
Build a super hero more powerful than Galactus. Obliterate all enemies by level 20.
Simplified skill trees. More skill points than you know what to do with.
Run around with a horrible third person camera, while mashing the search button.
Take a few screenshots because, yes, the environments are pretty. Even in a console game.
---
Fallout 4 is even worse. Every time you go through a door, epic loading screen. Even a little corner store. Epic loading screen.
Total garbage.
And people call it open world.
If Andromeda had captivating writing, if it excelled in the storytelling/dialogue department, and had a lot more variety/content, it would destroy Witcher III.
You don't need perfect facial expressions. Storytelling is one of the purest forms of expression. There's an art form in doing it skillfully. That's where Andromeda truly failed. The writing.
That, and lack of content. And the lack of variety in the content they gave us.
Lack? Dubious claim given a completionist run pushes 70 hours on average.
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Post by colfoley on Apr 14, 2017 7:35:07 GMT
Ape Witcher 3. To just make Mass Effect Andromeda a carbon copy of it.
The only thing I'd want to steal from Witcher III and put into this game is the writing and cut scene direction.
The rest is just your typical console garbage.
Build a super hero more powerful than Galactus. Obliterate all enemies by level 20.
Simplified skill trees. More skill points than you know what to do with.
Run around with a horrible third person camera, while mashing the search button.
Take a few screenshots because, yes, the environments are pretty. Even in a console game.
---
Fallout 4 is even worse. Every time you go through a door, epic loading screen. Even a little corner store. Epic loading screen.
Total garbage.
And people call it open world.
If Andromeda had captivating writing, if it excelled in the storytelling/dialogue department, and had a lot more variety/content, it would destroy Witcher III.
You don't need perfect facial expressions. Storytelling is one of the purest forms of expression. There's an art form in doing it skillfully. That's where Andromeda truly failed. The writing.
That, and lack of content. And the lack of variety in the content they gave us.
...I think I just touched a nerve.
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Post by xetykins on Apr 14, 2017 8:00:35 GMT
So first off a disclaimer. I really liked the Witcher 3. A dark game, sure, a mature game, sure, but a game which does not pause to examine or consider any of the issues it brings up with any depth. Really? Like alcohol and domestic abuse, which was considered one of the best? Racism? Just because The Witcher has no PoC it has other races. Euthenasia? ( or however that's spelled).The no fairy tale representation of Mislav? Or he does not count because.... no bigots allowed? Speaking of bigotry in a weird way, let us talk about the real and visible treatment of mages.Hello Miss Metz, did your teleport go wrong and literally skewered your arse on that pole? Gender issues? Hello Yonna!! Jealousy/unrequieted love? Hello that biatch in Skellige who cursed the man's kid to get back at him. That's just to name a few. But I guess I could find these things better in Andromeda with much much more depth than what the witcher has managed? I have to look around more then because I have not seen anything noteworthy so far after 43 hrs. But I will thank Bioware for Jaal,the combat and the gorgeous world they made for me to explore. Those, I really love.
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Post by Revan Reborn on Apr 14, 2017 14:53:21 GMT
So first off a disclaimer. I really liked the Witcher 3. A dark game, sure, a mature game, sure, but a game which does not pause to examine or consider any of the issues it brings up with any depth. Really? Like alcohol and domestic abuse, which was considered one of the best? Racism? Just because The Witcher has no PoC it has other races. Euthenasia? ( or however that's spelled).The no fairy tale representation of Mislav? Or he does not count because.... no bigots allowed? Speaking of bigotry in a weird way, let us talk about the real and visible treatment of mages.Hello Miss Metz, did your teleport go wrong and literally skewered your arse on that pole? Gender issues? Hello Yonna!! Jealousy/unrequieted love? Hello that biatch in Skellige who cursed the man's kid to get back at him. That's just to name a few. But I guess I could find these things better in Andromeda with much much more depth than what the witcher has managed? I have to look around more then because I have not seen anything noteworthy so far after 43 hrs. But I will thank Bioware for Jaal,the combat and the gorgeous world they made for me to explore. Those, I really love. Agreed. If there's anything The Witcher series excels at, it's providing depth and gravitas to really sensitive and uncomfortable issues for many folks. It's something that's just largely unique to that franchise, which is part of the reason I believe the series is so loved and adored. I've certainly always appreciated the realness of TW going back to the first game. Mass Effect is amazing, but it's ultimately just another space opera. I'm not really expecting to deal with domestic violence, drug or alcohol abuse, or discrimination. Some of those topics are touched on in Andromeda, but it's certainly never to the level of what you'd see in The Witcher 3. At the same time, that's perfectly okay. Mass Effect isn't entirely about those issues and it's fine for it to focus more on exploration and the adventures of the Pathfinder.
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Post by Garo on Apr 14, 2017 15:02:09 GMT
Oh please, don't thank BW for this broken game. I understand someone can like it but it's nowhere near as good to be thankful for.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
Origin: Stysiaq
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Post by stysiaq on Apr 14, 2017 15:18:28 GMT
If it's so easy to copy Witcher 3 then, by all means, do it every year.
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Post by friffy on Apr 14, 2017 17:40:05 GMT
Really? Like alcohol and domestic abuse, which was considered one of the best? Racism? Just because The Witcher has no PoC it has other races. Euthenasia? ( or however that's spelled).The no fairy tale representation of Mislav? Or he does not count because.... no bigots allowed? Speaking of bigotry in a weird way, let us talk about the real and visible treatment of mages.Hello Miss Metz, did your teleport go wrong and literally skewered your arse on that pole? Gender issues? Hello Yonna!! Jealousy/unrequieted love? Hello that biatch in Skellige who cursed the man's kid to get back at him. That's just to name a few. But I guess I could find these things better in Andromeda with much much more depth than what the witcher has managed? I have to look around more then because I have not seen anything noteworthy so far after 43 hrs. But I will thank Bioware for Jaal,the combat and the gorgeous world they made for me to explore. Those, I really love. Agreed. If there's anything The Witcher series excels at, it's providing depth and gravitas to really sensitive and uncomfortable issues for many folks. It's something that's just largely unique to that franchise, which is part of the reason I believe the series is so loved and adored. I've certainly always appreciated the realness of TW going back to the first game. Mass Effect is amazing, but it's ultimately just another space opera. I'm not really expecting to deal with domestic violence, drug or alcohol abuse, or discrimination. Some of those topics are touched on in Andromeda, but it's certainly never to the level of what you'd see in The Witcher 3. At the same time, that's perfectly okay. Mass Effect isn't entirely about those issues and it's fine for it to focus more on exploration and the adventures of the Pathfinder. So you actually telling me that Wicher would also have been "great" if Gerald would have banged males instead of females in all it's cinematic greatness? And if CDPR would have handled issues so sensitive and appropriate but it would have been just males to be abused, tortured and raped (yes, actually it was and is quite common to humiliate males that way). If there wouldn't have been just naked males around showing their goodies but no boobs or female butts? That anybody would have mentioned "great" and "witcher" together in one sentence then even if the game mechanics, the quests and combat system would have been far more than great or fantastic? You would have played these games? And you would also give them a lot of credit for having the courage to address these issues in gaming, rather than focus purely on entertainment and what sells? My deepest admiration to you then. Personally, I prefer that BW only "touches" such "dark" issues and let CDPR handles the more "deep" and "mature" games. And I hope it stays that way.
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Post by Revan Reborn on Apr 14, 2017 18:20:00 GMT
So you actually telling me that Wicher would also have been "great" if Gerald would have banged males instead of females in all it's cinematic greatness? And if CDPR would have handled issues so sensitive and appropriate but it would have been just males to be abused, tortured and raped (yes, actually it was and is quite common to humiliate males that way). If there wouldn't have been just naked males around showing their goodies but no boobs or female butts? That anybody would have mentioned "great" and "witcher" together in one sentence then even if the game mechanics, the quests and combat system would have been far more than great or fantastic? You would have played these games? And you would also give them a lot of credit for having the courage to address these issues in gaming, rather than focus purely on entertainment and what sells? My deepest admiration to you then. Personally, I prefer that BW only "touches" such "dark" issues and let CDPR handles the more "deep" and "mature" games. And I hope it stays that way. Remarks like these give me the impression you've never played any of the games, at least not for any extended period of time. I've seen this line of thinking used against The Witcher franchise time and time again. Yet, it always rings hollow because you fail to understand and grasp the core of the source material. Misogyny and sexism are very much a part of the experience just like discrimination, in general. Geralt, alone, deals with quite a bit of hatred and contempt for the simple fact that he is a witcher. What is actually ironic is The Witcher franchise has some of the strongest female characters you'd ever find in any video franchise, including Mass Effect and Dragon Age. It's clear before you even posited your original comment that you already had preconceived notions of what you believe the franchise stands for. That is your right, regardless of how ill-informed it may be. I can only retort that I respectfully disagree, being a person who has played all three games and recognizes there is far more depth and essence to these games than you give them credit for. I love BioWare and I enjoy the games they make. That being said, they are oftentimes far more family friendly and focus more so on epic tales rather than real world problems. There's nothing wrong with that either, and I'm glad that studios are free to pursue their own personal passions.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
Origin: helios969
Prime Posts: No Clue
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Post by helios969 on Apr 14, 2017 18:36:41 GMT
Here, here, OP. I pretty much think TW3 is the best game ever made, raising the bar to which every subsequent AAA RPG will be measured (and I'm wondering if CDPR's own Cyperpunk can live up to the standard they've created,) but I definitely wouldn't want every game to be a carbon copy in terms of tone, themes, or storytelling style. That would inevitably get boring. I'm generally pretty happy with MEA despite some of the questionable design choices, so I'll join you and say thank you, Bioware.
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Post by colfoley on Apr 14, 2017 18:41:59 GMT
So first off a disclaimer. I really liked the Witcher 3. A dark game, sure, a mature game, sure, but a game which does not pause to examine or consider any of the issues it brings up with any depth. Really? Like alcohol and domestic abuse, which was considered one of the best? Racism? Just because The Witcher has no PoC it has other races. Euthenasia? ( or however that's spelled).The no fairy tale representation of Mislav? Or he does not count because.... no bigots allowed? Speaking of bigotry in a weird way, let us talk about the real and visible treatment of mages.Hello Miss Metz, did your teleport go wrong and literally skewered your arse on that pole? Gender issues? Hello Yonna!! Jealousy/unrequieted love? Hello that biatch in Skellige who cursed the man's kid to get back at him. That's just to name a few. But I guess I could find these things better in Andromeda with much much more depth than what the witcher has managed? I have to look around more then because I have not seen anything noteworthy so far after 43 hrs. But I will thank Bioware for Jaal,the combat and the gorgeous world they made for me to explore. Those, I really love. it's always struck me as fascinating. People call DA I 'wide as an ocean deep as a puddle' when i find it a perfect example of how the witcher handles its darker subject matter. It just shoves crap after crap after more crap with crap on top and crap on the side...but it's rare that Geralt could actually do anything about it. The world of the witcher was so evil and so depraved that i was half tempted to leave it to the white frost and not look back. That isn't deep it's not even mature and it isn't even realistic. No matter how many whores and mad kings there are. Whereas Andromeda actually brings up many of these issues and even a few never touched by the witcher. Is it always perfect? No. But when Ryder messes up i feel it because in Andromeda there are sometimes ideal solutions. When Geralt messed up i shrugged my shoulders.
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Post by suikoden on Apr 14, 2017 19:02:10 GMT
Really? Like alcohol and domestic abuse, which was considered one of the best? Racism? Just because The Witcher has no PoC it has other races. Euthenasia? ( or however that's spelled).The no fairy tale representation of Mislav? Or he does not count because.... no bigots allowed? Speaking of bigotry in a weird way, let us talk about the real and visible treatment of mages.Hello Miss Metz, did your teleport go wrong and literally skewered your arse on that pole? Gender issues? Hello Yonna!! Jealousy/unrequieted love? Hello that biatch in Skellige who cursed the man's kid to get back at him. That's just to name a few. But I guess I could find these things better in Andromeda with much much more depth than what the witcher has managed? I have to look around more then because I have not seen anything noteworthy so far after 43 hrs. But I will thank Bioware for Jaal,the combat and the gorgeous world they made for me to explore. Those, I really love. it's always struck me as fascinating. People call DA I 'wide as an ocean deep as a puddle' when i find it a perfect example of how the witcher handles its darker subject matter. It just shoves crap after crap after more crap with crap on top and crap on the side...but it's rare that Geralt could actually do anything about it. The world of the witcher was so evil and so depraved that i was half tempted to leave it to the white frost and not look back. That isn't deep it's not even mature and it isn't even realistic. No matter how many whores and mad kings there are. Whereas Andromeda actually brings up many of these issues and even a few never touched by the witcher. Is it always perfect? No. But when Ryder messes up i feel it because in Andromeda there are sometimes ideal solutions. When Geralt messed up i shrugged my shoulders. Real world is a scary place, just like the Witcher. I'd thank BioWare for BG2 - still my favorite game, up there with Civ IV.
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