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Post by SofNascimento on May 13, 2017 6:19:28 GMT
I believe it's very wrong to blame fans for this.
Imagine a construction company that was hired to build a 30 stories building. It was given enough time and resources to properly plan and build it. During its construction a lot of people noticed it looked bad and said: "this doesn't look good". After it was done you can clearly see it is a disappointment: it's leaning to a side, the plumbling isn't done and the painting is falling off. People then start to complain and say it's shit and instead of selling 120 apartaments as it was expected, it only sells 60 or less.
Surely the people aren't to be blamed for this?
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Post by unwanted on May 13, 2017 6:26:22 GMT
I think they have just realized if they had remastered ME1 they would have 10x the sales. If theyd spent $40 million remasteringt he triLogy and adding the deleted scenes back in, it would be going gangbusters right now. If that was to materialize, I think all fans would want the gold platted-platinum-deluxe with cherry's version, and it would have the greatest sales record of all time. We can see that, but EA can't. Maybe it's because there are no gamer's at EA, only accountants.
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Zip has left the building.
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Post by zipzap2000 on May 13, 2017 6:26:33 GMT
Lets not blame each other for things.
We can sort this out over bottle of Ryncol.
Ryncol.
Drink it or die.
*Sips Ryncol*
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guanxi
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age Inquistion
PSN: guanxi
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Post by guanxi on May 13, 2017 6:55:04 GMT
If the new I.P. tanks (most do) Edmonton might have no choice but to return to Mass Effect. It would be effectively last chance saloon time for the future of not only Mass Effect but BioWare itself and with the stakes being so high and it possibly being BioWare's swansong I think they would knock out the park because anything less would be unthinkable.
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Post by darkway1 on May 13, 2017 8:16:42 GMT
What a poor attempt to down play Andromeda's glaring problems. I don't need to google information about any game sweet heart because we are here in the Mass Effect forums talking about Mass Effect Andromeda. Yep,I found it hard to enjoy the story and character narrative because Bioware failed to use THEIR tools to correctly tell THEIR story...........and I'm still waiting to here your reason why all the Asari and Angara females look the same???? To be fair, you were the one who mentioned all the other RPGs as a comparison, and called this game a new low while the ability of Bethesda games to dwarf almost anything in the bug and glitch department is a famous reality. Not sure if your directing your comment at me,but NO,I did not mention any other RPG......my response dismissed the idea that Mass Effect could be shelved on the basis of internet venom/hate when the game clearly shows a host of issues,genuine criticism is justified ........for a Bioware game,YES,it's a new low in terms of story and character narrative.
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Eterna
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Post by Eterna on May 13, 2017 8:33:13 GMT
Still waiting for a source other than Kotaku stating the series is done.
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Post by Lady Artifice on May 13, 2017 8:56:50 GMT
To be fair, you were the one who mentioned all the other RPGs as a comparison, and called this game a new low while the ability of Bethesda games to dwarf almost anything in the bug and glitch department is a famous reality. Not sure if your directing your comment at me,but NO,I did not mention any other RPG......my response dismissed the idea that Mass Effect could be shelved on the basis of internet venom/hate when the game clearly shows a host of issues,genuine criticism is justified ........for a Bioware game,YES,it's a new low in terms of story and character narrative. I was directing my comment at you, yes, in reference to this: That's a quote, from you, comparing Andromeda to "every RPG out there."
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Post by darkway1 on May 13, 2017 9:29:44 GMT
LOL,the point being,I didn't originality bring up "other" rpg's......nor do I wish to discuss "other" rpg's in context of the Mass Effect forum.
Again,YES,for a Bioware/story/character driven game.....it's a new low.
People can nit-pick and word play all they want about who said what but my post highlighted some genuine design,concept,game play issue's......still waiting for some one to explain the Asari being portrayed by a single model.....it's a level of laziness I've never seen in a Bioware game before.
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dm04
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by dm04 on May 13, 2017 9:38:19 GMT
ZaudStorm™ your poll question reads wrong, it should be "who is accountable for the mass effect andromeda disaster", but well, I gues we had suc ha poll already, so back to topic The only one to blame here is Bioware. I suppose you could say EA shouldn't have given such a huge task to an unproven studio, but still all the issues with MEA are squarely on Bioware's shoulders. Trying to blame fans or haters or SJWs for MEA's problems is just scapegoating to avoid the admitting the game's real issues. This, so pretty much this. 1) EA: As much as I do not like EA (on my list of the worst publishers in history, EA is ranked #1), there is nothing to blame here. BW got 5 years, FIVE... do you hear me? In the gaming industry that is like an eternity. IF they inveted a new IP, IF they had developed a new gameplay... but nothing, everything MEA offers is the same MET offered ... some RPG, cover based 3d shooting, car driving, space exploration. BW should have downscaled MEA if they had no time and upon ciritcal success on all fronts, EA would have given them enough money for some great DLCs. 2) Intolerant Fans: intolerant? Do you actualy know what intolerant mean? What should we be tolerant about? There are various aspects of the game, this "intolerant fans" are not fond of/ do not agree with (like the story, pacing, writing, the characters in general etc) but rest assured, if everything else was done fine, they would still say "well I do not like it" but they would be WAY more "tolerant" towards the end product. If a certain "feature" of a game serves no purpose, then get rid of the feature (speaking about downscaling). If something is there just to be there, it is not worth having, as many people already said: MEA is quantity over quality. Even the strongest feature of MEA (combat) is buggy and underdeveloped. hostaman said it quite nicely in bsn.boards.net/thread/6809/bsner-reviews-thread-based-completed?page=7"MEA is a triumph in mediocrity". 3) SJWs: realy? How about we blame BioWare because they were too stupid to catter to SJWs in the first place? SJ and political correctness is only a thing when we (in this case BW) make it a thing. 4) Haters who havent played the game: quite strong assumption here. First you do not have to play a game to be allowed "criticism" when you look at the wast number of bugs and the animation and facial expression problems, there are enough videos and reports to allow for a proper opinion. Second many "haters" did play for quite some time.... but seriously, people say "game beceomes better in the 2nd half"... eh what? I have to play bored for 50 hours before I get something? Sorry, this is not Lord of the Rings where you have to get past page 80 in oder to get the good story. With virtualy hundreds of games out there, there is no point getting bored through 50 hours in the first place. A good idea: ANY of the first ME games (yes even ME3), and you are "in" since the very beginning. If I do not get invested in the (ie) first 10 hours, then I quit and can call the game crap and it does not make me a "hater who havent played the game".
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N1
Done with MEA for now. Just too ....... dull.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age Inquistion
PSN: hostaman
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Done with MEA for now. Just too ....... dull.
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Post by hostaman on May 13, 2017 14:35:38 GMT
I'm not sure we'll ever really know why it went wrong. To me it just feels like design by committee rather than something that came from the heart. The original trilogy has some real left-field thinking. Even the ending was a brave gamble (which didn't really pay off). MEA feels safe and unadventurous. It doesn't really offend anyone, but doesn't delight them either. Like a drama on network TV. The only chance for Mass Effect now is if EA decide to sell the IP to a studio willing to do it justice, and lets face it, that will never happen. I hope all the great BW staff can leave the company and start something new. I'd buy it
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Post by ShadowAngel on May 13, 2017 14:56:42 GMT
ZaudStorm™ your poll question reads wrong, it should be "who is accountable for the mass effect andromeda disaster", but well, I gues we had suc ha poll already, so back to topic The only one to blame here is Bioware. I suppose you could say EA shouldn't have given such a huge task to an unproven studio, but still all the issues with MEA are squarely on Bioware's shoulders. Trying to blame fans or haters or SJWs for MEA's problems is just scapegoating to avoid the admitting the game's real issues. This, so pretty much this. 1) EA: As much as I do not like EA (on my list of the worst publishers in history, EA is ranked #1), there is nothing to blame here. BW got 5 years, FIVE... do you hear me? In the gaming industry that is like an eternity. IF they inveted a new IP, IF they had developed a new gameplay... but nothing, everything MEA offers is the same MET offered ... some RPG, cover based 3d shooting, car driving, space exploration. BW should have downscaled MEA if they had no time and upon ciritcal success on all fronts, EA would have given them enough money for some great DLCs. 2) Intolerant Fans: intolerant? Do you actualy know what intolerant mean? What should we be tolerant about? There are various aspects of the game, this "intolerant fans" are not fond of/ do not agree with (like the story, pacing, writing, the characters in general etc) but rest assured, if everything else was done fine, they would still say "well I do not like it" but they would be WAY more "tolerant" towards the end product. If a certain "feature" of a game serves no purpose, then get rid of the feature (speaking about downscaling). If something is there just to be there, it is not worth having, as many people already said: MEA is quantity over quality. Even the strongest feature of MEA (combat) is buggy and underdeveloped. hostaman said it quite nicely in bsn.boards.net/thread/6809/bsner-reviews-thread-based-completed?page=7"MEA is a triumph in mediocrity". 3) SJWs: realy? How about we blame BioWare because they were too stupid to catter to SJWs in the first place? SJ and political correctness is only a thing when we (in this case BW) make it a thing. 4) Haters who havent played the game: quite strong assumption here. First you do not have to play a game to be allowed "criticism" when you look at the wast number of bugs and the animation and facial expression problems, there are enough videos and reports to allow for a proper opinion. Second many "haters" did play for quite some time.... but seriously, people say "game beceomes better in the 2nd half"... eh what? I have to play bored for 50 hours before I get something? Sorry, this is not Lord of the Rings where you have to get past page 80 in oder to get the good story. With virtualy hundreds of games out there, there is no point getting bored through 50 hours in the first place. A good idea: ANY of the first ME games (yes even ME3), and you are "in" since the very beginning. If I do not get invested in the (ie) first 10 hours, then I quit and can call the game crap and it does not make me a "hater who havent played the game". Can't forget bioware seeems to be the only devs EA gives delays. Inquisition got a whole year off, andromeda got three months (but I could've thought they delayed it before then too), and now the new IP is getting a year to a potential two years off. Dice doesn't get delays or even 5 years to work on their games, I don't ever see the sports games get delays either and I know those games come out yearly (then again I don't think they're as complicated to make either). Regardless of people's dislike of EA, I feel like they treat bioware with much more respect than their other devs and bioware is given much more leeway with it. I bet Dice would love to get 5 years and even delays on their games if they could.
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Post by cheeseandonion on May 13, 2017 15:01:44 GMT
Should have just let the series die tbh.
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The Twilight God
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate
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Post by The Twilight God on May 13, 2017 15:32:29 GMT
A company pushing a sub-par product often has to face consequences, no one is really "accountable" aside from the company itself. In this case it's EA & Bioware. Bioware had 5 years.
It's just Bioware. EA expecting a finished game after more than enough time is not unreasonable.
EA is not obligated to give them a decade. Who does Bioware Montreal think they are? A Japanese developer?
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Post by jpcab on May 13, 2017 15:36:23 GMT
Andromeda is already a a catastrophic failure. I can t imagine how it was possible to do this to this game.
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The Twilight God
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate
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Post by The Twilight God on May 13, 2017 15:44:44 GMT
Bioware had 5 years.
It's just Bioware. EA expecting a finished game after more than enough time is not unreasonable.
EA is not obligated to give them a decade. Who does Bioware Montreal think they are? A Japanese developer?
Well, EA and Bioware are practically one entity at this point, so... *shrug* So it's DICE's fault too?
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Post by kleindropper on May 13, 2017 17:25:33 GMT
I voted EA. Those blaming Bioware clearly don't understand how EA's corporate structure limits their options to make a compelling and innovative game like they were able to as an independent company.
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Post by griffith82 on May 13, 2017 17:36:34 GMT
Still waiting for a source other than Kotaku stating the series is done. You and me both but will be waiting forever as there isn't one. Yet everyday ten more threads about this "fake" article.
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Post by kleindropper on May 13, 2017 17:48:14 GMT
So it's DICE's fault too? DICE? Aren't they a separate division? EA is something between a parent company to management for Bioware as far as I understand.
But in the end, I think that the question is more or less irrelevant (for the consumers at least). It's rather hard to answer this question accurately without knowing the exact process, and throwing blame isn't going to change ME:A.
EA also forced DICE to push out Star Wars Battlefront and add huge microtransactions, did they not? It all goes back to EA IMHO.
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Post by tantumdicverbo on May 13, 2017 18:01:21 GMT
Yeah, I'm seeing some conjecture from one outlet based on information from unnamed sources. I'm not quite ready to dance on Bioware's grave just yet.
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Post by mordingrimes on May 13, 2017 22:18:42 GMT
Bioware this time, nothing to do with EA. No way the fans are at fault for a game that was riddled with bugs, horrible characters and a boring story.
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Post by rawgrim on May 14, 2017 0:20:07 GMT
Bioware is to blame this time. EA gave them plenty of time to make the game. When Bioware hires devs to fill some quota instead of going for merit and talent, you get lacklustre games like this. All the really talented people have left Bioware in the last 5-6 years. Gaider being the last big name to jump ship. If there is a new Dragon Age game coming out further down the road, the writing will be missing David Gaider.
Lets just face it. The people who made the great Bioware games we all love are gone. Bioware is just a shell now. The logo is all that is left. It sucks, of course. But there you have it.
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Post by sageoflife on May 14, 2017 0:29:54 GMT
I'm still waiting for proof that there's anything to place blame for.
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Post by Puberty on May 14, 2017 0:40:01 GMT
I'm still waiting for proof that there's anything to place blame for. Have you played the game? Going back to the topic: Bioware is to blame. The whole scapegoating EA thing is getting old. Bioware released ME2 and DA:O while under daddy's roof, and they're two of their most highly regarded games.
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Cyberstrike
N4
is wanting to have some fun!
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
XBL Gamertag: cyberstrike nTo
PSN: cyberstrike-nTo
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Post by Cyberstrike on May 14, 2017 0:43:01 GMT
I say EVERYONE. (i) EA at the most by providing shitty deadlines, providing the responsibility of such a huge IP to an inexperienced team (BW Montréal) and outsourcing various animations to smaller companies. (ii) BioWare since they had 5 FuKIN YEARS to deliver a fresh new experience and yet they didn't deliver upto the expectations of the Mass Effect series. (iii) Intolerant Fans who would crucify BioWare for the slightest mistake ever since Mass Effect 3's ending. (iv) SJWs are one of the worst, wouldn't say the entirety of BioWare worships them but guys like Manveer Heir at the office definitely influenced a lot. (v) Most Haters who haven't even played the game but is already prepared to put MEA and BioWare on guillotine for no reason since it's a 2017 gaming trend. 1) EA is a business and their only goal is to make money. 2) BioWare IMHO did make a GREAT game. It's a game that deserved better fans. 3 and 5) Intolerant Fans and haters are the ones that I blame people whiny entitled crybabies who bitched and moaned at everything because MEA wasn't The Witcher 3 is space and wouldn't and still won't shut up about the endings to ME3 and people who haven't played a BioWare who just bash it for clicks/views and have little or nothing to say about it. 4) I think Heir's "influence" is overblown and he is NOT SJW. All he is just attention seeker media whore.
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Post by sageoflife on May 14, 2017 0:54:15 GMT
I'm still waiting for proof that there's anything to place blame for. Have you played the game? Going back to the topic: Bioware is to blame. The whole scapegoating EA thing is getting old. Bioware released ME2 and DA:O while under daddy's roof, and they're two of their most highly regarded games. Three times so far. I have some bones to pick, but much like Dragon Age II I found that most of the game's flaws were blown out of proportion.
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