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Post by commandercole5 on Mar 25, 2017 18:51:52 GMT
I was going to mention the Geth telescope thing.. but its been done. Has anyone seen an explanation for the Water and ice requirement in game yet? I'm referring to the pre release briefings where Suvi said they need helium 3, water, ice and element zero to rebuild the nexus. Helium 3 for Fusion reactors, water and ice for drinking, Ezoo because all of their tech is based on Ezoo and is apperantly used up
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Post by maximusarael020 on Mar 25, 2017 18:55:06 GMT
Well... Yes. Because of how the drives work. They don't make you go faster or anything, so using them to make other human or Batarian settlements wouldn't be sought-after because these people still want to be close to supply lines and the rest of civilization. As far as we can see in the OT there are no shortages of materials, so going far off the beaten path doesn't really grant anything to most people. As for the Quarians, sure they might get much want an ODSY drive. But these are experimental and EXPENSIVE. The Quarian fleet is centuries-old ships held together with duct tape. Where are they going to get the funds to retrofit their ships when they can barely afford to keep their ships working properly? And as they stick together as a fleet they would need to retrofit all their ships at once to make any difference. As for other explorers, who knows. Perhaps the Andromeda Initiative has a patent on the ODSY drive and aren't sharing. Maybe there are enough unexplored worlds in reach to satisfy other people. I mean, heck, we just stumbled upon Ilos, so there's obviously plenty of other things to find within reach as well. And if they had sold the tech to a small group of scientists who wanted to check out a nearby cluster not linked with a relay, they could have and Shep probably wouldn't have heard about it because why should he/she care? They don't gt you there any faster as the crow flies. But it gives you indefinite range. And given current ftl cores kill you if they run more than a couple of days, that means explored space is limited to a few lines of space. There could be any number of worlds just waiting to be colonized only a week's flight away, but totally out of reach because our drive cores WOULD KILL US if we tried to get to them. Funny thing about the quarians, they were building an ark of their own, according to MEA... There are demonstrably NOT enough garden worlds to satisfy everyone, as demonstrated by the quarians being space vagabonds (the Council won't let them settle in Citadel space) batarians and humans fighting over the Attican Traverse. The Council keeps a tight grip on the relay network, limiting exploration of it (see the First Contact War) The ODSY drive being widely available would spark a renaissance of space travel and colonization. From the codex: Citadel space is an unofficial term referring to any region of space controlled by a species that acknowledge the authority of the Citadel Council. At first glance, it appears this territory encompasses most of the galaxy. In reality, however, less than 1% of the stars have been explored. Even mass-effect-FTL drive is slow relative to the volume of the galaxy. Empty space and systems without suitable drive discharge sites are barriers to exploration. Only the mass relays allow ships to jump hundreds of light years in an instant, the key to expanding across an otherwise impassable galaxy. Whenever a new relay is activated, the destination system is rapidly developed. From that hub, FTL drive is used to expand to nearby star clusters. The result is a number of densely-developed clusters thinly spread across the vast expanse of space, connected by the mass relay network. The ODSY drive, like the Lazarus Project, is one of the greatest scientific discoveries of its time. ANd like the Lazarus Project, no one seemed to give a sh*t. I feel like Ultron talking about vibranium in AoU: "One of the most versatile substances on the planet, and they used it to make a frisbee!" Ok, first off, SPOILERS about the Quarian plans in MEA! Jeeze, dude. Thanks a lot for that tidbit. Go put that under a spoiler tag, quick! The humans and Batarians fighting over worlds is based on proximity and the fact that humans started settling where the Batarians had already claimed. The Council didn't intervene on the side of the Batarians, so they got pissy and left galactic politics. I haven't found anything about a shortage of worlds for Milky Way species, but it could be in there somewhere. Remember, they colonize along the Relay lines because it's easy! That's why most of large cities in the world are on rivers, why the biggest cities going west in the US were on railroads. It's the fastest and easiest way to move things and stay relevant. There isn't any necessity to move beyond the relay lines from what I can find in Mass Effect. And again, could be patent law, could be prohibitively expensive. The best discoveries made for the citizens of the Milky Way have always been Prothean in nature. Prothean tech is always on the Relay lines, so the chances of finding something better by randomly pointing off in a direction and using the ODSY drive to get there in the MW is a chance most investors would rather not take, I think. It's economics.
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Post by maximusarael020 on Mar 25, 2017 18:57:53 GMT
Oh it most certainly is! It is based on the lore that FTL Drives create a static charge on the ships that, when it reaches a critical point, fries all the people and tech inside the ship. So this drive is a development based on that lore in which it recycles that energy and puts it back into the drive-core. It's not magic. It's completely using previously-established lore to make the new drive. It is 100% compliant with previously-established lore. Nothing in the lore explicitly states that this technology cannot exist. It works exactly as previous lore describes the issue with FTL. But there was never a whisper of it's existence prior to MEA They also never talked about the Collectors in ME1. Or thermal clips. Or the Crucible in ME1 or 2. There were no Drell in ME1 as far as I know. Or omni-blades. There's a lot of stuff that "pops up" within the lore as the series goes on. Just because it wasn't mentioned in the first game doesn't mean it cannot exist in the lore.
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Post by jackdaniel on Mar 25, 2017 19:13:23 GMT
It's patently clear to me that the writer for this game treats setting as expendable in order to serve whatever decision they separately made. I can't see anything that shows they made extra effort to stay faithful either to existing science or the in universe science. ME1 bent over backward to make sure all the stuff in it is scientific, only making up Ezo as a plot device. But everything else is can be logically derived from EZO. Even things that never show up in game play had a thought out explaination: how laser beam diffract, how heat is managed in space, or build up of static electricity in starships. So yea, this science in this game maybe on par with a typical AAA game, but is definitely below ME standard. Examples please? I'm always just curious to see what other people have noticed. In terms of game science clashes with game story is the andromeda initiative. It's been stated that only a tiny portion of Milky Way is charted due to people relying on mass relays and not willing to open new dormant ones. This already implies that FTL engine are limited, so mass relay is key to star travel. With so much of Milky Way unexplored, and apparently huge advancement in FTL engine, sending ark ship to andromeda galaxy is kinda weird. I m not saying that this is absolutely impermissible, but the game handwaves it way to casually. On a more meta level, people on the forum defending this games flaw has already given the setting more thought and care than the writers. So while I m sure one can come up with in game reason for everything, it's BioWare's job to do it, not the players
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Post by Iakus on Mar 25, 2017 19:16:19 GMT
They don't gt you there any faster as the crow flies. But it gives you indefinite range. And given current ftl cores kill you if they run more than a couple of days, that means explored space is limited to a few lines of space. There could be any number of worlds just waiting to be colonized only a week's flight away, but totally out of reach because our drive cores WOULD KILL US if we tried to get to them. Funny thing about the quarians, they were building an ark of their own, according to MEA... There are demonstrably NOT enough garden worlds to satisfy everyone, as demonstrated by the quarians being space vagabonds (the Council won't let them settle in Citadel space) batarians and humans fighting over the Attican Traverse. The Council keeps a tight grip on the relay network, limiting exploration of it (see the First Contact War) The ODSY drive being widely available would spark a renaissance of space travel and colonization. From the codex: Citadel space is an unofficial term referring to any region of space controlled by a species that acknowledge the authority of the Citadel Council. At first glance, it appears this territory encompasses most of the galaxy. In reality, however, less than 1% of the stars have been explored. Even mass-effect-FTL drive is slow relative to the volume of the galaxy. Empty space and systems without suitable drive discharge sites are barriers to exploration. Only the mass relays allow ships to jump hundreds of light years in an instant, the key to expanding across an otherwise impassable galaxy. Whenever a new relay is activated, the destination system is rapidly developed. From that hub, FTL drive is used to expand to nearby star clusters. The result is a number of densely-developed clusters thinly spread across the vast expanse of space, connected by the mass relay network. The ODSY drive, like the Lazarus Project, is one of the greatest scientific discoveries of its time. ANd like the Lazarus Project, no one seemed to give a sh*t. I feel like Ultron talking about vibranium in AoU: "One of the most versatile substances on the planet, and they used it to make a frisbee!" Ok, first off, SPOILERS about the Quarian plans in MEA! Jeeze, dude. Thanks a lot for that tidbit. Go put that under a spoiler tag, quick! The humans and Batarians fighting over worlds is based on proximity and the fact that humans started settling where the Batarians had already claimed. The Council didn't intervene on the side of the Batarians, so they got pissy and left galactic politics. I haven't found anything about a shortage of worlds for Milky Way species, but it could be in there somewhere. Remember, they colonize along the Relay lines because it's easy! That's why most of large cities in the world are on rivers, why the biggest cities going west in the US were on railroads. It's the fastest and easiest way to move things and stay relevant. There isn't any necessity to move beyond the relay lines from what I can find in Mass Effect. And again, could be patent law, could be prohibitively expensive. The best discoveries made for the citizens of the Milky Way have always been Prothean in nature. Prothean tech is always on the Relay lines, so the chances of finding something better by randomly pointing off in a direction and using the ODSY drive to get there in the MW is a chance most investors would rather not take, I think. It's economics. It's not much of a spoiler, it was discussed before the game was even released, and there's plenty of worse spoilers in this very forum, but w/e, I put it in tags. And yes, Prothean tech makes things easier, it's part of the Reaper plan to channel organic development down the paths the Reapers' desire. But the thing is, ODSY drives circumvent that. It's a game changer. Something that can revolutionize society, and "they made a frisbee out of it" And yeah, garden worlds are rare. Screwing one up, inhabited or not, is one of the worst crimes a civilization can commit. Is it a lesser risk to build several enormous dreadnought-size vessels, a hundred thousand or more colonists (including some of the brightest people around) and go zipping off to a cluster of worlds centuries off the beaten path...or check out a star cluster six months away instead of six centuries?
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Post by Iakus on Mar 25, 2017 19:18:48 GMT
But there was never a whisper of it's existence prior to MEA They also never talked about the Collectors in ME1. Or thermal clips. Or the Crucible in ME1 or 2. There were no Drell in ME1 as far as I know. Or omni-blades. There's a lot of stuff that "pops up" within the lore as the series goes on. Just because it wasn't mentioned in the first game doesn't mean it cannot exist in the lore. And all of that (aside from the drell and arguably the Collectors) is stupid. Thermal clips was a poorly shoehorned in excuse to go to an ammo system. Omniblades the same for melee attacks. The Crucible was a Macguffin because it finally sank in that they wasted 2/3 of the story and had no idea how to end it.
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Post by laughingbanana on Mar 26, 2017 2:13:01 GMT
Arriving in a new galaxy, 200 million light years and 600 calendar years away, only to find out the locals speak perfect English. The Universal Translator tool is a thing in Mass Effect universe, at least if you bother to read the codex.
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Atemporal Vanguardian-Debugger
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At sunrise there is the sunset.
To find the secrets of the universe: Think in terms of energy, frequency & VIBRATION -Nikola Tesla
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
Origin: NO. NEVER. AGAIN.
XBL Gamertag: No.
PSN: No
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Post by Atemporal Vanguardian-Debugger on Mar 26, 2017 3:58:13 GMT
I'm only ~5-6 hours into this game and I cannot overstate how bad the science is. I don't know if I was too engaged in the story for the original trilogy to notice the various forms of science-hackery going on or if it just wasn't as blatant, BUT WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO BOY Please share any weird versions of "science" this game has to offer that you've seen, because I would sincerely like to hear them. I've probably missed a bunch already.
Here is the first massive one I've seen: Kesh, the female krogan on board the Nexus, talks about the genophage with your Ryder when prompted. What she says is something along the lines of "my clan developed a mutation that will help them resist the genophage, and underwent gene therapy while in cryo to help overcome it" For those who are not bio/science majors, there are MULTIPLE PROBLEMS WITH THIS: 1. mutations affect the individual, not an entire population - evolution happens vertically (from parent --> child) not horizontally (from sibling to sibling, friend to friend, uncle to aunt, etc). and therefore the entire clan would not all have the same mutation at the same specific locus without direct medical intervention (Kesh said there's no cure for the genophage that they know of, so medical intervention is unlikely) 2. almost all mutations are not helpful to individuals (people's genes mutate all the time, almost always without any real benefit - advantageous ones are rare and entirely dependent on environment), and a mutation in an extremely short period of time in a small population that almost never reproduces is HIGHLY HIGHLY unlikely. Non-mutation adaption would also be extremely slow given that selective pressures only work on populations that produce children, and if krogan almost never have children, it would take them millions upon millions of years to naturally build resistance to it. 3. mutations are the slowest form of evolution, because again, they ONLY affect the individual and potentially their offspring. 4. mutations just don't WORK THAT WAY5. they would not be able to notice a change in offspring viability without every clan woman getting pregnant thousands upon thousands of times (since viability is 1 in 1000) in the span of the fourteen months they've been on the Nexus, which seems unlikely to me 6. Apparently gene therapy isn't even possible with krogan (from the wiki here: masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Genophage)so... yeah. Sci-fi will always be rule-bendy (and breaky), but this is literally just false in every conceivable way, unless krogan genes work entirely differently than humans' (and given that they discuss genetic in a very human-oriented way, I doubt this). If I am correct then this is not plot hole but a misunderstanding: I ask these questions: Was it ever said what Clan Nakmor did before coming to the Andromeda Galaxy? I think and again it is only my opinion that Clan Nakmor are the Krogan scientific clan and that Dr. Okeer was one of them -HEAR ME OUT -then hate. Who was the only Krogan to be working on the Genophage? Who's research were those Krogan on Elaaden looking for? Why would they care to find research -if they didn't hold it in higher regard than most? If true it explains and connects the Krogan that Dr. Okeer was trying to breed without G.P. -clan Nakmor warriors to the slaughter: "For Science!" As well as the rest of clan Nakmor who Dr. Okeer sent his data and used it to develop a mutation that was then spread through genetic modification throughout their population. Could explain his not "having enough time" -okay I know that last bit is far fetched... more so than most of this. In other words clan Nakmor may be the Krogan science branch. That does not mean that they are all scientists -as Kesh is proof of but are more inclined toward sciences. By the way YES they can all have the mutation by the time they wake up in Andromeda -at least once the mutation was discovered -which was obviously before they started their trip in cryostasis for the trip to Andromeda. The mutation that was obviously discovered in subject zero (Grunt) of the population could be extracted and analyzed and then through RNA and DNA genetic modification be spliced into the rest of the population once -or just before being put into cryogenic suspension which may act as a catalyst in its implementation into the population. So that upon awaking they have no G.P. Also makes sense to me that Dr. Okeer's clan - the can with an individual with the fortitude to start trying to overcome the Genophage. Would also be the one to have the fortitude to leave the Milky Way Galaxy. Also certain sorts of genetic processes do not cease completely in hibernation stasis. Also why would RNA and DNA not be able to be rewritten in cryo? Cryogenic suspension does not stop biological processes but just slows them wayyyyyyyyyyyy down. Maybe that is what is necessary for this to work for all Krogan to be applicable: Take a shot before cryo then wake 600+ years later and be without the G.P. where as otherwise they take the shot here in Andromeda and have to wait 300 more years for it to activate. In the mean time they kill themselves off. Waste of Krogan. Waste of time. IE: This hypothetical shot to delude the G.P. takes 300 years of active time and in cryo it is double. Also don't know about DNA modification personally but RNA modfication is painful much better for them to be in Cryo for it. Love, Like, Anger, Loathe or Hate. Go ahead.
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Post by alanc9 on Mar 26, 2017 5:06:03 GMT
Well... Yes. Because of how the drives work. They don't make you go faster or anything, so using them to make other human or Batarian settlements wouldn't be sought-after because these people still want to be close to supply lines and the rest of civilization. As far as we can see in the OT there are no shortages of materials, so going far off the beaten path doesn't really grant anything to most people. They don't gt you there any faster as the crow flies. But it gives you indefinite range. And given current ftl cores kill you if they run more than a couple of days, that means explored space is limited to a few lines of space. There could be any number of worlds just waiting to be colonized only a week's flight away, but totally out of reach because our drive cores WOULD KILL US if we tried to get to them. This isn't true as written. The vast majority of stars have planets, very few systems with planets won't have anyplace to dump drive charge, and stars are close enough together to offer many options for dumping charge even if a system or two doesn't pan out. Fuel would probably be more of a constraint -- how big a constraint can't be determined because we have no real data on how fuel scooping works in the MEU. But we do know that the Ilos trip was considered impractical rather than impossible. The drive still does offer new capabilities, of course. Trips that had been difficult would become easy and quick; over long distances an ODSY craft would be far faster than a conventional ship. But we'd need cost figures to determine the economic effects of the ODSY drive. Maybe it's revolutionary, maybe it's the equivalent of nuclear power for ships in our era; limited military applications, all but useless for civilian purposes.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: LazyEcstasy
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Post by rudelove on Mar 26, 2017 6:01:09 GMT
I can't get over not having SAM or Lexi chime in over having sex with Jaal. They don't even touch on if its safe or not. I'm a physics major, not bio, so my only knowledge on it is with Mordin talking to you about sex with Garrus. If someone could make sense of having sex with Angara that would be great, thanks.
Also, how do Angara even reproduce? How long do they even live? I count the entire Angara as a science sin, they don't even make an effort to explain them much.
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