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Post by Catilina on Apr 4, 2017 19:40:45 GMT
With regard to Cullen's age in DAO, according to WoT2 he was eight years old when he declared to his family he wanted to be a Templar and ten years later he achieved his aim. He was assigned to Kinloch Hold and barely a year later the 5th Blight began. So in fact that would make him 19 in DAO. I certainly took him to be around the same age as my Surana and that she could not have been more than her late teens because she was only just taking her Harrowing and they usually seem to want them to have done so before they reach the end of their teens. Bethany was considered old to be only just taking her Harrowing in DA2 and yet she would have been 21 at the most (She was born in 9:11). The issues concerning the dangers of mages seemed to me to be far better handled in DAO. I still didn't feel it justified locking people up for their entire lives or making people Tranquil, particularly against their will as they were going to do with Jowan, but I could at least see how they could feel that way after things went so horribly wrong in the Circle Tower and with Connor in Redcliffe. I also sympathised with the Templars because I felt the Chantry were abusing them with lyrium addiction, since Alistair suggested he thought it wasn't necessary for their work (subsequently denied by the writers) and it was just a convenient way of controlling them. So basically both mages and Templars were being screwed over by the Chantry. Then in DA2 all semblance of balance and nuance in the debate was lost because both sides were taken to extremes of behaviour. However, I always end up supporting the mages because it is quite clear that the annulment is illegal and all the dangerous mages causing trouble in the city, including Anders, were always outside the Circle, not in it. Even Chantry supporter Sebastian could see that. Nevertheless, I really resented the fact that it was implied, even by Varric, that I was supporting "dangerous people running amok" by doing so and that I condoned bombing the Chantry, which I didn't. I was defending innocent people from being unjustly slaughtered, including my sister if I wasn't a mage.The same thing happened with DAI. I could justify going to the Templars instead of the mages for assistance with the Breach, for several good reasons, none of which meant that I actually supported the Templars or the Chantry but it was implied that in going to the Templars I did. Still at least I was able to disband the Templar order as too corrupt to be fixed and it did mean that in the future Fiona would not be leading the mages (her being left leading them was always the most annoying part of taking the mage path). I also always tell Cullen to kick the lyrium habit no matter which side I choose. I must admit I think his is one of the better story arcs. His attitude in DA2 was understandable considering what he went through in Kinloch Hold and yet he ultimately does overcome the mental problems that episode (and the lyrium addiction) inflicted on him. I respect him but I have never romanced him, so it was not his looks that influenced my views about him. That "dangerous people running amok" from Varric, was not related to Anders, was related to the Mages. Varric supports rather the Templars, than the Mages. Varric love Kirkwall, and think, that the Templars is the key to save Kirkwall, but when he say this, he don't know enough about Meredith's madness... but still, Varric is benevolent, but likes the stability. (Varric is the avatar of writers.)
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2017 19:56:32 GMT
I mean I did not like the endings doled out for my characters, and I don't feel like I have done anything to deserve it. I've searched the net and saw some folks expressing the same feeling of empty disappointment as I did with the Trespasser ending. If I am going to replay any of the DA franchise I am going to stick to DA2. Hawke's the only one DA protagonist who ended up with something I liked the way I played the game. So, yeah, disappointed.
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Post by phoray on Apr 5, 2017 18:30:21 GMT
Speak for yerself. My Warden is living in a manor by the Waking Sea with his lady love. Yes, it's just awesome how you can get punished for picking the wrong gender and race character. High five for gritty realism. Evildude is talking about a head canon. Which supports my suggestion that Bioware DA team has left a lot of things vague enough to allow a lot of characters happy endings. Either evildude is talking about Morrigan, who is left to her own devices at the end of main game, or Leliana after she's retired and given her stuff over to Scout Harding. I suspect Morrigan though. Now that the kid doesn't have an old god soul, one could canon easily a relatively normal ish life for the little family. But Morrigan has had a bit in all three games- Dorian has only been in one. It could be that once he straitens out Tevinter mess, he will get a happy epilogue slide about reuniting with the Inquisitor. Don't count your happy ending out. Edit Add: Oops. I learn more every day. Apparently a retired LEliana gets an epilogue slide about getting back with the Warden. That's sweet. I'll have to take that into consideration of my canon world state that has a female dwarf romancing her. Still, the morrigan thing is also possible. And this just supports that Dorian/Quiz will get their happy epilogue at end of DA4.
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Post by phoray on Apr 5, 2017 18:38:40 GMT
I mean I did not like the endings doled out for my characters, and I don't feel like I have done anything to deserve it. I've searched the net and saw some folks expressing the same feeling of empty disappointment as I did with the Trespasser ending. If I am going to replay any of the DA franchise I am going to stick to DA2. Hawke's the only one DA protagonist who ended up with something I liked the way I played the game. So, yeah, disappointed. I think a similar feeling about Dorian has been expressed by gervaise21 but they wrote some really good fanfiction (so good I can't read it or I will stop writing my own fanfiction) to help them roll it into something great. People have been similarly disappointed that Cass apparently breaks up with you to become Divine. OR, sans that, she starts rebuilding the Seekers- and you are not in the picture with her so you have to kinda canon that you two are just being busy and apart. Josephine also parts from the Quiz to go build her family's fortune. There is absolutely no reason why you can't be helping her with that. PErhaps it's not so much the gender here, but the LI. If you meet someone who has grand dreams of changing the world or a time consuming pet project-- don't be surprised that they go off to focus on that for a while when you encourage them and support them to do it. Blackwall wants to give himself to helping those on a dark path. You get to tag along. lovely ending. Cullen wants to focus on family- Rosy ending there. Sera invites you openly to do her job with her, but she takes it well even when you decline. I dunno what Iron Bull does... hahaha Invite you to be part of the Chargers I think? so good ending there. So, out of the ones listed, 3/7 have grandiose plans that take them apart from the Quiz.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2017 19:22:37 GMT
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Post by phoray on Apr 5, 2017 19:26:06 GMT
My ignorance of the other romance outcomes must be fixed.------------------By yet more DAI playthroughs. Okay. Then Add solas to the Non Standard romance endings. He also falls into grand dreams of changing the world group. 3/8
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2017 19:37:19 GMT
My ignorance of the other romance outcomes must be fixed.------------------By yet more DAI playthroughs. :yas: Okay. Then Add solas to the Non Standard romance endings. He also falls into grand dreams of changing the world group. 3/8 But he has a reason to walk away. Don't know about Cassandra's, but Dorian's sound like he is trying to tactfully untangle himself from the inconvenient affair. Also, dunno about Cassandra, but Dorian was preparing that strategic retreat for the full length of the Trespasser. Iron Bull's and Dorian's romantic ending implies equality - they both try to find a moment to meet half-way on the border, and Bull gets to roll in and heroically rescue Dorian. Inquisitor sounds like an obsessive ex, calling Dorian in the middle of Important Work he is doing for the New Way Party in Tevinter, with his new larger than life famous partner there (apparently from a comic book or something) and sneaking into the city by night because he just cannot stay away.
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Post by Catilina on Apr 5, 2017 19:41:10 GMT
I mean I did not like the endings doled out for my characters, and I don't feel like I have done anything to deserve it. I've searched the net and saw some folks expressing the same feeling of empty disappointment as I did with the Trespasser ending. If I am going to replay any of the DA franchise I am going to stick to DA2. Hawke's the only one DA protagonist who ended up with something I liked the way I played the game. So, yeah, disappointed. I think a similar feeling about Dorian has been expressed by gervaise21 but they wrote some really good fanfiction (so good I can't read it or I will stop writing my own fanfiction) to help them roll it into something great. People have been similarly disappointed that Cass apparently breaks up with you to become Divine. OR, sans that, she starts rebuilding the Seekers- and you are not in the picture with her so you have to kinda canon that you two are just being busy and apart. Josephine also parts from the Quiz to go build her family's fortune. There is absolutely no reason why you can't be helping her with that. PErhaps it's not so much the gender here, but the LI. If you meet someone who has grand dreams of changing the world or a time consuming pet project-- don't be surprised that they go off to focus on that for a while when you encourage them and support them to do it. Blackwall wants to give himself to helping those on a dark path. You get to tag along. lovely ending. Cullen wants to focus on family- Rosy ending there. Sera invites you openly to do her job with her, but she takes it well even when you decline. I dunno what Iron Bull does... hahaha Invite you to be part of the Chargers I think? so good ending there. So, out of the ones listed, 3/7 have grandiose plans that take them apart from the Quiz. About Dorian: the Inquisitor can disband the Inquisition, and join to Dorian in Tevinter. He refused him, justifying this decision with his concerns, that someone will assassination his love. Sorry, but I always felt that this bullshit, and felt, my Inquisitor is a burden to him. An attack surface, "what" interfere with the work of. As a Lavellan, this was disappointing. As a Vashoth mercenary probably somehow understandable. But if I would romance him with Trevelyan, I suppose, I would very angry. In Cassandra's position (Divine) the refusal was more understandable. Bull and Issaar stayed together, just the duty called away from them apart time to time.
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Post by midnight tea on Apr 5, 2017 19:46:46 GMT
I'd say that with the Trespasser ending as it did, the well-being of Inquisitor and how their story/love-life ends still awaits conclusion.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2017 19:54:12 GMT
EDIT: Also, the way Dorian's romance unfolded, I had a very odd impression.
Initially Dorian gets offended if the Inquisitor suggests keeping it casual and non-committal. He says his previous affairs were for pleasure. It seems like he is reaching out for a more committed relationship, but then, in the end of the game, he sort of starts keeping the Inquisitor at an arm's length. He says: "Ask me after we defeat Corypheus about the plans for the future." and then he starts packing for Tevinter, and keeps refusing to entertain the notion of the Inquisitor following. When he believes that the inquisitor is dying, he bursts out into the: "You bastard, I knew you'd break my heart!"
So what I am seeing is a man who really wanted to see if he can manage a long-term relationship, and is running from it once he did find someone he does care about and who is willing to really love him. He is either scared, or the thrill of the forbidden passion wore off, and he is thinking about the future of House Pavus. If it's the later, I'd rather he'd pulled Alistair... which would be hilarious on so many levels (can I pick them or what?!)
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Post by Catilina on Apr 5, 2017 19:59:10 GMT
EDIT: Also, the way Dorian's romance unfolded, I had a very odd impression. Initially Dorian gets offended if the Inquisitor suggests keeping it casual and non-committal. He says his previous affairs were for pleasure. It seems like he is reaching out for a more committed relationship, but then, in the end of the game, he sort of starts keeping the Inquisitor at an arm's length. He says: "Ask me after we defeat Corypheus about the plans for the future." and then he starts packing for Tevinter, and keeps refusing to entertain the notion of the Inquisitor following. When he believes that the inquisitor is dying, he bursts out into the: You bastard, I knew you'd break my heart!" So what I am seeing is a man who really wanted to see if he can manage a long-term relationship, and is running from it once he found someone he does care about and who is willing to really love him. Either that, or the thrill of the forbidden passion has passed and he is thinking about the future of House Pavus. As I recall, he said he will do everything As I recall, he said he will do everything for his homeland. So: he will marry into a powerful, noble family.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2017 20:09:14 GMT
EDIT: Also, the way Dorian's romance unfolded, I had a very odd impression. Initially Dorian gets offended if the Inquisitor suggests keeping it casual and non-committal. He says his previous affairs were for pleasure. It seems like he is reaching out for a more committed relationship, but then, in the end of the game, he sort of starts keeping the Inquisitor at an arm's length. He says: "Ask me after we defeat Corypheus about the plans for the future." and then he starts packing for Tevinter, and keeps refusing to entertain the notion of the Inquisitor following. When he believes that the inquisitor is dying, he bursts out into the: You bastard, I knew you'd break my heart!" So what I am seeing is a man who really wanted to see if he can manage a long-term relationship, and is running from it once he found someone he does care about and who is willing to really love him. Either that, or the thrill of the forbidden passion has passed and he is thinking about the future of House Pavus. As I recall, he said he will do everything As I recall, he said he will do everything for his homeland. So: he will marry into a powerful, noble family. He has options. Tevinter is based on the Roman society where adoption from a junior branch is common-place even to assure the succession for the Emperor himself, let alone a senator. If they introduced that, it would not have been world-shattering. After his quest, and his father's death, Dorian clams up about his plans. He also (unlike Gil) never mentions if having a child of his own body is at all calling to him. So we simply do not know anything save for BioWARe's unwavering desire to have him in Tevinter, and in a position of authority (most likely) when DA4 starts. So, we do not know if Pavus succession subplot is going to continue, or if it is too minor to make into a plot-line. Romance itself though, ends on an uncertain note, despite them trying to show the couple together. The way the game ended, I am starting to slowly rewrite it in my head with Dorian as a protagonist, and the Inquisitor - as a character whose importance in his story I do not understand yet.
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Post by phoray on Apr 5, 2017 20:11:06 GMT
Catilina@domi you two are head canoning some really mean Dorian Actions. I prefer Gervaise's Fanfiction. I still haven't done him myself to have a true understanding of what he seems to be saying/implying. Now I can't wait. Sounds like some lovely drama.
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Post by Catilina on Apr 5, 2017 20:12:29 GMT
As I recall, he said he will do everything As I recall, he said he will do everything for his homeland. So: he will marry into a powerful, noble family. He has options. Tevinter is based on the Roman society where adoption from a junior branch is common-place even to assure the succession for the Emperor himself, let alone a senator. If they introduced that, it would not have been world-shattering. After his quest, and his father's death, Dorian clams up about his plans. He also (unlike Gil) never mentions if having a child of his own body is at all calling to him. So we simply do not know anything save for BioWARe's unwavering desire to have him in Tevinter, and in a position of authority (most likely) when DA4 starts. So, we do not know if Pavus succession subplot is going to continue, or if it is too minor to make into a plot-line. Romance itself though, ends on an uncertain note, despite them trying to show the couple together. It's better to prepare for everything.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2017 20:17:14 GMT
Catilina@domi you two are head canoning some really mean Dorian Actions. I prefer Gervaise's Fanfiction. I still haven't done him myself to have a true understanding of what he seems to be saying/implying. Now I can't wait. Sounds like some lovely drama. :hue: It's not really mean. I think they had a conflict between wanting a meaningful love story, and moving Dorian onward to his Plot Important Position. They also gave Dorian the NPC-NPC romance which does not make it easier for them to account for in the sequel if Dorian is coming back. I am not unhappy about how they treat Dorian, it is about the Inquisitor again who comes across as pathetic. If Dorian is a hot/cold guy with a habit of relying on distance, chasing after/keeping in touch is a horrible idea. It also does not help that after killing the Iron Bull, Dorian sort of prods his corpse with the toe of his boot and exclaims something to the extent of: "Those Qunari! You manage to come to trust one, and you get disappointed!" Right into your Kossit (however you spell it) face. After close to three years together. Overall, the game is set-up with the idea in mind that Dorian and the Iron Bull may start that Qunari-Vinter star-crossed love-affair, and I think they keep forgetting that he can romance the Qunari PC.
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Post by shechinah on Apr 5, 2017 20:57:40 GMT
It also does not help that after killing the Iron Bull, Dorian sort of prods his corpse with the toe of his boot and exclaims something to the extent of: "Those Qunari! You manage to come to trust one, and you get disappointed!" Right into your Kossit (however you spell it) face. After close to three years together. As far as I know, Dorian is referring to Qunari as in the Qun, not as in the qunari (kossith) race.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2017 21:27:41 GMT
It also does not help that after killing the Iron Bull, Dorian sort of prods his corpse with the toe of his boot and exclaims something to the extent of: "Those Qunari! You manage to come to trust one, and you get disappointed!" Right into your Kossit (however you spell it) face. After close to three years together. As far as I know, Dorian is referring to Qunari as in the Qun, not as in the qunari (kossith) race. Nobody makes this fine distinction in the game, save for one convo option with the IB where he informs the Inquisitor about him not being Qunari. Also, at that point, and I have checked my DAK, the IB is TV. Earlier on, Dorian uses Qunari and oxmen interchangably, so I think he refers to the race, particularly because Qunari troops there are all Kossith. Finally, in the conversation where Dorian comments specifically on the inquisitor's race (you are so incredibly large) the word used by both is Qunari, not Kossith. So, I believe, it's race, not faith he is commenting on. When someone cusses out the evil commies, I don't take it that they limit their insults to the card carrying members of the Communist Party, I am positive they mean the Russians. It is funny, because he is quick to point out that A Tevinter is not necessary an evil blood Mage, and it makes him more human.
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Post by azuremazey on Apr 7, 2017 0:45:48 GMT
I enjoy it actually. I think I might be easily entertained, though. I liked the characters and some of my spell ability animations looked really cool. I'd like to play it again, but as a rogue or something.
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Post by kotoreffect3 on Apr 24, 2017 0:28:30 GMT
Not really a disappointment but it's got it's flaws which are related to bioware's bigger is better mindset. Though I think after MEA they won't have that mindset anymore.
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Post by mike3207 on Apr 24, 2017 4:41:15 GMT
No, because I expected Bioware would not make as good a game as Dragon Age Origins, and I was not disappointed that it wasn't. A total different case from DA2 where I did expect it would be as good as Origins or better, and was disappointed in that circumstance.
Overall, it was a good game and it brought back the PC as hero theme that was missing in DA2. I'd have liked the main quest to be longer, the side quests could have done more regarding the Inquisitor's story, and the spell system could have been done a lot better. It still did a lot right, and I enjoyed most of the adventures when I didnt get lost in the zones.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2017 20:18:34 GMT
It was a disappointment for me when I first played it as I would rather not have open world sacrifice narrative control and I didn't enjoy the subpar side quests. Yet I still played the game seven times and was mostly completionist on those play throughs except the nightmare difficulty one. While I really enjoyed TW3 and recognize it as a great game in many ways I only played through it once.
I just enjoy being able to create a character and work in a group over static solo protagonist. And I like the world building of Thedas. The themes of religion and the cast of characters were great, even if sometimes the main story was wonky (Adamant and the Fade were awesome but the stupidity of the Wardens and Erimond was irritating).
I really wish I had a PC which could play DAI and that Frostbite were easier to mod. To me, if I could eliminate respawns, have all spawned mats and quest items instead locked to a location, and could have the camera zoom in for conversations, the entire game would increase in my eyes.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2017 7:11:34 GMT
After we saw Andromeda this thread should be locked
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Post by Catilina on Apr 26, 2017 7:51:51 GMT
Yesterday I tried to continue the story of my vashoth archer, but... he has not enough point to start the Wicked Winterpalace quest. How I hate this block! I specced him to Artificer, because he had the "ingredients" for it (I bought the obsidians in the Black Emporium). Another boring method. (Willard became rift mage, for same reasons.) Certainly, everyone can believe that the Inquisitor can be learning a specialization, if s/he finds the books and collects pebbles, but it's just annoying to me.
Perhaps I need more pause.
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Post by raikas on Apr 26, 2017 14:49:40 GMT
As far as I know, Dorian is referring to Qunari as in the Qun, not as in the qunari (kossith) race. Nobody makes this fine distinction in the game, save for one convo option with the IB where he informs the Inquisitor about him not being Qunari. Also, at that point, and I have checked my DAK, the IB is TV. Earlier on, Dorian uses Qunari and oxmen interchangably, so I think he refers to the race, particularly because Qunari troops there are all Kossith. Finally, in the conversation where Dorian comments specifically on the inquisitor's race (you are so incredibly large) the word used by both is Qunari, not Kossith. I realize this is three weeks late to the conversation, but Dorian does make the distinction in the first conversation he has with a Vashoth Inquisitor in Haven - something along the lines of "You must be one of those Tal-Vashoth". No one in the games uses "Kossith", it's mentioned in the codex as an ancient term that's not in use anymore. Gaider wrote that it was never going to be used in game - obviously under other writers that might change, but in material up to and including DAI no character was going to use Kossith, so expecting them to is unrealistic.
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Post by Iakus on Apr 26, 2017 16:03:44 GMT
People have been similarly disappointed that Cass apparently breaks up with you to become Divine. OR, sans that, she starts rebuilding the Seekers- and you are not in the picture with her so you have to kinda canon that you two are just being busy and apart. With a non-Divine Cass, the romance still seems to work out: While Cassandra and the Inquisitor were often separated by duty, they still found time to be together. It was not unusual to see the Inquisitor appear unexpected at Cassandra's side - or her at his - as they worked to restore order. Those who knew her from earlier days said that while she was always true to her calling, they had never seen her smile so often.
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