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Post by smilesja on May 5, 2017 3:14:21 GMT
I'm glad the game got all those things then. You mean the pew-pew? Yep we got all of that and then some. I'm probably among the few though that would have been perfectly happy to have not had to shoot more than a few dozen things total in all of Andromeda. The narrative while not singularly unique in video games is the exception rather than the rule. Ryder's not (supposed to be anyway) the super soldier or the destined one or born with elfin magical luck or what have you. In the start he's just a regular guy. The story could/should have been about settling this new frontier instead of killing an ancient evil or stopping the hostile armies etc., etc.. Bioware said the game was to be about exploration and discovery but in the end every situation throughout the game is resolved at muzzle velocity. I would have loved if the game had been about actually exploring these new worlds, finding ways to make them habitable without the aid of a giant deus ex machina. Having to discover water sources, determine what species of plants and animals can help sustain life, having to find areas capable of supporting a settlement population instead of just riding up to randomly placed beacon and be told "here is your new settlement". I'd rather have had to rely on scientific skills, deduction, research, experimentation, surveying, all things a real Pathfinder would have needed. Then having the success or failure of your settlements depend on how well you did your job as Pathfinder. Instead we got the regular pew-pew everything in your way and win. I think a game about being an actual Pathfinder would not only have fit their narrative better, but also given them the opportunity to explore some unique gameplay. Risky. It very well could have flopped on them if they didn't find unique and interesting ways to do it, which of course is exactly why they would never even consider trying it. The ADD shooter crowd would have howled in terror at being expected to take longer than 5 seconds to resolve every conflict in the game, but for me personally I would relish a game like that. And the game has plenty of that is just that the remnant vault is there if you feel lazy or want to put the finishing touches on the planet
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Post by decafhigh on May 5, 2017 3:16:18 GMT
And the game has plenty of that is just that the remnant vault is there if you feel lazy or want to put the finishing touches on the planet Are we even talking about the same game? I'm talking about Mass Effect: Andromeda. What game are you talking about?
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Post by smilesja on May 5, 2017 3:20:25 GMT
And the game has plenty of that is just that the remnant vault is there if you feel lazy or want to put the finishing touches on the planet Are we even talking about the same game? I'm talking about Mass Effect: Andromeda. What game are you talking about? There were plenty of quests that required diplomency anaylyzing new life and handling conflicts just like a pathfinder. The shooting will always be there because mass effect has always been an action rpg
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Post by decafhigh on May 5, 2017 3:25:55 GMT
Are we even talking about the same game? I'm talking about Mass Effect: Andromeda. What game are you talking about? There were plenty of quests that required diplomency anaylyzing new life and handling conflicts just like a pathfinder. The shooting will always be there because mass effect has always been an action rpg Yeah, no. I'm not talking about just scanning something with your little wrist mounted scanner and calling that "research". The game I'm envisioning wouldn't be anything like MEA. But like I said, the idea of a game that doesn't rely on simply blowing away everything that moves is too 'out there' for most game companies, too risky, too untried. Would require players with more than a 5 second attention span. EA certainly would never go for it even if I thought BW could pull it off.
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Post by KaiserShep on May 5, 2017 4:07:41 GMT
I'm glad the game got all those things then. You mean the pew-pew? Yep we got all of that and then some. I'm probably among the few though that would have been perfectly happy to have not had to shoot more than a few dozen things total in all of Andromeda. The narrative while not singularly unique in video games is the exception rather than the rule. Ryder's not (supposed to be anyway) the super soldier or the destined one or born with elfin magical luck or what have you. In the start he's just a regular guy. The story could/should have been about settling this new frontier instead of killing an ancient evil or stopping the hostile armies etc., etc.. Bioware said the game was to be about exploration and discovery but in the end every situation throughout the game is resolved at muzzle velocity. I would have loved if the game had been about actually exploring these new worlds, finding ways to make them habitable without the aid of a giant deus ex machina. Having to discover water sources, determine what species of plants and animals can help sustain life, having to find areas capable of supporting a settlement population instead of just riding up to randomly placed beacon and be told "here is your new settlement". I'd rather have had to rely on scientific skills, deduction, research, experimentation, surveying, all things a real Pathfinder would have needed. Then having the success or failure of your settlements depend on how well you did your job as Pathfinder. Instead we got the regular pew-pew everything in your way and win. I think a game about being an actual Pathfinder would not only have fit their narrative better, but also given them the opportunity to explore some unique gameplay. Risky. It very well could have flopped on them if they didn't find unique and interesting ways to do it, which of course is exactly why they would never even consider trying it. The ADD shooter crowd would have howled in terror at being expected to take longer than 5 seconds to resolve every conflict in the game, but for me personally I would relish a game like that. I've enjoyed games that lacked combat entirely and required the character's ability to solve problems or assemble clues, but for a game like Mass Effect, I would say that a keen focus on combat against an antagonistic force is an absolute necessity, and not because of ADD or something like that. It's established from the start as a violent universe with turbulent politics, and on top of that, is a universe established to have fantastical tech and physical abilities beyond anything people are capable of in reality. Personally, I have a very visceral desire to destroy enemy characters in an adventure narrative. I find it makes the stories that drive the BioWare games that I've played all the more satisfying, but also makes any instances where I might be able to resolve an issue peacefully all the more meaningful. Without a hostile army for us to murder, a Mass Effect game would die a swift and painful death.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by erikson on May 5, 2017 4:11:15 GMT
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by erikson on May 5, 2017 4:12:05 GMT
You mean the pew-pew? Yep we got all of that and then some. I'm probably among the few though that would have been perfectly happy to have not had to shoot more than a few dozen things total in all of Andromeda. The narrative while not singularly unique in video games is the exception rather than the rule. Ryder's not (supposed to be anyway) the super soldier or the destined one or born with elfin magical luck or what have you. In the start he's just a regular guy. The story could/should have been about settling this new frontier instead of killing an ancient evil or stopping the hostile armies etc., etc.. Bioware said the game was to be about exploration and discovery but in the end every situation throughout the game is resolved at muzzle velocity. I would have loved if the game had been about actually exploring these new worlds, finding ways to make them habitable without the aid of a giant deus ex machina. Having to discover water sources, determine what species of plants and animals can help sustain life, having to find areas capable of supporting a settlement population instead of just riding up to randomly placed beacon and be told "here is your new settlement". I'd rather have had to rely on scientific skills, deduction, research, experimentation, surveying, all things a real Pathfinder would have needed. Then having the success or failure of your settlements depend on how well you did your job as Pathfinder. Instead we got the regular pew-pew everything in your way and win. I think a game about being an actual Pathfinder would not only have fit their narrative better, but also given them the opportunity to explore some unique gameplay. Risky. It very well could have flopped on them if they didn't find unique and interesting ways to do it, which of course is exactly why they would never even consider trying it. The ADD shooter crowd would have howled in terror at being expected to take longer than 5 seconds to resolve every conflict in the game, but for me personally I would relish a game like that. I've enjoyed games that lacked combat entirely and required the character's ability to solve problems or assemble clues, but for a game like Mass Effect, I would say that a keen focus on combat against an antagonistic force is an absolute necessity, and not because of ADD or something like that. It's established from the start as a violent universe with turbulent politics, and on top of that, is a universe established to have fantastical tech and physical abilities beyond anything people are capable of in reality. Personally, I have a very visceral desire to destroy enemy characters in an adventure narrative. I find it makes the stories that drive the BioWare games that I've played all the more satisfying, but also makes any instances where I might be able to resolve an issue peacefully all the more meaningful. Without a hostile army for us to murder, a Mass Effect game would die a swift and painful death. Without the action Mass Effect would be a politics and dating simulator.
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Post by KaiserShep on May 5, 2017 4:15:15 GMT
Well politics was never a strong suit of any Mass Effect game, as indicated by the depiction of the Council, who could just as well be replaced by Zaphod Beeblebrox and the galaxy would stand a better chance.
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Post by decafhigh on May 5, 2017 4:20:24 GMT
I've enjoyed games that lacked combat entirely and required the character's ability to solve problems or assemble clues, but for a game like Mass Effect, I would say that a keen focus on combat against an antagonistic force is an absolute necessity, and not because of ADD or something like that. It's established from the start as a violent universe with turbulent politics, and on top of that, is a universe established to have fantastical tech and physical abilities beyond anything people are capable of in reality. Personally, I have a very visceral desire to destroy enemy characters in an adventure narrative. I find it makes the stories that drive the BioWare games that I've played all the more satisfying, but also makes any instances where I might be able to resolve an issue peacefully all the more meaningful. Without a hostile army for us to murder, a Mass Effect game would die a swift and painful death. /shrug I still think everyone is missing the point I was making, or just don't care. One or the other. The point being the narrative about being an explorer, a discover, a Pathfinder and Ryder being an untested greenhorn doesn't sit well with the "murder a hostile army" game play. Its like making a Star Trek movie, but you pull Kirk out drop in Rambo as the new captain and even though your directive is still to discover new alien species and civilizations Rambo just goes ahead and slaughters everyone anyway. I'm fine with ME being a "murder them all" game series but you really need to marry the story and the narrative to that. MEA has quite the disconnect between its story and its gameplay. One or the other would really be better served by changing the other.
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zaeedisking
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
XBL Gamertag: V4vendetta82
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Post by zaeedisking on May 5, 2017 7:03:36 GMT
I've enjoyed games that lacked combat entirely and required the character's ability to solve problems or assemble clues, but for a game like Mass Effect, I would say that a keen focus on combat against an antagonistic force is an absolute necessity, and not because of ADD or something like that. It's established from the start as a violent universe with turbulent politics, and on top of that, is a universe established to have fantastical tech and physical abilities beyond anything people are capable of in reality. Personally, I have a very visceral desire to destroy enemy characters in an adventure narrative. I find it makes the stories that drive the BioWare games that I've played all the more satisfying, but also makes any instances where I might be able to resolve an issue peacefully all the more meaningful. Without a hostile army for us to murder, a Mass Effect game would die a swift and painful death. /shrug I still think everyone is missing the point I was making, or just don't care. One or the other. The point being the narrative about being an explorer, a discover, a Pathfinder and Ryder being an untested greenhorn doesn't sit well with the "murder a hostile army" game play. Its like making a Star Trek movie, but you pull Kirk out drop in Rambo as the new captain and even though your directive is still to discover new alien species and civilizations Rambo just goes ahead and slaughters everyone anyway. I'm fine with ME being a "murder them all" game series but you really need to marry the story and the narrative to that. MEA has quite the disconnect between its story and its gameplay. One or the other would really be better served by changing the other. For me the gameplay really didn't serve the narrative all that well.
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correctamundo
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Dr Obfuscate
Don't knock the little winds. They're important - for morale.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
Origin: correctamundo1
Prime Posts: A thousand and then some.
Prime Likes: They never liked me! No one likes me!
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Post by correctamundo on May 5, 2017 8:13:54 GMT
I think maybe the definition of "space opera" is getting kind of mixed up around here. Agreed, not near enough singing for it to be an opera. Agreed, not near enough singing for it to be an opera. That said, I think we all know what is meant by Space Opera. I think MEA tried really hard to be. Whether it succeeded in that is up to each individual. Games, stories, movies, operas, whatever can fail to connect with a specific person for a host of reasons. Any one of those reasons can be enough to completely shatter that overall illusion which is why making sure a game is as polished as possible before they go shoving it out the door is really important. Or at least try and make fixes quickly as possible before people's opinions of the game are cemented forever. Yeah, just imagine ME1 in Opera form. Oh Wiawa, you'w so wuvwy... Yes I know it I can't heeellp it... Unless it has valkyries riding sonic space rockets, carrying laser rifles, while immitting ear shattering sonic screams, then no it is not. Hey, we got reminescence of the prelude to act 1 of Lohengrin in one of the exploration themes! As ya'll have noted it doesn't get much more opera than Wagner.
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zaeedisking
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
XBL Gamertag: V4vendetta82
Posts: 329 Likes: 469
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Post by zaeedisking on May 5, 2017 8:54:58 GMT
Well at least this thread hasn't devolve into personal insults... yet.
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on May 5, 2017 12:17:32 GMT
It's the beginnings of a B-movie trilogy.
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Post by ayenari on May 5, 2017 12:25:57 GMT
If the writing team shapes their act up, the potential is there with where the story seems to be set up to go.
That's the big if though, it really is.
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Post by KaiserShep on May 5, 2017 12:37:09 GMT
It's the beginnings of a B-movie trilogy. Well, why break tradition?
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