The Witcher 3 and Mass Effect Andromeda thread

How are you going to end your ME2 playthrough if you don't do any Loyalty mission? They're main missions the same way that choosing to punch Iorveth in the face in Witcher 2 and taking the B-side Act 2 questline is a main quest and for the same reasons that choosing Mages instead of Templars in DA:I is a main quest. I get why you're reluctant to call them main quests because they can be skipped and approx 3 additional recruitments can be skipped in the middle of the game but they're all in the same pool of quests that trigger main plot progression so they're not side-quests. The reason Grissom Academy is not a side-quest to me is because I think there is such a clear distinction between the stuff you do in the non-linear part of the game vs the linear stuff and the stuff the game basically wants you to see. The Omega Mercs quest on Citadel and Jondum Bau as well as the one where Balak shows up feel like side-quests because, like in ME1 they consist of meeting NPCs, doing light objectives and triggering other cutscenes with choices in them. the Grissom academy quest is an actual level and the Grunt one can advance the plot for instance. 

Compare P:Tuchanka to Bloody Baron? Yes, that's kind of a decent answer. You did remind me that Bloody Baron is a bit more tied to the main story than I remember but it does cut off just before the request to rescue the Baron's wife IIRC and then the main quest goes to Novigrad. The comparison would be that the rest of the family matters quest is similar to the 3 extra quests on Tuchanka including the one away from the planet with Grunt. Those I count as sub-main quests just like the rest of the Bloody Baron questline. There are 3 areas in the "find Ciri" questline, one of which is Velen and they all follow that formula similar to how Tuchanka and Rannoch had a straight path tied to the main quest and then sub-quests that expand on the overall arc. Since you're asking me to compare the two, I would still prefer Witcher 3 from a writing- and design-standpoint. The quests are simply superior to me. Yeah, yeah, the combat is "fun" in ME3 but it's all secondary to me in both games. However, in ME3 I have a problem with how each quest, including main quests are designed like levels like in Gears of War that you plow through, shooting things and then there are segments of cinematics in between. Unlike ME2 there are no areas where it breaks off to let you explore the environment and find additional NPCs. It's more narrow and much more emphasizing the combat stuff. I believe it's an EA mandate that was imposed on the game from a management level and marketing interference, but BioWare worked around it the best they could by making all of this tie into the sense of being at war, so the objectives became more war-themed. Like I said, I just found ME3 less impressive and it's not just in regards to Witcher vs Mass Effect because I like Mass Effect much more as a franchise, but when I was playing ME3 after loving ME1 and ME2 (those two being my point of comparison) the game simply let me down. Witcher 3 gave me more of what I was looking for after playing ME1 and ME2 than ME3 did.

Also, I don't consider TW3 to be perfect. I do think it's up there with other "games of the generation" with Bloodborne and last gen I thought that crown went to Mass Effect 2. When people say "it's impressive how a game like this could even get made in this day and age" I completely agree. I don't mean it as to say that Witcher 3 is ahead of its time but more that given the toxic industry and publisher trends it's incredible how a game like Witcher 3 could get made that avoids so many of the AAA trappings and bullshit practices, the rushwork or over-focus. It has some focus-tested elements from games like Far Cry (it has the blips on the mini map) but it also has genuine inspiration that doesn't come across as cheap from Zelda and Red Dead Redemption whilist playing to CDPR's previous strengths and going further because the writing is so consistently great in all of the side-content.

And, (sorry I know I'm rambling on and on) believe me I'm not blindly praising it. I have plenty of criticisms to throw at it and I do let some issues slide. I do get very bored by it after long play-sessions and especially at the end of my playthrough I was ready for it to be over. My favorite games of all time (ME2, Zelda Ocarina of Time, Arkham City etc.) usually end just so that I either feel that it's appropriate for it to end when it does or it's so good that it leaved me wanting more. Witcher 3 drags on just a bit too long after the preliminary climax of act 2 before it arrives at its denoument in act 3, but that's where some of my harsher criticism of the writing comes into play. I won't say the ending is anywhere near as bad as ME3 because it doesn't go out of its way to eradicate its own story but it is still a somewhat rushed ending that feels strangely failed to give me the emotional catharsis I was expecting at that point in the story. I believe it also has failure in cause and effect both in design and in the logic of the writing but at least it plays strongly into the themes that the game was trying to feature. The rest of the story-missteps I can discuss in later posts.

The bottom line is that Witcher 3 was an impressive, heartfelt and satisfying game that kept me stimulated intellectually and it didn't grate on me out of patronizing plot-developments like ME3 did. ME3 is the biggest letdown in all of gaming to me and not just because of the ending. I went through that entire game with clenching teeth and anger in my eyes. Every good moment was followed by something I just plain didn't like. That's quite a change coming from ME2 which I thought was good 90% of the way through it. ME1 was boring and corny but it had substance all across the board. ME3 was so chock full of empty platitudes, tryhard and forced emotional moments and over-convenient character showups. Nothing in the story felt natural except for the excellent depiction of the reaper invasion itself.

I have been completely honest about the extent to which I have played TW3... Are you incapable of reading?  Furthermore, FYI - I usually played with Shepard's default face, so your lame attempt at insulting me falls completely flat in that regard.

Please tell me then what profound insights into Geralt's character are in Option 2.  How does choosing option 1 over option 2 affect the game down the road?  From an RPG perspective, taking the time to give a last message to a widow can also says reams about Shepard's character) without it being textually added to the quest list... or do you need to be spoonfed your PC's "religion" by the developer in text form?

He isn't wrong. Most of the side content (not all by any means) in W3  is "Geralt stops and takes odd jobs" It's not related to the main quest to find Ciri. Most of the side cointen in MEA is tied to Ryder's job as a pathfinder. It doesn't mean MEA's side content is better (it is not), but it does have more to do with the main plot than W3's does.

UpUpAwayRedux, you were called out on reducing the Allgod quest to a simple "go there and kill for a reward". It might be okayish in the context of comparison with ME3 quests. Why do you guys compare TW3 to ME3? I've heard pretty much only good impressions about the side content in ME3. (Okay, maybe not how the Jacob romance was handled, but that's about it).

You can still end the game and even have Shepard survive with only 2 squad mates who are loyal.  The game can also end with Shepard dying (i.e. that's not a critical mission failure screen).  It just means you do not have an importable file for ME3.  Unfortunately, TW3 (despite it's vastly proclaimed merits) is just too long and slog for me to stay connected with the actual story.  There is too much reading that comes in bits and drabs... and out of any real order for the most part and too many inconsequential side quests to appreciate the ones that do wind up having more consequence too them.  My point is that, from that aspect, ME3 allows me to at least stay with the story right through to the completion of the game.  I'm hoping, when I do start ME:A, that it will be more like ME3 than TW3.  I've never said ME3 was the perfect game either... but at least it's one I could finish.  TW3 is not one that I'm ever going to be inclined to finish... let alone invest any time or money to play TW1 or 2 to fill in my knowledge gaps in the lore.

Yes, because if my adopted daughter was being chased by a horde of evil Elves out to do god knows what to her I'd stop by the road a 109 times to help peasants with ghosts. Look, I'm not criticising the game, just poniting out how it uses Geralt's "job" as a an excuse for tons of filler that he most lilley would not be doing, at least in the amounts he is in the game, if this story werte told in a different medium. Ryder's story, at least not until much later in the game, is much less priority driven, and much of the side content is why her/he is there in the first place.

MEA has yet to define what it is a Pathfinder even does. So I can't say what quests are Ryder's job or not. I know placing trinkets on rocks for lazy bums isn't it.

As for Geralt, his job is a Witcher. That is literally his job. He doesn't get paid if he doesn't do this work. Without it, he can't have the weapons, potions, decocations, and armor made to help defend Ciri or anyone else against the Hunt.

the "side quests don't make sense" argument is not specific to the witcher, you can make it for most rpgs.

Sure I'm willing to wait (especially for Cyberpunk 2077 which CDPR has to build entirely from scratch), but a five year wait for stuff I want to play? Like i said, waiting a few years in between Bioware franschise installments will only be supplanted for me when CDPR has a few more franchises to offer (Cyberpunk and hopefully a Ciri led Witcher series). As far as Bethesda...I'm afraid I'm out in the cold with that one...so...so cold...

Good stuff takes time to make. I don't quite get how time factors into which developer is the favorite one. I get the impatience though.

As for Bethesda, I actually only played one of their games: Skyrim. A friend insisted I try it. I did not expect to like it after aborting Oblivion on Xbox after six hours thinking "What is this shit?" It was the first non-JRPG I ever tried and I had no idea what I was supposed to do and kept dying, hahaha. New Vegas is an Obsidian game in the Bethesda engine, so it looks and plays very familiar, but the writing is miles ahead. It's actually completely story-focused. All the different factions you can support effect the main game's outcome. Once you've done the main story there is actually no reason to stick around. It' not an endless sandbox like Skyrim or the other Fallout games. Bethesda couldn't be more different from Bioware, so I certainly understand the disinterest.I shared it for the longest time. I have more fun modding tbh since the vanilla games are ugly abominations. That said, Skyrim's Dawnguard DLC had some Bioware tingles for me, for real. Serana was the only companion I cared about in that game. And her daddy issues storyline was actually engaging.

... and I stand by that assessment.  The quest physically involves nothing more than - 1) talk to two guys after stumbling across the ruin 2) look around and go to basement 3) kill monster  or not 3) return to original 2 guys you talked with.  Yes, the conversations are cut scenes, but it is still not a complex Witcher Contract of anywhere near the depth of the Griffin one in White Orchard.  There are those little textual paragraphs for all the little quests... even the ones one just stumbles on like "Sunken Treasure."  I don't think the Allgod text is any more revealing about Geralt's character than Shepard opting to pass on a dying message or not.  In the case of ME3, that revelation about Shepard's character is just not laid out in a textual journal wrap up (which is merely a game mechanic).  Another example... Benning Evidence.  There are a couple of different ways to approach that quest - 1) obtain the quest by overhearing Ambassador Osoba and offer to  help him 2) overhear the soldiers talking in Purgatory 3) just stumble on the dog tags on Benning.  Then Shepard decides... do I take them to Osoba or not.  Doing the former reveals that it's important to him as a soldier to not leave relatives of the fallen hanging... regardless of how he acquires the quest).  Not completing it after overhearing all the anquish Osoba and the men in Bilal's unit are going through, says that he can be a pretty callous guy.  The difference is that it's just not spoon-fed to the player in a journal entry.

So, perhaps one improvement that could be suggested to Bioware is to spoon-feed the character results of each action in some sort of textual journal entry on the PC.  I don't know how the character tracking system in ME:A works (until I start playing the game itself).  No one has really mentioned it here.

1: I've picked that up  
2: I get it   but the above poster sounds like a 12 year old so I am trying to go easy on him
3: Then I am wrong, and Geralt sucks as a character.  As far as that last bit about Gerlat and Ciri, it proves my theory that humanity is no longer fit to survive 


cheap image hosting