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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2021 16:00:51 GMT
I wont deny I am a troll but I really am trying to have an actual conversation with this question. While trying to do it in a way that doesn't get the mods panties in a bunch.
I am curious where the line is draw for representation in terms of sexuality. I love big boobs, giant, real, fake huge fucking boobs, it is my sexuality, I would argue it as part as my sexuality just like that a gay man finds a penis attractive on another male. The closest Bioware has gotten was Isabela, but even then I'd say they were a little too small for me. As you can tell by my name I am in a small niche of dudes who would rather engage in mammary intercourse than vaginal. Is this not the same as a gay man wanting a gay LI? Or for a transexual individual to want to have representation?
Is the line orientation and not fetishism? I would argue that my orientation is based on breast size. I would have mammary intercourse with Nicki Valentina Rose even though she is transexual.
What are your guys(and gals) thoughts.
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Post by 10k on May 8, 2021 16:25:27 GMT
I would say that line is drawn where ever a developer of a game sees fit. This has become a touchy subject in gaming, because players can become offended by the appearance of a character. For me personally I don't care, at the end of the day it's a bunch of pixels on screen, and most sexual encounters and romances in games are cringe. Though I'd prefer if body parts on characters tend to stay on the less exaggerated side, mostly because I like when games stick to realism as much as possible.
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Post by Son of Dorn on May 8, 2021 16:39:09 GMT
I would say that line is drawn where ever a developer of a game sees fit. This has become a touchy subject in gaming, because players can become offended by the appearance of a character. For me personally I don't care, at the end of the day it's a bunch of pixels on screen, and most sexual encounters and romances in games are cringe. Though I'd prefer if body parts on characters tend to stay on the less exaggerated side, mostly because I like when games stick to realism as much as possible. Or download some mods if you want to go overboard on the sexuality.
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Post by kotoreffect3 on May 8, 2021 16:48:13 GMT
Eh to each their own but at the end of the day it is up to the developer to decide how much sex appeal they want in their games. I will never complain about a game having sex appeal but it isn't why I play games and is not even close to being a deciding factor when it comes to what games I play.
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Post by smilesja on May 8, 2021 17:28:43 GMT
As long as it serves a story, I don't mind utilizing any tropes because after all they are tools. I also don't mind fanservice because play games to escape at the end of the day. I do like me some sexualized characters at times. However that won't stop me from pointing some unfortunate mishaps or fumbles that writers can employ that could offend a person.
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2021 17:41:40 GMT
The problem is puritanism. It has always been a major problem, and until we kill it it will always be a problem. Burn them like they burned witches, imo, because they are the true heretics against humanity.
Despite being a white male, I am nothing like the "white male" trope. That trope is based on puritans that ruin things for thee, because.
Tipper Gore really inflamed this in the 90s, and then we had 2Live Crew reminding us to fuck Martinez and Navarro. Fuck them all.
We can do whatever the fuck we want to do at home, and no overseeing board should be dictating what content is or is not acceptable for the masses. Parents need to be parents and be involved, mindful and aware, or they can go to hell - they shouldn't have had children if they didn't want to raise them.
This is the problem. Entitled people need society to protect their children from penises because they can't be bothered to do that themselves.
/rant
I also like romances in games, I like boobs, I like interesting female characters that can kick my ass - be it mentally, or physically. I like vulnerability too. I like good characters.
If the tethers were off, you would have a better chance finding this sort of stuff. As long as we have angry lazy parents, gaming is fucked.
So we're fucked.
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Post by jrpN7 on May 8, 2021 18:21:35 GMT
I don't think sexual fetishes within your sexuality is the same thing as representation for your sexuality.
Being into big boobs and wanting more big boobs in your games is not the same as gay players wanting a gay characters/relationships in their games because it's never a question on whether you'll have straight representation. That's a given. In fact, it is such a given that you can even request big boobs. Gay men could never be taken seriously for asking for big bulges on male characters in games. It's like pulling teeth trying to get devs to simply understand we want masculine male characters kissing other masculine males. We can barely get a gay relationship that counts as an achievement/trophy without causing a ruckus.
Big boobs are just a perk.
That said, I do ultimately play games for the story and not sexualized content- but I do tend to enjoy games better if they have masculine gay representation (mShenko in ME3).
Must add I do hate prudes.
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2021 18:59:57 GMT
I didn't like it when Kaidan came on to me in ME3. It was abrupt, and after ME2 and his idiocy with Udina, not on the top of my list and that Shep happened to be straight.
If he had come on to me in ME1 when he turned to face me like a SexBot on the lower deck, maybe he could have turned me then, I dunno. But he would have had a chance in 3.
I want everything to be represented, and represented with respect. Some of it needs proper context - I can see transexuals engaging in combat wearing armor and dealing damage just fine. I have an issue with drag queens in full drag going to war, but that is because it makes no sense. I have no problem with the queen joining the fray after the tuck, but she should be fabulous when she is being fabulous.
It's all context dependent. What is the scope of the game? Can we include everyone with respect without breaking story elements or being hammy/shoehorning rather than being properly inclusive?
In Mass Effect for example, Andromeda shoehorned the T pretty hard in my opinion. Could have been done much better, and then anyone who had a problem with the character would be more obviously just a bigot, rather than potentially an actual thinker critical of poor writing.
Let there be platonic "romance" options too. Some people aren't into all of this nonsense, and they should have an easy way to opt out of it and be rewarded with some good development in the actual friendship between PC and NPC. Which, as corny as it might sound to some is something I think is missing in all BioWare romances (more friendship, especially post-bang) and I would enjoy having this option very much if it was done with respect and effort.
Let's bang, ok?
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Post by colfoley on May 8, 2021 19:13:57 GMT
I mean i never play me anyways so my orientayion is irrelevant
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Post by SirSourpuss on May 9, 2021 1:27:37 GMT
I do believe there wasn't enough diversity and representation in ME. That's why I always interpreted Kalros as a transgender womxn of colour. Now it's canon. Really problematic how Bioware killed her off ...
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Post by Element Zero on May 9, 2021 2:49:57 GMT
Well, I learned a new word in this thread. I guess that's something. 😕
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Post by colfoley on May 9, 2021 3:07:18 GMT
Well, I learned a new word in this thread. I guess that's something. 😕 always fun when that happens.
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Post by sassafrassa on May 9, 2021 3:23:48 GMT
I think sexuality in games should be geared towards the primary demographic who will actually play the game.
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2021 4:02:48 GMT
I think sexuality in games should be geared towards the primary demographic who will actually play the game. Get this logic out of here!
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Post by NotN7 on May 9, 2021 4:24:09 GMT
I think sexuality in games should be geared towards the primary demographic who will actually play the game. And whom would that be? seeing, we other than those who voice their preference here on the boards ? so please define primary demographic players.
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Post by michaeln7 on May 9, 2021 5:41:54 GMT
The problem is puritanism. It has always been a major problem, and until we kill it it will always be a problem. Burn them like they burned witches, imo, because they are the true heretics against humanity. Despite being a white male, I am nothing like the "white male" trope. That trope is based on puritans that ruin things for thee, because. Tipper Gore really inflamed this in the 90s, and then we had 2Live Crew reminding us to fuck Martinez and Navarro. Fuck them all. We can do whatever the fuck we want to do at home, and no overseeing board should be dictating what content is or is not acceptable for the masses. Parents need to be parents and be involved, mindful and aware, or they can go to hell - they shouldn't have had children if they didn't want to raise them. This is the problem. Entitled people need society to protect their children from penises because they can't be bothered to do that themselves. /rant I also like romances in games, I like boobs, I like interesting female characters that can kick my ass - be it mentally, or physically. I like vulnerability too. I like good characters. If the tethers were off, you would have a better chance finding this sort of stuff. As long as we have angry lazy parents, gaming is fucked. So we're fucked. Perhaps not how I would have phrased it, but if I'm understanding what you're saying (please correct me if I'm not), then I think we're in agreement. I do not like fanaticism. It's one of the four things I despise; Tyranny, Racism, Sexism, Fanaticism. I don't care what form it takes, whether it's red-n-black armbands or twisting religious iconography or cloaks itself in pretty words, if it takes any of those four forms then I don't like it. As for female characters, this is why I like Cora. She's strong (both physically and mentally), but she isn't a jerk about it. Being strong and being obnoxious are not the same. Yes, her borderline devotion to the Asari way of doing things can be odd, but her character development is, in my opinion, very well done. She recognizes the value in what she was taught as a commando, but isn't bound to it needlessly. That, and she wants to grow a rose garden. Call me old-fashioned, but that's hot. A pretty lady liking flowers is something I'm drawn to; if she were a redhead that would only make her more attractive. (I'm a sucker for redheads). It's also why I like Miranda. Yes, she's very snobbish at first, but SHE CAN BACK IT UP. As someone once told me, "It's not boasting if it's fact." So while it's not the most pleasant, she pulls her own weight and performs a valuable function for the team. There's a reason she's a permanent squadmate in my team along with Garrus. Not only that, but her struggle with her being 'engineered' is something I can actually relate to. Not that I'm some semi-superhuman, but I do know what it's like to deal with having the expectation of the exceptional on your shoulders 24-7, and how even the smallest failure feels catastrophically disproportionate. Furthermore, the fact that she's willing to defer to my command (what with being in charge of the mission and all) AND is willing to speak her mind only increases my attraction to her. At the risk of stating the obvious, I don't actually have any real attraction to these characters, because as everyone already knows, they're just pixels on a screen. But there's my two cents (plus interest).
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Post by michaeln7 on May 9, 2021 7:36:04 GMT
Addendum: I also like Yvonne Strahovski's accent. A light Australian, soft Russian, and/or posh British accents on ladies are something I find attractive. Yes, yes, I know. I'm so square I could be used to make right angles.
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Post by helios969 on May 9, 2021 7:57:50 GMT
Personally I think big boobs are overrated (particularly fake ones) and find there are far more interesting things on a woman's body. In terms of videogames I think the best approach is to keep things at a range of normalcy...small variations in height, weight, and proportions. Attractive faces are the bigger must. Actual sex scenes are a waste of resources, mostly cringy, and better done if you fade to black. I'd rather see hugs, cuddling, and walking hand-in-hand for romance representation.
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Post by SofaJockey on May 9, 2021 8:43:41 GMT
I wont deny I am a troll but I really am trying to have an actual conversation with this question. While trying to do it in a way that doesn't get the mods panties in a bunch. It's an interesting question and your attempt to do it without the thread going down in flames is appreciated. I really like that BioWare tries to give everyone a game where they can be represented, have a romance and to be fair to everyone without unreasonable objectification. Now BioWare doesn't always get it right, but I appreciate the attempt. I'm no fan of puritanism. I personally had a European upbringing where nudity and sex were appropriately discussed from childhood, and representing that in-game is perfectly fine. I'd like to see everyone get an equal ride, basically.
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Post by colfoley on May 9, 2021 9:41:40 GMT
I wont deny I am a troll but I really am trying to have an actual conversation with this question. While trying to do it in a way that doesn't get the mods panties in a bunch. It's an interesting question and your attempt to do it without the thread going down in flames is appreciated. I really like that BioWare tries to give everyone a game where they can be represented, have a romance and to be fair to everyone without unreasonable objectification. Now BioWare doesn't always get it right, but I appreciate the attempt. I'm no fan of puritanism. I personally had a European upbringing where nudity and sex were appropriately discussed from childhood, and representing that in-game is perfectly fine. I'd like to see everyone get an equal ride, basically. Was that intentional? In other words...giggity.
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Post by SofaJockey on May 9, 2021 11:11:26 GMT
In other words...giggity. The problem with the notion 'make it just for the main/target audience' is that this proposal is just selfish entitlement. The real target audience is everyone who would enjoy playing the game. And the more 'space passion' that allows, the better in my book.
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Post by SirSourpuss on May 9, 2021 11:23:11 GMT
In other words...giggity. The problem with the notion 'make it just for the main/target audience' is that this proposal is just selfish entitlement. The real target audience is everyone who would enjoy playing the game. And the more 'space passion' that allows, the better in my book. For me, it depends if you're doing it for accuracy, tokenism, or pandering. In my experience, it's usually one of the latter two. Or both.
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Post by SofaJockey on May 9, 2021 11:30:59 GMT
For me, it depends if you're doing it for accuracy, tokenism, or pandering. In my experience, it's usually one of the latter two. Or both. You're welcome to your view, but I think it's seriously flawed. Not sure what 'accuracy' means but for a future space fantasy, species having thrown off the repressed bigotry of the past seems to be accurate. 'Tokenism' doesn't appear to apply as I can see no evidence that BioWare are not entirely genuine in their purpose. As for 'pandering' that's a phrase I usually find used by bigoted players too busy whining that the game isn't customised to them, so I'm not convinced it's a meaningful criticism. So no, I find the latter two don't apply here and the first is accidental. The reason why these choices and options exist seem to me to be simply to allow many different people to play and enjoy the game.
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Post by SirSourpuss on May 9, 2021 11:43:23 GMT
For me, it depends if you're doing it for accuracy, tokenism, or pandering. In my experience, it's usually one of the latter two. Or both. You're welcome to your view, but I think it's seriously flawed. Not sure what 'accuracy' means but for a future space fantasy, species having thrown off the repressed bigotry of the past seems to be accurate. 'Tokenism' doesn't appear to apply as I can see no evidence that BioWare are not entirely genuine in their purpose. As for 'pandering' that's a phrase I usually find used by bigoted players too busy whining that the game isn't customised to them, so I'm not convinced it's a meaningful criticism. So no, I find the latter two don't apply here and the first is accidental. The reason why these choices and options exist seem to me to be simply to allow many different people to play and enjoy the game. I'm not pointing fingers, nor accusing Bioware specifically of doing anything of the above. But just because of "thrown off bigotry" doesn't mean everyone is automatically bi, in the least. As for "pandering", I've been told that it's bad, but only if it panders to me. And what panders to me, is the OT cast and all the colours of the rainbow that go along with them. So if that is bigotry, then I'm bigot.
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Post by SofaJockey on May 9, 2021 12:09:57 GMT
The I think we agree then. We could discuss player-sexuality (but that's a huge topic by itself). I rather like characters that have their own drives (and are not simply a toy for the player character). To my mind, game bigotry (entitlement could be another term) is simply insisting that other players can't play their way if that's different to how they play. I usually play paragon, but I don't want renegade to be removed because the choice is important even if I don't choose it.
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