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Post by Miaoven Winter on May 6, 2017 6:56:11 GMT
Much thanks. Will be interesting to see if BW caught this on their end in time for this upcoming patch, or if we'll be stuck with this mechanic for the foreseeable future. I'm almost certain, barring a major rework, that we will keep the light/medium/heavy mechanic even if they fix the difficulty scaling. Which means people should consider in their builds whether or not they're getting "strong" or "weak" combos. I think what's really important about this find is it'll put further changes in proper context. For instance, if the next patch rolls around with a listed combo damage increase to 175/262/350, then we'll know, "Oh, that's where they pulled the numbers from." Either BW intended for the "Insanity-level" damage values to be the baseline and the system was just bugged, or they just now decided to use these numbers that already existed. At which point we can slam them again, since, as I'm sure we all agree, adding ~75 damage to combos is not the buff we need.
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Post by Pounce de León on May 6, 2017 7:32:07 GMT
Lul, I guess I should host more.
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bacon4breakfast
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Post by bacon4breakfast on May 6, 2017 7:39:15 GMT
what to heck
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Post by peddroelm on May 6, 2017 7:39:44 GMT
Seriously, for everyone who worked on figuring this out, nice work. That's a gnarly thing to track down, and you nailed it within a couple of days (or less?) of discovering it. And this does seem to take the cake (so far) as the weirdest thing in MP. It was some dude on reddit that finally cracked this one ..
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Post by someN7orother on May 6, 2017 7:50:31 GMT
Hmm. I wonder if the value or file is just not present (maybe someone forgot to include the powerstatsmp.ebx file and the game is falling back to the SP file values instead of simply crashing). I can't imagine that the designer didn't tell the programmer that the game needs to look at the lobby difficulty to determine combo damage. It's really weird behavior and feels like the MP was thrown together at the last minute... Seeing how the data tables are unannotated themselves and are just raw numbers, it's going to be hard to say for sure what's going on. Thanks for the link, I have something to keep me entertained until the patch drops...
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Post by palker4 on May 6, 2017 8:06:03 GMT
So if i play on normal i loose whole 75 (SEVENTY FIVE) points of damage. In gold where mooks have 2000+ health it seems rather insignificant although still extremely stupid.
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xaijin
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Post by xaijin on May 6, 2017 8:38:39 GMT
WTF????????????? How is this even possible? Frostbite engine dependency scheme, and an MP team that does't have enough cross-trained veterans to account for things like this.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by KLGChaos on May 6, 2017 8:42:20 GMT
So if i play on normal i loose whole 75 (SEVENTY FIVE) points of damage. In gold where mooks have 2000+ health it seems rather insignificant although still extremely stupid. That's base damage before any buffs. Still not a ton, but more than 75 points.
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Post by kalil on May 6, 2017 9:21:24 GMT
So if i play on normal i loose whole 75 (SEVENTY FIVE) points of damage. In gold where mooks have 2000+ health it seems rather insignificant although still extremely stupid. You straight up lose 20% of your combo damage. This is not insignificant.
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Hey Conrad, I slept with your sister.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
XBL Gamertag: Rivercurse
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Post by Rivercurse on May 6, 2017 9:42:06 GMT
My God Bioware. This is absolutely ridiculous.
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Post by SalMasRac on May 6, 2017 9:44:17 GMT
WTF????????????? How is this even possible? One hypothetical possibility is that some intern was responsible for this part of the combos and actually did a good job, they do scale with difficulty. So, technically speaking, there is nothing wrong with them combos. Wrong difficulty, not his/her fault. Probably reported as working as intended and everything is peachy, even got some bonus paycheck for job well done. Now, weapons with focus in DAIMP, that is another story. I'm still puzzled at finding any explanation for that. Especially considering it was never fixed. When they say that combo damage scaling per difficulty setting was bugged and will be fixed in the upcoming patch, this is likely what they were talking about.
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Post by hobocommand3r on May 6, 2017 9:55:47 GMT
So if i play on normal i loose whole 75 (SEVENTY FIVE) points of damage. In gold where mooks have 2000+ health it seems rather insignificant although still extremely stupid. ANd I've had people trying to tell me that casters aren't bad in this game. When combos do 350 damage max? That's 1/3rd of a vanquisher shot. What were they thinking when they came up with these numbers?
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Post by Kenny Bania on May 6, 2017 9:59:09 GMT
One hypothetical possibility is that some intern was responsible for this part of the combos and actually did a good job, they do scale with difficulty. So, technically speaking, there is nothing wrong with them combos. Wrong difficulty, not his/her fault. Probably reported as working as intended and everything is peachy, even got some bonus paycheck for job well done. Now, weapons with focus in DAIMP, that is another story. I'm still puzzled at finding any explanation for that. Especially considering it was never fixed. When they say that combo damage scaling per difficulty setting was bugged and will be fixed in the upcoming patch, this is likely what they were talking about. Yeah, you're probably right.
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Post by kalil on May 6, 2017 9:59:16 GMT
So if i play on normal i loose whole 75 (SEVENTY FIVE) points of damage. In gold where mooks have 2000+ health it seems rather insignificant although still extremely stupid. ANd I've had people trying to tell me that casters aren't bad in this game. When combos do 350 damage max? That's 1/3rd of a vanquisher shot. What were they thinking when they came up with these numbers? Well. They are good on AA since she can pop them once per second while constantly refreshing her shields.
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Post by hobocommand3r on May 6, 2017 10:04:47 GMT
ANd I've had people trying to tell me that casters aren't bad in this game. When combos do 350 damage max? That's 1/3rd of a vanquisher shot. What were they thinking when they came up with these numbers? Well. They are good on AA since she can pop them once per second while constantly refreshing her shields. There's a cooldown before you can detonate the same target again and I feel like it's longer than a second. Personally i feel that when I play AA comboing is usually a waste since it tends to just ragdoll enemies unless it's lance and even then time spent lancing is time spent where you could have been shooting them with something like a piranha/talon/hurricane while they are 40% debuffed and that would yield much better damage than wasting time comboing them. I believe comboing them takes away the annihilation debuff untill it reapplies and you are able to combo them again as well so that's another negative. Asari adept is a good character but if you took away the 40% debuff from annihilation field and just left her with her comboing abilities she'd be a lot less good.
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Post by kalil on May 6, 2017 10:09:52 GMT
Well. They are good on AA since she can pop them once per second while constantly refreshing her shields. There's a cooldown before you can detonate the same target again and I feel like it's longer than a second. Personally i feel that when I play AA comboing is usually a waste since it tends to just ragdoll enemies unless it's lance and even then time spent lancing is time spent where you could have been shooting them with something like a piranha/talon/hurricane while they are 40% debuffed and that would yield much better damage than wasting time comboing them. I believe comboing them takes away the annihilation debuff untill it reapplies and you are able to combo them again as well so that's another negative. Principally I agree with you: Combos sucks fiend-ass. And it is boring as an ascendant orb. But BW will need to take the weird mechanics of the AA into account. If they just buff the combo damage by 50% or something the AA will break the game in half. Possible fix would be to make shield powered lance a weak detonator (like shockwave) while buffing raw combo damage so the AA is kept largely unchanged while buffing all other combos significantly.
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Post by hobocommand3r on May 6, 2017 10:12:41 GMT
There's a cooldown before you can detonate the same target again and I feel like it's longer than a second. Personally i feel that when I play AA comboing is usually a waste since it tends to just ragdoll enemies unless it's lance and even then time spent lancing is time spent where you could have been shooting them with something like a piranha/talon/hurricane while they are 40% debuffed and that would yield much better damage than wasting time comboing them. I believe comboing them takes away the annihilation debuff untill it reapplies and you are able to combo them again as well so that's another negative. Principally I agree with you: Combos sucks fiend-ass. And it is boring as an ascendant orb. But BW will need to take the weird mechanics of the AA into account. If they just buff the combo damage by 50% or something the AA will break the game in half. Possible fix would be to make shield powered lance a weak detonator (like shockwave) while buffing raw combo damage so the AA is kept largely unchanged while buffing all other combos significantly. I see what you are saying there. A shield powered lance build could definately have potential to become pretty OP if combos were buffed as much as they should be.
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Post by xaijin on May 6, 2017 10:56:48 GMT
So if i play on normal i loose whole 75 (SEVENTY FIVE) points of damage. In gold where mooks have 2000+ health it seems rather insignificant although still extremely stupid. ANd I've had people trying to tell me that casters aren't bad in this game. When combos do 350 damage max? That's 1/3rd of a vanquisher shot. What were they thinking when they came up with these numbers? imgur.com/9XQ0Xzd imgur.com/s1CXwB2
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Post by s0ulbearer on May 6, 2017 11:22:18 GMT
Well...
This blows my mind.
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Gigavorcha Breeder
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
Origin: Stysiaq
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Post by stysiaq on May 6, 2017 11:42:03 GMT
![](https://previews.123rf.com/images/iconicbestiary/iconicbestiary1612/iconicbestiary161200258/67653474-Young-school-kid-girl-studying-sitting-in-front-of-desktop-computer-at-her-home-desk-Doing-homework--Stock-Vector.jpg) LOOK MOM I AM A SENIOR ENGINE DEVELOPER ![](http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/001/094/858/dae.jpg)
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Post by Jeremiah12LGeek on May 6, 2017 11:56:12 GMT
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Post by shinobiwan on May 6, 2017 12:12:22 GMT
This may explain why they can't just effect server-side balance changes. The coding in this game is probably completely fucked.
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SentinelBorg
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Post by SentinelBorg on May 6, 2017 12:54:20 GMT
Well, that explains why Combos were never that weak for me. Insanity from my first minute in SP. Also explains why the Combos on my Krogan Engineer seemed to be that much stronger than the ones of my Human Sentinel.
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Post by huntedhunt on May 6, 2017 13:16:09 GMT
Right now (patch 1.05) the match host's single player difficulty setting determines ALL base combo damage in the game (affects all players present). Ah... Woke up to see the mystery was solved by crowd-sourcing - awesome! Turns out finally giving the SP a try and starting my first playthrough on Insanity was a good decision for me last month, despite the grind ![:o](//storage.proboards.com/6576594/images/aCYreiXWLepPDsSBAqBw.png) Also explains why combos in SP didn't feel any better - even at lowish level enemies feel like they have much more health on Insanity in comparison to gold. And this does seem to take the cake (so far) as the weirdest thing in MP. Same, and that's saying something given the stuff I've seen: ANd I've had people trying to tell me that casters aren't bad in this game. When combos do 350 damage max? That's 1/3rd of a vanquisher shot. What were they thinking when they came up with these numbers? What's funny is the whole throw -> ED combo including the 350 insanity damage was doing exactly the same for me as a single unmodded vanquisher X bodyshot (810). Even fully ranked, the combo probably won't touch a headshot and requires a mook to begin with, then has a cooldown whereas the vanq has 3 more bullets to spend. ... On a caster, not even a weapons platform.
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Post by CHRrOME on May 6, 2017 13:24:03 GMT
What happens when someone's never played SP? You should try, if anything to discover how the Mattock can actually kill stuff. It's shocking.
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